A7C ii vs A7CR - any disadvantages to the A7CR?

[dtc25]

I’ve not been a Sony user but I’m looking for a compact camera for travel, landscape and street photography. I’m thinking about either the A7C ii or the A7CR. 33MP is plenty for what I need, but I am quite attracted to the idea of being able to effectively extend focal length by cropping, while retaining good resolution. The two obvious disadvantages I can see to the A7CR are higher price and bigger file size, but these are not deal breakers for me. So my instinct is to go for the A7CR and have the additional cropping ability when I need it. I’m just wondering if anyone who’s used both can tell me any other advantages of the A7C ii or disadvantages of the A7CR. Sometimes you hear that lower resolution cameras have lower noise, but I’m not convinced that this is true.

 

[thunder storm]

I’ve not been a Sony user but I’m looking for a compact camera for travel, landscape and street photography. I’m thinking about either the A7C ii or the A7CR. 33MP is plenty for what I need, but I am quite attracted to the idea of being able to effectively extend focal length by cropping, while retaining good resolution.

That's an advantage, but for pixel peepers it takes very good glass to keep up with the higher pixel density. By cropping you don't just crop digital resolution, you're also cropping optical resolution.

The two obvious disadvantages I can see to the A7CR are higher price and bigger file size, but these are not deal breakers for me. So my instinct is to go for the A7CR and have the additional cropping ability when I need it. I’m just wondering if anyone who’s used both can tell me any other advantages of the A7C ii or disadvantages of the A7CR. Sometimes you hear that lower resolution cameras have lower noise, but I’m not convinced that this is true.

At the pixel level, yes, but at the picture level the difference is generally very minor.

 

[rashid7]

I have the A7Cii and A7Rv. I definitely notice more noise in the R.

While I enjoy the ergo's of the larger camera, I must say the Cii has plenty of Rez and also has good handling and IBIS. Love how compact it is w/ small lenses like the 4 "Tiny" Samyang f1.8 primes!

 

[thunder storm]

I have the A7Cii and A7Rv. I definitely notice

I believe you, however, noticing more noise might be comparing at pixel level?

more noise in the R.

While I enjoy the ergo's of the larger camera, I must say the Cii has plenty of Rez and also has good handling and IBIS. Love how compact it is w/ small lenses like the 4 "Tiny" Samyang f1.8 primes!

 

[pollup]

I’ve not been a Sony user but I’m looking for a compact camera for travel, landscape and street photography. I’m thinking about either the A7C ii or the A7CR. 33MP is plenty for what I need, but I am quite attracted to the idea of being able to effectively extend focal length by cropping, while retaining good resolution. The two obvious disadvantages I can see to the A7CR are higher price and bigger file size, but these are not deal breakers for me. So my instinct is to go for the A7CR and have the additional cropping ability when I need it. I’m just wondering if anyone who’s used both can tell me any other advantages of the A7C ii or disadvantages of the A7CR. Sometimes you hear that lower resolution cameras have lower noise, but I’m not convinced that this is true.

As you said, you are fine with a higher price and with larger files, then the A7CR is a no brainer, it's better than the A7CII as a compact camera for precisely the reason you mentioned: you have more pixels meaning you can crop in more, meaning you can have a smaller lens and do a lot more with it. The A7CII would force you to either have a larger zoom lens or 2 lenses, to compensate, which results in less compactness.

Noise is better with more pixels, even DPR made an article and video about it, and that includes low light. If you want better noise => you want more MP. The key mistake that people have been making for 20+ years is to compare at pixel level instead of comparing same portions of the image (or sensor). If you really compare the same image areas, then the higher MP wins, you might have to process the noise differently though, but the end result is superior with extra MP.

Even video is better with the A7CR if you like 4k60p, because it does a 1.2x crop only instead of 1.5x crop on the A7CII, and the rolling shutter is better too because it's using pixel binning, overall resulting in a faster readout at 4k60p. Yes it's a bit less sharp but still the same IQ as the A7Siii and nobody's complaining about that, it will be sharp!

 

[ahaslett]

I have the A7CR. The A7Cii would be too low res for my uses.

The A7CR comes with an included bottom grip extension, the A7Cii does not. I find the body is very uncomfortable without it because my little finger curls beneath the body at an odd angle. It works with small lenses but I need the extension for anything as large as the Sigma 35/2 or Sony 20-70/4, never mind something like the 100-400 GM.

The A7CII does 10 fps and the A7CR only 8fps. The A7CR weirdly has pixel shift and the A7CII does not. The A7CII has more focus points. It seems the A7CII is better for video but I don’t understand the details! The A7CR can output 16 bit video RAW via HDMI.

Given that you get smaller bodies to use with smaller lenses, the cropping advantage of the A7CR is a bonus in uses where the loss of DR and lens resolution is acceptable.

The A7CR has “R” on the front in case you meet someone who has an A7CII.

Remember that IBIS on these Sony bodies is still not as good as say an OM1, and low light AF is slightly worse with a larger sensor and without the unique QBPDAF array. By low light, I mean very very low light. Alternatively, the Sony AF system is better integrated.



A

--
Infinite are the arguments of mages. Truth is a jewel with many facets. Ursula K LeGuin
Please feel free to edit any images that I post

 

[nepalisherpa]

I’ve not been a Sony user but I’m looking for a compact camera for travel, landscape and street photography. I’m thinking about either the A7C ii or the A7CR. 33MP is plenty for what I need, but I am quite attracted to the idea of being able to effectively extend focal length by cropping, while retaining good resolution. The two obvious disadvantages I can see to the A7CR are higher price and bigger file size, but these are not deal breakers for me. So my instinct is to go for the A7CR and have the additional cropping ability when I need it. I’m just wondering if anyone who’s used both can tell me any other advantages of the A7C ii or disadvantages of the A7CR. Sometimes you hear that lower resolution cameras have lower noise, but I’m not convinced that this is true.

I moved from A7 IV (technically A7C II) to A7CR. I have NOT regretted that move at all. I love the resolution I am getting out of the camera. I currently use it with Samyang 24 f/1.8, Sony 50 f/2.5, and Sony 85 f/1.8, and all three lenses provide plenty of detail for serious cropping when needed.

If you have the budget then definitely go for an A7CR, otherwise you will always think about what you could have done with extra resolution or any other extra features.

--
https://www.instagram.com/nepalisherpa/

 

[A74Me]

I’ve not been a Sony user but I’m looking for a compact camera for travel, landscape and street photography. I’m thinking about either the A7C ii or the A7CR. 33MP is plenty for what I need, but I am quite attracted to the idea of being able to effectively extend focal length by cropping, while retaining good resolution. The two obvious disadvantages I can see to the A7CR are higher price and bigger file size, but these are not deal breakers for me. So my instinct is to go for the A7CR and have the additional cropping ability when I need it. I’m just wondering if anyone who’s used both can tell me any other advantages of the A7C ii or disadvantages of the A7CR. Sometimes you hear that lower resolution cameras have lower noise, but I’m not convinced that this is true.

As you said, you are fine with a higher price and with larger files, then the A7CR is a no brainer, it's better than the A7CII as a compact camera for precisely the reason you mentioned: you have more pixels meaning you can crop in more, meaning you can have a smaller lens and do a lot more with it. The A7CII would force you to either have a larger zoom lens or 2 lenses, to compensate, which results in less compactness.

Noise is better with more pixels, even DPR made an article and video about it, and that includes low light. If you want better noise => you want more MP. The key mistake that people have been making for 20+ years is to compare at pixel level instead of comparing same portions of the image (or sensor). If you really compare the same image areas, then the higher MP wins, you might have to process the noise differently though, but the end result is superior with extra MP.

Even video is better with the A7CR if you like 4k60p, because it does a 1.2x crop only instead of 1.5x crop on the A7CII, and the rolling shutter is better too because it's using pixel binning, overall resulting in a faster readout at 4k60p. Yes it's a bit less sharp but still the same IQ as the A7Siii and nobody's complaining about that, it will be sharp!

the a7rv rolling shutter in video 4k 60 is 15ms the a7cii 4k 60 is 13ms.

 

[Rod McD]

Hi,

I have the A7R3 and an A7CR, which I use for hiking and travel. I think you've nailed the reasons I chose the A7CR - higher res when you need it, cropability, and the extra 'reach' that comes with it. I don't shoot video at all, so I can't comment on the differences between the A7Cii and R for video.

You've probably read a lot of threads about the compromises in the C series design needed to achieve their small size and low weight. I find that the much-discussed disadvantages don't affect 99.9% of my photography. I will say that I think the A7CR lends itself to a kit of small lenses. You get a really compact feel with very small lenses like small primes and the 28-60. I have also used it with my 20-70 and 70-200Gii, but IMO you tend to lose that truly compact feel. I also prefer their balance on the full sized body.

It's a bit of a mystery to me why Sony included an extension grip with the A7CR and not the A7Cii. I never actually use the A7CR's extension grip. I can't see the point in paying good money for the lightest possible AF ILC camera, accepting a few compromises in doing so, and then adding back on 40% of the weight saved (compared to an A7R5) in an accessory grip. If you know you'll definitely need to use the grip, I'd consider buying a full sized body.

Regards, Rod

 

[rashid7]

when I put one of my small lenses on the A7Cii, it feels like I have a super successor to my RX1. It is an unbelievably nice, jacket-pocketable camera.

I bought the A7Rv as much for ergonomics, and slightly enhanced IBIS, as for the 62MP.

The bigger 'R' is nice, but sometimes when I'm using the 'C', I wonder why I bothered getting a 2nd camera... but with my 14 lenses, it was probably a good move (-;

 

[dtc25]

I'm still mulling this one over, but if I do go the Sony route I'm likely to go for the A7CR. I'm hoping that the extra cropping capability will let me use a single lens for hiking and travel.

 

[ahaslett]

I'm still mulling this one over, but if I do go the Sony route I'm likely to go for the A7CR. I'm hoping that the extra cropping capability will let me use a single lens for hiking and travel.

My A7CR kit is:




With the one-lens solution 20-70/4 488g




With the Samyang VAF 100mm T2.3 Cine 280g

The rubber hood is my addition to the Cine, which also covers the front accessory mount. The lens comes with a push cap which works if glare is not an issue. The 20-70/4 is very prone to veiling glare, so you have to compose for that.

I can also do primes only, in my case Loxia 21mm and Sony 55mm ZA as a pair.

A

--
Infinite are the arguments of mages. Truth is a jewel with many facets. Ursula K LeGuin
Please feel free to edit any images that I post

 

[Martin_99]

I have the A7CR. The A7Cii would be too low res for my uses.

What is your use if I can ask? I switched from 24Mpx to 33Mpx. My only usage for additional pixels is heavy cropping when shooting wildlife.

The A7CR comes with an included bottom grip extension, the A7Cii does not. I find the body is very uncomfortable without it because my little finger curls beneath the body at an odd angle.

I agree that body is too small, but found 3rd party options as better and cheaper (Smallrig)

It works with small lenses but I need the extension for anything as large as the Sigma 35/2 or Sony 20-70/4, never mind something like the 100-400 GM.

The A7CII does 10 fps and the A7CR only 8fps. The A7CR weirdly has pixel shift and the A7CII does not. The A7CII has more focus points. It seems the A7CII is better for video but I don’t understand the details! The A7CR can output 16 bit video RAW via HDMI.

Given that you get smaller bodies to use with smaller lenses, the cropping advantage of the A7CR is a bonus in uses where the loss of DR and lens resolution is acceptable.

The A7CR has “R” on the front in case you meet someone who has an A7CII.

Remember that IBIS on these Sony bodies is still not as good as say an OM1, and low light AF is slightly worse with a larger sensor and without the unique QBPDAF array. By low light, I mean very very low light. Alternatively, the Sony AF system is better integrated.



A

--
Infinite are the arguments of mages. Truth is a jewel with many facets. Ursula K LeGuin
Please feel free to edit any images that I post

 

[ahaslett]

I shoot landscape for which my minimum requirement is 40Mpix. Ideally I’d use the A7Riv on a tripod but there are times when handheld works better.

My other use is family with subject detection where using a small prime with cropping headroom is a bonus. I guess wildlife might be another use case.

The grip extension comes included with the A7CR. I tried it and liked it.

Andrew

 

[Martin_99]

I shoot landscape for which my minimum requirement is 40Mpix. Ideally I’d use the A7Riv on a tripod but there are times when handheld works better.

Thanks. Do you think, that you would recognize the difference between eg. 33Mpx and 42Mpx on your largest landscape prints? So far I found that most medias are quite forgivable in comparison with pixel peeping on PC.

My other use is family with subject detection where using a small prime with cropping headroom is a bonus. I guess wildlife might be another use case.

The grip extension comes included with the A7CR. I tried it and liked it.

Andrew

 

[ahaslett]

I shoot landscape for which my minimum requirement is 40Mpix. Ideally I’d use the A7Riv on a tripod but there are times when handheld works better.

Thanks. Do you think, that you would recognize the difference between eg. 33Mpx and 42Mpx on your largest landscape prints? So far I found that most medias are quite forgivable in comparison with pixel peeping on PC.

My other use is family with subject detection where using a small prime with cropping headroom is a bonus. I guess wildlife might be another use case.

The grip extension comes included with the A7CR. I tried it and liked it.

Andrew

I don’t print, but if I did it would have to be 6’ x 4’, so yes I’m sure. Viewing one quarter of an image on a 32” 4k screen, I can see the difference between 42Mpix and 61Mpix. It’s not much but surprisingly it is there.

A

 

[rashid7]

I shoot landscape for which my minimum requirement is 40Mpix. Ideally I’d use the A7Riv on a tripod but there are times when handheld works better.

Thanks. Do you think, that you would recognize the difference between eg. 33Mpx and 42Mpx on your largest landscape prints? So far I found that most medias are quite forgivable in comparison with pixel peeping on PC.

My other use is family with subject detection where using a small prime with cropping headroom is a bonus. I guess wildlife might be another use case.

The grip extension comes included with the A7CR. I tried it and liked it.

Andrew

I find that even when comparing my Cii to Rv (33 vs 62MP) that the difference is unnoticeable unless I zoom in. Even then (4me) it ain't a big deal.

I often read comments about how the 62mp is great for cropping. That may be true, but only if you stop down, nail focus, & eliminate motion (?)

 

[Lukacs85]

A7CII.
Price difference is significant, a good lens price. You have plenty crop ability even from 33MP.
60MP sensor has two advantage, resolution and less color artifact and better pixel level sharpness at 26MP. If you plan buying GM lenses then A7CR may worth it, and you get the grip to handle those larger lenses.

 

[benmao]

I often read comments about how the 62mp is great for cropping. That may be true, but only if you stop down, nail focus, & eliminate motion (?)

No, not at all. Crop Mode on the A7CR ist the same as A6700 (same pixel number, same area on the sensor).

61 MP/ 33 MP = 1,85 and the square root hereof is 1,36: You have (only) 36 % more pixels horicontally and vertically than the A7Cii.

I have recently bought the Sony 24-50/2.8 G. If I crop in post as much as I get the 33 MP out of the 61 MP, I have a picture like made with a 68 mm lense.

To be honest, you have also to multiply the f-stop, because you loose sensor area and magnify the noise (50 mm f/2.8 -> 68 mm f/3.8)

 

[thunder storm]

I shoot landscape for which my minimum requirement is 40Mpix. Ideally I’d use the A7Riv on a tripod but there are times when handheld works better.

Thanks. Do you think, that you would recognize the difference between eg. 33Mpx and 42Mpx on your largest landscape prints? So far I found that most medias are quite forgivable in comparison with pixel peeping on PC.

My other use is family with subject detection where using a small prime with cropping headroom is a bonus. I guess wildlife might be another use case.

The grip extension comes included with the A7CR. I tried it and liked it.

Andrew

I find that even when comparing my Cii to Rv (33 vs 62MP) that the difference is unnoticeable unless I zoom in.

I like to zoom in.

Even then (4me) it ain't a big deal.

I often read comments about how the 62mp is great for cropping. That may be true, but only if you stop down, nail focus, & eliminate motion (?)

With cropping you have to do your composition in post, or accept 26Mp. I think 26 is a bit low. Composition in post is not a fun way shoot for me, except for avoiding perspective distortion shooting tall buildings by using a wider angle and cutting off the foreground.