New monitor time, thought I had it sorted but ...

[BobKnDP]

More than tempting. I did see the reviews on rtings.com. These were all $1,500 monitors when I started looking a couple of weeks ago.

I was leaning towards the Asus Proart PA329CRV as a possible splurge, but the black levels on the Dell are stunning. Damn you black Friday.

Hmm ...

Proart: better brightness at 350 cd/msq, no burn in

Dell: better everything else, possible burn in

I see that the Dell has a pixel refresh feature built-in, like my LG OLED TV. Automatic after 7000 hours, but it can also be run manually.

My Philips/JOLED monitor lacks such a feature. No Image retention/burn-in so far. (18 months. Something over 4000 hours, I'd guess.)

 

[CompleteUtterNonsense]

Thanks Bob. According to rtings.com the qd-oled panels seem to suffer more from burn in than the woled, but it is still early in testing. Curiously two Samsung qd oled tvs sit on the opposite end of the testing spectrum, one at the very top, one near the bottom. I love conclusive tests. :-D

Still undecided on this one. That Dell at least convinced me that 32" and 4K are both a good thing. I also don't mind the curve in the least.

 

[BobKnDP]

If you're worried about burn-in, I suggest that you go for the IPS monitor. I believe they're still the standard for photo processing.

I doubt that the "perfect black" of the OLED is significant in photo work. (Not sour grapes; I'm running an OLED.)

The only complaint I have about my Asus PA329c is that I can see some angle of incidence effects at my normal viewing distance. (The brightness falls off a little, and there is a slight color shift.) There may be better displays in that context. It's probably less with a curved display.

 

[CompleteUtterNonsense]

It looks like the Dell monitor uses the gen 3 Samsung panel that started production this year. It is supposed to have improved longevity.

I would have thought that black levels would help with editing for shadow detail. Does this not improve a monitors ability to show slight differences in light levels in darker shadow areas?

It sure seems to make a difference in images that have both black and very brightly lit areas such as in the cat picture in the link below.

https://www.dpreview.com/samples/6770159472/sony-28-70mm-f2-sample-gallery

 

[Austinian]

It looks like the Dell monitor uses the gen 3 Samsung panel that started production this year. It is supposed to have improved longevity.

I would have thought that black levels would help with editing for shadow detail. Does this not improve a monitors ability to show slight differences in light levels in darker shadow areas?

It sure seems to make a difference in images that have both black and very brightly lit areas such as in the cat picture in the link below.

https://www.dpreview.com/samples/6770159472/sony-28-70mm-f2-sample-gallery

I didn't have the LG WOLED long enough to do any real photo processing on it, but I did notice that I could see more shadow detail while playing "Skyrim".

 

[New Wrycuda]

If you're worried about burn-in, I suggest that you go for the IPS monitor. I believe they're still the standard for photo processing.

I doubt that the "perfect black" of the OLED is significant in photo work. (Not sour grapes; I'm running an OLED.)

The only complaint I have about my Asus PA329c is that I can see some angle of incidence effects at my normal viewing distance. (The brightness falls off a little, and there is a slight color shift.) There may be better displays in that context. It's probably less with a curved display.

Best monitor that I have is ASUS VP249QGR (2k 24") that cost OZ$299 some years ago. Beautiful color, good blacks. Good for everything, including games.

I also have an Acer 4k 28" for multi-windowed work, and it's very good, despite being (shock, horror) only TN technology.

Too much agonizing about monitors IMHO.

 

[BobKnDP]

It looks like the Dell monitor uses the gen 3 Samsung panel that started production this year. It is supposed to have improved longevity.

I would have thought that black levels would help with editing for shadow detail. Does this not improve a monitors ability to show slight differences in light levels in darker shadow areas?

It sure seems to make a difference in images that have both black and very brightly lit areas such as in the cat picture in the link below.

https://www.dpreview.com/samples/6770159472/sony-28-70mm-f2-sample-gallery

Sure.

Does it matter enough to you to risk burn-in?

For me, the answer was yes. Even though I'm hardly expert in maintaining shadow detail.

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

 

[CompleteUtterNonsense]

It looks like the Dell monitor uses the gen 3 Samsung panel that started production this year. It is supposed to have improved longevity.

I would have thought that black levels would help with editing for shadow detail. Does this not improve a monitors ability to show slight differences in light levels in darker shadow areas?

It sure seems to make a difference in images that have both black and very brightly lit areas such as in the cat picture in the link below.

https://www.dpreview.com/samples/6770159472/sony-28-70mm-f2-sample-gallery

Sure.

Does it matter enough to you to risk burn-in?

Yes.

No.

Yes.

No.

Hmm, its a tie.

At this point, probably not. The ASUS ProArt will be a big step up, work better in my light conditions and I won't have to worry about burn in.

That Dell is a beautiful monitor though.

 

[Austinian]

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

Just a thought:

If you have a backup of a pre-24H2 install, would it be possible to back up your current install, restore the pre-24H2, run the profiling software, copy the .icc/.icm file to a USB flash drive, restore the current install, and copy the .icc/.icm file back into your color management folder?

A hassle, but you keep mentioning this problem so it must be important, and understandably so.

 

[Chris Noble]

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

I haven't had that issue. Are you unable to generate the profile (what SW do you use?), or unable to install it, or unable to then select it? Three different possible problems. And are you using the latest rev of your profiling SW?

 

[BobKnDP]

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

Just a thought:

If you have a backup of a pre-24H2 install, would it be possible to back up your current install, restore the pre-24H2, run the profiling software, copy the .icc/.icm file to a USB flash drive, restore the current install, and copy the .icc/.icm file back into your color management folder?

A hassle, but you keep mentioning this problem so it must be important, and understandably so.

Important?

Not so much. I'm just compulsive.

I'd like to use the last profile I generated under 23H2, but I adjusted some monitor settings before I understood the bug, so I can't go back.

It might be simpler to dual boot 23H2, generate the profile, and copy it over. Not gonna do that, either.

 

[Austinian]

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

Just a thought:

If you have a backup of a pre-24H2 install, would it be possible to back up your current install, restore the pre-24H2, run the profiling software, copy the .icc/.icm file to a USB flash drive, restore the current install, and copy the .icc/.icm file back into your color management folder?

A hassle, but you keep mentioning this problem so it must be important, and understandably so.

Important?

Not so much. I'm just compulsive.

I'd like to use the last profile I generated under 23H2, but I adjusted some monitor settings before I understood the bug, so I can't go back.

It might be simpler to dual boot 23H2, generate the profile, and copy it over. Not gonna do that, either.

I often experience a conflict between compulsive and lazy, so I understand perfectly when 'lazy' wins, as it generally does with me.

 

[CAcreeks]

More than tempting. I did see the reviews on rtings.com. These were all $1,500 monitors when I started looking a couple of weeks ago.

I was leaning towards the Asus Proart PA329CRV as a possible splurge, but the black levels on the Dell are stunning. Damn you black Friday. Hmm ...

Proart: better brightness at 350 cd/msq, no burn in

Dell: better everything else, possible burn in

Unless you dislike (slightly) curved monitors, I feel you should buy the Dell Alienware AW3225QF at Best Buy. It's a bargain at $300 off (USD, maybe Canadian?).

I ordered a mini-LED monitor, the Acer Nitro XV275K, because I'm interested in HDR, and I read that it's cooler running and uses less power than OLED. Also $300 off at Best Buy. Rtings ranked it "best 4K monitor" although at 27" it's too small for you.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/best/by-resolution/4k-ultra-hd-uhd

The MSI MAG 321UPX that you looked at has two less-frilly models, URX and UR, which oddly cost more on Amazon. The Rtings remark, "unlike some monitors, it uses a heatsink instead of a fan to dissipate heat" kind of scares me. I don't believe my current LG 27UK650 has a fan, nor does it run hot. About four years ago it was top-rated by Rtings, and I've been happy with it. (LG U = UHD, G = gaming)

 

[skyglider]

More than tempting. I did see the reviews on rtings.com. These were all $1,500 monitors when I started looking a couple of weeks ago.

I was leaning towards the Asus Proart PA329CRV as a possible splurge, but the black levels on the Dell are stunning. Damn you black Friday.

Any reasons for choosing the Proart PA329CRV over the PA239CV?

I'm interested in both.

 

[BobKnDP]

More than tempting. I did see the reviews on rtings.com. These were all $1,500 monitors when I started looking a couple of weeks ago.

I was leaning towards the Asus Proart PA329CRV as a possible splurge, but the black levels on the Dell are stunning. Damn you black Friday.

Any reasons for choosing the Proart PA329CRV over the PA239CV?

I'm interested in both.

The CRV model is 3 years newer.

It's not obvious to me why that would matter.

 

[CAcreeks]

More than tempting. I did see the reviews on rtings.com. These were all $1,500 monitors when I started looking a couple of weeks ago.

I was leaning towards the Asus Proart PA329CRV as a possible splurge, but the black levels on the Dell are stunning. Damn you black Friday.

Any reasons for choosing the Proart PA329CRV over the PA239CV [sic, PA329CV]

I'm interested in both.

The CRV model is 3 years newer.

It's not obvious to me why that would matter.

Asus compares 'em. The CRV has an extra USB hub and costs less! (on sale)

https://www.asus.com/us/product-compare?ProductID=22271,15371&LevelId=Displays-Desktops-Monitors

Also based on Rtings reviews of the 27" models with similar product names, CV and CRV, the older model doesn't support HDR. Any of 'em look great for Adobe RGB editing.

https://www.rtings.com/monitor/reviews/asus/proart-display-pa279crv

 

[skyglider]

Any reasons for choosing the Proart PA329CRV over the PA239CV?

I'm interested in both.

BobKnDP and CAcreeks,

Thanks for your inputs.
Per this bhphotovideo comparison chart , the differences between the PA329CRV and the PA329CV are:

- - - - - - - - - - -

Screen size:
CV=32 inches
CRV=31.5 inches.

Maximum Brightness:
CV= 400 nits / cd/m2 (Peak in HDR Mode)
CRV= 400 nits / cd/m2 (Peak in HDR Mode), 350 nits / cd/m2 (Sustained in SDR Mode)

Contrast Ratio:
CV=1000:1
CRV=1000:1

Dynamic Contrast Ratio:
CV=100,000,000:1
CRV=3000:1

Variable Refresh Technology:
CV=Adaptive-Sync
CRV=Adaptive-Sync, Variable Refresh Rate (VRR)

Inputs:
CV=1x DisplayPort 1.2, 2x HDMI 2.0
CRV=1x DisplayPort 1.4 , 2x HDMI 2.0

Multi-Input Support (PIP/PBP):
CV=No
CRV=Picture-in-Picture (PIP), Picture-by-Picture (PBP)

- - - - - - - - - - -

Googling, for any monitor some say that the "Dynamic contrast ratio" is a bogus number. But still, is 100,000,000:1 worthy of consideration compared to 3000:1?

Is the CRV "350 nits / cd/m2 (Sustained in SDR Mode)" a worthy consideration?

In your opinion, would the CRV be the better monitor to buy?

Thanks.

 

[BobKnDP]

Any reasons for choosing the Proart PA329CRV over the PA239CV?

I'm interested in both.

BobKnDP and CAcreeks,

Thanks for your inputs.
Per this bhphotovideo comparison chart , the differences between the PA329CRV and the PA329CV are:

- - - - - - - - - - -

Screen size:
CV=32 inches
CRV=31.5 inches.

Maximum Brightness:
CV= 400 nits / cd/m2 (Peak in HDR Mode)
CRV= 400 nits / cd/m2 (Peak in HDR Mode), 350 nits / cd/m2 (Sustained in SDR Mode)

Contrast Ratio:
CV=1000:1
CRV=1000:1

Dynamic Contrast Ratio:
CV=100,000,000:1
CRV=3000:1

Variable Refresh Technology:
CV=Adaptive-Sync
CRV=Adaptive-Sync, Variable Refresh Rate (VRR)

Inputs:
CV=1x DisplayPort 1.2, 2x HDMI 2.0
CRV=1x DisplayPort 1.4 , 2x HDMI 2.0

Multi-Input Support (PIP/PBP):
CV=No
CRV=Picture-in-Picture (PIP), Picture-by-Picture (PBP)

- - - - - - - - - - -

Googling, for any monitor some say that the "Dynamic contrast ratio" is a bogus number. But still, is 100,000,000:1 worthy of consideration compared to 3000:1?

Is the CRV "350 nits / cd/m2 (Sustained in SDR Mode)" a worthy consideration?

In your opinion, would the CRV be the better monitor to buy?

Thanks.

I'm skeptical about the B&H comparison link. (I visited it myself, earlier.) For example: it says that the HDMI ports on the CV are 2.0, but it doesn't support HDCP. That's wrong.

If either was a TV, I'd be checking the number of local dimming zones. For photo work, some people turn that feature off. I failed to find that number on both the CV and the CRV.

 

[CAcreeks]

Thanks for your inputs.
Per this bhphotovideo comparison chart , the differences between the PA329CRV and the PA329CV are:

Thanks for that! Easier to digest than Asus website information.

Googling, for any monitor some say that the "Dynamic contrast ratio" is a bogus number. But still, is 100,000,000:1 worthy of consideration compared to 3000:1?

No idea, but one-hundred-million to one looks like a bogus number.

Is the CRV "350 nits / cd/m2 (Sustained in SDR Mode)" a worthy consideration?

That's not very bright. In my opinion 400 nits should not even be called HDR. The Rtings review of the PA278CV says it does not have HDR mode. That might indicate another mistake in B&H specs, like the HDCP issue that Bob mentioned.

In your opinion, would the CRV be the better monitor to buy?

I would buy the one that costs less. There's not much practical difference, unless you really need a USB hub. For the $529 price, this is an excellent way to get a large monitor that shows nearly all of Adobe RGB gamut. Usually such monitors are very high priced.

I'm skeptical about the B&H comparison link. (I visited it myself, earlier.) For example: it says that the HDMI ports on the CV are 2.0, but it doesn't support HDCP. That's wrong.

If either was a TV, I'd be checking the number of local dimming zones. For photo work, some people turn that feature off. I failed to find that number on both the CV and the CRV.

A comment on Reddit said, "OLED has as many local dimming zones as pixels."

Another said that HDR video content looks convincing on OLED because of very dark blacks.

 

[BobKnDP]

(I'm still annoyed with Microsoft. I haven't been able to properly re-profile my monitor since I got Windows 11 24H2, due to what I assume is a bug in the OS. The manufacturer's ICC profile leaves a bit to be desired, especially in the blacks.)

I haven't had that issue. Are you unable to generate the profile (what SW do you use?), or unable to install it, or unable to then select it? Three different possible problems. And are you using the latest rev of your profiling SW?

I've used both Calibrite Profiler and DisplayCal/Argyll CMS. Latest versions. (1.33, and 3,8.9.3 respectively. Argyll CMS 3.3.0.)

Both appear to detect the monitor as sRGB. (Which probably means that it isn't being detected at all. I believe sRGB is the default.) The issue didn't appear under 23H2, with the same hardware and monitor gamut settings.

I haven't validated the resulting limited-gamut ICC profiles. They may be OK, within their limits.

If I hadn't checked with the DisplayCal "Profile info" tool, I don't know when I would have noticed the issue. Maybe that means I shouldn't care. (Dammit, though, I paid for a monitor that goes wider than Adobe RGB.)

I've been in touch with Calibrite support. If what I was told is to be believed, their developers hadn't begun to work 24H2 (as of 13 November). They must have very few developers, if they're not staying ahead of Win 11 releases.

I also contacted MS support. I was told they are aware of the issue. However, it was just the first line outsourced support, so perhaps they were just trying to get rid of me.

As far as I know, neither Calibrite nor Microsoft has acknowledged the bug anywhere on the Web.

The issue also appears to affect my secondary desktop PC, also on 24H2.