NX1 - micro-blur - even with E-Shutter On, and OIS in Mode 2

[StenM]

Claudio NC

I bought three NX1, two NX500, all the fixed and zoom professional lenses (two 16-50) and two low cost zoom.
I absolutely do not regret having bought all this equipment, I bought it just when it was starting to be probable and then it was obvious that Samsung had come out of the camera market.
All I have are still as new, amazing for many aspects but the unbearable defect, I repeat once again, already said this years ago, is that the NX1 creates micro blurred images due to the vibration of the shutter blades, particularly with 50-150 mm, when T is between 1/125 and 1 s, (sometimes at 1/160) and well visible also with 16-50 mm, above 30 mm focal lenght.
This does not happen with the NX500.

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/3...pressive-three-years-later?comment=2586323121

• NX1 50-200 hand-held EFL 107mm ISO-100 f/5.6 1/400 sec.

Apparently, the NX1 creates micro blurred images - even with E-Shutter On, and OIS in Mode 2! The NX500 has a newer image processor - DRIMe Vs, and does not have this problem. The solution seems to be to 'spray and pray' ...

 

[parakalien]

Does it happen on all 3 of your nx1?

I had an nx500, and now have the nx1, and my pictures are tack sharp. I don't have either S lens, and I've heard that some people have had issues with the OIS on them blurring pictures like the example you posted.

Have you tried a 3rd party long lens on a tripod or the S lens with OIS disabled on a tripod?

That would eliminate the margin for error and show you if it's really the shutter.

 

[StenM]

Does it happen on all 3 of your nx1?

that's Claudio NC with the 3 x NX1

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/3...pressive-three-years-later?comment=6612316343

 

[StenM]

Have you tried a 3rd party long lens on a tripod?

That would eliminate the margin for error and show you if it's really the shutter.

yes, 3rd party - no micro-blur - it may not be the shutter mechanism

 

[Sendeva]

Are you sure its ois thats blurring the photo or is it a simple case of missed focus. With the nx1 some times the focus box will show green but it didn't focus properly this could be due to your focus priority setting (i use Accuracy priority) even with accuracy priority the focus can miss.

 

[StenM]

Thanks, the pics above were taken on Auto (AF Release Priority) and with DMF. I'll test Accuracy priority, but page 107 of the manual says: "When you select the Continuous High shooting method, the Accuracy priority setting is applied only on the first shot."

 

[STexan]

The NX1 system has a number of "issues" that come up here and there. I've seen this often with my NX1 16-50s setup in conditions that should haveproduced sharp results. It's a hit and miss system in many aspects. 85% of the time, it grabs a great picture, the others can be anywhere from completely OOF, to delayed capture, to improper exposure by 3+ stops, to slightly OOF. I'll also say the IS is also hit and miss, either mode. It may activate properly and instantly, it may not.

I only have 2 Samsung lenses. The other is the 50-150s but I don't use it often. I can't determine if it's a body issue or a lens issue or a blend of both. All that said, I still like the system but would never recommend to anyone to buy a used system unless it was offered very inexpensive (50% or more off of last retail $), but still in excellent condition. Some love it's video capability by I don't have any use for that.

--
Robert K

 

[Tugela]

Claudio NC

I bought three NX1, two NX500, all the fixed and zoom professional lenses (two 16-50) and two low cost zoom.
I absolutely do not regret having bought all this equipment, I bought it just when it was starting to be probable and then it was obvious that Samsung had come out of the camera market.
All I have are still as new, amazing for many aspects but the unbearable defect, I repeat once again, already said this years ago, is that the NX1 creates micro blurred images due to the vibration of the shutter blades, particularly with 50-150 mm, when T is between 1/125 and 1 s, (sometimes at 1/160) and well visible also with 16-50 mm, above 30 mm focal lenght.
This does not happen with the NX500.

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/3...pressive-three-years-later?comment=2586323121

• NX1 50-200 hand-held EFL 107mm ISO-100 f/5.6 1/400 sec.

Apparently, the NX1 creates micro blurred images - even with E-Shutter On, and OIS in Mode 2! The NX500 has a newer image processor - DRIMe Vs, and does not have this problem. The solution seems to be to 'spray and pray' ...

The processor in the NX500 is a scaled down version of the one in the NX1, otherwise they are the same. It is not a "newer" version. It is comparable to an i3 processor compared to a i7. Same processor, just with some bits disabled due to manufacturing inconsistency or to make it comply with a thermal envelope spec. The DRIMe Vs is a DRIMe V with parts disabled so that it can operate reliably within the smaller thermal envelope of the NX500.

A vibration within the camera would have a direction, which your image does not. It simply is not in critical focus, that is all.

If the camera is doing the same thing with the e-shutter then it has nothing to do with shutter vibration.

If you have OIS enabled, the system vibrates for a short while the motors stabilize when the camera is switched on. So, if you switch on and immediately shoot, chances are the OIS will prevent you from getting a stabilized shot, and it will be difficult getting decent shots at all during this period. Give the lens a chance to stabilize before starting to take photographs.

My camera does not do that with either S lens, so I suspect that the issue is a user error on your part.

 

[kattoufcy]

hello three nx1+ 1650s lens have an issue of blurred photos the first minute after switching on. (at any shutter speed with ois on or off) At least that's the case for me. after that they are sharp.

 

[Claudio NC]

Yes, blurred images with all three NX1, with any lens with a focal lenght long enough to be able to notice it, of course not with a wide angle, NX1 has not an "infinite" resolution.

Any lens, thus means also adapted lens of different brands, as the Sony 70-300mm 4.5-5.6 G SSM, just to say one of the hundreds of lens I own (Nikon, Canon, Sony, Pentax, Sigma, Tamron, etc.), but now under my eyes, attached on a white NX500, with a well made KIWI manual adapter ring.

The problem IS (... do not means Image Stabilizer) ... repeat, is inside the NX1, not on the Samsung lens stabilization (that really is not so effective as others made by Nikon and Canon).

I do almost always AEB shots, (to produce high res panoramics, stitching dozens or hundreads of shots), always on tripod.

I never use active stabilizations, by lenses or by cameras, when is on tripod (well known why, I think), I always take pictures with RRS (and similar modified by me) panoramic heads, always with remote controller, cable or IR (no error by operator, that is me, is involved here ... after 25 years of activity, not only as photographer!).

A panoramic head amplifies the vibrations, but have tested, various solutions and I found blurred shots also without the panoramic head, with the NX1camera-lens group attached directly on the tripod, with no head, in the center of gravity of the group and at various distances from the center of gravity.

Different intensities of vibrations/blurred images obtained, but always there to ruine also my mental stability!

Probably cementing NX1 on a rock, it would be not more able to create blurred images, but would be an uncomfortable, not so handy solution.

Think no need to say more on this unhappy Samsung NX argument-topic, not me.

 

[markyboy81]

hello three nx1+ 1650s lens have an issue of blurred photos the first minute after switching on. (at any shutter speed with ois on or off) At least that's the case for me. after that they are sharp.

Does this also apply if the nx1 has been switched on but then goes into standby mode and is then woken by half pressing shutter?

 

[StenM]

Accuracy priority on - screen grab (to the right) from 4K video appears sharper than the crop of 6K photo


crop v. screen grab

 

[Tugela]

hello three nx1+ 1650s lens have an issue of blurred photos the first minute after switching on. (at any shutter speed with ois on or off) At least that's the case for me. after that they are sharp.

Does this also apply if the nx1 has been switched on but then goes into standby mode and is then woken by half pressing shutter?

The lens motors are on all the time when the camera is switched on. You will only have stability issues when they are spinning up. That is why you see problems like that just after a cold start. The motors are on irrespective of whether you are using IS or not, so "not using IS" is not going to resolve it. You need to let the camera operate for a minute or two before you start shooting. If you are constantly turning it on and off to conserve battery power or something like that, then you are probably going to get poor performance from the camera, while someone who is more patient will get excellent performance.

Like I said, personally I have never experienced anything like what the OP is describing, unless I start shooting immediately after flipping the on switch. I always turn the camera on a few minutes before I start so that it can stabilize, and then leave it on until I am done.

If the camera is in focus, I never, ever, see 4K sharper than stills.

 

[Tugela]

Accuracy priority on - screen grab (to the right) from 4K video appears sharper than the crop of 6K photo


crop v. screen grab

It just looks sharper to you because the video image has more pronounced sharpening applied to it. The resolution is actually pretty much the same. If you doubt me, open in photoshop, blow it up and look at the edges. The video image has way more pure white pixels on the edge than the stills image, and that creates the illusion of being sharper. The actual resolution however is the same.

 

[Giannis Ch]

I think I have seen what the OP is describing, but very rarely. For example, the camera is ON for awhile and after a series of shots, all are sharp apart from one (not the first, could be the last) that is slightly blurry with a shutter speed that should be more than plenty for the specific focal length. I check for misfocus, but it appears that all of photo is slightly blurry (I am speaking about a photo with depth, not a wall for example).

However, I have only noticed it a couple of times in thousands of shots and that's because I am picky.

 

[Tugela]

I think I have seen what the OP is describing, but very rarely. For example, the camera is ON for awhile and after a series of shots, all are sharp apart from one (not the first, could be the last) that is slightly blurry with a shutter speed that should be more than plenty for the specific focal length. I check for misfocus, but it appears that all of photo is slightly blurry (I am speaking about a photo with depth, not a wall for example).

However, I have only noticed it a couple of times in thousands of shots and that's because I am picky.

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/giannis_ch/

The OP's image is not showing vibration/movement blur however, it is simply out of focus.

 

[BernardoAdam]

Hello, a friend had similar problems with his NX1+16-50S (you can search in the forum (Ralph McIntosh - nearly 2 years ago). Since I remember it was hardware problems from the IS system. Samsung changed NX1 and 16-50S and since this time he is happy with his equipment. In your case it must be the lens, since 3 cameras cannot be defective.

 

[lebigmac]

I experienced a lot of problems with randomly absolutely blurry results in absolutely normal shooting environments, but I wasn't able to find a common reason for it (Kit lens, 30mm and 16-50s.) In some occassions, I found one sharp area in an otherwise blurry or unsharp image even though it all was in the same distance, like a wall for instance. As someone wrote here, it was like an hit and miss game. After sending the camera in two times I got it reimbursed. I bought a new one after that, and the issues were gone (I count the few bad ones to handling) .
The first one had firmware 1.00 on it, the second was delivered with 1.3x. (1.3.1 I think) Maybe there was some hardware error that was addressed in later manufacturing?

I have found quite a few reviews with "early" Nx1s exposing the problem, take a look at the sharpness section of this one, f.ex.: https://phillipreeve.net/blog/samsung-nx1-impressions-thoughts-sony-a7-user/

Here are two examples of mine:

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www.dpreview.com

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www.dpreview.com

 

[StenM]

Claudio NC states that: "the NX1 creates micro blurred images due to the vibration of the shutter blades" - this is known problem for Nikon - it's not the lenses as they work fine on NX500, NX1000, etc. The NX500 has a newer/different shutter mechanism ...

 

[Kisaha]

I do occasionally pro photography (my profession is videography) with my NX cameras and I haven't notice any of these. Some sessions last for 2000-3000 photos.

I believe my 16-50S needs some warm up in the beginning (something between 20-30 seconds) but it is a non factor in reality.