Still struggling with auto iso setup on D90

[Northeasterner]

So I’ve asked this before and I thought I had it figured out, but I stopped by a camera shop and the guy at the counter offered to go through my camera settings to help me get sharper photos and he completely changed everything in the iso menus. I’m still a beginner and want to use auto iso for a while. I was under the impression that lower iso = better quality and less noise on my old camera. I had it set as follows; auto on, max 3200, iso sensitivity 200, min shutter speed 1/500. He set iso sensitivity to 1250 and min shutter speed to 1/200. This didn’t make sense to me.



as a beginner using auto iso on a D90 shooting almost exclusively outdoors in daylight how would you recommend I set the iso menus ?

 

[David Lal]

As a beginner using auto iso on a D90 shooting almost exclusively outdoors in daylight how would you recommend I set the iso menus ?

That's how I would set auto-ISO unless I was dealing with rapidly changing light conditions such as walking through a forest with dappled sunlight patches or if skudding clouds were passing through a brightly lit sky.

I think you will learn much faster dealing with just two variables aperture and shutter while leaving ISO fixed (at, say 400). Probably on a decently lit day outside I'd begin with F8 and the camera in aperture priority. Too dark an image? Open the aperture to F6.3. Too overexposed? Close it down to F11.

DPR has a beginners' forum you might find useful: https://www.dpreview.com/forums/1002

 

[Blufftonian]

I have my cameras set to Manual with Auto ISO just about exclusively. And yes, the lower the ISO the better the quality of the image so I have it set at 100 on my D500. As for the max I set it very high. I don’t remember what I use to use on my old D90, but on my D500 I set it to 51200. I’m not sure it ever gets that high but I can fix a lot of noise with software. Take some photos at higher ISO values to figure out what you can live with as the max.

I mostly photograph birds so I use the shutter speed to control how much movement I want to stop. That typically means at least 1/1250 but often I’ll go higher and sometimes I’ll go lower, sometimes much lower if I want to see blur in the wings. I use the lens aperture to control depth of field and subject isolation. I also use exposure compensation a fair bit, especially for backlit subjects or all white, or all black, birds,

 

[Northeasterner]

I have my cameras set to Manual with Auto ISO just about exclusively. And yes, the lower the ISO the better the quality of the image so I have it set at 100 on my D500. As for the max I set it very high. I don’t remember what I use to use on my old D90, but on my D500 I set it to 51200. I’m not sure it ever gets that high but I can fix a lot of noise with software. Take some photos at higher ISO values to figure out what you can live with as the max.

I mostly photograph birds so I use the shutter speed to control how much movement I want to stop. That typically means at least 1/1250 but often I’ll go higher and sometimes I’ll go lower, sometimes much lower if I want to see blur in the wings. I use the lens aperture to control depth of field and subject isolation. I also use exposure compensation a fair bit, especially for backlit subjects or all white, or all black, birds,

As it’s turning out I’m mostly photographing birds too, ironically I got the camera to photograph aircraft but that’s only possible when one’s flying by, so I go walk around some local lakes looking for birds just so I can use my camera actually having more fun with birds than aircraft!

in the iso menu the “minimum shutter speed” setting should be set based on the max focal length of the lens I’m using right ? I’m using a 300mm full frame lens mostly so I set it to 1/500 (300mm x 1.5 on APS-C =450) and this keeps the shutter speed from going below that in aperture priority mode and auto mode ? Or did I completely miss something here ?

The iso range (excluding the L1,2,3 and H1,2,3…) is 200-3200 on my D90 so I set them as my minimum and maximum so it has the full iso range available. I mostly shoot in aperture priority and out in sunlight it usually picks a fairly high shutter speed (1/1000-1/3000) so even birds in flight still come out decent for me without switching the shutter priority and setting the shutter speed manually.

 

[David Lal]

in the iso menu the “minimum shutter speed” setting should be set based on the max focal length of the lens I’m using right ? I’m using a 300mm full frame lens mostly so I set it to 1/500 (300mm x 1.5 on APS-C =450) and this keeps the shutter speed from going below that in aperture priority mode and auto mode ?

Interesting how you have moved from metal birds to feathered ones. Good for you!

With birds, regardless of focal length of the lens, I aim for around 1/1000s which seems OK for most, at least the larger ones. It would not be enough for a humming bird - but we don't have too many of those in coastal East Sussex (UK).

To be honest, birds sitting on twigs or flapping across a sky don't really interest me unless they are exceptional. My bird photography is more a documentation of how close I can manage to get. Usually, I will watch behaviour, sometimes for hours, to predict whither they will fly.

This one is a flying peregrine falcon (fastest bird on the planet) - just about to land on its favourite pole and I was positioned accordingly only 3 or 4 metres away:

Flying peregrine


D300; Nik 300/F4; ISO was 400 (I think)

A bowl of nuts


High shutter speed unnecessary - small aperture and larger depth of field more important

By the way, I liked your 'Fire and Water' image you posted in the sampes gallery.

 

[Redhenry]

I’m happy using “vintage” D40 bodies, a couple of years older than your D90. I’ve experimented with the ISO settings and found that up to 800, there isn’t a huge difference in image quality. I leave my ISO set on 400. I’m starting to get old and can’t hold a camera as still as I used to so avoid shutter speeds below 1/200. I wouldn’t bother with auto ISO if I were you. As said in a previous post, shutter speed and aperture are the main things to concentrate on.

 

[WPMChan]

in the iso menu the “minimum shutter speed” setting should be set based on the max focal length of the lens I’m using right ? I’m using a 300mm full frame lens mostly so I set it to 1/500 (300mm x 1.5 on APS-C =450) and this keeps the shutter speed from going below that in aperture priority mode and auto mode ? Or did I completely miss something here ?

Correct, when you have good light, keeping the ISO at not higher than your maximum setting. The 1/FL rule for shutter speed is a good guideline to minimise effect of camera shake, especially at longer FL.

The iso range (excluding the L1,2,3 and H1,2,3…) is 200-3200 on my D90 so I set them as my minimum and maximum so it has the full iso range available. I mostly shoot in aperture priority and out in sunlight it usually picks a fairly high shutter speed (1/1000-1/3000) so even birds in flight still come out decent for me without switching the shutter priority and setting the shutter speed manually.

Agree. In very good light, camera like D90 tends to pick very high shutter speed at minimum ISO.

I have been using auto ISO most of the time for over 20 years. The max ISO setting will become more significant in low light situation. You certainly don't want the ISO to be higher than what you would be happy with, and you set the max ISO accordingly.

The minimum shutter speed will be less significant in low light. The Nikon Auto ISO control will prioritise ISO setting over shutter speed. If in a situation when max ISO is not high enough for optimum exposure, the shutter speed will be lowered to below the minimum setting.

Different photographer will have different ways in setting up the "ISO sensitivity settings". Only what works for you that counts.

I think that guy at the camera shop was trying to set the max ISO to what HE believed to be acceptable. ISO 1250 is quite low for a camera like D90. I had a D5100, similar vintage as the D90, a bit less sophisticated. I would be happy with ISO 2000, may be even a bit higher than that.

As I have pointed out, the minimum shutter speed will be less significant, as the camera will find the right shutter speed in Auto ISO, when the selected max ISO has been reached.

 

[Blufftonian]

I have my cameras set to Manual with Auto ISO just about exclusively. And yes, the lower the ISO the better the quality of the image so I have it set at 100 on my D500. As for the max I set it very high. I don’t remember what I use to use on my old D90, but on my D500 I set it to 51200. I’m not sure it ever gets that high but I can fix a lot of noise with software. Take some photos at higher ISO values to figure out what you can live with as the max.

I mostly photograph birds so I use the shutter speed to control how much movement I want to stop. That typically means at least 1/1250 but often I’ll go higher and sometimes I’ll go lower, sometimes much lower if I want to see blur in the wings. I use the lens aperture to control depth of field and subject isolation. I also use exposure compensation a fair bit, especially for backlit subjects or all white, or all black, birds,

As it’s turning out I’m mostly photographing birds too, ironically I got the camera to photograph aircraft but that’s only possible when one’s flying by, so I go walk around some local lakes looking for birds just so I can use my camera actually having more fun with birds than aircraft!

in the iso menu the “minimum shutter speed” setting should be set based on the max focal length of the lens I’m using right ? I’m using a 300mm full frame lens mostly so I set it to 1/500 (300mm x 1.5 on APS-C =450) and this keeps the shutter speed from going below that in aperture priority mode and auto mode ? Or did I completely miss something here ?

The iso range (excluding the L1,2,3 and H1,2,3…) is 200-3200 on my D90 so I set them as my minimum and maximum so it has the full iso range available. I mostly shoot in aperture priority and out in sunlight it usually picks a fairly high shutter speed (1/1000-1/3000) so even birds in flight still come out decent for me without switching the shutter priority and setting the shutter speed manually.

For me, the Auto ISO is generally the prime method of setting the exposure. I think of the aperture more of a way of setting depth of field and subject isolation than of using it to control exposure. Similarly with the shutter speed, I primarily think of it as a way to freeze, or not to freeze, action. I'm always in full Manual (rather than Aperture or Shutter priority) and I can control both of those with the wheels at my right index finger and thumb. Auto ISO takes care of everything else, with the possible addition of a little exposure compensation.

And for birds my lenses are typically shot wide open (my 200-500 and 500 PF at f/5.6, my 300 PF at f/4) to give me maximum isolation - keeping a low ISO is a nice plus - although I will stop down if I feel the need for more DOF.

Most of the time I take single shots although if the action is hot I'll take short bursts of maybe 4 or 5 exposures. My reactions are much slower than birds and that way I can pick the best out of a sequence when I load up the images to Lightroom.

Here's an osprey at dusk in my back yard. It's one I picked from a short sequence...



And here's a roseate spoonbill at a local marsh...



And a bald eagle, also at dusk and in my back yard.



Have fun out there!

 

[toomanycanons]

Second, practice setting your own iso number. I've never used auto iso

 

[David Lal]

.. the bald eagle but they are all splendid Kevin. Also, somehow, I think I recognise your style in all three. Well done.

 

[Blufftonian]

.. the bald eagle but they are all splendid Kevin. Also, somehow, I think I recognise your style in all three. Well done.

Thank you David for your kind comment. It’s very nice of you.

And I think with time we do all develop a style in the way we photograph and post process. We all still need to keep learning, and growing, though.

 

[Northeasterner]

Wow ! Those photos are amazing ! Gives me something to aspire too I love the peregrine and the eagle ! I have bald eagles around me but I can never seem to spot them within 500 yards when my camera is handy.



thanks for the input, I have bad weather where I’m at for about a week, don’t think I’ll be out with my camera until the rain stops But once it clears up I’m gonna focus on iso settings and get a better handle on it. I’ve got quite a few hot pixels on my camera, keeping the iso lower should help with that a bit anyway…

 

[lomoapontaechuta]

I have my cameras set to Manual with Auto ISO just about exclusively. And yes, the lower the ISO the better the quality of the image so I have it set at 100 on my D500. As for the max I set it very high. I don’t remember what I use to use on my old D90, but on my D500 I set it to 51200. I’m not sure it ever gets that high but I can fix a lot of noise with software. Take some photos at higher ISO values to figure out what you can live with as the max.

I mostly photograph birds so I use the shutter speed to control how much movement I want to stop. That typically means at least 1/1250 but often I’ll go higher and sometimes I’ll go lower, sometimes much lower if I want to see blur in the wings. I use the lens aperture to control depth of field and subject isolation. I also use exposure compensation a fair bit, especially for backlit subjects or all white, or all black, birds,

As it’s turning out I’m mostly photographing birds too, ironically I got the camera to photograph aircraft but that’s only possible when one’s flying by, so I go walk around some local lakes looking for birds just so I can use my camera actually having more fun with birds than aircraft!

in the iso menu the “minimum shutter speed” setting should be set based on the max focal length of the lens I’m using right ? I’m using a 300mm full frame lens mostly so I set it to 1/500 (300mm x 1.5 on APS-C =450) and this keeps the shutter speed from going below that in aperture priority mode and auto mode ? Or did I completely miss something here ?

The iso range (excluding the L1,2,3 and H1,2,3…) is 200-3200 on my D90 so I set them as my minimum and maximum so it has the full iso range available. I mostly shoot in aperture priority and out in sunlight it usually picks a fairly high shutter speed (1/1000-1/3000) so even birds in flight still come out decent for me without switching the shutter priority and setting the shutter speed manually.

Leave it at Auto ISO. 200-3200. He probably set to 1250 because of personal preference, and for D90, the 3200 ISO it's the max inside the native range, i'm not seeing the cam reaching that mark in bright Sun light, in night time or dim light it can reach 3200 but unless you have a faster lens ( around 1.8 or higher, 1.4 e.g. ) the results will not be great.

Faster lens are always shorter lens, so, not suitable for what you are doing

with that being said, here's one with 3200 Iso







Planes and birds require different approaches.

As a rule of thumb...

for stationary or birched birds, around 1/250 s to 1/500 s ( or swimming)

for slow moving / flying birds around 1/1000 s to 1/1500 s ( or swimming )

Flying birds 1/2000 s or up

The type of birds it's also a factor, if it's a small one higher shutter speeds but you can get away with slower shutters speeds with bigger ones. ( inside that rule of thumb )

Aperture, between F8 and F11... as a rule of thumb but you can use other apertures like 5.6 e.g. ( with closer and slower / birched birds )

VR always on, when you are shooting

For planes, jets you can have higher Shutter speeds than with propeller ones where around 1/320 s it's the "red line" to obtain some kind of movement in the propellers ( at least for me).

 

[Full Frame]

Second, practice setting your own iso number. I've never used auto iso

"By the livin' Gawd that made you, You're a better man than I am, Gunga Din!"

 

[Blufftonian]

Second, practice setting your own iso number. I've never used auto iso

Maybe you should. Using it is no different than letting the camera set f-stop or shutter speed. It’s just one of the three variables you need to control to get a good image. With fast moving subjects like birds, I don’t have the time to manually set all three, and depth of field and shutter speed are more important to me than ISO. I can fix noise from high ISO in post, but I can’t fix DOF or motion blur.

 

[WPMChan]

Maybe you should. Using it is no different than letting the camera set f-stop or shutter speed. It’s just one of the three variables you need to control to get a good image.

Agree, Auto ISO works very well most of the time for me, including in flash photography. Cameras are very clever these days and can make better and faster decisions than I can.

I use manual ISO if I want special results when in using flash, like low ISO for better subject isolation and higher ISO when I like to see more background.

Even such decision is only required when I use my D5600. My D780 comes with a setting for me to choose "Subject only" or "Subject and Background" when in using flash in Auto ISO. Looks like I would be using Auto ISO all the time when using the D780.

Then again, I know a few who do enjoy manual settings. Setting up the camera to get a brilliant image have been the best part of their photography experience.

 

[Full Frame]

Maybe you should. Using it is no different than letting the camera set f-stop or shutter speed. It’s just one of the three variables you need to control to get a good image.

Then again, I know a few who do enjoy manual settings. Setting up the camera to get a brilliant image have been the best part of their photography experience.

The best part of the photography experience should be the journey you took to get those far and few in-between "brilliant images". Spending countless hours reading books, watching videos, taking evening classes, joining camera clubs and meet-up groups. Looking at photos and guessing then verifying what settings were used or looking at a scene through your camera knowing the number of stops between different areas. Never stop learning.

A wold famous photographer was being interviewed and said out of the tens of thousands of photos taken only a small handful would he consider "brilliant".

I do realize that not that everyone has the time or inclination as I did.

As for auto ISO, i would not recommend it for a beginner. It takes away from the learning experience.

 

[David Lal]

As for auto ISO, i would not recommend it for a beginner. It takes away from the learning experience.

Absolutely agreed and just what I say too. In the old days one could not usually change between say, Tri-X at ASA 400 and Pan-F at ASA 120 film. That was a decision one made at the start of a session.

In addition to your list of learning activities I would add the fun and knowledge acquisition of experimenting for oneself.

Still, à chacun son goût.

 

[WPMChan]

I do realize that not that everyone has the time or inclination as I did.

You surely can find lots of people as enthusiastic and diligent as you are in photography.

As for auto ISO, i would not recommend it for a beginner. It takes away from the learning experience.

Sounds like my Fuji friend, wanting to set up his X-T1 manually for every shot, got great results and thoroughly enjoying doing that. His X-T1 has great high ISO performance and he has a very steady hand, often taking photo at 1/15 sec, part of his manual setting.

He shot RAW when I first met him. He has since given that up and just shoots Jpeg.

We often discuss how to get a good shot. He found out that I often use full auto for outdoor scenic shots and P mode, auto ISO with flash for indoor. He wasn't impressed, but we always ended up with a good laugh.

We travel together a lot and that his images are always brilliant, but I am happy with what I got. I just didn't show him my bad ones.

 

[Blufftonian]

...Absolutely agreed and just what I say too. In the old days one could not usually change between say, Tri-X at ASA 400 and Pan-F at ASA 120 film. That was a decision one made at the start of a session.

In addition to your list of learning activities I would add the fun and knowledge acquisition of experimenting for oneself.

Still, à chacun son goût.

You could change film with a Hasselblad CM 500 like mine. You just put the dark slide in to the camera body then swap out the A12 film back for another one loaded with different 120 film. Of course there was no automatic anything including metering. But that's where my Gossen Luna-Pro came in handy.

I still use that camera once in a while, but not for BIF. ;-)