Pan Indexing Click Rotator Head

[tradesmith45]

This is a DIY 45º wedge made from a sawed off piece of 2" Al bar stock. I ventilated it to cut the weight in half. I backpack so weight matters.

Its purpose is placing the ball head in a position so ball remains in the region with max movement rather than in the notch. This makes it easier to shot panos from atop a tracker. W/ the ball in the notch, its common to have to adjust both the base & ball while making a pano.

I'm considering switching to an Acratech Ultimate head.

But the other thing this wedge does is make the use of a simple nodal rail possible for pano. W/ a rail only, you must use the ball head panning base for rotations when the camera is tilted up/down in order to rotate around the lens nodal point. The camera has to be slid back/forth when tilted to place the nodal point over the axis of the head. This is complicated to write but easy to see if you try it.

Thanks Terry. Love the design of the wedge. I've been trying to solve the problem that this fixes. Wish it was available commercially.

Joe

A local machine shop can make something like this for you for maybe $100.

One problem w/ my DIY design is that to reposition the wedge, you have to run the tracker awhile if yours doesn't have a clutch system. An open design that Roger uses would allow use of a nut to attach the wedge an any desire position. Problem there is many trackers have very short tripod studs so the plate has to be thin & probably flexible.

You could also try Z plates from eBay or Amazon. Don't know how sturdy these are.

I’ve considered replacing the ball head I use on my Vixen Polarie with one of these:

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1182201-REG/sirui_bsrl20s_l_20s_2_way_pan_tilt_head.html

I have one but its heavy for backpacking - 1.5x the weight of my ball head. I've recommend to members of my photo club using one of these instead of a ball head UNDER a Vixen. Makes alignment easier. But in either case, it means all leveling has to be done with the tripod legs.

 

[NancyP]

They are revising the M2 upper rotator used in the M series pano kits. (per the M series kit description page)

 

[NancyP]

Oh, very nice indeed.

I would like a lighter weight ~44 degree declination wedge for under the equatorial mount (currently I use the Manfrotto 410 geared head for declination, along with a carpenter's angle level/protractor* to get head plane to 44 degrees)

and on the top of the mount, this ~ 45 degree mount with 3/8 x 16 male for the camera head.

A solid block design would require machine tools, wouldn't it?

* https://www.grainger.com/product/6A...2882!&ef_id=WvMzQgAAAF15wVdN:20180816194850:s good product, find at local HW store

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

They are revising the M2 upper rotator used in the M series pano kits. (per the M series kit description page)

Can I bother you with one last thing?

I've been to their site and looked all over the main M2 landing page, plus on several of the individual M1/M2 listings, but couldn't find any mention of future development for a click-stop upper-rotator. I looked in the forums, plus emailed them on Thursday (have yet to hear back).

If you know where on their site this is mentioned, could you provide a link. I'd appreciate it very much, to set my expectations of near-term purchases (I need to upgrade soon).

Thanks much, Chris

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

FYI: According to NN, they already came out with this upper rotator solution, 3 years ago. It's the M2 Giga product:

Fanotec Website | Page not found

shop.nodalninja.com

I was thinking and hoping that something simpler and cheaper would be coming, like with a click-stop upper rotator that worked much like the lower rotator, but that's not the case.

Chris

 

[1llusive]

FYI: According to NN, they already came out with this upper rotator solution, 3 years ago. It's the M2 Giga product:

https://shop.nodalninja.com/m2-giga-w-rd8-ii-f9000/

I was thinking and hoping that something simpler and cheaper would be coming, like with a click-stop upper rotator that worked much like the lower rotator, but that's not the case.

Chris

You better really want to do panoramas to spring for that. I'm sure it's nice, but it's the price of a high-end lens.

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

1llusive wrote:
[...]

You better really want to do panoramas to spring for that. I'm sure it's nice, but it's the price of a high-end lens.

Yeah, I have to remind myself of my original goal: find a better base / lower click-stop rotator and forget the Giga.

An M1 with a non-click upper rotator requires that you turn on a light to adjust the vertical tilt only, which would be just once per pano, so that'll have to be good enough for me.

It's a shame -- even if the upper rotator didn't have click stops, it wouldn't be rocket science to build in a SINGLE hard stop that you could set once with a light, then operate in the dark all night (as long as you didn't change focal length).

Chris

 

[NancyP]

It looks like the Nodal Ninja NN-6 has click stops on both lower and upper rotators, and is half the price of the M series.

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

It looks like the Nodal Ninja NN-6 has click stops on both lower and upper rotators, and is half the price of the M series.

Yeah, I saw that, but the upper rotator doesn't have adjustable click stops so much as it has positive detent lock at 7.5 degrees only (1 or more than one I'm not sure, but the way it is written is that it or they are all 7.5 degrees). So those stops are good for only a certain focal length; though you can disable the detent stop for free rotation.

And I'm not sure if the D10 rotator is the one for me -- it doesn't have the ball-bearing stops that the RD16-II has.

Chris

 

[Hoka Hey]

Not nearly as exciting or as expensive as the NN is the SunwayFoto DDP-64SI Indexing Rotator for 360x180deg. Spherical and HDR Panoramas, 17.6lbs Capacity, 64mm Diameter/Nadir Footprint . It is really smooth, has adjustable detent intervals and you can adjust the sensitivity of the clicks.

Joe

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

Not nearly as exciting or as expensive as the NN is the SunwayFoto DDP-64SI Indexing Rotator for 360x180deg. Spherical and HDR Panoramas, 17.6lbs Capacity, 64mm Diameter/Nadir Footprint . It is really smooth, has adjustable detent intervals and you can adjust the sensitivity of the clicks.

Hi Joe,

That's interesting. The main thing with the cheap rotator I got off of ebay is that there was play at each of the detents -- too much wiggle (even when screwed in tight). Does this one have a positive spot with no wiggle, or maybe just a little wiggle?

By 'adjust sensitivity', do you mean screw the plunger in loose or tight?

I noticed a discrepancy between the image and the description, but the first user review straightened that out.

This doesn't cost that much more than the ebay model, but it seems to actually have lubricated bearings (the first user review pointed this out as well).

Chris

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

PS: I found the text you were initially thinking of. On this page , this text appears (6th bullet item under the feature section):

• "Upper rotator upgradeable (optional) with precise positive stops up to 1.5 finest intervals (coming soon)"

I've emailed them to be sure that this is talking about the Giga head. If so, hopefully it also means they'll correct the page.

I also noted something mentioned about the M2 upper rotator head on this page , as follows:

"The upper rotator uses compression locking system and incorporates special tab to mark end points of rotator usage."

I asked what this special tab is to see if it is at least a single hard stop. It probably isn't, but I'll report back either way.

Chris

 

[Hoka Hey]

Not nearly as exciting or as expensive as the NN is the SunwayFoto DDP-64SI Indexing Rotator for 360x180deg. Spherical and HDR Panoramas, 17.6lbs Capacity, 64mm Diameter/Nadir Footprint . It is really smooth, has adjustable detent intervals and you can adjust the sensitivity of the clicks.

Hi Joe,

That's interesting. The main thing with the cheap rotator I got off of ebay is that there was play at each of the detents -- too much wiggle (even when screwed in tight). Does this one have a positive spot with no wiggle, or maybe just a little wiggle?

No wiggle in mine

By 'adjust sensitivity', do you mean screw the plunger in loose or tight?

Yes, works well

I noticed a discrepancy between the image and the description, but the first user review straightened that out.

This doesn't cost that much more than the ebay model, but it seems to actually have lubricated bearings (the first user review pointed this out as well).

This one is recommended by Ian Norman at lonelyspeck.com. So, I’m guessing that they are consistent.

Joe

 

[NancyP]

I suppose that one could get two base rotators with top AS clamps, attach a short AS plate to the top rotator, then get a right angle adapter AS clamp in which to insert top rail and two long (marked) nodal rails.

Hejnarphoto has buckets of rail choices (no rotators) and clamps, good quality, not RRS level but very good. I use their stuff if possible - American jobs.

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

I heard back from the NN folk as follows:

PS: I found the text you were initially thinking of. On this page , this text appears (6th bullet item under the feature section):

• "Upper rotator upgradeable (optional) with precise positive stops up to 1.5 finest intervals (coming soon)"

I've emailed them to be sure that this is talking about the Giga head. If so, hopefully it also means they'll correct the page.

That is indeed an obsolete reference and it is the Giga head they mean. It's not corrected as of this reply, but may be by the time you read this, future archaeologists.

Even if I got the best and most expensive non-Giga NN setup (M2 with RD16-II), it would still be $250 cheaper than with the Giga; though the Giga upgrade kit is $300.

I also noted something mentioned about the M2 upper rotator head on this page , as follows:

"The upper rotator uses compression locking system and incorporates special tab to mark end points of rotator usage."

I asked what this special tab is to see if it is at least a single hard stop. It probably isn't, but I'll report back either way.

It's not a hard stop.

Chris

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

I suppose that one could get two base rotators with top AS clamps, attach a short AS plate to the top rotator, then get a right angle adapter AS clamp in which to insert top rail and two long (marked) nodal rails.

Hejnarphoto has buckets of rail choices (no rotators) and clamps, good quality, not RRS level but very good. I use their stuff if possible - American jobs.

Thanks, I'll look them up.

Chris

 

[NancyP]

Giga setup is overkill unless one is using a long telephoto lens. Nodal Ninja seems to be working on a way to automate the process and the current pano kits are "robot compatible".

 

[jakelindsay]

PS: I found the text you were initially thinking of. On this page , this text appears (6th bullet item under the feature section):

• "Upper rotator upgradeable (optional) with precise positive stops up to 1.5 finest intervals (coming soon)"

I've emailed them to be sure that this is talking about the Giga head. If so, hopefully it also means they'll correct the page.

I also noted something mentioned about the M2 upper rotator head on this page , as follows:

"The upper rotator uses compression locking system and incorporates special tab to mark end points of rotator usage."

I asked what this special tab is to see if it is at least a single hard stop. It probably isn't, but I'll report back either way.

Chris

Thread resurrection....

By "upper rotator" do you guys mean the Tilt part of panos? There seem to be plenty of panning indexing click heads but I can't find any that have tilt indexing clicks. Any luck?

 

[NotASpeckOfCereal]

neverendinglight wrote:
[...]

Thread resurrection....

By "upper rotator" do you guys mean the Tilt part of panos? There seem to be plenty of panning indexing click heads but I can't find any that have tilt indexing clicks. Any luck?

Yes, the vertical rotation for tilting up down with stops is what I meant by upper rotator.

You need to spring for their Giga head ($$$). This link shows an M2 package with the Giga, or you can get a update kit for your existing M2 on their accessories menu (M2 parts).

I ended up with the package linked to in my previous post (M2 w/RD16-II (F8002)) and it's working just fine. If you pre-determine the degrees of tilt, you can just use the tab to mark the stop point, or just use the degree ticks on the marked index ring. I haven't had a problem with it, but I have yet to do a lot of astro panos (in the dark) yet.

Chris

 

[jakelindsay]

neverendinglight wrote:
[...]

Thread resurrection....

By "upper rotator" do you guys mean the Tilt part of panos? There seem to be plenty of panning indexing click heads but I can't find any that have tilt indexing clicks. Any luck?

Yes, the vertical rotation for tilting up down with stops is what I meant by upper rotator.

You need to spring for their Giga head ($$$). This link shows an M2 package with the Giga, or you can get a update kit for your existing M2 on their accessories menu (M2 parts).

I ended up with the package linked to in my previous post (M2 w/RD16-II (F8002)) and it's working just fine. If you pre-determine the degrees of tilt, you can just use the tab to mark the stop point, or just use the degree ticks on the marked index ring. I haven't had a problem with it, but I have yet to do a lot of astro panos (in the dark) yet.

Chris

Thanks! Weird that these guys are the only guys providing options for upper index clicks. I'm looking at taking a 90 image pano with 10 rows and 9 columns - IN THE DARK! Having the clicks both ways will be useful. Cheers!