Lets stop the arguments and probe what is said...

[Daniella68313]

what I don,t understand is why is the meetering of the 300d linked to the focusing point?

why is it not selectable like with the 10D?

answer? because it is a consumer level 300d...and that was my point.. it is not a PRO camera.

for those test shots..I was entirely leaving the exposure decision to the camera...i was there only to test the sharpness on my new APO lens. This is why I used the Av mode and left that decision to the camera.

now what I don,t understand is why can't I rely on the camera meetering ?

you own a 10d..do you also have a 300d?

The problem wasn't the metering in the camera. It was the lack of
thought, preperation and understanding on your part.

well that's your opinioin..that is not mine. this is what I beleive:

the camera meetering is WAY too weighted when you use the central
focusing mode. got it?? is that too hard to understand?

No I understand that is your opinioin. I don't agree but that is
ok. And even in the examples images in the link below each and
every exposure would show in the histogram and could be corrected
with a slight bias adjustment. What is so hard to understand about
that. You can set the histogram to show in the insant review. Quick
glance and adjust. This isn't rocket science...well knowing what is
inside these cameras maybe it is.

I beleive at this point only an image will five you the clue..

http://www.pbase.com/sandman3/rebel_tests

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Wild-Mike]

Danielle in the middle and everyone else trying to beat her up.

I'm going to go take a few pictures, have fun

--
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/
http://wnyboaters.com/

It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems longer -- Albert Einstein

 

[Daniella68313]

surely beats relying on the meetering system of the 300d.

heehe..

Regards,
xvrbx

stop up or down, or use a gray card.

By using a gray card, do you mean holding a gray card out in front
of the camera (where it would be exposed to the same lioght as the
subject) and doing an exposure lock on it?
Carl

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Kevin Bird]

Have any thoughts of replacing your 300D with the 10D? I just sold my 300D and my 10D will be here tomorrow. Can't wait

In your case, where you are in shade shooting into an area that is
in sun, you'd want to use the histogram to nail the exposure (hint:
use the histogram) and then set the 300D to manual mode and dial in
that aperture and shutter. This is done all the time in situations
were the lighting is relatively constant. I just shot a stage show
today and applied that very concept. Ths first few shots were test
shots to determine exposure and the remainder of almost 200 shots
were shot in manual.

ok this was a cloudy day...exposure was changing constantly.
clouds, sun, clouds, partial clouds..sun...

It is not the 300D per se that is giving you

trouble with correct exposure as almost all pro type slr bodies
will do the same in high contrast situations.

well I already said that this is a very difficult situation..but
with real evaluative mode you can do this easily! Or explain to me
how my cheap point and shoot can expose this perfectly?

there is also a dynamic range issue here because I was shooting at
.jpg in parameter 1..but I am not really talking about the blown
out highlights here..I am more refering to general overexposure and
underexposure problem because the meetering mode is too weighted
when you use central focusing point?

If you read my original message..I said that the first photo was
the best that I got...all other were WAY WAY overexposed or WAY WAY
underexposed like the second photo.

I don't beleive that is normal and that a PRO camera would have got
such results.

 

[Daniella68313]

yes...people are very qick to flame in this forum..you just can't say anythign negative about the camera or you'll be the ennemy instantly...

have a nice photo session..wish I could do the same but the excellent PRO 300d is at Canon for a shutter replacement after only 4000 pics

Danielle in the middle and everyone else trying to beat her up.

I'm going to go take a few pictures, have fun

--
http://tkis.com/wild-mike/
http://wnyboaters.com/

It's not that I'm so smart, it's just that I stay with problems
longer -- Albert Einstein

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[xvrbx]

It works great. The only drawback is when fotographing animals without opposable thumb that cannot hold the gey card properly. But most of the upper mammals can do the work with a little training

Regards,
xvrbx

heehe..

Regards,
xvrbx

stop up or down, or use a gray card.

By using a gray card, do you mean holding a gray card out in front
of the camera (where it would be exposed to the same lioght as the
subject) and doing an exposure lock on it?
Carl

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Leonard Richmond]

A pro knows the Sunny 16 rule:

"Mid-day sunlight exposure - f/16 at 1/ISO seconds".

and it corollary:

"Open up 3 stops for open shade (on a sunny day) - f/5.6 at 1/ISO seconds."

The exposure for your lighter shot is the open shade exposure. For the darker shot, you've got the equivalent of the sunlight exposure.

You've got black and white fur in sunlight AND in shade! A pro KNOWS that's not going to work. Burned out whites in the sunlight, or completely black darks in the shade.

So you recompose. Get this contrasty subject completely in the sun (recognizing that parts will still be in shadow and darks there will go completely black). Or completely in the shade (the best solution for such a contrasty subject). Or use fill flash if the subject is within range (probably not, since you're shooting 300 mm, or 480 mm equivalent).

Under the circumstances shown, a pro knows that he/she needs to check the metered exposure against what the rules would give, or by test shots and looking at the histogram (pre-digital, we pulled out our light meter). Just seeing those aperture, shutter speed and ISO combinations would have set off warning bells. "That's the daylight exposure - the blacks in the shade will be completely gone", or "that's the shade exposure - the whites in the direct sun will burn completely out."

Look at the face in the lighter picture. All the nose and eyes, and all the black on his head except above his left eye is in the shadow of the limb. Pretty good exposure using the open shade rule. Of COURSE, the white fur in the sun is going to burn out.

Looking at the darker picture, I have to wonder why the white fur isn't brighter. Your exposure is the Sunny 16, your EXIF data show 2 p.m., and the branch's shadow in the lighter picture indicates the sun was behind you and to the left. Should give you Sunny 16 white fur, but the white fur is too dark. Hazy sky, maybe? Or more likely, it's just that you're shooting a 70-300mm zoom wide open at 300mm, and a Pop Photo lens test report would show that the lens is 1/2 stop under (or even a little more) wide open at 300? That's my bet. Sure enough, the EXIF shows f/5.6, wide open for that lens at 300mm.

Of course, as a pro, you'd know your lens well enough to realize that and compensate for a sunny exposure and give it that extra half stop (maybe even 2/3) with that lens wide open at 300.

Bottom line: Just walking up, a pro could have nailed the light metering down to within a third of a stop just from the 2 rules stated above and knowledge of the lens, waited until the animal was completely in the sun, or preferably in the shade, and shot the exposure dead on without ever having to meter or take a test shot.

Been there, done that all the time, even with persnickity slide film in the OLD days. Sre beats blindly believing ANY metering scheme.

Of course, like you, I would much rather have the same evaluative metering that my Canon S30 has. But Canon didn't ask me...

 

[Daniella68313]

I wish I could..it's too late.. and now the camera is at Canon service because after one month it failed.

now the 300d is a good camera for 90% of the time.. but hey..it is no PRO camera.

I beleive that if I would have got a 10D with evaluative mode selected..those lemur photos woud have turned out much better.

Learn how to use it or return it. I've captured many a special
moment with my 10D. You can do the same with the the 300D. Do a
search on Travis. Travis bought a 300D a few months ago and has
posted many "special moments" type photos of his family that are
simply superb. If he can do it so can you.
If all you want is a camera that you push the button and it
magically produces magazine cover quality photos automatically
without input from you then no DSLR will suit you.

I just want a camera with a reliable meetering mode..is that too much to ask? is that not possible with a DSLR as well as a 300$ point and shoot?

I don,t beleive so.

--
Doug Walker
Check my profile for equipment list.

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[DRG]

Can anyone post samples of pictures taken with a "PRO" camera that
the 300D could not take?

By the same token, if someone has Pictures that can defeat the ones
posted please do so.

Lets demonstrate with results where the 300D stands...

I don't think you'll find useful answers asking this sort of question. It's akin to taking two cars (not SUVs) and comparing them according to what stretch of road couldn't be traversed by one or the other. You'll end up with extreme cases at the edges of typical use. Typically, a professional-level camera distinguishes itself by its ability to consistently get "money" shots though durability, speed and flexibility. You can get around any of these issues for any given image. However, in heavy use or in adverse conditions, you might find that the pro camera pulls through more often than the less expensive, possibly more fragile or failure-prone, possibly slower or less feature-rich cameras.

David

 

[Daniella68313]

did you exchange it in store ? we are pass the 14 days delay (( but yes lots of thoughts about it.

In your case, where you are in shade shooting into an area that is
in sun, you'd want to use the histogram to nail the exposure (hint:
use the histogram) and then set the 300D to manual mode and dial in
that aperture and shutter. This is done all the time in situations
were the lighting is relatively constant. I just shot a stage show
today and applied that very concept. Ths first few shots were test
shots to determine exposure and the remainder of almost 200 shots
were shot in manual.

ok this was a cloudy day...exposure was changing constantly.
clouds, sun, clouds, partial clouds..sun...

It is not the 300D per se that is giving you

trouble with correct exposure as almost all pro type slr bodies
will do the same in high contrast situations.

well I already said that this is a very difficult situation..but
with real evaluative mode you can do this easily! Or explain to me
how my cheap point and shoot can expose this perfectly?

there is also a dynamic range issue here because I was shooting at
.jpg in parameter 1..but I am not really talking about the blown
out highlights here..I am more refering to general overexposure and
underexposure problem because the meetering mode is too weighted
when you use central focusing point?

If you read my original message..I said that the first photo was
the best that I got...all other were WAY WAY overexposed or WAY WAY
underexposed like the second photo.

I don't beleive that is normal and that a PRO camera would have got
such results.

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Daniella68313]

no actualy I had better results with a 300$ and a 500$ point and shoot..Olympus c700 and Dimage 7 which all have evaluative meetering selectable..not the 300d.

I don't use film.

Am I right here?

Simone

but they all came out either overexposed or underexposed with the
300d...all 76 of them!

in fact..this one was my best:

http://www.pbase.com/image/23374967

and mostly very overexposed or underexposed like this one,
depending if I was focusing on the light or dark area....yes
focusing.

http://www.pbase.com/image/23374969

I never had any problem to take those lemurs with my C700uz 300$
point and shoot and my Dimage 7.

Can anyone post samples of pictures taken with a "PRO" camera that
the 300D could not take?

By the same token, if someone has Pictures that can defeat the ones
posted please do so.

Lets demonstrate with results where the 300D stands...

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Wm. Bates]

yes I saw it...outstanding and your more than qualified.

awesome work! really.

but I stil dont, accept your insults. as if there is no problem

It wasn't meant to be an insult....well maybe a little. But really were talking a tool here. Not all tools work for everyone. If it isn't working for you try something else. The metering work in a predictable manner so i'm not sure it is a fault. In tough metering situations change methods. i check my histogram after almost every shot. It has become just habit after fighting with my 10D the first few weeks. It was like that wit the Minolta D7 took me awhile to figure out that pretty much anything other that 100iso was going to give me noisy pics. So I stopped changing iso. Pretty much got to where it was manual set the Av to a good value for the desired dof and just dial the shutter speed till the evf looked good.

We're talking work arounds. And all these cameras and lens each have there quirks that need to be worked out. Things I have learned with Canon dslr are, shoot raw, double check the histogram, use the depth of feild preview button, watch your shutter speed and bump iso as needed, tripods are very good things, ai focus is blessing, and one that most will disagree with seven focus point is the way to go most of the time. When not in 7 point learn to move focus point fast instead of center and recomposing. 7 point and AIfocus switching to aiservo makes getting sharp in focus moving shots very easy.

with teh 300d..but there is.

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

 

[Kevin Bird]

I sold my lens on ebay for $202.50 and my body for $500, I just considered it a expensive learning experience. I should have waited to read the consumer reviews before I plunked down the money. I consider myself an average photographer but I found myself wanting more control.

In your case, where you are in shade shooting into an area that is
in sun, you'd want to use the histogram to nail the exposure (hint:
use the histogram) and then set the 300D to manual mode and dial in
that aperture and shutter. This is done all the time in situations
were the lighting is relatively constant. I just shot a stage show
today and applied that very concept. Ths first few shots were test
shots to determine exposure and the remainder of almost 200 shots
were shot in manual.

ok this was a cloudy day...exposure was changing constantly.
clouds, sun, clouds, partial clouds..sun...

It is not the 300D per se that is giving you

trouble with correct exposure as almost all pro type slr bodies
will do the same in high contrast situations.

well I already said that this is a very difficult situation..but
with real evaluative mode you can do this easily! Or explain to me
how my cheap point and shoot can expose this perfectly?

there is also a dynamic range issue here because I was shooting at
.jpg in parameter 1..but I am not really talking about the blown
out highlights here..I am more refering to general overexposure and
underexposure problem because the meetering mode is too weighted
when you use central focusing point?

If you read my original message..I said that the first photo was
the best that I got...all other were WAY WAY overexposed or WAY WAY
underexposed like the second photo.

I don't beleive that is normal and that a PRO camera would have got
such results.

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Wm. Bates]

what I don,t understand is why is the meetering of the 300d linked
to the focusing point?

why is it not selectable like with the 10D?

answer? because it is a consumer level 300d...and that was my
point.. it is not a PRO camera.

for those test shots..I was entirely leaving the exposure decision
to the camera...i was there only to test the sharpness on my new
APO lens. This is why I used the Av mode and left that decision to
the camera.

now what I don,t understand is why can't I rely on the camera
meetering ?

you own a 10d..do you also have a 300d?

My nephew who shoots wit me has 300D so I have played with it often. For what it is worth I leave my 10D in the same metering modes the reb is stuck with and aifocus most all the time. The spot metering is so wide it is not much value over partial from what I have seen and evaluative does a good job. When I do use the spotmeter it is to check different light values in a scene to determine roughly how many stops of light I'm dealing with. I'm old fashion to many stops of light and I pull out the Cokin Ps Graded ND filters.

The problem wasn't the metering in the camera. It was the lack of
thought, preperation and understanding on your part.

well that's your opinioin..that is not mine. this is what I beleive:

the camera meetering is WAY too weighted when you use the central
focusing mode. got it?? is that too hard to understand?

No I understand that is your opinioin. I don't agree but that is
ok. And even in the examples images in the link below each and
every exposure would show in the histogram and could be corrected
with a slight bias adjustment. What is so hard to understand about
that. You can set the histogram to show in the insant review. Quick
glance and adjust. This isn't rocket science...well knowing what is
inside these cameras maybe it is.

I beleive at this point only an image will five you the clue..

http://www.pbase.com/sandman3/rebel_tests

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

 

[Daniella68313]

I am not a pro! never claimed to be one..I am just an amateur learning like many people here. I just want to rely on a meetering system.

A pro knows the Sunny 16 rule:

"Mid-day sunlight exposure - f/16 at 1/ISO seconds".

and it corollary:

"Open up 3 stops for open shade (on a sunny day) - f/5.6 at 1/ISO
seconds."

The exposure for your lighter shot is the open shade exposure. For
the darker shot, you've got the equivalent of the sunlight exposure.

You've got black and white fur in sunlight AND in shade! A pro
KNOWS that's not going to work. Burned out whites in the sunlight,
or completely black darks in the shade.

I know there will be blown out areas...I guess I did not made my point clear..I was NOT concerned about blown highlitht at all here...and I think the first photos is at the best it can get due to the conditions here...but that the ONLY one that I got out of 76 there was exposed in that way..all other were TOTALY overexposed or TOTALY underexposed like the second photos. I unfortunatly deleted the overexposed ones because they were almost all white.

how do you explain this?

 

[Wm. Bates]

Have any thoughts of replacing your 300D with the 10D? I just sold
my 300D and my 10D will be here tomorrow. Can't wait

coming over to the 10D forum and complaining about focus problems. Were much nastier over there. ;^)
--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

 

[Daniella68313]

Ok that's what I thought...it was becoming more and more obvious that you did not own the camera.

the problem with the 300d is that it does not have evaluative..I could not choose this but you can...you have a pro camera..or semi pro camera..the 300d is by no mean anywehre near the 10D.

The problem wasn't the metering in the camera. It was the lack of
thought, preperation and understanding on your part.

well that's your opinioin..that is not mine. this is what I beleive:

the camera meetering is WAY too weighted when you use the central
focusing mode. got it?? is that too hard to understand?

No I understand that is your opinioin. I don't agree but that is
ok. And even in the examples images in the link below each and
every exposure would show in the histogram and could be corrected
with a slight bias adjustment. What is so hard to understand about
that. You can set the histogram to show in the insant review. Quick
glance and adjust. This isn't rocket science...well knowing what is
inside these cameras maybe it is.

I beleive at this point only an image will five you the clue..

http://www.pbase.com/sandman3/rebel_tests

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

--
I am not an English native speaker!
http://www.pbase.com/zylen
http://www.photosig.com/go/users/userphotos?id=26918

 

[Kevin Bird]

I either resolve problems or get rid of them. I don't complain much. If it's a front or rear focus problem, send it in with a 50 1.8 to calibrate. The 10D I understand has faster focusing than the 300D as I have read. I shoot 700+ sports pictures a week, I'll be able to compare easily

Have any thoughts of replacing your 300D with the 10D? I just sold
my 300D and my 10D will be here tomorrow. Can't wait

coming over to the 10D forum and complaining about focus problems.
Were much nastier over there. ;^)
--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

 

[Wm. Bates]

But I use the partial metering and AIfocus almost all the time. So not much difference really.

AS far as pro, no I don't think the 300D really fits the bill. I don't think it will hold up over the long run to hundreds of photos day in and day out. As for function there are very few times I would feel under gunned with a 300D. It is why I recommend it to my nephew over the 10D. He trades up cameras every few months it seems. He won't have it long enough to wear it out. Kids! The only things I would really miss with the Rebel are no mirror lockup and no FEC. Both are features I use often and wouldn't want to be without.
--
Bill
http://www.pbase.com/slowpokebill
'Sometime the magic works. Sometimes it doesn't'

 

[Mikeslc]

Daniella, remember your comments about how people get offended too easily? You have some nice work, but don't get too carried away as many people have good work too. Some like to show off and some don't. IMO, Photography skills isn't the same as Photoshop skills. I often wonder if you realize how frequent you do insult other people.

Seems that Canon's beginner DSLR is a little over your head.

do you have any brain in there??? hello!!!????

however..we can surely compare our photos if you want to judge my
photography skills...

here is my gallery: http://www.pbase.com/zylen

where is yours????????????????????

I don,t beleive you're getting my point... my point was that the
300d has not enough control over the meetering and the focusing
mode to be considered a PRO camera.

and your freaking insult wont change anything.

PERIOD