Infrared with the M system

[MacM545]

I happened to find your post after asking about using Lumix cameras for UV and IR. An interesting try also could be a narrowband filter. It May also be interesting to try a filter such as a narrowband Green that can transmit also, a narrow band of INfrared at about 1,100nm; I don’t currently remember the name of it but if interested, let me know, as there are also other such filters available which I have never seen tried on a camera before, whether stock or modified.

 

[Larry Rexley]

I happened to find your post after asking about using Lumix cameras for UV and IR. An interesting try also could be a narrowband filter. It May also be interesting to try a filter such as a narrowband Green that can transmit also, a narrow band of INfrared at about 1,100nm; I don’t currently remember the name of it but if interested, let me know, as there are also other such filters available which I have never seen tried on a camera before, whether stock or modified.

I have a Hoya X1 which transmits only green and then a little IR light, it doesn't really work well as a standalone dual-band filter but if you combine it with others, the net result can be green and more infrared.

I also have a Hoya X0 yellow-green filter which transmits quite a bit more IR and seems to be more useful for IR. The spectral response curves for both those filters are easy to find using google search for example 'hoya X1 curve'.

I haven't tried any other green filters as mostly I'm trying to bring out interesting foliage colors, so normally I try to exclude green! My favorite overall is the Tiffen #47, it acts as a nice dual-band filter and can give you super-color-like IR images without reversing in post processing, and can compose thru the camera with blue skies and white or golden foliage.

 

[petrochemist]

I have a Hoya X1 which transmits only green and then a little IR light, it doesn't really work well as a standalone dual-band filter but if you combine it with others, the net result can be green and more infrared.

I have three different #58 / X1 filters, one (a gel which wouldn't be coated) transmits loads of IR, one hardly any with the third in the middle.

The wratten spectra of the #058 only shows the visual range, I suspect the variation in IR is down to coatings.

 

[HaroldC3]

Can we get folks to post in this thread in the feedback forum so we can try and get an IR forum created?

IR Photography

We have a Windows Phone Talk forum but no IR photography forum?? I think there would be a great amount of interest in discussing this technique.

www.dpreview.com

 

[Garry2306]

Can we get folks to post in this thread in the feedback forum so we can try and get an IR forum created?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66617895

I just posted the following on that forum

I have several Magic Lantern M cameras converted to IR and Full spectrum, and just treated myself to an M10 conversion at 720nm.

The advantage of the M10 is that it runs CHDK, so I’m able to use my focus and exposure bracketing script, eg https://photography.grayheron.net/2022/06/landscape-bracketing-script-update.html

Here’s a test, single image I took the other day and colour processed, rather than doing a B&W version.

 

[Larry Rexley]

Can we get folks to post in this thread in the feedback forum so we can try and get an IR forum created?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66617895

I just posted the following on that forum

I have several Magic Lantern M cameras converted to IR and Full spectrum, and just treated myself to an M10 conversion at 720nm.

The advantage of the M10 is that it runs CHDK, so I’m able to use my focus and exposure bracketing script, eg https://photography.grayheron.net/2022/06/landscape-bracketing-script-update.html

Here’s a test, single image I took the other day and colour processed, rather than doing a B&W version.

Nice image... I like the mood.

I've read a lot about Magic Lantern but never tried it. Canon started implementing some of the extra features it provided in the later M cameras like the M200, M50ii, and M6ii, and I haven't been tempted to dabble further.

 

[Garry2306]

Can we get folks to post in this thread in the feedback forum so we can try and get an IR forum created?

https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/66617895

I just posted the following on that forum

I have several Magic Lantern M cameras converted to IR and Full spectrum, and just treated myself to an M10 conversion at 720nm.

The advantage of the M10 is that it runs CHDK, so I’m able to use my focus and exposure bracketing script, eg https://photography.grayheron.net/2022/06/landscape-bracketing-script-update.html

Here’s a test, single image I took the other day and colour processed, rather than doing a B&W version.

Nice image... I like the mood.

I've read a lot about Magic Lantern but never tried it. Canon started implementing some of the extra features it provided in the later M cameras like the M200, M50ii, and M6ii, and I haven't been tempted to dabble further.

Larry, Magic Lantern only runs on the M, on my M3 and M10 I use CHDK.

As both ML and CHDK give you real math Lua scripting, you can do all the things Canon doesn’t let you ;-)

Things like auto ETTR at the push of a button. Complex focus and exposure bracketing, at the push of a button. Focus feedback, eg for infinity focus. BTW my script includes the option of convolving optical blur with vis or IR diffraction.

Fun stuff

 

[Carl LaFong]

This IR stuff is interesting. I shot a few rolls of IR back in my B&W film days in the last century, but have not experience since.

I might have missed it, but how does one “convert” a digital camera (specifically a Canon M) to IR?

 

[petrochemist]

This IR stuff is interesting. I shot a few rolls of IR back in my B&W film days in the last century, but have not experience since.

I might have missed it, but how does one “convert” a digital camera (specifically a Canon M) to IR?

Some cameras have enough IR sensitivity to be usable with just a filter added to the lens, but most need the internal IR/UV blocking 'hot mirror' removed from the sensor stack (and normally replaced with something else quartz, glass or a filter)

 

[Carl LaFong]

I figured it was something like that, but I don’t know who does that kind of thing, because I wouldn’t know where to start.

 

[Photoclever]

Interestingly, shooting full-spectrum, the camera seems to collect 2/3 EV more light than a normal camera... this could have some interesting implications for low-light night photography.

It should be 1ev at night. Roughly half the available light at night is in the IR band.

 

[barbara j]

I figured it was something like that, but I don’t know who does that kind of thing, because I wouldn’t know where to start.

I sent my GX9 to lifepixel to have the hot mirror replaced by a piece of clear glass. More people today are using Kolari.

I can still use an filter on the lens to shoot great "regular" color

 

[Larry Rexley]

Interestingly, shooting full-spectrum, the camera seems to collect 2/3 EV more light than a normal camera... this could have some interesting implications for low-light night photography.

It should be 1ev at night. Roughly half the available light at night is in the IR band.

I don't remember the context I was thinking of when quoting 2/3 EV. I may have been shooting trains lit by a variety of light sources including street lights of various 'flavors' including sodium vapor lights, LED and other colors. When lit by residual daylight (skylight), or shooting astro, I think you're right it's about 1 EV more light captured with full spectrum, needing half the exposure of a standard camera.

 

[Carl LaFong]

I figured it was something like that, but I don’t know who does that kind of thing, because I wouldn’t know where to start.

I sent my GX9 to lifepixel to have the hot mirror replaced by a piece of clear glass. More people today are using Kolari.

I can still use an filter on the lens to shoot great "regular" color

Thanks Barbara,

That gives me a good starting place.

Now to decide which body to use, once I decide to go ahead. Don’t want to mess around with either of my M6 II’s, and I want to keep my M200 unchanged because it’s “handy’’, so that leaves my M5 as the most likely candidate.

 

[barbara j]

I figured it was something like that, but I don’t know who does that kind of thing, because I wouldn’t know where to start.

I sent my GX9 to lifepixel to have the hot mirror replaced by a piece of clear glass. More people today are using Kolari.

I can still use an filter on the lens to shoot great "regular" color

Thanks Barbara,

That gives me a good starting place.

Now to decide which body to use, once I decide to go ahead. Don’t want to mess around with either of my M6 II’s, and I want to keep my M200 unchanged because it’s “handy’’, so that leaves my M5 as the most likely candidate.

Just for interest:

Canon M5 Full Spectrum Infrared Converted Mirrorless Camera – Kolari Vision

Convert your Canon DSLR camera to infrared or full spectrum with our large selection of supported models and enjoy easy handheld infrared photography.

kolarivision.com

 

[Larry Rexley]

I figured it was something like that, but I don’t know who does that kind of thing, because I wouldn’t know where to start.

I sent my GX9 to lifepixel to have the hot mirror replaced by a piece of clear glass. More people today are using Kolari.

I can still use an filter on the lens to shoot great "regular" color

Thanks Barbara,

That gives me a good starting place.

Now to decide which body to use, once I decide to go ahead. Don’t want to mess around with either of my M6 II’s, and I want to keep my M200 unchanged because it’s “handy’’, so that leaves my M5 as the most likely candidate.

To me that sounds like a good plan... The M5 would make a great IR camera.

Isaac Dzabo did my M200 conversion... Less than the bigger companies, and he did a great job. I highly recommend him.

 

[Larry Rexley]

This is one of my favorite 'mood' infrared images, taken at the Orange Hill Cemetery in Tampa, FL in April 2023.

It was shot with a full-spectrum infrared-converted M200, with a $6 950-nm deep infrared filter I got off eBay and the Laowa 9mm f2.8 Zero-D lens at f8, 1 second time exposure on a tripod, ISO 100.

This ultra-wide image combines the deep infrared's ability to render almost pure black-and-white with a ghostly glow, turning the foliage white, rendering the sunlight filtering down into a beautiful light appearing to shine down from heaven onto the graves. The image almost has a night/Moonlit quality to it.