Epson P5370 Issue - Question for P5370 Users

[Gryphon69]

I do hope this does solve your issue, so you can start enjoying this amazing printer.

Thank you Alan, so do I: after going through five different printers from two manufacturers in 12 months (and as many new setups and calibrations, adjustments, etc.) I wouldn’t mind the switch from troubleshooting mode to just enjoying printing! At any rate, I have seen what the P5370 is capable of by printing from a roll, which is impressive - I would just love to have the flexibility of also being able to print from cut sheets when it makes sense to do so and get equally impressive prints. Fingers crossed.

Although the techs explanation is feasible, it sounds to me that it is more likely that the rollers supplied for this particular batch of printers were defective, or out of spec, rather that the wrong part number.

Completely agree with you: wrong part number sounds very unlikely considering the level of automation that there is in today’s assembly facilities. Much more likely that Epson got a bad batch of rollers from a supplier, which might even explain why the spare parts have been back ordered. Whatever the cause of the issue, I just hope they have a set of “correct rollers” in stock that they can install on my printer and that take care of the issue. We’ll see how it goes.

--
Alan
www.Studio1zImaging.com

 

[jochenb]

I might need to add that the marks my friends and I are noticing (also in PRO-1100 prints) seem to be fainter than the ones in your examples.

I didn’t notice them at first, until I got a brighter lamp for checking my prints. Now, it’s hard to unsee them.

I use the exact same papers you mentioned, but for me, it’s actually the opposite. The marks are more noticeable on something like HFA FineArt Baryta than on Photo Rag Pearl or Canson Platine. But that’s just because imperfections show up more easily on glossier coatings.

So, it seems that your Epson rollers are putting more pressure on the paper, which could explain your findings regarding the type of paper. Photo Rag Pearl "chips" more easily than FineArt Baryta or Baryta Satin.

It just doesn’t seem possible to get completely mark-free glossy prints when rollers are advancing the paper during printing.

In this thread, people mention that bright lights aren’t allowed and that only inspecting the print from a distance (behind glass) is accepted. Sure... in such cases, my prints are fine.

I hope the Epson technicians can help you out with different rollers!

I also have a can of Hahnemühle Protective Spray, but I don't like it. It does hide some issues (it also helps with bronzing), but changes the look of the paper.

 

[Gryphon69]

I might need to add that the marks my friends and I are noticing (also in PRO-1100 prints) seem to be fainter than the ones in your examples.

Yes, in my case the marks on the cotton rag papers in particular are pretty bad and pretty conspicuous.

I didn’t notice them at first, until I got a brighter lamp for checking my prints. Now, it’s hard to unsee them.

For me too! And honestly I do not have the confidence to sell a print in that condition, so either Epson can fix the issue by replacing the rollers or I will have to print only from roll paper those images that would be affected by the issue if printed on cut sheets.

I use the exact same papers you mentioned, but for me, it’s actually the opposite. The marks are more noticeable on something like HFA FineArt Baryta than on Photo Rag Pearl or Canson Platine. But that’s just because imperfections show up more easily on glossier coatings.

This is a very interesting observation.

So, it seems that your Epson rollers are putting more pressure on the paper, which could explain your findings regarding the type of paper. Photo Rag Pearl "chips" more easily than FineArt Baryta or Baryta Satin.

That is what I think is happening too, unless the rollers installed in certain P5370 units come from a substandard or defective batch.

It just doesn’t seem possible to get completely mark-free glossy prints when rollers are advancing the paper during printing.

And yet I have been in touch with a forum member and with someone else who is not a member here and they both have early production P5370’s and both of them can print images that would show roller marks if printed on my printer with no issue. This makes me think that there is a problem with the rollers in my printer.

In this thread, people mention that bright lights aren’t allowed and that only inspecting the print from a distance (behind glass) is accepted. Sure... in such cases, my prints are fine.

And I am sure that so are prints that are stored in an album and kept in a dark room for that matter… But I think that that cannot be the standard that a professional photographic printer should live up to. In the immortal words of Terence Fletcher: “there are no two words in the English language more harmful than ‘good job’” ;-)

I hope the Epson technicians can help you out with different rollers!

So do I, although now they are all of a sudden stalling without providing information. Not sure if this is because they keep having inventory issues. I will keep pushing them. We’ll see, but it’s pretty frustrating. Feels like Canon tech support is light years ahead of Epson’s in terms of actually doing something to help their customers.

I also have a can of Hahnemühle Protective Spray, but I don't like it. It does hide some issues (it also helps with bronzing), but changes the look of the paper.

I do too, although I have been mostly using it on matte paper, not luster/semigloss. I will give it a try though, thanks for the tip.

 

[Lumpia]

It just doesn’t seem possible to get completely mark-free glossy prints when rollers are advancing the paper during printing.

Under bright lights I don't see any marks even for prints with a lot of black areas.

 

[Gryphon69]

It just doesn’t seem possible to get completely mark-free glossy prints when rollers are advancing the paper during printing.

Under bright lights I don't see any marks even for prints with a lot of black areas.

Thank you: you are confirming what two other P5370 users told me.

Just out of curiosity, how long ago did you buy your P5370? No need to provide a specific date, just a general idea of how long ago that was as both people I spoke to were early adopters and got their well-functioning P5370’s more than 6 months ago.

 

[Lumpia]

Just out of curiosity, how long ago did you buy your P5370? No need to provide a specific date, just a general idea of how long ago that was as both people I spoke to were early adopters and got their well-functioning P5370’s more than 6 months ago.

I've had mine for about 2 months, but I think it was at the store longer than that. If I remember correctly, it was in the store for almost a year.

 

[Gryphon69]

Just out of curiosity, how long ago did you buy your P5370? No need to provide a specific date, just a general idea of how long ago that was as both people I spoke to were early adopters and got their well-functioning P5370’s more than 6 months ago.

I've had mine for about 2 months, but I think it was at the store longer than that. If I remember correctly, it was in the store for almost a year.

Thank you, very helpful.

 

[Lumpia]

btw, the light gray gets used up first followed by the other light colors. The remaining colors get used up a lot less. Just in case you're not sure which replacement inks to have on hand.

 

[Gryphon69]

btw, the light gray gets used up first followed by the other light colors. The remaining colors get used up a lot less. Just in case you're not sure which replacement inks to have on hand.

Thank you! I noticed the same thing that you are mentioning with my first P5370 that got replaced by the current one. The two inks that were depleting more rapidly were light grey and photo black, followed by grey. The other inks were decreasing at a much slower pace.

This information is particularly helpful because I have noticed on the B&H website intermittent “out of stock” alerts on certain P5370 inks. They appear to get back in stock in a relatively short period of time though.

 

[ken5678]

btw, the light gray gets used up first followed by the other light colors. The remaining colors get used up a lot less. Just in case you're not sure which replacement inks to have on hand.

Thank you! I noticed the same thing that you are mentioning with my first P5370 that got replaced by the current one. The two inks that were depleting more rapidly were light grey and photo black, followed by grey. The other inks were decreasing at a much slower pace.

This information is particularly helpful because I have noticed on the B&H website intermittent “out of stock” alerts on certain P5370 inks. They appear to get back in stock in a relatively short period of time though.

Once the printer is in "production mode", and it will be then it's worthwhile to buy a light grey. you will be able to get a fair number (or one might say a lot) of prints before the original runs out, but you'll have peace of mind if its on your shelf, and odds are very high that light grey will run out first, and then you can pace yourself based on this data for the other cartridges.

also, on MAC OS, when you are looking at ink levels and hover the mouse over a specific color, it will give you a percentage left. note, when it gets to 1%, you have a lot more than 1% left. as all epsons, just keep printing until you are forced to change.

 

[Gryphon69]

I would like to provide an update about the issues that I have been experiencing with roller marks on fine art PK cut sheets printed on my P5370. Note that this has been cross-posted to the Epson WF printers forum, so if you are on that group too, please skip this.

Given Epson’s inventory shortages affecting certain parts that would be required for servicing my printer (specifically, the star wheels), I called B&H who have been super helpful and have agreed to replace my P5370. I have since received a new unit with a S/N that is greater than my original unit by about 200 and after setting it up I have found that it has the same issue (visible pizza wheel marks in black or dark colored areas).

I have reached out to Epson Tech Support once more and things have been weird. At first they were all like, oh yeah, you have an issue with the paper eject rollers and we need to replace them - we just need to check if we have all the parts in stock. Sounded promising.

Then more than a week went by with me calling daily to understand whether or not they had the parts in stock (didn’t seem too complex/time-consuming to determine) and I got in a loop of “we are still checking” or “I need to talk to an engineer and I will revert later today or tomorrow”. They even transferred me to an engineer who basically told me the same things.

After a week with no news and a few increasingly frustrated emails and voice mails, I got a call from a local technician who wanted to set up an appointment for servicing my printer as soon as I receive the necessary parts from Epson. Over the next couple of days I received two packages from Epson, one with the roller motor and one with the star wheels, and I set up an appointment with the technician. Progress, I thought.

Yesterday the technician came over, I showed him the issue on both B&W and color satin fine art papers, both from Canson (Platine FR) and from Epson (Legacy Platine), and he documented it and sent pictures to Epson Tech Support (I had already sent a collection of pictures to them when the issue had originally come up with my original printer). We also made a couple of prints when he was there, who showed the same issue.

We then talked about settings and the endless troubleshooting that I had already done. He finally spent a long time over the phone with Epson Tech Support (both level 1 and level 2) and in the end he told me that Epson had advised him not to replace the rollers because they had not even sent all the necessary parts for him to do so (!) and to tell me that there was nothing else he could do for me. While recognizing that this was unacceptable, he advised that I get back in touch with Epson Tech Support.

I called them up again and spoke with a guy who attempted to give me some attitude by making blanket, unverified statements like “there’s nothing we can do to help because all P5370’s have that issue because they all have star wheels on their rollers” or “you already had one printer replaced and the replacement unit has the same issue, which means it is not an issue as otherwise you’d have won the lottery [he really used those words - quite a lottery to win…] in getting two printers that are both defective”.

I easily disproved both of his pseudo-arguments by providing first-hand experience with other P5370 users that I know (one of whom is a member here) who sent me pictures of prints that they made on their P5370’s on the same papers that I use which do not show any roller marks and by asking the guy what kind of factual elements he could provide to support his claim that two printers that are relatively close to one another in terms of their serial numbers do not come from a same batch that may have used defective rollers coming from a given Epson supplier, which he obviously was not in a position to articulate. Regardless, he said there was nothing else he could do for me.

To say that I am majorly disappointed in Epson’s tech support is a major understatement. And when I bought my P5370 I even shelled out the money for a 4-year extended service plan, which cost me more than 50% of the cost of the printer.

Thanks to the kindness of a forum member here who has a P5370, I am now in the process of documenting the different outcomes that he and I get from our respective printers when printing the same image on the same papers (including Epson papers) and using the same settings and the same printing software (Epson Print Layout) on Mac computers. Unless someone here has better ideas/recommendations that they are willing to share, I will then reach out to Epson Customer Relations and demand that they fix the issue. If I do not get a satisfactory response from them, I will further escalate the issue at the Epson USA corporate level. It would be sad if it came to that.

Canon’s tech support and customer relations team are incomparably better and far more respectful of their customers and the issues that they experience than the abysmal “service” that I have received from Epson so far. Issues can happen - the real difference is made by the way a company deals with them and interacts with its customers. Now I am in this situation and I will be stuck with Epson for the next five years because of the service plan that I bought from them, but once that is over I will make certain to stay away from Epson for all my future printing needs.

 

[bmw44]

Sorry to hear about your negative experience with Epson Tech support. Could you demand a full refund?

My experience has been the opposite with an Epson P900. Of course, the printer has been replaced multiple times. So my problem is poor quality control with the P900 while the tech support has been outstanding.

Finally your comment about Canon printer service does not correspond to the problems people are having with the Pro 1100 printer. I wonder if Canon has agreed to give anyone a full refund for that printer.

 

[Gryphon69]

Sorry to hear about your negative experience with Epson Tech support. Could you demand a full refund?

My experience has been the opposite with an Epson P900. Of course, the printer has been replaced multiple times. So my problem is poor quality control with the P900 while the tech support has been outstanding.

Finally your comment about Canon printer service does not correspond to the problems people are having with the Pro 1100 printer. I wonder if Canon has agreed to give anyone a full refund for that printer.

 

[jochenb]

I'm sorry to hear that.

Sounds like a lot of wasted time and effort, with still no positive outcome...

Are you judging the prints of the "good" P5370 the exact same way as your own prints?

It actually doesn't surprise me that your new copy shows the same thing.

Like I said in a previous post, I'm just not used to seeing completely markless (dark) glossy prints when they've been in contact with the spiky row of wheels in the paper feed, with any brand.

The depth of the marks does vary, though. Yours seem to actually remove the coating or ink, making them much more visible.

So to me, it’d be amazing if they really have a new set of rollers that completely eliminate this issue. Let's hope they do, but I have yet to witness it myself.

Epson support sounds a lot like Canon’s over here. A real shame.

 

[Gryphon69]

I'm sorry to hear that.

Sounds like a lot of wasted time and effort, with still no positive outcome...

Are you judging the prints of the "good" P5370 the exact same way as your own prints?

Hi jochenb, good to hear from you and thanks for your comments. You sure went to the core of the problem. So far I am not 100% certain because everything has been done remotely, although I have received input from multiple professional or advanced P5370 users telling me that they cannot see roller marks on their cut sheets when printing similar images on the same media.

In order to make the exercise more scientific, I have come up with a list of all applicable parameters (hardware and software related) and I am coordinating with an extremely kind and helpful forum member who has a P5370 that is supposed to be problem-free so that we will both print the same image on the same media by using the exact same settings and then we will compare the end results.

This exercise should give us a good idea of any differences or similarities in the final prints.

It actually doesn't surprise me that your new copy shows the same thing.

Like I said in a previous post, I'm just not used to seeing completely markless (dark) glossy prints when they've been in contact with the spiky row of wheels in the paper feed, with any brand.

I hear you, but (certainly anecdotally) I do not seem to remember getting from my old 4900 or from the three Canon Pro 1100’s that I have used anything even remotely as bad (in terms of roller marks) as what I am getting from my P5370. Even the technician who came over to look at my printer said that he had not seen similar output issues from any other P5370 that he serviced.

The depth of the marks does vary, though. Yours seem to actually remove the coating or ink, making them much more visible.

Yes, that’s right: the marks are so deep that they remove the ink from where the star wheels hit and the paper surface shows through, so if I am printing on black/dark ink I get these unsightly white dotted lines across most of the surface of the print.

So to me, it’d be amazing if they really have a new set of rollers that completely eliminate this issue. Let's hope they do, but I have yet to witness it myself.

I guess my point in the end is this: if it were confirmed that the behavior of my P5370 is what any user can normally expect from that printer, this would mean that the only way to print on PK paper contrasty B&W images or low key images in general from the P5370 is from a roll. I bet no client would ever accept a white-dotted print that is not supposed to be white-dotted! ;-)

I am still not convinced that this is the case as I would guess that someone would have raised the point, while my understanding was that the P5370 was a printer that was not susceptible to roller marks - and if the issue was so bad, I would expect Epson to warn their customers in the user guide that the P5370 cannot successfully print certain types of images on PK media, not even Epson-branded media.

Epson support sounds a lot like Canon’s over here. A real shame.

Honestly up until now I find them worse than Canon’s (once you go past level 1 tech support). Despite the woes of the Pro 1100, Canon tech support sent me two replacement units overnight and at least tried to fix the issue. Epson has so far been in denial and actively trying to stonewall, which is not cool.

I am waiting to hear back from the technician who has escalated the matter on his end and is in contact with the Epson APS team to see if anything helpful comes out of it, otherwise I will pursue other avenues (assuming the results of my comparative test confirm my theory).

 

[Stefano Germi]

Are the same pizza wheels that I have to Epson p900 with paper like Canson Platine Rag especially in large print event I’d use the back tray and not use roll to expulsion the print almost all are little pizza wheels.I have near home a epson technical service and I bring my prints to give us to use a chief technician said me that is a projection error on P900 sometimes print is good other no, no update to resolve, but on P900 so I m waiting to change it with a canon if resolve 1100 ok if not get a canon 2600.

 

[Gryphon69]

Are the same pizza wheels that I have to Epson p900 with paper like Canson Platine Rag especially in large print event I’d use the back tray and not use roll to expulsion the print almost all are little pizza wheels.I have near home a epson technical service and I bring my prints to give us to use a chief technician said me that is a projection error on P900 sometimes print is good other no, no update to resolve, but on P900 so I m waiting to change it with a canon if resolve 1100 ok if not get a canon 2600.

I agree, a Canon 2600 would be a great choice: 24”, roll capability and all the quality of the Pro 1100 without the banding at a competitive price point.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

...I agree, a Canon 2600 would be a great choice: 24”, roll capability and all the quality of the Pro 1100 without the banding at a competitive price point.

"Without the banding?" A quick search returns numerous complaints about banding with the 2600.

 

[Gryphon69]

...I agree, a Canon 2600 would be a great choice: 24”, roll capability and all the quality of the Pro 1100 without the banding at a competitive price point.

"Without the banding?" A quick search returns numerous complaints about banding with the 2600.

Ah! Sorry, I remember looking at user reviews about the 2600 a while back and did not remember seeing banding complaints back then (other than one thread about it that however indicated that banding was due to a defect in the ink pumps of that specific 2600 unit). Interesting if the banding issues affect both the Pro 1100 and the 2600: they share the same head and the same inks. I wonder if the 4600 experiences the same issues too.

 

[Remko II]

...I agree, a Canon 2600 would be a great choice: 24”, roll capability and all the quality of the Pro 1100 without the banding at a competitive price point.

"Without the banding?" A quick search returns numerous complaints about banding with the 2600.

Can you please show us the numerous complaints?

I know about one, reported on the Canon USA website which appeared not to be banding at all. Besides this one I never came across a banding issue with the large format Canons.

The large format Canon printers have sensors on the print head carrier to manage the paper feed. So a paper feed adjustment - one of the things you do when having banding with any printer - is not needed on the x600 line. Those sensors are not available on the Pro-1100 though. The x600 is much more sophisticated than the Pro-1100.

I have a Pro-2600 myself. I carefully inspected all my prints and have no banding at all. None. And no one in the international user groups I am part of ever reported having a banding issue with the x600 printers. So I am truly interested about your finding, Sal Santamaura.

Cheers,
Remko