DSLR without usb C doomed in EU ? Maybe?

[jxh]

Not that the law impacts me (living on the other side of the pond) but the wording likely reads something like: "...manufactured and sold after..."

- Gary

As I understand it is mandatory for all products sold, not just released.

It was decided at the end of 2022, giving manufacturers 2 years to implement it.

https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/...-approval-to-one-size-fits-all-charging-port/

All the real issues going on in the world and EU micromanages ridiculous ideas like this.

 

[Dave Oddie]

My Canon DSLRs couldn’t charge via USB. It was only my USB-C equipped R5 came out that in-camera charging was supported. Not sure about Sony and Nikon though.

I have a Sony RX100 VII which despite being a few years old is still Sony's top of the range compact camera. It can charge over micro-usb B so presumably they won't be selling this model going forward.

Might apply to the RX10 as well.

Sony has a habit of retaining older models in the inventory and selling them so this law may kill that idea off by preventing them selling older A7 models.

 

[Dave Oddie]

All devices that support fast charging will now have the same charging speed, allowing users to charge their devices at the same speed with any compatible charger.

And what speed is that?

This could affect phone makers like Oneplus who have their warp charging that runs at 65w or even 100w. So what wattage have the EU settled on? If it is lower than that it puts a break on very fast charging.

Will Oneplus have to deliberately slug their phones or not supply their warp chargers because they are too fast?

You can charge a Oneplus phone on a slower charger but this part of the law reads like it could limit very fast charging and prevent the likes of One Plus selling chargers faster than whatever this "same charging speed" is.

 

[BGD300V1]

A USB-C charger wouild then charge my Micro-USB devices. Including the cable with the device would meet the requirement to 'support' USB-C charging.

 

[Doug J]

My Canon DSLRs couldn’t charge via USB. It was only my USB-C equipped R5 came out that in-camera charging was supported. Not sure about Sony and Nikon though.

I have a Sony RX100 VII which despite being a few years old is still Sony's top of the range compact camera. It can charge over micro-usb B so presumably they won't be selling this model going forward.

Might apply to the RX10 as well.

Sony has a habit of retaining older models in the inventory and selling them so this law may kill that idea off by preventing them selling older A7 models.

They might simply sell them in markets elsewhere.


Cheers,
Doug

 

[Mika Y.]

All devices that support fast charging will now have the same charging speed, allowing users to charge their devices at the same speed with any compatible charger.

And what speed is that?

This could affect phone makers like Oneplus who have their warp charging that runs at 65w or even 100w. So what wattage have the EU settled on? If it is lower than that it puts a break on very fast charging.

Will Oneplus have to deliberately slug their phones or not supply their warp chargers because they are too fast?

You can charge a Oneplus phone on a slower charger but this part of the law reads like it could limit very fast charging and prevent the likes of One Plus selling chargers faster than whatever this "same charging speed" is.

Looking at this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32022L2380

this seems to be the relevant part:

"In so far as they are capable of being recharged by means of wired charging at voltages higher than 5 Volts, currents higher than 3 Amperes or powers higher than 15 Watts, the categories or classes of radio equipment referred to in point 1 of this Part shall:
3.1.

incorporate the USB Power Delivery, as described in the standard EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 “Universal serial bus interfaces for data and power – Part 1-2: Common components – USB Power Delivery specification”

Quick search for the EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 seems to state this: "IEC 62680-1-2:2021 defines a power delivery system covering all elements of a USB system including: Hosts, Devices, Hubs, Chargers and cable assemblies. This specification describes the architecture, protocols, power supply behavior, connectors and cabling necessary for managing power delivery over USB at up to 100W."

 

[BGD300V1]

From Dec 2024 all electronic devices must have usb C charging in EU. Is it likely that camera manufacturers are going to adapt older DSLR cameras to meet this legislation?

But wait, what is the reasoning for this legislation ?

That is a question that is seldom asked and less often answered truthfully or convincingly.

 

[Mika Y.]

All devices that support fast charging will now have the same charging speed, allowing users to charge their devices at the same speed with any compatible charger.

And what speed is that?

This could affect phone makers like Oneplus who have their warp charging that runs at 65w or even 100w. So what wattage have the EU settled on? If it is lower than that it puts a break on very fast charging.

Will Oneplus have to deliberately slug their phones or not supply their warp chargers because they are too fast?

You can charge a Oneplus phone on a slower charger but this part of the law reads like it could limit very fast charging and prevent the likes of One Plus selling chargers faster than whatever this "same charging speed" is.

Looking at this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32022L2380

this seems to be the relevant part:

"In so far as they are capable of being recharged by means of wired charging at voltages higher than 5 Volts, currents higher than 3 Amperes or powers higher than 15 Watts, the categories or classes of radio equipment referred to in point 1 of this Part shall:
3.1.

incorporate the USB Power Delivery, as described in the standard EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 “Universal serial bus interfaces for data and power – Part 1-2: Common components – USB Power Delivery specification”

Quick search for the EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 seems to state this: "IEC 62680-1-2:2021 defines a power delivery system covering all elements of a USB system including: Hosts, Devices, Hubs, Chargers and cable assemblies. This specification describes the architecture, protocols, power supply behavior, connectors and cabling necessary for managing power delivery over USB at up to 100W."

Actually, this seems to be superseded:

Loading…

data.consilium.europa.eu

states: "The reference to those standards will allow the harmonised charging solution (interface and communication protocol) to be implemented in the categories or classes of radio equipment listed in the Directive for any device up to 240 Watts, which is specifically very relevant for laptops. It will also allow other categories or classes of radio equipment requiring such levels of power to be considered for potential inclusion in the list."

 

[Overrank]

From Dec 2024 all electronic devices must have usb C charging in EU. Is it likely that camera manufacturers are going to adapt older DSLR cameras to meet this legislation?

But wait, what is the reasoning for this legislation ?

That is a question that is seldom asked and less often answered truthfully or convincingly.

I suspect if Apples multi-million $ lawyers could have made something of it, then they would have. But as it is the iPhone 15 has USB-C, so everyone else will have to fall in line….

 

[Overrank]

Our EU importers advised us today that all our products must have usb c built in or they cannot be sold from Dec 2024. The legislation was passed in 2022 with two years to sell through existing products. I see other people including Mr T Hogan have picked up on this..

Are they new products (even if just adaptations of older ones) since the law was passed ? As far as DSLRs are concerned, how many new DSLRs have been introduced since 2022 ? I can think of one Pentax …..

If that is the case the whole debate on interpretation of enforcement in EU fourteen months from now may be irrelevant unless Ricoh/Pentax suddenly comes to life. A single EU compatible mid cycle APS-C DSLR with limited acceptance is not going to push others to retrofit. It seems DSLR sales are declining but still quite strong in EU and Canada/US but many suggest that is due mainly to sales of entry level low profit offerings from Canon/?Nikon which are not going to see retrofits. In Japan, where decisions are made, it appears the DSLR market is all but dead.

I don’t see where there’s a requirement for retrofitting. It’s only for new products. But many people are already working with this anyway, it’s only the choice of a connector. Example, I’ve just bought a brand new film camera (Alfie Tych) which has USB-C charging. So if yesterdays technology can do it, how much easier will it be for tomorrows

 

[lumigraphics]

The EU directive is for ALL appliances with an integral or removable battery.

So I guess Toyota will have to add USB-C charging to all its cars? :eyeroll:

 

[commiebiker]

From Dec 2024 all electronic devices must have usb C charging in EU. Is it likely that camera manufacturers are going to adapt older DSLR cameras to meet this legislation?

But wait, what is the reasoning for this legislation ?

That is a question that is seldom asked and less often answered truthfully or convincingly.

I suspect if Apples multi-million $ lawyers could have made something of it, then they would have. But as it is the iPhone 15 has USB-C, so everyone else will have to fall in line….

this might be why iPhone has USB-C

 

[trungtran]

It is still nowhere as durable as what it should be. They need a new plug that has a durability of a 3.5 mm jack and can keep up with the life of the product

 

[Revenant]

The EU directive is for ALL appliances with an integral or removable battery.

So I guess Toyota will have to add USB-C charging to all its cars? :eyeroll:

 

[Dave Oddie]

All devices that support fast charging will now have the same charging speed, allowing users to charge their devices at the same speed with any compatible charger.

And what speed is that?

This could affect phone makers like Oneplus who have their warp charging that runs at 65w or even 100w. So what wattage have the EU settled on? If it is lower than that it puts a break on very fast charging.

Will Oneplus have to deliberately slug their phones or not supply their warp chargers because they are too fast?

You can charge a Oneplus phone on a slower charger but this part of the law reads like it could limit very fast charging and prevent the likes of One Plus selling chargers faster than whatever this "same charging speed" is.

Looking at this: https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=CELEX:32022L2380

this seems to be the relevant part:

"In so far as they are capable of being recharged by means of wired charging at voltages higher than 5 Volts, currents higher than 3 Amperes or powers higher than 15 Watts, the categories or classes of radio equipment referred to in point 1 of this Part shall:
3.1.

incorporate the USB Power Delivery, as described in the standard EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 “Universal serial bus interfaces for data and power – Part 1-2: Common components – USB Power Delivery specification”

Quick search for the EN IEC 62680-1-2:2021 seems to state this: "IEC 62680-1-2:2021 defines a power delivery system covering all elements of a USB system including: Hosts, Devices, Hubs, Chargers and cable assemblies. This specification describes the architecture, protocols, power supply behavior, connectors and cabling necessary for managing power delivery over USB at up to 100W."

100W is fine for the use case I mentioned but that doesn’t mean all devices charge at the same speed. So if you had say a Google Pixel 8:that can charge at 30W max and switched to a One Plus phone that could charge at 100W you still need a new charger to get 100W charging so that defeats the object of not proliferating the number of chargers out there.

 

[msu79gt82]

FYI: Thom Hogan has some thoughts

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dslrbodies.com

 

[lumigraphics]

The EU directive is for ALL appliances with an integral or removable battery.

So I guess Toyota will have to add USB-C charging to all its cars? :eyeroll:

The law specifies what devices are covered, and it doesn't include all appliances, and certainly not cars. It includes smaller home electronics products like smartphones, tablets, laptops, digital cameras, headphones, portable speakers etc.

Many DSLR/Mirrorless don't have USB charging at all. I personally think the mandate is idiotic and will cause more problems than it solves.

 

[David Lal]

From Dec 2024 all electronic devices must have usb C charging in EU.

In this respect, I am so glad we went for BREXIT in the UK. We can and do invent ludicrous legislation of our own!

 

[Robert Salton]

Not all DSLR are doomed, the D850 can charge via USB. Some newer Pentax can do so too.

Even more interesting will be the situation for cine cameras. Does the EU really expect something like an Alexa LF, Venice, Komodo, VRaptor to charge batteries via USB?

I get, and like, the idea of one charger to charge them all. However, so far that has failed miserably. From the variety of USB-chargers, USB-C devices and USB-C cables I accumulated, some combinations charge quickly, some charge slow as molasses and some do not charge at all.

The majority of old, prorietary power supplies were nothing more than a dumb SMPS shoving more or less well regulated DC into the device, worst case was some fancy proprietary plug. Simple, reliable, long service life, easy to diagnose and repair. Could have been grand if guided into a few standardized voltages and plugs without communication, power negotiation, fragile plugs and active cables.

I shudder to think what happens when USB-PD becomes obsolete or evolves to the point of missing backwards capability. They'll likely keep the old way mandatory for at least a decade.

 

[egk4260]

Not all DSLR are doomed, the D850 can charge via USB. Some newer Pentax can do so too.

My D850 has no USB-C port.