>>> Challenge 74: Character Studies <<<

...and I'd like to offer a word on the current state of the challenge.

The word is "fantastic". I knew this would be a tough assignment. I'm really delighted to see the fine exhibition gallery which you all have put together. Even more so, I'm delighted to see the effort people are putting into the Eligible gallery. This is tough work, but y'all are really rising to the challenge. My thanks for your efforts and my encouragement as we embark on the second weekend to shoot.

Thanks,

Michael

--

Galleries:
http://www.pbase.com/mtpuff
 
Somehow we ended up with two #22's...and mine is the second one. (I also noticed that #18 is now missing.) If it's no problem, I'll just rename mine and put at the end...or I could slip it into #18's slot. Just let me know.
--Mary Anne
 
Mary Anne,

You can just renumber the image. It only matters that the numbers are unique so that everything appears in the voting booth. I suppose it's best to use #18 if you leave the image in its current slot. I can't see a reason to move it since you've replaced the original with a re-worked version.

Michael
Somehow we ended up with two #22's...and mine is the second one.
(I also noticed that #18 is now missing.) If it's no problem, I'll
just rename mine and put at the end...or I could slip it into #18's
slot. Just let me know.
--Mary Anne
--

Galleries:
http://www.pbase.com/mtpuff
 
I just use the "Save As" method in Photoshop. That saves the photo to my hard drive.

Then, I just look at the resulting file in ACDsee or Windows Explorer, or whatever, and verify the file's size.

It's really easy to check the size of a file prior to uploading it. I leave the file "up" in Photoshop while I just check the file size.

Here's what you see if you're using Windows Explorer (since that's the basic file navigation tool for Windows, we know everyone on a Windows machine has that - I often use ACDSee, but I can't be sure everyone uses that, obviously.

First, the Save As dialog in Photoshop. Note that Photoshop claims the file will be 115.86K. This cracks me up because they give a size to two places past the deicimal, but their accuracy is not good to even two significant figures :)



Next, I fired up Windows Explorer right on top of Photoshop. No problem, Windows is a multitasking OS :) I've navigated to the file in question and highlighted it. Then I "right clicked" on it and got the dialog you see. In that dialog, I've highlighted "properties".



Clicking on "Properties" yields this dialog:



Note that they give you the flie's "Size" and the "Size on disk".

We're interested in the "Size" since the size on disk just takes into account the fact that any given file uses an integer number of disk clusters, so unless you're using disk compression, it will always be larger.

In any case, the "Size" is the number we want, and you'll find that this will always be the same number as PBase reports, too.

Note that this is considerably larger than what Photoshop "predicted". Let that be a lesson to you :)

Ok, so if the file is oversize, I just do the Save As again with slightly more compression. This is easy as long as you've still got the photo "up" in photoshop. I always test right then and there before closing the photo so that I can "re-save" fast and easy. I go back and forth, checking the file size and resaving as many times as it takes to get it close but not over the limit.

And before too long, you get a "feel" for how "Save As" lies to you about the projected file size and you end up not needing to do as many trials to nail it.

So it's fast and easy to look at the file size on your hard drive before uploading it. I don't think anyone should ever upload a non-checked file since checking the size is so fast and easy.

The size reported by PBase is EXACTLY the size that you'll see when looking at the file with Explorer or ACDSee, or whatever :)

Pops' method is nice in that you can get a lot finer increments of file size when using "Save for Web". And the ultimate file compression is less because of that and because you are leaving out the EXIF which bloats the file a bit. But I like to have the EXIF in the file to begin with.

Also, if you use Paint Shop Pro for this, it doesn't suffer from these issues.

What is odd to me is that Photoshop's "Save for web" can show you the exact file size accurately before it is used but "Save As" is so far off! Come on, Adobe! Get your act together here :)

If I've said it once, I've said it a dozen times on here:

Give us a checkbox in the "Save For Web" dialog that lets us leave the EXIF in place. And, for heaven's sake, make the prediction of file size in "Save As" be accurate. This is not rocket science, it's just simple programming here ;) It really is an oddity that Photoshop, a $300-700 program doesn't get this simple task right.

--
Jim H.
 
Thanks for the suggestions Jim. I use Macs, so it's slightly different. In particular the file info box only specifies the size on disk, but, since you say that is usually slightly larger than the actual size, at least I wouldn't risk uploading a file that's too large. What I like about Pops's suggestion is that it allows me to display a file with less compression and still keep the EXIF info. It does involve a bit more work (uploading a file with EXIF and then replacing it with a save for web version), but with pictures with lots of detail heavy JPEG compression can look really nasty. But those are the very pictures that are going to need heavy compression to come in under 150K.
--
Alastair
http://homepage.mac.com/anorcross/home.html
http://anorcross.smugmug.com
Equipment in profile

 
.. the situation can be complicated by files having data forks and resource forks (NTFS supports this too).

When you look at the file size in finder (the eqiv of explorer) is shows the combined size, but when you upload to pbase, only the data fork gets used so the effective file size shrinks.

It depends on the software as to what goes in the resource fork, but in my setup it includes a mini version of the image which is used for the files icon, letting you see the image is on the desktop/finder without opening it.

My image files usually shed about 50K off their size when uploaded to pbase.

Now I have an intel mac and have started using Aperture to process the files for the challenge. It's a dream. It allows for "export profiles" to be created so I have set up one called cslr_challenge which has the appropriate settings for the challenge (jpeg, 700pixels, limited metadata, etc).

To save for the challenge I just export and chose the profile, it's really quick and foolproof. I have to adjust the compression setting for some pictures, so I have a couple of profiles with different compression settings, starting at the highest quality and work down if the file is too big.

Naj
 
It has been a while since I participated and it looks like several things have changed, like numbered entries.

I am wondering it the use of an asterisk still means comments welcome, or is it now just generally considered that comments are made on all items?

Thanks in advance,

Chris
 
Chris,

Numbers instead of titles is just for this challenge. It was host's choice...I expect we'll go back to titles in the next challenge.

There was a short discussion about the asterisk several challenges back. It was the general feeling (as I recall) that most people favored honest critique and that the ( ) was not needed. I think comments are welcome on all entries.

Michael
It has been a while since I participated and it looks like several
things have changed, like numbered entries.

I am wondering it the use of an asterisk still means comments
welcome, or is it now just generally considered that comments are
made on all items?

Thanks in advance,

Chris
--

Galleries:
http://www.pbase.com/mtpuff
 
that what you refer to as "resource fork" is what Windows Explorer refers to as "size on disk" which takes into account the fact that you're gonna use a whole allocation unit whether or not that block is totally filled.

Still, the "real" file size shouldn't be hard to view with some kind of tool on a Mac. I can't say what that tool would be, however :) On a PC it's pretty straight forward.

But I do blame Adobe for allowing Photoshop to provide us all with bogus file size estimates when using the "save as" command. Shame, shame :)

--
Jim H.
 
Debbi,

Yup, I used dry ice. I used a lightweight Glad[tm] food storage container that fit in my hands well enough that I only touched the sides of the container. I used scissors to cut down the height of the container to about 1 or 1.5 inches tall. Broke the dry ice in smallish pieces with a hammer, filled the container with dry ice, poured hot water over the dry ice just before shooting.

Cheers,

Michael
Did you use dry ice in the last challenge...and if yes how did you
keep it off your hands.
Thanks,
Debbi
--
http://www.pbase.com/debbi
pBase Supporter
--

Galleries:
http://www.pbase.com/mtpuff
 
who walked into the lecture one day with an ever growing spot of white on his pants pocket and the same "fog" coming off of the area for about the first half of the lecture. He then reached into his pocket, pulled out a large chunk of dry ice, and matter of factly stated:

"Never put dry ice in your pocket and never touch it with your bare hands."

The lecture then continued on - something about freezing point depression or the like as I recall.....

--
Jim H.
 
....but absent the naughty bits.

Not that anything I might do would be comparable to Mr. Soo...but seeing his image embarrassed me. So I had to find something quickly, at least moderately interesting, before bed.

I have done badly in this Challenge...I had some ideas that just went weirdly wrong. For example, there was, The Fisherman. My neighbor has a boat but it is not normally around...so when I saw it in his driveway, I thought, great, put him in the fishing chair and have him fishing out of a coffee cup propped up on a small Grecian column while in his driveway...I liked it.

But I took a phone call and an hour and a half later when I returned, I asked where he was...and true to his word, he had gone fishing for a week.

Gads, that knocked the wind out of my sails. Another one went dirty also...sigh.

Maybe next Challenge.

In any case, The Tourist is about the last image in Exhibition.

Best Wishes,

Traveller
 
Hi Traveller,

You think too highly of me. In any case, I think a lot can come
with that boat idea. Very few photographers conceptualize their
images. So, if you have that ability, squeeze your juice out of it
like anything. Great thing to have!

I haven't been entering these challenges. Seems like Michael
Puff is the guy cheer on these days, eh! ;)
  • MS
--
Photographer of the Year 2005 http://www.soocool.com/poty/

Explore beyond the norms - http://www.soocool.com
Business site - http://www.soophotography.com
 
...I've just spent the past hour trying on my own, "Sisters," shot to duplicate, a little, your skin tones...not to no avail, but as I posted under your image...it was a good exercise for me.

Michael is always the guy to beat, even in this Challenge, his clown is pretty damned good. I think that the Exhibition Gallery is better in this Challenge than Eligible...there are, of course, some outstanding images in Eligible, but this task has been harder than it first appeared.

Even if you only stop in from time to time, it is great to have you around.

Best Wishes,

Traveller
 

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