Baryta paper comparison

[NAwlins Contrarian]

Judging by recent threads, there is significant interest in baryta inkjet photo papers. The discussions have covered the recent lack of availability of many baryta inkjet papers, most of them being alpha-cellulose instead of cotton rag, many of them having OBAs, and new ones replacing old ones. Semi-subjective properties are certainly important, and I'm interested in your opinions on those, but what follows tries to be a reasonably-comprehensive listing with some basic objective data.

I've compiled a little chart, taking information from the paper manufacturers' specifications, with some basic comparisons of some common baryta papers. Note that different manufacturers quote different specifications, and sometimes appear to address the same basic specification in different ways. I'm not positive how to assess / compare "brightness", "whiteness", "gloss", "opacity", and similar specifications. I can tell you no manufacturer lists specifications for all of those. So, here's the chart:



Note that:

(1) (a) Only Hahnemühle Photo Rag Baryta, (b) (apparently) Ilford Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk, and (c) Moab Juniper Baryta Rag are 100% cotton; (d) Canson Baryta Prestige is a mix of (apparently mainly) alpha-cellulose with (apparently less) cotton; and the rest are 100% alpha-cellulose.

(2) Several baryta papers at least claim to be OBA-free: (a) Hahnemühle FineArt Baryta Satin, (b) Hahnemühle Photo Rag Baryta, (c) Ilford Galerie Prestige Gold Fibre Silk, (d) Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta, (e) Moab Juniper Baryta Rag, and (f) apparently--the information on the website is not totally clear--Red River Palo Duro Baryta Fiber. Several other baryta papers claim "very low" OBA content.

(3) Thicknesses range from 12 mil i.e. 0.3mm (Canson Baryta Photographique II Satin and Epson Legacy Baryta) to 16 mil i.e. 0.4mm (Hahnemühle FineArt Baryta and Moab Juniper Baryta Rag).

(4) Weights range from 300 gsm (Hahnemühle FineArt Baryta Satin and Red River Palo Duro Baryta Fiber) to 350 gsm (Hahnemühle Baryta FB).

So, am I missing any widely-available baryta photo papers? Do you think any chart entries are incorrect? And maybe most importantly, do you have any comments on why you do or do not like certain baryta papers?

 

[Alexey]

Really helpful info. Thanks so much for compiling this chart!

 

[mike earussi]

Quite the list, thanks for the work.

I experimented with Barytas but their susceptibility to scratching put me off so I switched to Platine type papers instead.

I hate the stiff texture of Alpha-Cellulose because it feels like I'm printing on cardboard, but if I did want to switch back the only one I'd be interested in trying is the Moab.

The reason for that is because of the three that are OBA free and also 100% cotton, the Hahnemuhle I've already tried and found it scratched easily, though admittedly that was some years ago (and maybe the surface has been improved), and Ilford is such an unstable company that I don't trust them to provide a steady product. Moab I haven't tried before so there's always hope.

 

[Alan Goldhammer]

Ilford Gold Fibre Silk does contain OBAs and I do not believe that it is a cotton rag paper unless they have changed things very recently. As with some other Baryta papers it is in short supply and Ilford stated that they are reformulating it as Canson have recently done.

 

[NAwlins Contrarian]

Ilford Gold Fibre Silk does contain OBAs

Alan, you are right, the Ilford data sheet for Gold Fiber Silk says "OBA Content Yes". See https://ilford.com/wp-dev/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/GPGFS_v3_19032019.pdf. Sorry about that.

and I do not believe that it is a cotton rag paper unless they have changed things very recently.

As for cotton, Ilford does not appear to say either cotton or alpha-cellulose, but B&H lists it as "Material Cotton Rag". See https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...004003_galerie_prestige_gold_fibre.html/specs.

 

[Howard Moftich]

You're right on both counts.

I have no doubt the new re-formulation will bump the price up 10+%

 

[NAwlins Contrarian]

Quite the list, thanks for the work.

You're welcome. Note one error below--the Ilford does contain OBAs.

I experimented with Barytas but their susceptibility to scratching put me off so I switched to Platine type papers instead.

Last night--after noting that Hahnemuhle's website said that Photo Silk Baryta was discontinued, and while trying to decide whether to order up a stock of it--I spent some time looking at and comparing my prints on that paper, Canson Platine, and Red River Palo Duro Softgloss Rag. My conclusion was that I'd very likely be essentially equally happy using only Palo Duro Softgloss Rag going forward.

However, I haven't used anything that is a likely substitute for Hahnemuhle Photo Gloss Baryta, even though it scratches somewhat easily and has OBAs.

I seem to recall your current favorite is Innova Exhibition Cotton Gloss? How does its surface compare to these papers?

 

[Mark McCormick]

Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta also contains OBAs. It's a dead ringer for Hahnemühle Photo Silk Baryta, IGFS, etc., so probably being coated at Felix Schoeller in Europe, and perhaps now discontinued along with the others noted.

The manufacturers should really give media color properties in CIELAB values. Otherwise, it's impossible to compare them on whitepoint properties and/or OBA fluorescence. Also, OBA comments like "very low" are not all that useful because they don't tell us where in the material the OBAs are located. OBAs in paper core are less prone to cause significant yellowing in the image bearing layer, for example, than OBAs in a coating layer containing TiO2. And that's the other wild card. Many of the so-called Baryta papers do not have a traditional 100% baryta whitening layer. They contain other whitening pigments like TiO2 as well.

My research project at Aardenburg Imaging for 2020 is to look more closely at these OBA and TiO2 induced yellowing issues in the Baryta class of inkjet media, but I'm off to a very slow start due to the availability issues here in the U.S. and elsewhere. Hoping to include in testing, the new Canson Baryta Photographique II and Photographic II matte versions, for example, but none of my suppliers have the new papers yet.

cheers,
Mark

 

[NAwlins Contrarian]

Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta also contains OBAs.

Mark, I certainly acknowledge your expertise, but just to point out, the Innova data sheet for Exhibition Photo Baryta says, "OBA Content No". See https://www.innovaart.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Innova-Editions_Data-Sheet_2019_IFA-69.pdf. I was taking the information for my chart from the paper manufacturers' specifications.

To me that raises three plausible situations:

(1) Innova has reformulated this paper since you examined it and found OBAs;

(2) your examination found something that mimics OBAs, but is not in fact OBAs; and/or

(3) Innova is reporting inaccurate information on its website / in its official data sheet.

Your thoughts?

 

[mike earussi]

Quite the list, thanks for the work.

You're welcome. Note one error below--the Ilford does contain OBAs.

I experimented with Barytas but their susceptibility to scratching put me off so I switched to Platine type papers instead.

Last night--after noting that Hahnemuhle's website said that Photo Silk Baryta was discontinued, and while trying to decide whether to order up a stock of it--I spent some time looking at and comparing my prints on that paper, Canson Platine, and Red River Palo Duro Softgloss Rag. My conclusion was that I'd very likely be essentially equally happy using only Palo Duro Softgloss Rag going forward.

However, I haven't used anything that is a likely substitute for Hahnemuhle Photo Gloss Baryta, even though it scratches somewhat easily and has OBAs.

I seem to recall your current favorite is Innova Exhibition Cotton Gloss? How does its surface compare to these papers?

It's not a smooth type F surface but has a slightly mottled texture like a Platine which keeps down fingerprints, hence my preference for using it as a greeting card stock. I think it's as good or better looking as Canson's Platine--intense color saturation and excellent dmax.

 

[mike earussi]

Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta also contains OBAs.

Mark, I certainly acknowledge your expertise, but just to point out, the Innova data sheet for Exhibition Photo Baryta says, "OBA Content No". See https://www.innovaart.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/Innova-Editions_Data-Sheet_2019_IFA-69.pdf. I was taking the information for my chart from the paper manufacturers' specifications.

To me that raises three plausible situations:

(1) Innova has reformulated this paper since you examined it and found OBAs;

(2) your examination found something that mimics OBAs, but is not in fact OBAs; and/or

(3) Innova is reporting inaccurate information on its website / in its official data sheet.

Your thoughts?

I've had this confusion from Innova before, with one department saying it has OBAs and another saying it doesn't (for one of their canvases, not this paper). This is why I bought my own UV light so I could check myself, something I now recommend for everyone.

 

[pjog]

There's a review of Innova IFA-45, including pictures of its surface, on Keith Cooper's Northlight site. Like Canson Platine, it's not a "Baryta" paper, but they're both very nice and (according to the manufacturers) OBA free if that is important.

 

[mike earussi]

There's a review of Innova IFA-45, including pictures of its surface, on Keith Cooper's Northlight site. Like Canson Platine, it's not a "Baryta" paper, but they're both very nice and (according to the manufacturers) OBA free if that is important.

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/paper-review-innova-fibaprint-warm-cotton-gloss-335gsm/

 

[Mark McCormick]

Innova is reporting inaccurate info. Period.

They aren't alone. IGFS, for example, was also called OBA-free when it was first introduced and for a few years after that. Published errors seem to have a long shelf life on the internet!

I don't believe it's some nefarious plot to lie to the customer, merely miscommunication between the marketing teams who write the brochures and the technical teams that actually know what's in the product. The good news is that the enduser can easily check for presence of OBAs with a UV LED flashlight.

 

[pjog]

Thank you for the information. I must say that I trust Mike Earussi's expertise with the uv light to confirm that Innova IFA-45 does not contain OBAs

One thing I can check is that in the UK, 17" X 15m of the Innova is about £70, 17" x 15m of Platine is about £96 and 17" X 12m of Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta is over £122 (all prices including VAT at 20%). They're all really nice papers, but like Mike I'm happy with the Innova.

 

[mike earussi]

Thank you for the information. I must say that I trust Mike Earussi's expertise with the uv light to confirm that Innova IFA-45 does not contain OBAs

Part of this "confusion" could possibly stem from the practice of calling a paper/canvas OBA free if there are no OBAs in the coating but there is in the paper base.

My favorite example of this is from Breathing Color who proudly proclaims their Lyve canvas as being OBA free, but the canvas base itself lights up like a flood lamp when a UV light is shined on it. Let the buyer beware.

One thing I can check is that in the UK, 17" X 15m of the Innova is about £70, 17" x 15m of Platine is about £96 and 17" X 12m of Hahnemuhle Photo Rag Baryta is over £122 (all prices including VAT at 20%). They're all really nice papers, but like Mike I'm happy with the Innova.

 

[Mark McCormick]

Thank you for the information. I must say that I trust Mike Earussi's expertise with the uv light to confirm that Innova IFA-45 does not contain OBAs

To be clear, IFA-45 is Innova Exhibition Cotton Gloss. It is indeed OBA free.

I was talking about Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta. It has OBAs, but is listed in the OP's chart as having no OBAs, because it is also incorrectly labeled in Innova's spec sheet as having no OBAs.

To confirm, I just rechecked a roll I have here of IFA-69, Aka, Innova Exhibition Photo Baryta with a 365nm UV LED flashlight. It was sent to me last fall courtesy of David Williams, Global Supply Chain & Quality Manager at Innova. So, it is pretty recent stock. And it fluoresces brightly under the UV LED, no mistake about it.

 

[pjog]

Yes, I did not doubt what you were saying about the Baryta paper and sorry if I gave that impression. I was just establishing that Innova hadn't made a false claim about the Exhibition Cotton Gloss, which I'm pleased you have confirmed.

Thanks for all your expert input on this topic, and please do keep on informing us: there are so many similarly named papers it can be quite confusing.

 

[binarybob]

Here is another 100% Cotton rag based Baryta paper you might consider as well, it's a newer addition.

Bob.

 

[mike earussi]

Yes, I did not doubt what you were saying about the Baryta paper and sorry if I gave that impression. I was just establishing that Innova hadn't made a false claim about the Exhibition Cotton Gloss, which I'm pleased you have confirmed.

Thanks for all your expert input on this topic, and please do keep on informing us: there are so many similarly named papers it can be quite confusing.

Especially when many of them are made by the same company just with different brand names, like RC luster.