All the rumours in a nutshell

[realgeek]

We need to replace our camera bodies once a year now ...

True enough. But I will try to resist! (At least until the 750 rolls around!)

I am actually more tempted by the A55 than the A590, because it seems different enough from my A550 to warrant a look ....

 

[Dennis]

Dennis, I believe you are looking at the old Sony of a few tears back.

Yes, that's mostly what we have to go on. Actually adding features like DOF preview back into these cameras when many of us have been fearing the continued "dumbing down" is also a positive step. It will take generations of cameras (and more products in the sytem) though, to really make a dent in DSLR market share. Again, not that Sony isn't doing good things; dominance over Canon & Nikon is just a huge stretch. (And nothing we should really care about, for that matter ... if we wanted to own the dominant system, it's there on the shelves).

• Dennis

--
Gallery at http://kingofthebeasts.smugmug.com

 

[glarry]

Maybe, maybe not. It really depends on what Canon and Nikon, as well as Olympus and Panasonic, do in competition with the NEX cameras. From what I have seen of the NEX cameras, Sony has cut off a potential customer base (photographers who want a small camera but don't want to shoot in auto-everything mode) due to a horrid user interface.

Lousy UI, lack of IBIS (though only Oly offers that) and lack of lenses.

NEX is cute, NEX is promising, but Sony has to do something with it before more competitors jump into the fray. I read one rumor saying that Sony might delay the NEX-7 because the NEX-3 & 5 are supposedly selling so well. If there's any truth to that, it could prove to be a mistake, because to date, I think most of the ILCs have been selling well not so much for what they are, but for lack of anything better. If NEX numbers look good now, I'd love to see what Canon or Nikon's first ILC sales look like. If I were Sony, I'd push anything & everything I had for NEX out the door in hopes of getting a few users to build even modest systems that would make them reluctant to switch to something else. Micro 4/3 did that and there are users with pretty extensive systems right now. In particular, though, the users who are adapting legacy lenses are going to be free to choose their camera in the future and when one shows up with a PASM dial, ISO button and EV + - they probably won't hesitate to put their NEX on eBay.

• Dennis

--
Gallery at http://kingofthebeasts.smugmug.com

Dennis ,I think you exaggerate the lousiness of the UI. Only for ISO it's a bit of searching, but using auto iso it's good alternative - high ISO up to 1600 is looking nice. EV is down the wheel, one push and is coming. The 16 mm lens doesn't have stabilization, but camera gives you few option for low light :Anti Motion Blur, Hand Held Twilight. For me, after spending few hours with the camera, I find the UI really O.K.

 

[tom55604]

Good post.

I agree, as DSLR technology converges with communication and video tech Sony will leverage a significant advantage in scale, and expertise.

Canikon may find themselves struggling to keep up in software and electronic hardware terms. Much like Minolta struggled to compete in the digital space.

Canon is a huge multi-national corporation with significant expertise in electronics. I doubt they'll struggle to "keep up." Check their web site and you'll see how far their reach really is.

--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'

So short sighted. Sony are in a completely different league in comparison to Canon, or Nikon for that matter as a diverse business. The future of the DSLR and cameras in general is a converged future. Like it or not. Sony have expertise in communications, GPS, LCD screen technology, sensor design, storage technology, etc etc etc.

As we move away from legacy SLR systems towards an electronics future Sony are unique in the depth and breadth of their capabilities and scale in terms of buying and R&D.

Sure Canon and Nikon dominate traditional DLSR market, they have all the expertise to develop DSLRs as we know them today....but the future will look very different.

Nikon were recently asked why a £200 iPhone can take a picture, connect to a wifi network, upload to a server for review, give maps and directions to shoot locations, provide sunset and sunrise, weather, tidal info for landscape shooters and even do DOF calculations when a £5000 DSLR can do none of this. Mmmm. So which company is best placed to deliver a DSLR that can do all of this AND take great images, it's not Nikon nor is it Canon. To believe this is delusional.

Sounds like Apple to me. Sony better watch out.

 

[Gionni Dorelli]

The only real source I have seen sofar is Japanese camera sales where the NEX3/5 are firmly settled in the top 3.

You mean the country that has Used Girls Under Pants Vending Machines?
--

You know what Doctor House would tell you?
You do right?

 

[Gil Knutson]

By-the-by, having now seen a NEX-5 in person I am underwhelmed. Not at all user friendly for how I shoot (which is not in auto-everything mode). The complaints about the user interface are entirely justified, and it's not something I would consider buying.

I had a sneaking hunch that that was how the NEX is... great for some folks, but I don't feel it is what DSLR users will cotton to... that is why they are using DSLRs...

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

 

[Gil Knutson]

Just curious, does BFD translate internationally?

I would guess, only if you speak English...

Correct me if I am wrong.

(Or, if it translates, it will mean something esle... maybe worse....)

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

 

[Gil Knutson]

As the new kid on the block, the NEX cameras have apparently sold well, at least in some markets (like Japan; ...)....

I understand that many things sell well in Japan, and don't make a ripple anywhere else in the world. One always has to be careful when they say, "Well, it did well in Japan...."

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

 

[Gil Knutson]

I agree fully that Sony needs to strike while the iron is hot with NEX. No holding back.

I concur.... however, from Sony's past history with the Alpha, they will wait two years before we see an NEX-7...

Well, maybe not, but that is what they have done with the A700...

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

 

[Gil Knutson]

And where is the NEX on this list?

I can't see the NEX.... but I also can't see any Sony Alpha DSLR there either....

Very disappointing!!!

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

 

[dmanthree]

But anyhow, up to now they electrified the old film-bricks, not more. Up to now you get their old SLRs with film replaced by a sensor, not moch more. And many photographers do the same, see the discussions about OVF and EVF. Why using copper or bronze when we have been so glad in stone age !

Two reasons:

1. Canon already had a vast stable of lenses that worked a certain way, and needed to keep that alive for photographers who migrated to digital from film.

2. Phase detect aF is still the fastest, so Canon used the systems that provided the best results. See any contract detect EVIL cameras shooting focus tracking AF at 10 FPS? Me, neither.

Honestly, to say that Canon will be left behind is simple fanboy commentary and ignores reality.

--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'

 

[dmanthree]

Nikon were recently asked why a £200 iPhone can take a picture, connect to a wifi network, upload to a server for review, give maps and directions to shoot locations, provide sunset and sunrise, weather, tidal info for landscape shooters and even do DOF calculations when a £5000 DSLR can do none of this. Mmmm. So which company is best placed to deliver a DSLR that can do all of this AND take great images, it's not Nikon nor is it Canon. To believe this is delusional.

Sounds like Apple to me. Sony better watch out.

Not really. Apple will sell a camera that works great, as long as you hold it a certain way, or wrap it in a condom.

I wouldn't buy an Apple product, other than a PC, on a bet.

--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'

 

[dmanthree]

Good post.

I agree, as DSLR technology converges with communication and video tech Sony will leverage a significant advantage in scale, and expertise.

Canikon may find themselves struggling to keep up in software and electronic hardware terms. Much like Minolta struggled to compete in the digital space.

Canon is a huge multi-national corporation with significant expertise in electronics. I doubt they'll struggle to "keep up." Check their web site and you'll see how far their reach really is.

--

yes, of course, and pretty agile for a company so long in the lead. But things happen, as we have been reminded often recently, and the mighty fall. To me, Canon's response--so far at least--to the CSC (compact system camera) challenge has not been vigorous. Perhaps you would expect the leader to play it conservatively, to respond last--but didn't they achieve their dominance by siezing upon opportunities?

Canon has to introduce systems that serve their current base, as well as new customers. Sony does, do a point, but if the NEX is any indication of what direction they're going in, I'll pass. Utterly horrible interface; unusable (for me...).

That said, the new little Alphas (if they're real) look nice. We'll see when they're introduced and tested. Nice to have competition, though.
--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'

 

[dmanthree]

We need to replace our camera bodies once a year now ...

Nah, just have a little discipline. Don't get on the treadmill; you'll go broke.

--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'

 

[winedarksea]

I agree fully that Sony needs to strike while the iron is hot with NEX. No holding back.

I concur.... however, from Sony's past history with the Alpha, they will wait two years before we see an NEX-7...

Well, maybe not, but that is what they have done with the A700...

--
Gil
Sardis, BC
Canada

It's a new day at Alpha.
--
Dulaney
A700; SAL 50 f1.4; SAL 18-250; CZ 85 f1.4

 

[winedarksea]

The only real source I have seen sofar is Japanese camera sales where the NEX3/5 are firmly settled in the top 3.

You mean the country that has Used Girls Under Pants Vending Machines?

That was almost relevant.

Almost as relevant as quoting an obscure Japanese web site as proof of the NEX popularity.
--
Tom Seiler
My portfolio:
http://picasaweb.google.com/SeilerBird/MyPortfolio

BCN is by no means "an obscure Japanese web site." It is the company that compiles sales statististics in Japan for the Japanese camera industry. Furthermore, even if the Japanese camera market is odd, by comparison with the rest of the world, it is nevertheless very large--one of the three largest camera marketplaces in the world, about the same size as both the US and the EU--so whatever happens in the Japanese market has a serious impact on world numbers. AND, in this case, Sony has never before done as well in Japan as in Europe, for example--and the NEX cameras appear to have gotten 10-15% of the Japanese market by themselves in June. That's big. Then there is the reliable anecdotal evidence that the NEX cameras are also doing very well in England, in Europe, and elsewhere.
--
Dulaney
A700; SAL 50 f1.4; SAL 18-250; CZ 85 f1.4

 

[winedarksea]

And where is the NEX on this list?

http://www.dslrphoto.com/dslr/space.php?do=ranking&view=all
--
Tom Seiler
My portfolio:
http://picasaweb.google.com/SeilerBird/MyPortfolio

mmmm . . . you're quoting Amazon again
--
Dulaney
A700; SAL 50 f1.4; SAL 18-250; CZ 85 f1.4

 

[winedarksea]

Dennis, I believe you are looking at the old Sony of a few tears back.

Whose tears? Their customers? Or, was this a Freudian Slip?

--
Henry Richardson
http://www.bakubo.com

let me think about that
--
Dulaney
A700; SAL 50 f1.4; SAL 18-250; CZ 85 f1.4

 

[winedarksea]

Dennis, I believe you are looking at the old Sony of a few tears back.

Yes, that's mostly what we have to go on. Actually adding features like DOF preview back into these cameras when many of us have been fearing the continued "dumbing down" is also a positive step. It will take generations of cameras (and more products in the sytem) though, to really make a dent in DSLR market share. Again, not that Sony isn't doing good things; dominance over Canon & Nikon is just a huge stretch. (And nothing we should really care about, for that matter ... if we wanted to own the dominant system, it's there on the shelves).

• Dennis

--
Gallery at http://kingofthebeasts.smugmug.com

we might not like to be part of the dominant system, either
--
Dulaney
A700; SAL 50 f1.4; SAL 18-250; CZ 85 f1.4

 

[dmanthree]

Good post.

I agree, as DSLR technology converges with communication and video tech Sony will leverage a significant advantage in scale, and expertise.

Canikon may find themselves struggling to keep up in software and electronic hardware terms. Much like Minolta struggled to compete in the digital space.

Canon is a huge multi-national corporation with significant expertise in electronics. I doubt they'll struggle to "keep up." Check their web site and you'll see how far their reach really is.

So short sighted. Sony are in a completely different league in comparison to Canon, or Nikon for that matter as a diverse business. The future of the DSLR and cameras in general is a converged future. Like it or not. Sony have expertise in communications, GPS, LCD screen technology, sensor design, storage technology, etc etc etc.

As we move away from legacy SLR systems towards an electronics future Sony are unique in the depth and breadth of their capabilities and scale in terms of buying and R&D.

Sure Canon and Nikon dominate traditional DLSR market, they have all the expertise to develop DSLRs as we know them today....but the future will look very different.

Nikon were recently asked why a £200 iPhone can take a picture, connect to a wifi network, upload to a server for review, give maps and directions to shoot locations, provide sunset and sunrise, weather, tidal info for landscape shooters and even do DOF calculations when a £5000 DSLR can do none of this. Mmmm. So which company is best placed to deliver a DSLR that can do all of this AND take great images, it's not Nikon nor is it Canon. To believe this is delusional.

What skills or expertise does Sony have that Canon does not? Sony, for all their skills, can be a very stupid company, always trying to rule the world with proprietary products. And let's not forget the famous "rootkit" debacle. I take nothing away from them, but to dominate the SLR market they'll need to grow up, and somehow acquire the expertise in lens production to produce a system of lenses equivilant to Nikon's and Canon's. That's not easy.

And are you really comparing a phone with a professional level DSLR? Really? How many sports shooters do you see using camera phones? Sorry, that's a simply bizzare comparison.

--
-------------------------------------------------
'Hit Refresh if pix do not appear. Flaky ISP at work.'