Advice on upgrade from 70D

[MarshallG]

Barak, in photography there are all kinds of things we spend money on — tripods, fast computers, raid storage, lighting equipment.

In my opinion, I think you should consider one or two sharp prime lenses and take them on a landscape photography getaway. There are vacations and outings which are lead by pro photographers, and they give you incredible insight and inspiration to shoot. I’ve developed a lot of skill by doing this.

My view on equipment upgrade is to do it when there’s a shot you can’t take with the equipment you have. There are a lot of really good photographers who use crop sensor and 4/3 sensors and they are very happy with their systems.

Generally, I think the brand comparisons are worthless because once you get into this hobby and you’ve sunk a few thousand into glass, batteries and flash equipment, it’s pointless to switch brands. Yes, Canon is lagging a little at the moment, but no doubt they’ll leapfrog and then it will start all over again. There’s no question you can shoot pro photos using Canon, Nikon or Sony, so it’s a matter of what system you’ve invested into or whatever personal decision you’ve made. I love the ergonomics of my Canon and I’ve invested so much at this point... and I bought a 5D before the latest Nikon and Sony’s came out, and I figure the 5D Mark IV is good for at least three years, so I don’t think about switching, I think about improving my photography.

 

[Barak Ton]

[No message]

 

[Barak Ton]

Thanks everyone for well appreciated thoughts and comments.

I get the point on the D750 IQ advantage over the 6Dii.

I've come to realize the 6Dii price (along with at least one new FF lens)is more than I'm willing to pay. So I either look for used Nikon gear or play the waiting game for the 6Dii price (and a new D750) to be lower.

Meanwhile, I've also looked at the Sigma 18-35 F1.8 ART as possible upgrade for 70D, It's probably the best zoom you can get for an APS-C these days, It's DXO mark is the best I've seen for the 70D (mainly sharpness). Don't really need the F1.8 for landscapes, but it's not bad to have (especially since there's no IS).

Downside is focal length - I can live with it not going longer than 35, but 18mm is not wide enough for most landscape photography, so although the improvement in IQ should be quite noticeable it may not be all that useful for me. Furthermore it's not compatible with FF so not future proof.

Any thoughts?

 

[Barak Ton]

Certainly some food for thought.

While I know I should invest in improving my skill (and actively doing so), I feel there may be a room for improvement in IQ over the body-lens combinations I use today. That is the reason for opening this thread.

Of course there's always the chance that no significant improvement i will come out of this course of action, which is why I'm debating this for quite some time.

Thanks.

 

[MarshallG]

Certainly some food for thought.

While I know I should invest in improving my skill (and actively doing so), I feel there may be a room for improvement in IQ over the body-lens combinations I use today. That is the reason for opening this thread.

Of course there's always the chance that no significant improvement i will come out of this course of action, which is why I'm debating this for quite some time.

Thanks.

Look at it this way... whether you upgrade your camera or not, you ought to upgrade your skills. I am very enthusiastic about seminars because they work! I love learning directly from expert photographers. Once you upgrade your skills, it will be easier to know what equipment you want, and you’ll be able to better exploit it.

 

[SteveAnderson]

Thanks everyone for well appreciated thoughts and comments.

I get the point on the D750 IQ advantage over the 6Dii.

I've come to realize the 6Dii price (along with at least one new FF lens)is more than I'm willing to pay. So I either look for used Nikon gear or play the waiting game for the 6Dii price (and a new D750) to be lower.

Meanwhile, I've also looked at the Sigma 18-35 F1.8 ART as possible upgrade for 70D, It's probably the best zoom you can get for an APS-C these days, It's DXO mark is the best I've seen for the 70D (mainly sharpness). Don't really need the F1.8 for landscapes, but it's not bad to have (especially since there's no IS).

Downside is focal length - I can live with it not going longer than 35, but 18mm is not wide enough for most landscape photography, so although the improvement in IQ should be quite noticeable it may not be all that useful for me. Furthermore it's not compatible with FF so not future proof.

Any thoughts?

That Sigma is great for sure, so is the MUCH cheaper Tamron 17-55 f2.8.

Problem is that its only really great at f1.8 - f4.0. Most lenses are good at f5.6-f8. Its not worth the price unless you use it at the 1.8 - 4.0.

And you are right, 18mm is not very wide.

EF10-18, or Sigma 8-16 are good APS-C wide angles.

Otherwise, best price/performance for FF is Tamron 15-30 f.2.8.

You could get a 5Dm2 and the Tamron?

Keep the 70D for everything else.

 

[Hoenemor]

Hi,

Hev given a thought on moving to a Sony.

I know the IQ is excellent, only thing that really bugs me is battery life. From what I hear the difference compared to a Canon DSLR is so great I'm not sure carrying a bag of spares is a good enough solution.

I may be wrong in this..

I have not had big problems with this... It is mostly an issue in the beginning before i got used to check battery level before leaving the house. Had a couple of experiences in the beginning where i left the house with flat battery. Now i have a habit of checking battery before leaving and always bringing a spare.

In other words, you get used to it i havent actually thought of this problempin a while

 

[c h u n k]

I upgraded from the 70d as well recently. I spent many, many, haha, MANY excruciating hours reading reviews, watching videos, looking at charts etc etc etc. I ended up buying a 6dii refurb kit, and Canon ended up giving me a new/non-refurb 24-105 STM as part of the kit as the refurbs ran out of stock. It cost me a total of $1460, but the lens is being sold. I will get a bare minimal of $375 for the lens so the camera cost me less than $1,100!! Unfortunately the crazy good deals ended after the holidays, but checking for refurbs is the way to go. They are basically brand new and still come with a Canon 1 yr warranty.

I LOVE THIS CAMERA!!

Honestly, for the type of photos I do, coming from the 70d, its like night and day. And dont get me wrong. I love the 70d still and Im keeping it for wildlife and macro, but the 6d is worlds better for focus accuracy in lowlight, tracking, and lowlight IQ. Despite the hate, the DR is way better than the 70d too (which it should be - its full frame). The resolution is noticeabally higher as well, but just for editing and not so much for viewing.

Ive also shot the original 6d, and I def say dont go that route. The mark ii has way better focus system which is a huge deal to me, it has the flip screen, and it has the dual pixel AF which is a nice add on for sure. It also has a reliable wifi connection and, I dont remember, but I dont think the 6d has that. It also has betrer weather sealing. I came close to buying the 5d iii instead, but, well, I already said it all and the 5Diii costs significantly more as a refurb.

The only thing that bothers me about the 6d are, well, theres 2 things - the first is the focus area. The focus points only take up the very middle of the frame and the full area is too small. Often, this doesnt matter, but when shooting a moving subject, like sports, I find myself really wishing I had a bigger spread. The thing is, is even the 5div doesnt have a much bigger focus area. This is something about full frame cameras I didnt know about. Live view still focuses pretty much wherever you want in the frame though. Next, is the max flash sync speed without HSS is only 1/180 of a second. However, I found this is pretty typical for full frames which makes sense after thinking about it that crops can have higher sync speeds because the shutter has less of an area to travel. HSS is always an option to solve this.

Heres one thing though - I started building my lenses in anticipation of upgrading to full frame before I upgraded. I now have a 6dii and 70d bodies. Tamrom 70-200 2.8 G2, EF 100 2.8 macro, ef 85 1.8, ef 50 1.8, Tamron 28-75, and now added the 15-30 (to replace my efs 10-18) and a Tamron 150-600. I always suggest to get the glass 1st. A full frame will do no good for you with the glass you have. If you can get a body AND a good kit of lenses then go for it though. You wont regret the 6dii and its returnable so risk free really.


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Some of my photos here: https://flic.kr/ps/2i6XL3
“You're off to Great Places! Today is your day! Your mountain is waiting, So... get on your way!” --Dr. Seuss

 

[c h u n k]

Just looked. Refurbs back in stock but $1599 now. Still a great deal.

 

[BlueCosmo5050]

Hi,

Hev given a thought on moving to a Sony.

I know the IQ is excellent, only thing that really bugs me is battery life. From what I hear the difference compared to a Canon DSLR is so great I'm not sure carrying a bag of spares is a good enough solution.

I may be wrong in this..

Yes, All the Sony mirrorless before the most recent A7Riii have really bad battery life.

The ergonomics do matter too although I didn't talk about that much in my earlier post. When I had the A7R the ergonomics never felt natural but I thought I'd get used to it but it actually held me back quite a bit. I'm nowhere near as fast with it. But if you're only doing Landscapes the ergonomics don't begin to matter as much.

While the battery life isn't great, it might not as far off as you might think from something like a 5D mark IV. I'm not sure on the exact numbers.

I know my 6D would go forever on one battery, I could shoot an entire wedding plus what went on before and after the wedding and not change a battery. The 5D Mark IV seems to go down quite fast and I don't have GPS or WIFI on. I only turn wifi on when I'm doing video and want to use the iPad Pro as a monitor that will allow me to see it larger and touch focus the iPad instead of the camera.

The other downside is there isn't a two card slot option with Sony until once again, the newest A7Riii. So that is the only one so far that has resolved battery issues and memory card slots, besides the A9 of course but that is a new line.

But even with all of that said, I'd rather deal with all of that than hand Canon a new camera price for the 6d Mark ii. Because a 6D Mark ii still doesn't resolve not having two card slots, it'll have better economics and focus system than the older Sony's though.

 

[SteveAnderson]

Hi,

Hev given a thought on moving to a Sony.

I know the IQ is excellent, only thing that really bugs me is battery life. From what I hear the difference compared to a Canon DSLR is so great I'm not sure carrying a bag of spares is a good enough solution.

I may be wrong in this..

Yes, All the Sony mirrorless before the most recent A7Riii have really bad battery life.

The ergonomics do matter too although I didn't talk about that much in my earlier post. When I had the A7R the ergonomics never felt natural but I thought I'd get used to it but it actually held me back quite a bit. I'm nowhere near as fast with it. But if you're only doing Landscapes the ergonomics don't begin to matter as much.

While the battery life isn't great, it might not as far off as you might think from something like a 5D mark IV. I'm not sure on the exact numbers.

I know my 6D would go forever on one battery, I could shoot an entire wedding plus what went on before and after the wedding and not change a battery. The 5D Mark IV seems to go down quite fast and I don't have GPS or WIFI on. I only turn wifi on when I'm doing video and want to use the iPad Pro as a monitor that will allow me to see it larger and touch focus the iPad instead of the camera.

The other downside is there isn't a two card slot option with Sony until once again, the newest A7Riii. So that is the only one so far that has resolved battery issues and memory card slots, besides the A9 of course but that is a new line.

But even with all of that said, I'd rather deal with all of that than hand Canon a new camera price for the 6d Mark ii. Because a 6D Mark ii still doesn't resolve not having two card slots, it'll have better economics and focus system than the older Sony's though.

Yes its easy to be spoiled by some cameras battery life.

My 50D with an 8yr old battery takes 3000 photos with IS on.

It will sit for months in stand-by mode also, ready to take photos still.

6D is good but no where near my 50D for battery life. Same as D750. I think the newer cameras are never really as "off" as the 50D even in its standby mode.

 

[Jura S]

That Sigma is great for sure, so is the MUCH cheaper Tamron 17-55 f2.8.

Problem is that its only really great at f1.8 - f4.0. Most lenses are good at f5.6-f8. Its not worth the price unless you use it at the 1.8 - 4.0.

Do you have it? Do you use it?

This is one of or maybe the sharpest of semi wide angle zooms. It surrpaseses many primes.

And you are right, 18mm is not very wide.

EF10-18, or Sigma 8-16 are good APS-C wide angles.

Otherwise, best price/performance for FF is Tamron 15-30 f.2.8.

At this moment (Canon cashback) Canon's 16-35/4.0 IS L is cheaper than Tamron.

You could get a 5Dm2 and the Tamron?

5D mkII has one lethal flaw. AF.

Keep the 70D for everything else.

Or not.

 

[SteveAnderson]

That Sigma is great for sure, so is the MUCH cheaper Tamron 17-55 f2.8.

Problem is that its only really great at f1.8 - f4.0. Most lenses are good at f5.6-f8. Its not worth the price unless you use it at the 1.8 - 4.0.

Do you have it? Do you use it?

This is one of or maybe the sharpest of semi wide angle zooms. It surrpaseses many primes.

And you are right, 18mm is not very wide.

EF10-18, or Sigma 8-16 are good APS-C wide angles.

Otherwise, best price/performance for FF is Tamron 15-30 f.2.8.

At this moment (Canon cashback) Canon's 16-35/4.0 IS L is cheaper than Tamron.

You could get a 5Dm2 and the Tamron?

5D mkII has one lethal flaw. AF.

Keep the 70D for everything else.

Or not.

This is for Landscapes if I read the OP correctly. AF not so crucial at all.

16-35 is not cheaper or better in my country. Dont know about the OP country.

Already said the Sigma is great. How much better than the Tamron is worth considering. My main point is neither are good for the OP landscapes.

You cant beat the 70D with a 6dm2 for telephoto. Seeing how much telephoto you lose in FF is shocking for most people.

 

[ecka84]

I'm not sure what you expect from a FF. Did you really "grow out of" crop? Because, when you are ready, you don't normally ask this kind of question.

I think 6D2 is definitely not a landscaping camera, despite that many are recommending it. Because most of its advantages are useless for landscapes, like AF systems or the flip out screen, while it is lacking the mostly desirable features - no AA filter, great DR, proper 4K video (it got a soft 1080p instead), or at least dual memory card slots for backup. 6D2 is better than 70D alright, but so is the 80D, which beats the 6D2 in many important aspects, including AF, DR and price.

 

[Barak Ton]

It seems an upgrade to FF from the 70D may happen down the road, but not right now.

While I'm considering the Sigma 18-35 F1.8 as an upgrade to the Sigma 17-50 I have (appears significant), I'm also looking at a telephoto lens (don't have one).

I have seen great reviews on the Canon 70-200F4 IS (also the non IS), however not sure how much resolution is obtained with this lens on a crop sensor like the 70D. Have looked at DXO and it appears there is a significant difference in sharpness with this lens between the 6D and 70D. Would like to hear real-world experiences of crop sensor users before I spend that much on a lens..,Of course if I do get it it will serve me nicely also if I move to FF.

Any other telephoto options I may consider? need the IQ to be good on the 70D. F2.8 is not that important to me as I mostly shoot landscapes on a tripod.

 

[Andy01]

It depends on how much you want to spend.

I had the original 100-400L and later 100-400L ii on my 70D and both performed very well. Obviously bigger, heavier etc than 70-200L f4, but also much great range.

Best viewed full size

Colin

 

[SteveAnderson]

It seems an upgrade to FF from the 70D may happen down the road, but not right now.

While I'm considering the Sigma 18-35 F1.8 as an upgrade to the Sigma 17-50 I have (appears significant), I'm also looking at a telephoto lens (don't have one).

I have seen great reviews on the Canon 70-200F4 IS (also the non IS), however not sure how much resolution is obtained with this lens on a crop sensor like the 70D. Have looked at DXO and it appears there is a significant difference in sharpness with this lens between the 6D and 70D. Would like to hear real-world experiences of crop sensor users before I spend that much on a lens..,Of course if I do get it it will serve me nicely also if I move to FF.

Any other telephoto options I may consider? need the IQ to be good on the 70D. F2.8 is not that important to me as I mostly shoot landscapes on a tripod.

Hi again Barak,

The new Tamron 100-400 VC f4-6.3 is an excellent lens.

All tests show it to be as sharp as the new EF 100-400 II with similar contrast even.

It is much smaller and half the weight.

I have it and friend has the 100-400 II, there is really nothing between them for IQ. Tank like build of the Canon is what separates them.

If f2.8 is not that important, the Tamron is the perfect long zoom price/performance.

ef70-200f4 is excellent of course also. Just wanted to make sure you know about this Tamron.

 

[c h u n k]

Id consider the Tamron 70-200 2.8 G2. I cant imagine anyone that couldnt use the 2.8 over f/4 aperture at least some of the time. The Tanrom is surprisingly sharp wide open. If not, the 70-200 F4 is known to be a very good lens.

 

[1DSmII]

If you want to move to full frame, and you don't mind the extra weight, I'd recommend the 1ds mkII. I love it for landscape. It's true that you will have to forego a few bells and whistles, but you would gain other, IMHO, more important features. Don't let it being old put you off, it still takes amazing images.

Best of all, used examples in good condition will cost you less than the other bodies mentioned here, and you'll get a fully pro body that is better built/more solid, which could easily last a lifetime. Put the money saved towards the best glass you can afford.

As a bonus, battery life is never an issue, and with weather sealing you don't have to worry so much if you get caught out by rain.