Sony ASP-C camera future

A6100 with

newly released 11mm f/1.8
Viltrox 23 f/1.4
Sigma 56 f/1.4

A dream comes true.

But I'm not sure about the future of photo centric APS-C bodies from Sony. So I"m sticking to Fuji.

ms18 said:

A6100 with

newly released 11mm f/1.8
Viltrox 23 f/1.4
Sigma 56 f/1.4
A dream comes true.

But I'm not sure about the future of photo centric APS-C bodies from Sony. So I"m sticking to Fuji.

Click to expand...

Seems absolutely bizarre to me that you would not go for a6600, none of those lenses are stabilized and the battery in the a6600 is absolutely incredible, is there a mirrorless camera that has a better battery life?

As you say Sony lens options for aps-c are a dream come true and if you have a FF Sony, even better. Don't know anything about Fuji other than what the dealer told me. He said its ok but the build quality of the cheaper cameras was not as good as Sony, he also said the Fuji ibis cameras battery life wasn't the best, there was the Fuji 16-55 2.8 but it was very large, big as full frame and no 2.8 11-20 (16-30) yet, just an f4 Fuji option.

I simply love 11mm prime lens from Sony!

I use the unstabilized 16-55 on my A6400 without IBIS. As long as you make sure to use a shorter SS it just works fine. I often take pictures of my children (1/500) and landscapes on sunny days so IBIS is not too relevant for me. The lens is so sharp that in darker conditions you can easily shoot at F2.8 for faster SS and still everything is perfectly sharp. Still I see the benefits of an A6600 but it costs 500€ more than the 6400 and this is just ridiculous.

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Canon2018 said:

I use the unstabilized 16-55 on my A6400 without IBIS. As long as you make sure to use a shorter SS it just works fine. I often take pictures of my children (1/500) and landscapes on sunny days so IBIS is not too relevant for me. The lens is so sharp that in darker conditions you can easily shoot at F2.8 for faster SS and still everything is perfectly sharp. Still I see the benefits of an A6600 but it costs 500€ more than the 6400 and this is just ridiculous.

Click to expand...

It was never my intention to buy this camera, a6600, its completely crazy on paper, I have the Sony a1 lol. But, it was immediately obvious I wanted something smaller/cheaper/lighter as I didn't want to damage the a1 just because I thought I should use it for everything.

I could have gone a7iv and 20-70, total cost £3.5k, a7c, £3.1k or a used a7 body of some description. But when I looked at everything 24mp FF didn't seem to look that different to aps-c 24mp and 30mp of a7iv didn't look so much better and needed aps-c lenses anyway for video. I wanted ibis, great battery life and 2.8 zooms if possible, originally I was smitten by the 10-20 f4 but after a while decided to stick to 2.8, the 10-20 still appeals to me though for size and video.

So, on receiving this a6600 and even after using a demo one at the dealer I think its better made than the Fuji alternatives I was shown, X-S10, the a7c which felt slippery and the evf was even more cramped and that dreadful 28-60 lens contraption I couldn't even open it feels to me like a6600 is a misunderstood bargain. Now I've fitted the 2.8 zooms its like wow, what a great little camera.

I've been looking around to see what cameras can compete with the a6600, its really difficult for them, Sony was very clever;

IBIS, soft cup evf as standard, selfie screen, excellent (incredible) eye af, state of the art rtt, similar to a1, if a little slower obviously, best battery life of any mirrorless camera, might be wrong on that but its what I was told, great grip, easy to operate, weather sealed, good buffer for its intended purpose.

So, what really does do more in that size of camera, 500gr or less?

Dylan10 said:

So, what really does do more in that size of camera, 500gr or less?

Click to expand...

You're in your honeymoon phase, we get it. We really do.

But... don't forget that not everybody uses the camera the same way as you do.

I will list some of the shortcomings of the a6600 compared to what choosing other manufacturers/bodies can improve, both at lower and higher price points;

• AWFUL 1080p video
• pretty bad 4k rolling shutter
• no 4k60
• no 10 bit video
• no gyro sensor
• no flippy screen
• micro HDMI
• no in-camera focus bracketing for macro work
• no in-camera focus stacking (into a single image)
• single card slot
• UHS-1 slot, made it worse because:
• buffer emptying prevents access to many settings
• no bird detection
• no front dial
• IBIS is inferior to the competition
• no popup flash
• 1/4000 max SS (seems to be important for Josè B in example)
• anonymous aesthetics

Most of these things don't bother me, but that doesn't mean other people might find 1 or more compelling reasons to choose other options.

Again, are those dealbreakers for me? No. For you? No.

But we're all different. There's other people on this planet that might see things different.

Bender79ita said:

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

Click to expand...

The sensor performance is same as Fuji 26mp sensor according to some guy who posted a link to someone called photons who'd measure everything?


The a6600 has the battery of the a7iv already! The a7iv needs aps-c lenses for video too.

Bender79ita said:

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Click to expand...

a7iv is full frame, they might put that inside the a7cii is the rumor, is it enough?

Bender79ita said:

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Click to expand...

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Bender79ita said:

Dylan10 said:

So, what really does do more in that size of camera, 500gr or less?

Click to expand...

You're in your honeymoon phase, we get it. We really do.

But... don't forget that not everybody uses the camera the same way as you do.

I will list some of the shortcomings of the a6600 compared to what choosing other manufacturers/bodies can improve, both at lower and higher price points;

• AWFUL 1080p video
• pretty bad 4k rolling shutter
• no 4k60
• no 10 bit video
• no gyro sensor
• no flippy screen
• micro HDMI
• no in-camera focus bracketing for macro work
• no in-camera focus stacking (into a single image)
• single card slot
• UHS-1 slot, made it worse because:
• buffer emptying prevents access to many settings
• no bird detection
• no front dial
• IBIS is inferior to the competition
• no popup flash
• 1/4000 max SS (seems to be important for Josè B in example)
• anonymous aesthetics

Most of these things don't bother me, but that doesn't mean other people might find 1 or more compelling reasons to choose other options.

Again, are those dealbreakers for me? No. For you? No.

But we're all different. There's other people on this planet that might see things different.

Click to expand...

Well, to get all of those will mean which camera?

Canon R7, big, Fuji X-T something, big, do they even have 10 bit video except latest FF cameras? So basically it could be what to get all of that?

Dylan10 said:

Bender79ita said:

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

Click to expand...

The sensor performance is same as Fuji 26mp sensor according to some guy who posted a link to someone called photons who'd measure everything?

https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#FujiFilm X-S10,Sony ILCE-6600

The a6600 has the battery of the a7iv already! The a7iv needs aps-c lenses for video too.

Dylan10 said:

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Click to expand...

a7iv is full frame, they might put that inside the a7cii is the rumor, is it enough?

Click to expand...

I would find an a7Cx much more compelling with a 33MP or 42MP sensor to differentiate it from APS and MFT bodies.

Dylan10 said:

Dylan10 said:

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Click to expand...

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Click to expand...

Jacques Cornell said:

Dylan10 said:

Bender79ita said:

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

Click to expand...

The sensor performance is same as Fuji 26mp sensor according to some guy who posted a link to someone called photons who'd measure everything?

https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#FujiFilm X-S10,Sony ILCE-6600

The a6600 has the battery of the a7iv already! The a7iv needs aps-c lenses for video too.

Jacques Cornell said:

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Click to expand...

a7iv is full frame, they might put that inside the a7cii is the rumor, is it enough?

Click to expand...

I would find an a7Cx much more compelling with a 33MP or 42MP sensor to differentiate it from APS and MFT bodies.

Click to expand...

Exactly, 24mp on FF feels a side step, ok you have better noise control, expanded dr but it needs FF lenses. Just remove the hump of the a7r3, shrink it a bit, add the new ai chips, job done!

Jacques Cornell said:

Jacques Cornell said:

Jacques Cornell said:

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Click to expand...

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Dylan10 said:

Bender79ita said:

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

Click to expand...

The sensor performance is same as Fuji 26mp sensor according to some guy who posted a link to someone called photons who'd measure everything?

https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#FujiFilm X-S10,Sony ILCE-6600

Click to expand...

It's basicly the same sensor in a bayer version. SAR posted the patent some time ago.

I think that they're gonna use that because it's what they patented and already put in a camera.

Dylan10 said:

The a6600 has the battery of the a7iv already! The a7iv needs aps-c lenses for video too.

Click to expand...

Yes and no, it can still shoot full width 7k downsampled. I simply use my FF lenses for stills, in crop mode 4k 60 too.

Dylan10 said:

Dylan10 said:

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Click to expand...

a7iv is full frame, they might put that inside the a7cii is the rumor, is it enough?

Click to expand...

Personally I don't like the A7C form factor. That's why I bought a full frame camera after 3 years of aps-c. I use the 3 programmable top dials and the movie switch quite alot.

Dylan10 said:

Dylan10 said:

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Click to expand...

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

Click to expand...

Sony doesn't make cameras for you, and, as covered in another post, you are not the center of the universe.

Regardless of your preference, the FX30 sensor does shoot 4k 60 and so a new aps-c might need different construction from the current rangefinder style, but maybe not.

Dylan10 said:

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Click to expand...

Yes, everybody got that. Perhaps from the 20+ posts on two different subforums :-D

Bender79ita said:

Dylan10 said:

Bender79ita said:

Nielk Mike said:

Reading the interview with Sony managers from October (I think it was), it seems that Sony considers APS-C the format of choice for video and hybrid cameras. But to be honest: The interview gave little hope of any significant development regarding cameras for still photographers. Do I interpret the interview correctly? Owning a couple of older APS-C bodies I am fine with what they offer and may add an a6400 in the future when the a6500 breaks down.

Click to expand...

If they update the sensor with the FX30, add a UHSII card slot, improve IBIS and at least the AF module of the A7IV (and the battery) it will be a very competitive camera.

Click to expand...

The sensor performance is same as Fuji 26mp sensor according to some guy who posted a link to someone called photons who'd measure everything?

https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#FujiFilm X-S10,Sony ILCE-6600

Click to expand...

It's basicly the same sensor in a bayer version. SAR posted the patent some time ago.

I think that they're gonna use that because it's what they patented and already put in a camera.

Bender79ita said:

The a6600 has the battery of the a7iv already! The a7iv needs aps-c lenses for video too.

Click to expand...

Yes and no, it can still shoot full width 7k downsampled. I simply use my FF lenses for stills, in crop mode 4k 60 too.

Bender79ita said:

Bender79ita said:

They already have this technology, it would be very easy to add it. Basicly a baby A7IV, that would be quite realistic.

Click to expand...

a7iv is full frame, they might put that inside the a7cii is the rumor, is it enough?

Click to expand...

Personally I don't like the A7C form factor. That's why I bought a full frame camera after 3 years of aps-c. I use the 3 programmable top dials and the movie switch quite alot.

Bender79ita said:

Bender79ita said:

Still no idea about the shape, if rangefinder or bump. 4k60 heat might need a bigger body.

Click to expand...

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

Click to expand...

Sony doesn't make cameras for you, and, as covered in another post, you are not the center of the universe.

Regardless of your preference, the FX30 sensor does shoot 4k 60 and so a new aps-c might need different construction from the current rangefinder style, but maybe not.

Bender79ita said:

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Click to expand...

Yes, everybody got that. Perhaps from the 20+ posts on two different subforums :-D

Click to expand...

I'm sorry but I thought the idea was to discuss things, apologies if it's upset you!

Dylan10 said:

ms18 said:

A6100 with

newly released 11mm f/1.8
Viltrox 23 f/1.4
Sigma 56 f/1.4
A dream comes true.

But I'm not sure about the future of photo centric APS-C bodies from Sony. So I"m sticking to Fuji.

Click to expand...

Seems absolutely bizarre to me that you would not go for a6600, none of those lenses are stabilized and the battery in the a6600 is absolutely incredible, is there a mirrorless camera that has a better battery life?

As you say Sony lens options for aps-c are a dream come true and if you have a FF Sony, even better.

Click to expand...

I stay with ASP-C because I want smaller size and reasonable to me prices. A FF lens that can go on the APS-C sensor is not appealing to me. Now I'm curious how many of E mount lenses are designed for APS-C only sensor, including third party. For example the 16-50 was released for APS-C 10 years ago, 16-55 f2.8 was released a little over three years ago, but for FF. Look at the size difference and price difference. And 16-55 is not stabilized.

Dylan10 said:

Don't know anything about Fuji other than what the dealer told me. He said its ok but the build quality of the cheaper cameras was not as good as Sony, he also said the Fuji ibis cameras battery life wasn't the best, there was the Fuji 16-55 2.8 but it was very large, big as full frame and no 2.8 11-20 (16-30) yet, just an f4 Fuji option.

Click to expand...

Bender79ita said:

Dylan10 said:

So, what really does do more in that size of camera, 500gr or less?

Click to expand...

You're in your honeymoon phase, we get it. We really do.

But... don't forget that not everybody uses the camera the same way as you do.

I will list some of the shortcomings of the a6600 compared to what choosing other manufacturers/bodies can improve, both at lower and higher price points;

• AWFUL 1080p video
• pretty bad 4k rolling shutter
• no 4k60
• no 10 bit video
• no gyro sensor
• no flippy screen
• micro HDMI
• no in-camera focus bracketing for macro work
• no in-camera focus stacking (into a single image)
• single card slot
• UHS-1 slot, made it worse because:
• buffer emptying prevents access to many settings
• no bird detection
• no front dial
• IBIS is inferior to the competition
• no popup flash
• 1/4000 max SS (seems to be important for Josè B in example)
• anonymous aesthetics

Most of these things don't bother me, but that doesn't mean other people might find 1 or more compelling reasons to choose other options.

Again, are those dealbreakers for me? No. For you? No.

But we're all different. There's other people on this planet that might see things different.

Click to expand...

That's a nice complete list Bender!

No one knows when the A6600 replacement will arrive but I'm already thinking of my next camera I'm checking out the Canon R forum due to the hot rumor of the R8. Love the specs of the R6MKII as well. I haven't discounted the A7IV (plus OEM vertical grip) as well.

The R6MKII's 40 fps ES looks very appealing considering the rolling shutter is well controlled. Another advantage is I can use my EF lenses with it with the adapter. However, it's 24MP so not enough cropping power.

OTOH, the A7IV seems like a great sweet spot at 33MP. Sure it's 'only' 10 FPS but I heard the sound of the mechanical shutter at high bursts and it seems more quiet than the A6600. Also, I shoot sports using jpeg so I would imagine the buffer with a fast Sandisk UHS-II 128GB card with the 135/1.8 GM @ ISO-100-800 should be pretty much endless. Also, I can use my e-mount lenses which are more or less more modern than if I shoot EF with the R6II. Also I don't shoot sports all the time and the A7IV is a well-rounded camera.

Having said all the above, I'll wait for the A6600 replacement before I make my decision.

piticoto said:

Dylan10 said:

ms18 said:

A6100 with

newly released 11mm f/1.8
Viltrox 23 f/1.4
Sigma 56 f/1.4
A dream comes true.

But I'm not sure about the future of photo centric APS-C bodies from Sony. So I"m sticking to Fuji.

Click to expand...

Seems absolutely bizarre to me that you would not go for a6600, none of those lenses are stabilized and the battery in the a6600 is absolutely incredible, is there a mirrorless camera that has a better battery life?

As you say Sony lens options for aps-c are a dream come true and if you have a FF Sony, even better.

Click to expand...

I stay with ASP-C because I want smaller size and reasonable to me prices. A FF lens that can go on the APS-C sensor is not appealing to me. Now I'm curious how many of E mount lenses are designed for APS-C only sensor, including third party. For example the 16-50 was released for APS-C 10 years ago, 16-55 f2.8 was released a little over three years ago, but for FF. Look at the size difference and price difference. And 16-55 is not stabilized.

piticoto said:

Don't know anything about Fuji other than what the dealer told me. He said its ok but the build quality of the cheaper cameras was not as good as Sony, he also said the Fuji ibis cameras battery life wasn't the best, there was the Fuji 16-55 2.8 but it was very large, big as full frame and no 2.8 11-20 (16-30) yet, just an f4 Fuji option.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

The Sony 16-55 is a dedicated aps-c-lens, not FF and was introduced alongside the equally brilliant 70-350G. Recently, the 11mm 1.8, the 10-20G and 15mm 1.4 were released for aps-c only. Now we have a complete lineup of lenses for Sony aps-c and even if no more were to come we could not possibly miss anything.

Canon2018 said:

even if no more were to come we could not possibly miss anything.

Click to expand...

It seems like a reasonably fast 200 or 250mm would still be useful/nice, right?

Tamron 70-180 2.8 is close to that range

kerpan said:

Canon2018 said:

even if no more were to come we could not possibly miss anything.

Click to expand...

It seems like a reasonably fast 200 or 250mm would still be useful/nice, right?

Click to expand...

Dylan10 said:

4k60 is not a priority for me, 30p is fine.

I am really impressed with a6600 even next to a1!

Click to expand...

Then you don't need a new Sony camera model, you need the A6600.