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Should Fuji go FF? (instead of MF)
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Bobo Hodls
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Shoot me now. Please.
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...Bob, NYC
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Esmond_B
Well-known member
The next generation of sensors and processors could give the MF line the on-sensor PDAF and speed boosts which would lift it from its narrow niche. The GFX and any successors are not on my wanted list, though.
T
Tim C.
Guest
I believe it is not a matter of if, but when Fujifilm enter the full frame market.
Tim C.
Snap Happy
Senior Member
I don’t:
FF is a smaller market than APS with a higher risk of failure (established competition, cost of launching and maintaining a 3rd ILC range).
I think Fuji have shrewdly gone all-in for the higher volume APS market with appealing products now right across the range, and an interesting brand proposition - retro stylng, Kaizen updates and FPS.
The GFX sits in a niche with very little competition at the price, it may be low volume but continues their presence in what is predominantly a professional market (and therefore less price-sensitive?). Remember they have history here with their 6x9 & 6x17 film cameras, as well as once being an OEM for at least one big name in MF film cameras.
That they are now about raid the parts-bin and produce a rangefinder MF I think is another shrewd move, just like the X-T100 was at the other end of the range.
Driving down your component cost by increased volume is always smart, especially when the MF sensor is a large proportion of the cost of these cameras. Imagine the impact of dropping the unit cost of the sensor by 10 or 20%.
Plus, they will steal more sales from the FF trinity at the high end - always good to steal a bit of your competitors lunch.
Doug MacMillan
Senior Member
I hope they never do. I think they are sitting in a sweet spot.
DangerouslyCheesey
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A deeply strange article that makes claims without backing them up (for example, that Sony is "winning" over Fuji and that its because Sony went Full Frame), while ignoring any data that it doesn't consider relevant. Its always amusing to see the differences between what photography nerds think matters and what actually matters. No one ever seems to bother to consider that the majority of camera users will never use anything other than the kit lens, or that the majority of photographers display their work on social media, viewed on smartphone screens.
And if there were three gas stations on three corners of an intersection you would be the guy advising some poor fool to open a gas station on the forth corner with his life savings!
No FF please! As Abraham Lincoln once said. “One war at a time.”
rwbaron
Forum Pro
:-D
And the three already there are Exxon, BP and Shell.
I'm always amazed by the FF hysteria which has resulted in the race to the bottom by the big three.
Fuji has a great niche and needs to stay the course.
Bob
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rwbaron
Forum Pro
Who is Usman Dawood and why should I care what he thinks?
Why is his opinion more valid than Thom Hogan's or anyone else for that matter?
Why is his opinion more valid than Thom Hogan's or anyone else for that matter?
third son
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Bang!..... Yer dedShoot me now. Please.
Greg7579
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There are four FF mirrorless systems now. No need for a fifth. Fuji has the Sweet Spot.
Greg Johnson, San Antonio, Texas
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Greg7579
Forum Pro
Amazed that you would think that. Some people may want them to, but I've never heard anyone who really thinks that they will. You are incorrect. Not happening.
Greg Johnson, San Antonio, Texas
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May I ask why do you "play around with the idea of a GFX"? What good is an idea if one cannot afford it, or if is useless for one's job?
Yeah I know most here defend APS-C and hey I personally do NOT have a beef with Fuji's APS-C because I have own a few of them starting with the S5 Pro and X10 and I do love my Fuji APS-C, BUT, I would have also wanted two Fuji FF bodies for sure.
I have never said for Fuji to eliminate APS-C or that it was a mistake but I do agree they should have started making FF around the same time as Sony to stay in the lead and ahead of canikon. Fuji should have only made certain compact bodies size wise for the folks that demand the light weight and portability and then jump straight to FF for us that want and need it. My dream camera is a X-Trans FF 36MP sensor. That would have been something pretty amazing IMHO buy hey that's just me talking crazy and there is no harm in dreaming ;-)
How many car manufacturers or car models exist now days? Is it a bad thing to have more options?
Fuji APS-C is sweet indeed, but FF is missing. That's a fact. Plus Fuji's APS-C prices are just too darn close to FF now days.
One thing I have learned in my short life is that the world doesn't stop spinning and things always keep changing. Change is inevitable and there is nothing wrong with change or "options"
I mean, would it hurt you or anybody else here in some possible way physically, mentally, emotionally, financially if Fuji made a FF??
I personally have never understood this strong opposition against FF. Now if Fuji for sure will NEVER change their mind about providing FF then so be it, I'm perfectly fine now by owning dual camera systems with another brand and I'm not going to die if they don't. Is all good to me.
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Jerry-astro
Forum Pro
Nahhh, I think you’ll be standing all by yourself (or nearly so) on this one, Tim. Fuji very wisely decided to let Canikon fight it out along with Sony for the FF market, and as it turns out, they’re doing that with (IMHO) some VERY also-ran products. Instead, Fuji has chosen to make crop their sweet spot and invest very heavily in that format. And for those who want or need something bigger, they’ve begun to carve out a very nice niche in MF... something that both Canon and Nikon have basically ignored. I think as Fuji develops and expands its GFX line and perhaps pushes it a bit downstream in pricing and develops the X line pushing it upwards with the X-Hn series, Canikon will be caught in the middle. Granted, they have huge market share and loyal customer bases, but I’d have to question how much real market share they’ll be able to capture with those also-ran products, particularly with both Sony and Fuji as well established competitors.
It’s always a mistake to underestimate the value of momentum and the influence that both Canon and Nikon wield in the industry. However, I think they have a tough road ahead in mirrorless and until they make a serious commitment to the market with seriously competitive products (which IMHO they don’t have yet), I think they’ve left a wonderful opening for Fuji to continue to grow and develop its line. And Sony is not to be ignored here either, IMHO. Meanwhile, Fuji is highly focused on MF and crop and I believe the recipe for success is for them to maintain that focus. There’s lots of evidence to suggest that this is exactly what they’re doing IMHO.
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Jerry-Astro
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Jerry-astro
Forum Pro
Yup, that’s a fact. It’s missing, and it probably should remain that way IMHO.How many car manufacturers or car models exist now days? Is it a bad thing to have more options?
Fuji APS-C is sweet indeed, but FF is missing. That's a fact.
Yes, because it diverts valuable (and finite) R&D resources into the development of yet another format and line of cameras. Those are resources that could (and should IMHO) be spent strengthening both Fuji’s MF and crop lines, not stretching them thin with yet another format. That effort will weaken their existing lines (remember: finite resources), likely making them less competitive over time. I’d much rather they build on their momentum and continue to compete where they have the best chance for success.One thing I have learned in my short life is that the world doesn't stop spinning and things always keep changing. Change is inevitable and there is nothing wrong with change or "options"
I mean, would it hurt you or anybody else here in some possible way physically, mentally, emotionally, financially if Fuji made a FF??
Terrific. Then enjoy that other brand and, IMHO. Meanwhile, I’m happy that Fuji is focused on markets where they can succeed and continue to carve out more unique niches in the industry (like MF) with a better chance for success.
I say you and I leave those decisions to Fuji and I think they are very capable of figuring it out. I personally welcome a Fuji FF so whatever happens happens. If they don't make one great, if they do make one great.Yup, that’s a fact. It’s missing, and it probably should remain that way IMHO.How many car manufacturers or car models exist now days? Is it a bad thing to have more options?
Fuji APS-C is sweet indeed, but FF is missing. That's a fact.
Yes, because it diverts valuable (and finite) R&D resources into the development of yet another format and line of cameras. Those are resources that could (and should IMHO) be spent strengthening both Fuji’s MF and crop lines, not stretching them thin with yet another format. That effort will weaken their existing lines (remember: finite resources), likely making them less competitive over time. I’d much rather they build on their momentum and continue to compete where they have the best chance for success.One thing I have learned in my short life is that the world doesn't stop spinning and things always keep changing. Change is inevitable and there is nothing wrong with change or "options"
I mean, would it hurt you or anybody else here in some possible way physically, mentally, emotionally, financially if Fuji made a FF??
Jerry-astro
Forum Pro
You seem to be confusing opinions with decisions. I don't think anyone is questioning who gets to make the final call. However, you offered an opinion here and should expect reasonable rebuttals if people don't happen to agree. It is a forum after all.
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