horizontal lines across image ??? using FLASH

Chris Dera

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HI ALL

so i was shooting some portraits yesterday for the first time.

I used a flash on wireless mode and HSS so i can get a fast shutter speed.

And what i notice are those horizontal lines on all of my images?

Why is That?

Please Help



6d351ade93754621b3f6aa15c0ca392b.jpg.png
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
 
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All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
Yep, exactly, and typically the sync speed combined with flash will freeze things nicely. I’ve got some fun pics of my daughter from when she was two jumping in the air with flash set at sync speed. Because my exposure was practically entirely flash they’re absolutely razor sharp, no hss even needed. The strobist site is a wonderful primer to flash photography imho.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
The very definition of "fill" flash is indeed in SUN, which causes shadows.

And I really showed that the max-range is 4-5'. (not 20-30')

Even in the linked-article his max was 8' w/ GN-300 strobe @ f/1.4.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
Yep, exactly, and typically the sync speed combined with flash will freeze things nicely. I’ve got some fun pics of my daughter from when she was two jumping in the air with flash set at sync speed. Because my exposure was practically entirely flash they’re absolutely razor sharp, no hss even needed. The strobist site is a wonderful primer to flash photography imho.
But 1/250s in sunlight is prone to show blur.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
The very definition of "fill" flash is indeed in SUN, which causes shadows.

And I really showed that the max-range is 4-5'. (not 20-30')
No you didn't . You assumed that you needed all the power the flash was capable of dumping at its rated Guide Number. As I said, for fill flash you only need a little bit of light, maybe 1/8 of the rated Guide Number so you get all of your working distance back.
Even in the linked-article his max was 8' w/ GN-300 strobe @ f/1.4.
That's with the flash dumping everything in the capacitor. You don't need that for fill flash.

Tedolph
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
The very definition of "fill" flash is indeed in SUN-light to fill SHADOWS.

And I already showed that the FP/HSS max-range is only 4-5' w/ GN-48. (not 20-30')
No you didn't . You assumed that you needed all the power the flash was capable of dumping at its rated Guide Number. As I said, for fill flash you only need a little bit of light, maybe 1/8 of the rated Guide Number so you get all of your working distance back.
I call BS ....

If you are not within 1-stop (below) ambient SUN-light, I suggest you won't see much of a noticeable result of EFFECTIVE fill-flash.

And I often like the effect of 1-stop above ambient, with SS adjusted to lower the "ambient" ... or ... even with SS set to lower ambient 3-5 stops to totally darken-ambient to "black". (IMPOSSIBLE w/ FP/HSS.)
Even in the linked-article his max was 8' w/ GN-300 strobe @ f/1.4.
That's with the flash dumping everything in the capacitor. You don't need that for fill flash.
Still BS, even the linked article used full-power GN-300 @ f/1.4, (and even "2" of them for one example) to a MAX distance of only 8'.

I CHALLENGE you prove your point w/ a noticeable/effective example of FP-shutter 20' fill-flash -- (in bright-SUN) ???

(I have REPEATEDLY showed sun-light leaf-shutter examples w/ built-in strobe (GN-48) of fill-flash to 20' -- and "dark" background at closer-range w/ 1/4000s.)
 
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All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
Yep, exactly, and typically the sync speed combined with flash will freeze things nicely. I’ve got some fun pics of my daughter from when she was two jumping in the air with flash set at sync speed. Because my exposure was practically entirely flash they’re absolutely razor sharp, no hss even needed. The strobist site is a wonderful primer to flash photography imho.
But 1/250s in sunlight is prone to show blur.
Looks like the OP is shooting indoors though.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
Yep, exactly, and typically the sync speed combined with flash will freeze things nicely. I’ve got some fun pics of my daughter from when she was two jumping in the air with flash set at sync speed. Because my exposure was practically entirely flash they’re absolutely razor sharp, no hss even needed. The strobist site is a wonderful primer to flash photography imho.
But 1/250s in sunlight is prone to show blur.
Looks like the OP is shooting indoors though.
Then he should not even need HSS.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
Yep, exactly, and typically the sync speed combined with flash will freeze things nicely. I’ve got some fun pics of my daughter from when she was two jumping in the air with flash set at sync speed. Because my exposure was practically entirely flash they’re absolutely razor sharp, no hss even needed. The strobist site is a wonderful primer to flash photography imho.
But 1/250s in sunlight is prone to show blur.
Looks like the OP is shooting indoors though.
Then he should not even need HSS.
EXACTLY. :-)
 
But still choose to use it so lets get back to the issue at hand, I've already mentioned the likely culprit (Electronic First Curtain Shutter) but it seems of have been totally overlooked.

Just took a handful of shots to show the banding and the "fix"
First at 1/2500sec

HSS flash and EFCS turned on
HSS flash and EFCS turned on



HSS and EFCS turned off
HSS and EFCS turned off

And at 1/4000 sec



EFCS on
EFCS on



EFCS turned off
EFCS turned off

So, HSS flash with a camera that has EFCS, turn it off unless you want banding.
 
All the OP needs to know is that it pulses and reduces the strength of the flash in exchange for being able to use flash with a higher shutter speed. They also should realize for the type of shooting they are doing (portraits) HSS is probably not needed / desired.
It could be, but then you don't need much power at all for fill flash. That is why Joe's straw man objections are misleading. It doesn't matter that your GN drops with HSS because you don't need much power for fill flash anyway.

Sure, you might only have an 8' flash range with HSS at a higher shutter speed, but you only need maybe 1/8 or 1/16 flash power for fill flash so your effective range goes back up to 20 or 30'. More than you need for any fill flash portrait.

Joe's objection really only applies if you are using a very high shutter speed and HSS and you are trying to overpower a bright sun. Hard to imagine that circumstance in a portrait setting.

tEgdolph
The very definition of "fill" flash is indeed in SUN, which causes shadows.

And I really showed that the max-range is 4-5'. (not 20-30')
No you didn't . You assumed that you needed all the power the flash was capable of dumping at its rated Guide Number. As I said, for fill flash you only need a little bit of light, maybe 1/8 of the rated Guide Number so you get all of your working distance back.
You do realize you are making no-sense what-so-ever ....

How do you get MORE working distance w/ 1/8 power ???

And SUN-light fill-flash almost always needs all the power you got ... "SCOTTY ... GIVE IT ALL YOU GOT !!!"

Are you aware of the "Sunny-16" formula .. Are you aware of the GN/distance formula ???

And are you aware that for sun-light fill-flash they have to (+/-- 1 stop) EQUAL each other for a combined ambient/flash exposure ???
Even in the linked-article his max was 8' w/ GN-300 strobe @ f/1.4.
That's with the flash dumping everything in the capacitor. You don't need that for fill flash.
Once again ... how do you get MORE working distance with less power ???
 
A somewhat MISLEADING article link because he never mentions the GN "halves" with each subsequent SS increase above "native" flash-sync SS.
What do you mean by "misleading"? Its normal meaning is that it leads someone to believe something that's untrue, but there's nothing in the article to lead anyone to any conclusion about Guide Number (this is a beginners forum so just using initials without explanation isn't much use).
Misleading when he never "cautions" that HSS drastically reduces GN, (ok Guide Number), and that it required GN-300 @ f/1.4 to do his example images, (and only to a max distance of 8').
He says "It works well, but it comes at the expense of power, and heat. HSS works the flash really hard."

Now, if you are really bothered about beginners (and not, as I suspect, just beating a drum) then you'll realise that a beginner won't know what Guide Number means (whether abbreviated or not) but can easily understand the message "... at the expense of power".

In other words, a sufficient caution is given so your argument is false.
How many beginners have GN-300 and f/1.4 and the SKILL to properly use it when limited to 8' ???
Straw man argument. By this standard no one should ever tell a beginner anything because they won't have the requisite equipment. Narrow DOF - don't tell them because they don't have f/1.4 lenses.
Notice that the quote I sent indeed did say it was very problematic with very limited applications, (f/2.8 in sunlight @ only very short-range).

What is wrong with a "beginner" being told that a leaf-shutter will allow f/2.8 at MUCH longer range and also the ability to darken-backgrounds for CREATIVE effect ???
What is wrong with it is that it's not relevant to most beginners because they don't have that sort of camera. There are hundreds, probably thousands, of things that one could tell a beginner: put them all in every post and they'll be swamped. Pick just one and it gets unwarranted notice.
Notice his best images are VERY close, and one of his images with (2-stop robbing) soft-modifier shows almost no-flash effect at all. The only distance shot was under overcast so he could shoot @ 1/1000, (instead of 1/4000s).
The article is about a particular type of picture and the illustrations are that type of picture. Nothing misleading there.
It is when posted in the "beginners" forum when most "beginners" won't have the equipment or skill to duplicate.
Nonsense. Surely even you can see the difference between reading about something and being able to do it.
The technique, of course, like every other technique is limited in its application. But including a list of every possible limitation is more likely to confuse than illuminate ...
So it is not confusing if they try, (but FAIL), to duplicate it w/ LESS than GN-300 or distance greater than 8' ???
Read Ted's posts.
I suggest the article was WORTHLESS to such a beginner.
You keep banging on about beginners. The article isn't aimed at beginners. It includes a statement about how HSS works that answers the question posed by the OP (a beginner). I copied that statement to show the attribution of the quotation.
I have found I can use the built-in (GN-48) strobe on FZ-1000 & 2000/2500 to a SUN-light effective range 15+'.
... for example, small-sensor cameras have limitations that include restricted ability to give shallow depth of field
Which can also sometimes, (and maybe MORE OFTEN), be an ADVANTAGE.
Utterly irrelevant. Whatever the benefit in one direction it's a drawback in the other direction. You say that beginners should be cautioned about drawbacks but consistently fail to do so.
and restricted ability to capture low light;
Absolutely I will AGREE with that ... I can't think of any disadvantage to the low-light high-ISO ability of larger sensors.
But you never mention that your favoured camera lacks it.
but you fail to mention those. Either the article isn't misleading or your comment is even more misleading.
 
Once again ... how do you get MORE working distance with less power ???
What he says is that you need less power than full.

Inverse square law - if you need full power at 1m then but you need only 1/4 power you get 2m, etc ...
But for sun-light fill-flash you usually are going to need "full" power. Thats why he needed an (originally) GN-300 to reach (only) 8' @ f/1.4 -- because it's effective power was so severely reduced via HSS.

I could get 15+' (w/ GN-48 @ f/2.8) because leaf-shutters don't (effectively) "reduce" the original GN, (until SS is shorter than flash-duration).

So w/ leaf-shutter, I still had an effective GN (48) -- HIGHER than he had w/ GN-300 after FP/HSS "reduction", (to what appeared to be about GN-11).
 
A somewhat MISLEADING article link because he never mentions the GN "halves" with each subsequent SS increase above "native" flash-sync SS.
What do you mean by "misleading"? Its normal meaning is that it leads someone to believe something that's untrue, but there's nothing in the article to lead anyone to any conclusion about Guide Number (this is a beginners forum so just using initials without explanation isn't much use).
Misleading when he never "cautions" that HSS drastically reduces GN, (ok Guide Number), and that it required GN-300 @ f/1.4 to do his example images, (and only to a max distance of 8').
He says "It works well, but it comes at the expense of power, and heat. HSS works the flash really hard."
If you were buying a car w/ 300HP engine, and some told you of a really neat "trick" you could do "but at the expense of power", would you really expect an "expense" down to (an almost unusable) only "11"-HP ???

I would appreciate a little more "warning" than that.
Now, if you are really bothered about beginners (and not, as I suspect, just beating a drum) then you'll realise that a beginner won't know what Guide Number means (whether abbreviated or not) but can easily understand the message "... at the expense of power".

In other words, a sufficient caution is given so your argument is false.
How many beginners have GN-300 and f/1.4 and the SKILL to properly use it when limited to 8' ???
Straw man argument. By this standard no one should ever tell a beginner anything because they won't have the requisite equipment. Narrow DOF - don't tell them because they don't have f/1.4 lenses.
Notice that the quote I sent indeed did say it was very problematic with very limited applications, (f/2.8 in sunlight @ only very short-range).

What is wrong with a "beginner" being told that a leaf-shutter will allow f/2.8 at MUCH longer range and also the ability to darken-backgrounds for CREATIVE effect ???
What is wrong with it is that it's not relevant to most beginners because they don't have that sort of camera.
But we advise beginners all the time to buy a camera for what they want/need to do.

I suggest (effective) fill-flash in sunlight may indeed be something they might want, (and indeed NEED judging by the number of sun-light back-lit/shadowed questions of how to properly expose "face" w/out saturating the background. Longer-range effective fill-flash is obviously the quickest/easiest method and therefore they may (highly) consider a leaf-shutter.

What is wrong with simply informing a beginner of that option if they are (probably) not aware of it ???

On the specific camera you know I am referring to, ALL one needs to do is select flash and the camera auto selects appropriate SS, (normally above typical FP sync speeds), and TTL's the flash, (out to 17').

No "manual" calculations of reduced FP/HSS GN and max effective power/range, (which is most often beyond limits of his GN or f/stop -- unless he has a GN-300 w/ f1/4).
There are hundreds, probably thousands, of things that one could tell a beginner: put them all in every post and they'll be swamped. Pick just one and it gets unwarranted notice.
You don't think sun-light fill-flash could/should be an important consideration ???

You don't think a "creative" ability to darken/isolate a (closer) subject could/should be a consideration ???

Is only a "larger" sensor important enough to put ABOVE ALL ELSE ??? (when there have been many threads where no-one could tell the difference between FF & 1/2.3")

Now absolutely I agree with the necessity of larger sensor if their intended use is low-light or largest poster prints.

But I suggest the advantages of leaf-shutters w/ 1/4000 flash-sync, (and speed/convenience of), continuous zoom, are still worth KNOWING about before making a decision to buy or return a camera. (again considering many "family" shots are done in "shadows" while back-lit)

I take MANY photos of people with their cell-phone, and I ALWAYS turn on their flash first, (they are often amazed when their faces are no-longer dark/black -- albeit cell-phone flash is also VERY limited)
Notice his best images are VERY close, and one of his images with (2-stop robbing) soft-modifier shows almost no-flash effect at all. The only distance shot was under overcast so he could shoot @ 1/1000, (instead of 1/4000s).
The article is about a particular type of picture and the illustrations are that type of picture. Nothing misleading there.
It is when posted in the "beginners" forum when most "beginners" won't have the equipment or skill to duplicate.
Nonsense. Surely even you can see the difference between reading about something and being able to do it.
Now who is demeaning the intelligence of beginners ???

And as mentioned above -- ALL you really have to do is "raise" flash and the camera can be "auto" (TTL) so I suggest it is not as complicated as you indicate above.

HSS is indeed very complicated when you have to re-calculate GN & f/stop with change in SS or (usually too far) distance.
The technique, of course, like every other technique is limited in its application. But including a list of every possible limitation is more likely to confuse than illuminate ...
So it is not confusing if they try, (but FAIL), to duplicate it w/ LESS than GN-300 or distance greater than 8' ???
Read Ted's posts.
I suggest the article was WORTHLESS to such a beginner.
You keep banging on about beginners. The article isn't aimed at beginners. It includes a statement about how HSS works that answers the question posed by the OP (a beginner). I copied that statement to show the attribution of the quotation.
But I suggest that every beginner should be told about HSS limitations, especially when so-many "experts" here suggests that HSS is "equal" to a high native sync-SS, (literally every time I mention leaf-shutters).
I have found I can use the built-in (GN-48) strobe on FZ-1000 & 2000/2500 to a SUN-light effective range 15+'.
... for example, small-sensor cameras have limitations that include restricted ability to give shallow depth of field
Which can also sometimes, (and maybe MORE OFTEN), be an ADVANTAGE.
Utterly irrelevant. Whatever the benefit in one direction it's a drawback in the other direction. You say that beginners should be cautioned about drawbacks but consistently fail to do so.
Absolutely not.

I always suggest that FF is "best" if they want/need low-light and/or largest-posters and/or narrow DOF.

And I suggest 1/2.3" if smaller/lighter/cheaper zoom-tele is their priority.

And I always admit that the 1"-type sensor is a "compromise", just like smaller and larger sensors/cameras/lenses are also.
and restricted ability to capture low light;
Absolutely I will AGREE with that ... I can't think of any disadvantage to the low-light high-ISO ability of larger sensors.
But you never mention that your favoured camera lacks it.
(see above) I always allow that it is a compromise and sometimes suggest either FF or 1/2.3" if best for them.

But you should know that "Hand-Held NIGHT-shot" works well, albeit with static subjects. (but if lower-light requires a longer SS, they may still have a problem w/ moving subjects)
 
A somewhat MISLEADING article link because he never mentions the GN "halves" with each subsequent SS increase above "native" flash-sync SS.
What do you mean by "misleading"? Its normal meaning is that it leads someone to believe something that's untrue, but there's nothing in the article to lead anyone to any conclusion about Guide Number (this is a beginners forum so just using initials without explanation isn't much use).
Misleading when he never "cautions" that HSS drastically reduces GN, (ok Guide Number), and that it required GN-300 @ f/1.4 to do his example images, (and only to a max distance of 8').
He says "It works well, but it comes at the expense of power, and heat. HSS works the flash really hard."
If you were buying a car w/ 300HP engine, and some told you of a really neat "trick" you could do "but at the expense of power", would you really expect an "expense" down to (an almost unusable) only "11"-HP ???
If I were a beginner driver I wouldn't be near a car that powerful so this line of argument - throughout this post, nearly - is false.
I would appreciate a little more "warning" than that.
And if I decided that I was interested in the specific [car, technique or whatever] I'd note the warning and research further before buying.
Now, if you are really bothered about beginners (and not, as I suspect, just beating a drum) then you'll realise that a beginner won't know what Guide Number means (whether abbreviated or not) but can easily understand the message "... at the expense of power".

In other words, a sufficient caution is given so your argument is false.
How many beginners have GN-300 and f/1.4 and the SKILL to properly use it when limited to 8' ???
Straw man argument. By this standard no one should ever tell a beginner anything because they won't have the requisite equipment. Narrow DOF - don't tell them because they don't have f/1.4 lenses.
Notice that the quote I sent indeed did say it was very problematic with very limited applications, (f/2.8 in sunlight @ only very short-range).

What is wrong with a "beginner" being told that a leaf-shutter will allow f/2.8 at MUCH longer range and also the ability to darken-backgrounds for CREATIVE effect ???
What is wrong with it is that it's not relevant to most beginners because they don't have that sort of camera.
But we advise beginners all the time to buy a camera for what they want/need to do.
But that's not what this is about. The beginner with the problem that HSS may solve already has the camera without a leaf shutter so mentioning it is irrelevant.
I suggest (effective) fill-flash in sunlight may indeed be something they might want, (and indeed NEED judging by the number of sun-light back-lit/shadowed questions of how to properly expose "face" w/out saturating the background. Longer-range effective fill-flash is obviously the quickest/easiest method and therefore they may (highly) consider a leaf-shutter.

What is wrong with simply informing a beginner of that option if they are (probably) not aware of it ???
Why not write a book about all the options open (there are many)? - Because it's too much information. Why pick out just one option: it gives an unbalanced - that is, misleading, which is your prime concern here - impression.
On the specific camera you know I am referring to, ALL one needs to do is select flash and the camera auto selects appropriate SS, (normally above typical FP sync speeds), and TTL's the flash, (out to 17').

No "manual" calculations of reduced FP/HSS GN and max effective power/range, (which is most often beyond limits of his GN or f/stop -- unless he has a GN-300 w/ f1/4).
There are hundreds, probably thousands, of things that one could tell a beginner: put them all in every post and they'll be swamped. Pick just one and it gets unwarranted notice.
You don't think sun-light fill-flash could/should be an important consideration ???
I didn't say that. All I said is that you are being selective - and therefore potentially misleading - if you introduce just one of the many possible topics.
You don't think a "creative" ability to darken/isolate a (closer) subject could/should be a consideration ??? Is only a "larger" sensor important enough to put ABOVE ALL ELSE ??? (when there have been many threads where no-one could tell the difference between FF & 1/2.3")

Now absolutely I agree with the necessity of larger sensor if their intended use is low-light or largest poster prints.

But I suggest the advantages of leaf-shutters w/ 1/4000 flash-sync, (and speed/convenience of), continuous zoom, are still worth KNOWING about before making a decision to buy or return a camera. (again considering many "family" shots are done in "shadows" while back-lit)

I take MANY photos of people with their cell-phone, and I ALWAYS turn on their flash first, (they are often amazed when their faces are no-longer dark/black -- albeit cell-phone flash is also VERY limited)
... so why go on about HSS being limited?
Notice his best images are VERY close, and one of his images with (2-stop robbing) soft-modifier shows almost no-flash effect at all. The only distance shot was under overcast so he could shoot @ 1/1000, (instead of 1/4000s).
The article is about a particular type of picture and the illustrations are that type of picture. Nothing misleading there.
It is when posted in the "beginners" forum when most "beginners" won't have the equipment or skill to duplicate.
Nonsense. Surely even you can see the difference between reading about something and being able to do it.
Now who is demeaning the intelligence of beginners ???
It's not the beginners' intelligence I doubt.
And as mentioned above -- ALL you really have to do is "raise" flash and the camera can be "auto" (TTL) so I suggest it is not as complicated as you indicate above.

HSS is indeed very complicated when you have to re-calculate GN & f/stop with change in SS or (usually too far) distance.
The technique, of course, like every other technique is limited in its application. But including a list of every possible limitation is more likely to confuse than illuminate ...
So it is not confusing if they try, (but FAIL), to duplicate it w/ LESS than GN-300 or distance greater than 8' ???
Read Ted's posts.
I suggest the article was WORTHLESS to such a beginner.
You keep banging on about beginners. The article isn't aimed at beginners. It includes a statement about how HSS works that answers the question posed by the OP (a beginner). I copied that statement to show the attribution of the quotation.
But I suggest that every beginner should be told about HSS limitations, especially when so-many "experts" here suggests that HSS is "equal" to a high native sync-SS, (literally every time I mention leaf-shutters).
I have found I can use the built-in (GN-48) strobe on FZ-1000 & 2000/2500 to a SUN-light effective range 15+'.
... for example, small-sensor cameras have limitations that include restricted ability to give shallow depth of field
Which can also sometimes, (and maybe MORE OFTEN), be an ADVANTAGE.
Utterly irrelevant. Whatever the benefit in one direction it's a drawback in the other direction. You say that beginners should be cautioned about drawbacks but consistently fail to do so.
Absolutely not. I always suggest that FF is "best" if they want/need low-light and/or largest-posters and/or narrow DOF.
I haven't checked back but my recollection is that you intervene in many threads to vaunt your favourite cameras without listing their drawbacks. When challenged you do acknowledge some of those drawbacks.
And I suggest 1/2.3" if smaller/lighter/cheaper zoom-tele is their priority.

And I always admit that the 1"-type sensor is a "compromise", just like smaller and larger sensors/cameras/lenses are also.
and restricted ability to capture low light;
Absolutely I will AGREE with that ... I can't think of any disadvantage to the low-light high-ISO ability of larger sensors.
But you never mention that your favoured camera lacks it.
(see above) I always allow that it is a compromise and sometimes suggest either FF or 1/2.3" if best for them.

But you should know that "Hand-Held NIGHT-shot" works well, albeit with static subjects. (but if lower-light requires a longer SS, they may still have a problem w/ moving subjects)
--
---
Gerry
___________________________________________
First camera 1953, first Pentax 1985, first DSLR 2006
http://www.pbase.com/gerrywinterbourne
[email protected]
 
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Once again ... how do you get MORE working distance with less power ???
What he says is that you need less power than full.

Inverse square law - if you need full power at 1m then but you need only 1/4 power you get 2m, etc ...
But for sun-light fill-flash you usually are going to need "full" power.
No, you don't.

For me fill flash is usually 1/8 or 1/4 power. Just enough to get the shadows from out underneath the eyes. Every studio photographer knows that the fill light is always less than the key light. Never equal or greater.

I know that you know this.That is why I know that you are purposely being misleading.
Thats why he needed an (originally) GN-300 to reach (only) 8' @ f/1.4 -- because it's effective power was so severely reduced via HSS.

I could get 15+' (w/ GN-48 @ f/2.8) because leaf-shutters don't (effectively) "reduce" the original GN, (until SS is shorter than flash-duration).

So w/ leaf-shutter, I still had an effective GN (48) -- HIGHER than he had w/ GN-300 after FP/HSS "reduction", (to what appeared to be about GN-11).
Tedolph
 
Once again ... how do you get MORE working distance with less power ???
What he says is that you need less power than full.

Inverse square law - if you need full power at 1m then but you need only 1/4 power you get 2m, etc ...
But for sun-light fill-flash you usually are going to need "full" power.
No, you don't.

For me fill flash is usually 1/8 or 1/4 power. Just enough to get the shadows from out underneath the eyes. Every studio photographer knows that the fill light is always less than the key light. Never equal or greater.

I know that you know this.That is why I know that you are purposely being misleading.
Thats why he needed an (originally) GN-300 to reach (only) 8' @ f/1.4 -- because it's effective power was so severely reduced via HSS.

I could get 15+' (w/ GN-48 @ f/2.8) because leaf-shutters don't (effectively) "reduce" the original GN, (until SS is shorter than flash-duration).

So w/ leaf-shutter, I still had an effective GN (48) -- HIGHER than he had w/ GN-300 after FP/HSS "reduction", (to what appeared to be about GN-11).
Tedolph
I've been in situation shooting at the beach where the sun is behind the model. In that case the sun is illuminating the background, and the flash is the main light for the model. In that situation, I want the power of the flash to be similar to the sun, not a few stops down.

Not everyone is in the same situation.
 
Once again ... how do you get MORE working distance with less power ???
What he says is that you need less power than full.

Inverse square law - if you need full power at 1m then but you need only 1/4 power you get 2m, etc ...
But for sun-light fill-flash you usually are going to need "full" power.
No, you don't.

For me fill flash is usually 1/8 or 1/4 power. Just enough to get the shadows from out underneath the eyes. Every studio photographer knows that the fill light is always less than the key light. Never equal or greater.

I know that you know this.That is why I know that you are purposely being misleading.
Thats why he needed an (originally) GN-300 to reach (only) 8' @ f/1.4 -- because it's effective power was so severely reduced via HSS.

I could get 15+' (w/ GN-48 @ f/2.8) because leaf-shutters don't (effectively) "reduce" the original GN, (until SS is shorter than flash-duration).

So w/ leaf-shutter, I still had an effective GN (48) -- HIGHER than he had w/ GN-300 after FP/HSS "reduction", (to what appeared to be about GN-11).
Tedolph
I've been in situation shooting at the beach where the sun is behind the model. In that case the sun is illuminating the background, and the flash is the main light for the model. In that situation, I want the power of the flash to be similar to the sun, not a few stops down.

Not everyone is in the same situation.
Yes, that is one. The other one is sort of a passing fad with wedding photographers where they are outdoors but they still want to over-power the Sun.

It looks a little weird.

Tedolph
 

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