F70EXR: can you explain how focus works?

Hi all.

Looking for a relatively cheap but good performing compact to try and break my inability to leave the house without lugging my entire DSLR kit with me - and very taken with the F70 (especially with the current cashback offer in the UK).

However haven't managed to work out exactly how the focus works on the cam from the reviews (and all the instore demo models I've seen have had the batteries drained over Christmas, so I can't play with them).

I know it doesn't have manual focus, but - if someone has the time - can you explain if there is any flexibility in the focus system in terms of altering the focus point, or do you have to rely on focusing in the centre and recomposing, or just leaving the auto focus to pick whichever spot it feels best?

Last compact digital I used was a clunky Kodak, more than five years ago, so I'm a bit in the dark about anything that isn't a DSLR at the moment!

Thanks in advance.

BT

Edit: just to pre-empt any grumpy answers, I have tried to search on this in the forums, as well as googling to see if anything pops up, but can't seem to find a clear answer.
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I found it did not focus very well, some blurry shots but thast might have been user error,, at the long end the IS does seem to let the cam down some shake I do believe or might even be lack of good focus at the longer end ?.. Anyway I returned it , I must say I like my F200 very nice cam, getting to learn it is really very good for a purse camera . hope that help some

Rhoda
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I have my opinion and so I am allowed to give just my point of view

Thanks Rhoda.

There isn't the cash back deal on the F200 (which makes the decision making a lo easier) and also, as I'm trying to replicate my DSLR lens range as much as possible to help with my "treatment" having closer to 300mm reach should make the cold turkey a little easier to bear!

From what I read here and elsewhere, the cameras seem very similar in every way other than a (debatable) image quality difference (I really don't want to get involved in this!) between the two and obviously the lens difference...plus what seems to be a different video approach in the F70.

You didn't really detail how the focus system works however - is there just one central focus point which you have to place over what you want in focus and then recompose, or can you shift it around the frame manually? Or does the camera just choose what it wants to focus on when in auto mode?

Interesting you had problems with the F70 but not the F200 as I'd imagine the focus module is much the same in both...but then again, as I said, I'm very out of date with how compacts work these days!

Nice to hear you're getting on with the F200 after not such a happy start with the F70.

Cheers - BT
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigtom

I believe there are two ways that this camera can focus. If the face detect mode is on, then the camera will find a face anywhere in the frame and then focus on that. If there are no faces or the mode is off, then it will focus in the center of the screen. There arent any adjustments that can be made here. The manual states to focus using the center point and recomposing if you want this point away from the center.

Big Tom said:

Thanks Rhoda.

There isn't the cash back deal on the F200 (which makes the decision making a lo easier) and also, as I'm trying to replicate my DSLR lens range as much as possible to help with my "treatment" having closer to 300mm reach should make the cold turkey a little easier to bear!

From what I read here and elsewhere, the cameras seem very similar in every way other than a (debatable) image quality difference (I really don't want to get involved in this!) between the two and obviously the lens difference...plus what seems to be a different video approach in the F70.

You didn't really detail how the focus system works however - is there just one central focus point which you have to place over what you want in focus and then recompose, or can you shift it around the frame manually? Or does the camera just choose what it wants to focus on when in auto mode?

Interesting you had problems with the F70 but not the F200 as I'd imagine the focus module is much the same in both...but then again, as I said, I'm very out of date with how compacts work these days!

Nice to hear you're getting on with the F200 after not such a happy start with the F70.

Cheers - BT
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http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigtom

Click to expand...

-Fuji uk are doing refurbs the F70 for £143 the F200 a little more £147 , yes just like some other F200 choosers pointed out to me the IQ difference is noticeable enough for there only to be one keeper out of the two choices , One guy even uses a F70 and a TZ7 one can do what the other cant is the answer, I didnt like the TZ7 much , just my view,I remain very happy with my choice

Rhoda
I have my opinion and so I am allowed to give just my point of view

Big Tom said:

Looking for a relatively cheap but good performing compact to try and break my inability to leave the house without lugging my entire DSLR kit with me - and very taken with the F70 (especially with the current cashback offer in the UK).

Click to expand...

That is exactly the cam you should be looking at ...

Big Tom said:

I know it doesn't have manual focus, but - if someone has the time - can you explain if there is any flexibility in the focus system in terms of altering the focus point, or do you have to rely on focusing in the centre and recomposing, or just leaving the auto focus to pick whichever spot it feels best?

Click to expand...

You get three focus modes ...

1) Center: this is the focus and reframe technique. It is what I use. AF is fast.

2) Multi: This is camera chooses. I tested it for a few minutes indoors and it workjs fine from what I can tell. AF is almost as fast as center.

3) Continuous: You get a cross hair and focus is always active, unless you half press. AF is slow whien no half pressed (but it is always trying to stay close to the subject) and fast when you half press. I don't like the mode ... it feels unnatural.

4) If you switch on face detect, it tracks faces. This works great unless the face fills the frame completely ...

Big Tom said:

Last compact digital I used was a clunky Kodak, more than five years ago, so I'm a bit in the dark about anything that isn't a DSLR at the moment!

Click to expand...

The F70 focuses very fast in AF center mode ... even when at full zoom ... it is a joy to use after older cams ...

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

CAMMASTER said:

I found it did not focus very well, some blurry shots but thast might have been user error,, at the long end the IS does seem to let the cam down some shake I do believe or might even be lack of good focus at the longer end ?.. Anyway I returned it , I must say I like my F200 very nice cam, getting to learn it is really very good for a purse camera . hope that help some

Click to expand...

Tom ... read a few threads and you will find that Rhoda hates the F70 unreasonably ... in fact the F70 is probably quicker to focus than the F200 because it has to have better focus for the narrow field of view at 270mm ... it also has to have better stabilization and many have reported that it does ...

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

CAMMASTER said:

-Fuji uk are doing refurbs the F70 for £143 the F200 a little more £147 , yes just like some other F200 choosers pointed out to me the IQ difference is noticeable enough for there only to be one keeper out of the two choices , One guy even uses a F70 and a TZ7 one can do what the other cant is the answer, I didnt like the TZ7 much , just my view,I remain very happy with my choice

Click to expand...

TZ7 is a superb cam for video ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgl_uLTzTBQ

F70 is a superb general purpose camera ...

No other camera can touch either of these in their niche ...

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

I found both the stablization and focus to be the same on both cameras, both are very capable of very OOF shots in low light (for some reason, even when locked onto a contrasty edge) and attain the same handholding ability at corresponding focal lengths for a given shutter speed. this was after comparing the two side by side..

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Please ignore the Typos, I'm the world's worst Typist

AdamT said:

I found both the stablization and focus to be the same on both cameras, both are very capable of very OOF shots in low light (for some reason, even when locked onto a contrasty edge) and attain the same handholding ability at corresponding focal lengths for a given shutter speed. this was after comparing the two side by side..

Click to expand...

Ok ... I figured AF was probably a wash. Both seem pretty fast (I have limited experience playing with the F200.) Several people have reported that the stabilization is better on the F70, but this is no doubt rather subjective.

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

Kim Letkeman said:

Ok ... I figured AF was probably a wash. Both seem pretty fast (I have limited experience playing with the F200.) Several people have reported that the stabilization is better on the F70, but this is no doubt rather subjective.

Click to expand...

I've found Fuji AF in general , since the Fxx series anyway to be very fast (I wish the G10/11 were that quick) and the F70/200 are certainly more than fast enough even in low light for the type of camera,,

IS opinions are rather subjective, people shake / jitter / sway in different ways. I was actually rather impressed with how well the IS works on these two Fujis for sensor based stabilization (a big step up from the F60 and the Ricoh GX100 which seemed to do nothing) though I do find lens IS is quite noticably better , the G10/11 always were excellent as is the old TX1.. I've borrowed a TZ65 for a short while and the IS seems even better than the TZ5 was and that was good - may even be usable in typical UK weather at full zoom .....

BTW the TZ65's not got HD but does the "better than VGA" 840X480 mode , the Video AF and sound are a LOT better than the TZ5 was, I'll have to try it in low light compared to the TX1.. I don't need HD but do need quality video with zoom, half decent sound and decent IS .

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Please ignore the Typos, I'm the world's worst Typist

...to all who have replied - now clear on the focus options, was what I thought, but best to check rather than buy and then be surprised.

As an old D70 user, older digi-compact user and even older slow AF film user, I think I've got focus and recompose hardwired into me, despite the current Nikon spoiling me with a myriad of focus points. Sure I can cope with the F70 system, although suspect there will be a bit of user reprogramming required to switch between a rear screen cam and a OVF.

Rhoda - the Garpist in me likes the idea of a "pre-disastered" refurb and the thought that what is likely to go wrong with a unit might have already happened and been solved. However the pessimist in me worries that a refurb might be first signs of a "Friday" unit, which is set for a life of problems. Currently with the cash back I can get a brand new F70 for the same price as a refurb F70/F200, which seems like an offer silly to refuse.

From what I've seen and researched I've yet to be personally convinced that there is a substantial IQ difference between the cams either way - and certainly nothing I'm going to notice in the sort of photography I'll be doing with the F70...I've got the D300 for important stuff where IQ is priority. And there are other factors differentiating between the cameras, which IMO, are more important when it comes to the utility of the cam for me, personally. However sure other people, and you, have other needs and priorities, so the F200 is a much better choice.

Kim - I've been lurking for two/three weeks while trying to decide what to buy, so hopefully I've got a feel for the various agendas/viewpoints and I'm trying to take into account everyone's apparent perspective! And here was me thinking it was just the Canon/Nikon forums where people got bent out of shape...

Cheers - BT

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigtom

Just a thought, for my 700 F72 EXR first shots : 45% were framed at a focal superior to 140 mm (max of the F200). I think you should analyze in depth your current behaviour as SLR photographer prior making a decision between F200 and F70.
The ExposurePlot freeware can perform this analyze for you.

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Jean-Pierre

AdamT said:

BTW the TZ65's not got HD but does the "better than VGA" 840X480 mode , the Video AF and sound are a LOT better than the TZ5 was, I'll have to try it in low light compared to the TX1.. I don't need HD but do need quality video with zoom, half decent sound and decent IS .

Click to expand...

I admit ... I'm addicted to the stereo mics and HD of the TZ7 / ZS3 ...

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=525C40E78D8CEB3B

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

Big Tom said:

Kim - I've been lurking for two/three weeks while trying to decide what to buy, so hopefully I've got a feel for the various agendas/viewpoints and I'm trying to take into account everyone's apparent perspective! And here was me thinking it was just the Canon/Nikon forums where people got bent out of shape...

Click to expand...

The FTF is special ... some people here never get bent into shape

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

JeanPierre Ancona said:

Just a thought, for my 700 F72 EXR first shots : 45% were framed at a focal superior to 140 mm (max of the F200). I think you should analyze in depth your current behaviour as SLR photographer prior making a decision between F200 and F70.
The ExposurePlot freeware can perform this analyze for you.

Click to expand...

Agreed ... if you find yourself pegged at 140 all the time ... chance are that you will shot quite a bit of 270 ...

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http://letkeman.net/Photos
http://kimletkeman.blogspot.com

Tom

Kim summarized the various AF modes of the F70EXR. I have found the AF on the F70 (and presumably similar on the f200) to be quite fast and accurate, actually surprisingly fast and accurate compared to other p&s I have used/owned.

I have been quite pleased with my F70EXR, which serves the same purpose for me and my Canon 50D kit, as you plan to use it. the 10x zoom is quite handy and I have been pleased with the image quality. Just be sure to get it set up properly before heading to the field.

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Dustin

Kim Letkeman said:

I admit ... I'm addicted to the stereo mics and HD of the TZ7 / ZS3 ...

Click to expand...

Those clips are excellent !! ..

I briefly tried the TZ65 indoors lit by one table lamp and it was superb even viewed connected to a 48" TV via the socket on the camera (Exceeded my expectations anyway) .. the sound has none of the tinniness of the TZ5 (voices are deep and rounded not scratchy) . I think I'll be getting one or the TZ7 and lose the TX1

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Please ignore the Typos, I'm the world's worst Typist

Thanks.

Yep I'm hoping it will be a good pocket cam to free me up from the almost compulsive need to carry to DSLR kit with me whenever I leave the house just in case !

Foolishly I gave my brother a Fuji F30 a few years ago for his 30th birthday - foolish because I always regretted not getting one for myself as well at the time, as having played with it a little it seemed like a very responsive and fast camera (plus, with hindsight, I now know I gave him what has become a bit of a legendary classic).

F70/F200s seem to have a similar responsiveness, from the reviews I've read - and also appear to see a return of Fuji to standards set by the F30/31...so this might be the time to take another look...and not for anyone else this time!

Planning to find a shop with a working demo model this weekend for a proper look before buying.

BT

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http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigtom

It's a good tip - although I'm a Mac user, so not sure if there is a compatible similar program.

Even without analysis, I know the majority of my shots would fall into the 16-85 range...but that's because that's my favourite walkaround VR lens for general shooting (and also covers my close second favourite, the 50mm 1.8).

However the 70-300 comes out the camera bag often enough to suggest that for a walkaround compact cam, I need to know I've got the reach...otherwise I'm going to get that itchy feeling I should have the full camera kit slung over my shoulder again...which defeats the point of this therapy!

And sometimes it's not knowing how many shots you take at 300m...it's looking at what those shots are and realising you'd have missed them without the extra length, IMO. Focal length analysis never shows you stats of the pictures you didn't take.

I also suspect that if, for example, I had a hypothetical 27-270 lens on the Nikon, I'd be using the long end of the lens a lot more, just because I could.

Currently the need to switch lenses means I either compose differently (which isn't necessarily a bad thing, equipment limitations can sometimes actually force you to think more about what you're doing) or use the "foot zoom" (although that's not always an option).

Cheers - BT

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