FF vs. DX is Like Automatic vs. Stick

ExposureMeter · Sep 30, 2005

The issue should be about choice.

We should also be able to choose our Nikons to have an optional mobile phone.

Also it would be good if the D2 series had the option of wheels so we could drive it to work we would save lots with the price of fuel at the moment.
--
Geoff
Gold Coast, Australia

Bruce Crossan · Sep 30, 2005

. . . Ferrari don't. . . they stick to making really good sports cars - like Nikon just make really good cameras.

Bruce
--
http://www.bwcpix.PhotoShare.co.nz
Nikon D70

Adam Kmiec · Sep 30, 2005

The noise above 400 is unacceptable. I would actually like to use FF for weddings in addition to landscapes. The body of the 14n, I think most would agree with this, is substandard. What I want, and I think most FF advocates want is a nikon FF, not a 3rd party one. I have tried out the 14N and to put it bluntly it would be great for studio work, but that's about it.

Thanks
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

Adam Kmiec · Sep 30, 2005

if i lose x number of inches by having a DX sensor, it does change the final product?
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

Adam Kmiec · Sep 30, 2005

as are these: http://share.shutterfly.com/action/welcome?sid=9AYuXDlw3buRg

Current portfolio site is being updated. Trying to use an Flash XML driven solution for folders; racking my brains as I can get it to load is ASP, but not PHP which is what the server is.
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

hphoto · Sep 30, 2005

so many in this forum have complained about Nikon's absence of fullframe DSLR. That they really need fullframe sensors.

If you do, then why not simply switch to Canon. If fullframe sensor is that important to you, and at the top of the list of your requirement, then switch to Canon - get the 1DS or 5D.

What is so difficult about making that decision?

It's like complaining that if Mercedes is selling trucks, why can't Ferrari make trucks? "What is wrong with Ferrari? They should get with the program!"

Already have lots of Nikon lenses? there exist ebay.com. blah blah blah...

RudivanS · Sep 30, 2005

Adam Kmiec said:
I'm a FF proponent, want FF, don't want DX. After reading through
the countless threads here lately about FF vs. DX, specifically as
it relates to the 5D has been exhausting.

I don't know about you, but for me the single biggest issue is
Nikon supporters do NOT have an option. When I buy a car I can
choose automatic or manual transmission. There are those that will
tell you one is better than the other; but at the end of the day
the consumer can choose. Even in cars that don't offer an
automatic option can have one put in after-market (the Lamborghini
and Ferrari come to mind). With the Nikon stance on DSLRs our
choice is clear, DX or DX, unless you want to switch.

As a consumer i'm irritated that I don't have the option. The
issue at hand isn't if FF is better than DX or if Nikon is better
than Canon. The issue should be about choice. I hope that whether
you are a DX or FF advocate you at least understand that what is
ultimately right for you may not be right for me; and unless there
are service offerings to accomodate both perspectives, the only
real losers are us as consumers.
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

Hi Adam,
As a Nikon Photographer that goes back to film days, funny thing is that I've
become used to / adapted to the 1.5x crop.
I will not buy DX lenses as my Nikkors must also work on the F5.
Which only leaves me with the 14mm as the only UWA lens (yet to purchase).
Getting back to my point - my 17~35 f2.8 now feels quite wide at 17mm.
Overall, am producing good images with the cropped sensor.
Early film days the 24mm f2.8 was like WOW this is wide, then after a while
got the 18mm f3.5 and once again WOW this is wide.

It's all about what I see through the viewfinder not the crop factor that matters.
To me at least.
Cheers, Rudi
http://www.vanstarrex.com

Adam Kmiec · Sep 30, 2005

hp, here is what I ask of you, please give me fair market value for all my gear:

n90s with grip
F5
D100 with grip
D2H
60mm 2.8
17-35 2.8
70-200 2.8
50mm 1.8
85mm 1.8
2 X SB 800

on top of that give me the bridge fees to drop about 3K to switch and also I need 100% assurance that Nikon will never move to FF and that canon will introduce native wireless CLS - esque flashes within the next 30 days.

I think you can see why many don't switch; it's just too costly.
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

hphoto · Sep 30, 2005

Yep, you've got alot of equipment.

But you also have to reanalyze your priorities - how important is fullframe sesor to you? If it's at the top of the list, then you should take the loss of selling your equipment and switch to Canon. And why would it then matter if Nikon switches to fullframe, you will already own Canon equipment which invests in fullframe sensor NOW?

From your post, it seems to me that fullframe sensor is a very important feature. (why else would you spend that much time writing paragraphs of gripe about Nikon non-fullframe sensors?)

you should switch to canon.

BruceEvans · Sep 30, 2005

Please help a newbie. What's FF and DX?

Bruce

bgm62 · Sep 30, 2005

and get over it.

You do have a choice. Get a Kodak DCS or sell all you gear and switch to Canon.

--

My Humble On-Line Portfolio

Adam Kmiec · Sep 30, 2005

I think that's what bothers me. My only choice is to leave a brand i've been with for over 10 years. My first camera was an FE2. I go back a while.
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

Dan62326 · Sep 30, 2005

FF stands for full-frame and DX is the sensor that is a 1.5 crop of full-frame. Check this web page out.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/dx.htm

BruceEvans said:
Please help a newbie. What's FF and DX?

Bruce

Dan62326 · Sep 30, 2005

Adam Kmiec said:
hp, here is what I ask of you, please give me fair market value for
all my gear:

n90s with grip

$300

Adam Kmiec said:
F5

not sure

Adam Kmiec said:
D100 with grip

not sure

Adam Kmiec said:
D2H

$1500 to $2000 depending on condition

Adam Kmiec said:
60mm 2.8

$300

Adam Kmiec said:
17-35 2.8

don't know

Adam Kmiec said:
70-200 2.8

$1600

Adam Kmiec said:
50mm 1.8

not much

Adam Kmiec said:
85mm 1.8

$250

Adam Kmiec said:
2 X SB 800

$800

Adam Kmiec said:
on top of that give me the bridge fees to drop about 3K to switch

???

Adam Kmiec said:
and also I need 100% assurance that Nikon will never move to FF and

Just sell your Canon stuff when Nikon appeals to you again.

Adam Kmiec said:
that canon will introduce native wireless CLS - esque flashes
within the next 30 days.

What is that?

Adam Kmiec said:
I think you can see why many don't switch; it's just too costly.

Too costly because you paid too much or what's the reason?

Adam Kmiec said:
--
Currently refusing to upgrade until Nikon gives me FF.

It is so easy to sell your stuff. You don't even have that many lenses. It's better than living in bitterness wishing for FF =)

hphoto · Sep 30, 2005

I can understand that - I've used Nikon since the FG. Personally, I just can't get myself to switch to Canon - I'm too spoiled by Nikon's ergonomics and lens quality and I just can never get used to Canon's ergonomics. I use the D100 now and the non fullframe sensor never bothered me, and I am strictly a wide angle user.

MarcV · Sep 30, 2005

[nt]

--
Marc Vandenhende
http://www.mvdh.be

Led566 · Oct 1, 2005

Bruce Crossan said:
. . . Ferrari don't. . . they stick to making really good sports
cars - like Nikon just make really good cameras.

Bruce
--
http://www.bwcpix.PhotoShare.co.nz
Nikon D70

But you don't know the entire story...

Mr. Ferruccio Lamborghini started with tractors and then, after some years, with sport cars. His first 12 cylinders was so powerful to even bend the crankshaft!

The reason why he started to make sport cars is legend: if I recall well when Mr. Lamborghini became wealthy (because of tractors...) bought of course a Ferrari but he had problems with the shift and protested directly to Enzo Ferrari who told him: "You keep building tractors and leave me build my sport cars!": of course he did the opposite.

Adam Kozlowski · Oct 1, 2005

This has also another side of the story - I would like to choose the DX or EF-S format, but Canon doesn't allow me too, because they don't provide the EF-S substitutes of all EF lenses. So i also don't have the freedom of choice.
--
Adam Kozlowski Photography - http://www.spooky.pl
Creative and fun outlet - http://spooky79.deviantart.com

stany buyle · Oct 1, 2005

It doesn't interest me at all, because I decide for myself what I buy, and that's Nikon after a AF desaster with a Canon 10D two or three years ago, but I really believe that some of these FF die-hards on this forum are PR people from Canon who try to pull Nikon users over the border. Big bussiness is like that.

Kindest regards,
Stany Buyle

RudivanS · Oct 1, 2005

Have just started a new thread in Nikon SLR Lens section re:
Best quality UWA - ultra wide angle for both film and digital.
May help.
Cheers, Rudi

FF vs. DX is Like Automatic vs. Stick

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