PC users switching to Mac for Security

Apple's June quarter strong as consumers switch to Mac for security

Full article here:

http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1098

“The most recent study comes research and investment firm PiperJaffray, which earlier this week spoke with 20 of Apple's specialist resellers regarding business in the June quarter and trends with various products. On average, Apple specialists said that over 16% of customers who buy a Mac from their stores are PC switchers. In Apple's own retail stores, this figure is closer to 50%.”

Ken Leonard
http://porg.4t.com/Tiger.html

In my own experience, the Windows box can be just as safe as any other platform. 99% of the time, users are to blame for security problems and not the technology. Why most home users of Windows are logged in as administrators is beyond me, that is where lot of these problems start! I think it is wrong to think that Mac or Linux will protect you any better than Windows box will.

--
'Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses simply have their
bright ideas closer together. '

Paul

Contrary to popular belief, 80% of all PC users experience spyware. The typical PC / Mac users are not knowledgeable about precautions other than perhaps to use virus blockers (which are swiftly outdated). The fact remains that PC style spyware/malware/viruses do not affect macs. That being said Apple closes security holes on a regular basis. The fact remains however that in the 4+ years of OS X not a single Mac virus has been successful. Even the CEO of Intel is recommending switching to Mac to get away from viruses.

Avoid risks, buy a Mac (Intel CEO Paul Otellini)

world.co.uk/news/index.cfm?RSS&NewsID=11698

Mad as hell, switching to Mac

Article here:

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/mc/20050526/tc_mc/madashellswitchingtomac

“Over 80% of PC users have been infected by spyware, and, dozens of spyware applications are typically found on their computers. Even the fastest Pentium-based workstations can slow to a crawl under this abuse. If you want to get a small picture of the damage Windows users face, read attorney Eric J. Sinrod's article in USA Today on the subject. No wonder Congress is struggling over bills to protect us against the malware scourge.”

Full article here

http://www.macnightowl.com/index.htm#overconfident

Paul Samoluk said:

In my own experience, the Windows box can be just as safe as any
other platform. 99% of the time, users are to blame for security
problems and not the technology. Why most home users of Windows are
logged in as administrators is beyond me, that is where lot of
these problems start! I think it is wrong to think that Mac or
Linux will protect you any better than Windows box will.

--
'Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses
simply have their
bright ideas closer together. '

Click to expand...

I have kept my PCs free from viruses and spyware for 15 years and very easy to do. It is user error and user error only. Oh CEO of intel knows how to ceo but he doesn't know **** about computers.

Ken you are nothing but a sith spawn.
--
Shawn Grant

I happen to agree with Sean on this one....i use a Mac @ home but PC's exclusivelly at work and school, my IBM ThinkPad has been virus free ever since i got it...The users and their lack of computer knowledge is to blame for allowing security to become such a problem. On the side note, if the CEO of Intel did say to switch to macs he should be fired by the board right away. How can he say something like that when probably 90% of the chips they make are used in PC's....Intel is currently in fearse competition with AMD and to make such dumb statemtents is borderline criminal!!!

cheers,

--
'Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses simply have their
bright ideas closer together. '

Paul

Maybe you agree with Sean but I disagree with Shawn.

And therein lies the problem. You and likely Shawn know enough to put up firewalls and intall third party virus detectors. Trouble is, even government agencies are attacked. The lame excuse that there are no Mac viruses is because of the small market share Mac has is absolutely insane IMHO. Let's say that Mac's market share is 3% (I believe it is a bit more now). Win has experienced over 67,000 viruses. A linear comparison would say that Mac's should have experienced 3% X 67,000 = 2,010 viruses if the level of security was the same on both. But then there are those that say that Mac's are not a viable target by the 'hacker' community. Would you say that so much so that there has been Zero viruses on OS X for the past 4+ years?

Wouldn't it be safe to say that someone out there is trying to prove Mac's security penetrable and would succeed? Bear in mind we are talking about all Mac users here, from the most casual/inexperienced to the super geeks! Heck, most Mac users do not even use a third party fire wall or virus detector.

As I have said before, let's watch what happens in the next year or so on the Mac security front. I for one feel that we will see 5 years of OS X without successful viruses/Spyware/Malware.

The fact remains that Windows is being challenged almost daily and failing against the virus scourge while Mac's are increasingly being targeted and winning the battle. Thre must be a reason people are all at once switching to Mac's and I for one feel it is because of:

1. Security issues
2. The new Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger OS

Ken Leonard
http://porg.4t.com/Tiger.html

Paul Samoluk said:

I happen to agree with Sean on this one....i use a Mac @ home but
PC's exclusivelly at work and school, my IBM ThinkPad has been
virus free ever since i got it...The users and their lack of
computer knowledge is to blame for allowing security to become such
a problem. On the side note, if the CEO of Intel did say to switch
to macs he should be fired by the board right away. How can he say
something like that when probably 90% of the chips they make are
used in PC's....Intel is currently in fearse competition with AMD
and to make such dumb statemtents is borderline criminal!!!

cheers,

--
'Everyone is a genius at least once a year. The real geniuses
simply have their
bright ideas closer together. '

Click to expand...

Maybe you Shawn have been able to do so but the facts say otherwise for most PC users. Why don't you start a worldwide campaign to put your fellow Windows users wise on how to keep their systems virus free for 15 years?

Hmmm, the CEO of Intel not knowing anything about Computers? Now that Shawn is funny!

"> Ken you are nothing but a sith spawn."

Is this what you do when you canoot efectively defend what you say Shawn. You are strating to go over the edge again. Tell you what Shawn, if you want to sell more of your put together PC's you might consider a civil tongue in public, show your fellow Windows users how to be virus free for 15 years and back up your statements sometime with actual third party fact.

Ken

Go Vols said:

I have kept my PCs free from viruses and spyware for 15 years and
very easy to do. It is user error and user error only. Oh CEO of
intel knows how to ceo but he doesn't know **** about computers.

Ken you are nothing but a sith spawn.
--
Shawn Grant

Click to expand...

I just got a Pentium two Compaq Presario with no operating system yet installed for a very poor friend who knows less than I do about pcs. (I picked it up at a garage sale for $30 including monitor) I'm a long time mac user (dual 2 GHz G5) If you would, what is the simplest way to set my friend up with a virus free system he can use for his telephone repair and installation business? Probably lots of internet use. I'm figgering Windows 2000 or? How much RAM? I'm figgering 1 Gig. Any help appricated.
Will

I'll bet that would make a pretty effective ad campaign for Apple:
"Tired of spyware and virus attacks? Buy a Mac Mini!"
The ad flashes the price and shows a Mini in someone's hand.
Ka-chink! Sold!
fsw

Always assuming a linear rather than sigmoid relationship between cause and effect.

The numeber of Macs would have to reach a certain threshold before michief makers felt it was worth their while to act. So your argument is flawed from the beginning.

FYI, the effects of radiation, smoking, exposure to any carcinogen is always a sigmoid relationship. IOW, you have to reach a threshold before effects become evident.

The Left ALWAYS disingenuously assumes a linear relationship. Just another example of their intractable dishonesty.

Well, I would have to agree with Paul on a broad scale. I would make it a bit broader than security and windows by saying that most (but NOT all) computer problems, whatever the platform, are user induced or neglect.

I haven't run on a Wintel system for years, nor do I intend to, but a little preventive maintenance on any hardware/software can go a long way. Then too, problems on either (or any) system can be caused/exacerbated by poorly (amateurishly) programed applications and/or any software that "patches" the OS. And finally, a little bit of reading here and there on how things are supposed to work goes a long way toward making things run smoothly. I am always surprised at how often it is apparent that many Mac users are not aware of just how many things are covered in the Help menu.

Paul Samoluk said:

In my own experience, the Windows box can be just as safe as any
other platform. 99% of the time, users are to blame for security
problems and not the technology.

Click to expand...

--
Rod Smith
Niceville, FL

The vast majority of consumers are too inexperienced (regarding technical issues) to administrate a complex OS like WinXP Pro. Most do not care about, or even understand the relevance of performance benchmarks.
People just want the computer-equivalent of a toaster. ie: simple and reliable.

cheap and able to use the cornucopia of software out there.

"I have kept my PCs free from viruses and spyware for 15 years and very easy to do. It is user error and user error only."

What a useless comment. ALL the world's problems are caused by "User Error" somewhere in the chain of events. But some things lead to more User Errors, thus more problems, than others. Like Win XP compared to Mac OS X.

Hmmm...seems like I remember similar useless comments from Shawn in other Mac threads. Is there a firewall setting for Trolls?

Rod Smith said:

Well, I would have to agree with Paul on a broad scale. I would
make it a bit broader than security and windows by saying that most
(but NOT all) computer problems, whatever the platform, are user
induced or neglect.

Click to expand...

So Paul, let me get this right. You are saying that malicious viruses / malware / spyware are user induced?

I am sorry Rod but I just cannot agree with that statement one bit. Perhaps what you were trying to say is that it is up to the individual user to be vigelent and keep on top/prevent Viruses/Malware/Spyware. I do not know about you but if I was constantly trying to fight off these threats by "internet terrorists" I would certainly be looking for a better solution (Hint: Mac is one of them). My girlfriend has a Compaq desktop PC. She is so paranoid about all the virus threats that she refuses to even hook up to the 'net. In fact at least a couple of times a month she asks me if her computer has a virus even though she seldom even installs legal software on he PC (and does not hook up to the 'net).

Don't get me wrong, I am not dumb enough to suggest that Mac's totally imune to Viruses/Malware/Spyware. What I am saying ius that under the UNIX underpinnings of OS X and the constant securety updates (automatic) that Apple provides there is virtually zero possibility of future such attacks just as it has been for 4+ years now. I could care less if Mac's have a small market share, if the virus thugs want to stay away from Mac then more power to the Mac!

Rod Smith said:

I haven't run on a Wintel system for years, nor do I intend to, but
a little preventive maintenance on any hardware/software can go a
long way. Then too, problems on either (or any) system can be
caused/exacerbated by poorly (amateurishly) programed applications
and/or any software that "patches" the OS. And finally, a little
bit of reading here and there on how things are supposed to work
goes a long way toward making things run smoothly. I am always
surprised at how often it is apparent that many Mac users are not
aware of just how many things are covered in the Help menu.

Click to expand...

Unfortunately the vast majority of users do not know the slightest minimum to prevent these problems. Thank goodness even the Mac novice can stay away from Viruses.

Rod Smith said:

Paul Samoluk said:

In my own experience, the Windows box can be just as safe as any
other platform. 99% of the time, users are to blame for security
problems and not the technology.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Wrong, 100% of the time the internet thugs are responsible for such problems.

Rod Smith said:

--
Rod Smith
Niceville, FL

Click to expand...

BobHaverford said:

Always assuming a linear rather than sigmoid relationship between
cause and effect.

Click to expand...

Bob, assuming I am not and you have not come up with an explanation of what that "threshold point" is.

Where does the point at whcih Mac's will be attacked? #.5% market share? 7% market share? 10%, 20%?

JUst what makes you believe the internet thugs are waiting for a certain market share penetration to pull their dirty deeds on Mac? By calling me a liberal I suppose you are accusing me of being open thinking. If so, yes I am guilty (and right).

BobHaverford said:

The numeber of Macs would have to reach a certain threshold before
michief makers felt it was worth their while to act. So your
argument is flawed from the beginning.

Click to expand...

See my above reply on this. I would say that your way of thinking is the flawed way.

BobHaverford said:

FYI, the effects of radiation, smoking, exposure to any carcinogen
is always a sigmoid relationship. IOW, you have to reach a
threshold before effects become evident.

Click to expand...

And what is theat threshold? I am waiting for that magic number.

BobHaverford said:

The Left ALWAYS disingenuously assumes a linear relationship. Just
another example of their intractable dishonesty.

Click to expand...

Oh, so you are accusing me of being a "leftist" now? You are beginning to sound like an articulate Shawn! LOL!

My mom is probably an A-typical PC user- which is to say she knows how to resart the machine and that is the extent of her trouble-shooting paradigm. She uses Norton's in so much as she can run the scan and that tells her about all the viruses she has but it can't remove (don't get me started on the registry). She is the type of person you love to hate because yes, she will click on that A$#&@^$( & pop-up window because she just won a free trip to Disney World for her a 500 of her closest friends. She sends & receives emails from similarly minded friends and family thereby keeping the worms, trojans and what not happy. Once a month I go home, do want I can to clean up her system, tell her not to open attachments from unknown sources and so on. And then the process repeats itself month after month. Could my mom prevent most of the problems on her computer. Sure. But she doesn't think that way. She doesn't think that clicking on something should cause untold grief, no matter how much untold grief it has caused. She doesn't get it. She gets Christmas and Thanksgiving dinner, grandson's baseball games & sunsets. Her life doesn't revolve around the computer, how it operates, and why she needs to have software running every night to prevent the bad guys from coming in. The good news is that my parents bought a new house... and with it a new Mac. Why? Because I told her I would only troubleshoot a Mac... Which like it or not, hardly needs troubleshooting regardless of what anyone's opinion is of either platform. So my mom is your A-typical switcher. Argue it all you want.

Mike

Judging by some of Shawn's replies in other threads I don't think he can be regarded as a conservative. His political philosophy can be summed up, as near as I can tell, as the big guys vs the little guys, the oppressed vs the oppressors. victims vs victimizers.

I have no idea what the threshold is. I do know this. There is NOT, I repeat NOT a LINEAR relationship between market share and sustained attacks. Let's say you are a michief maker. By definition you're going to want to do as much micheif as possible. So, of course, you are going to go after the fattest, in this case PC's, target.

I suspect that the inflection point or threshold is about 25% but that's just a guess. MAC's are WAY below that point.

My objection to MAC's: Limited software, more expensive, less flexible, and from what I can tell slower dollar for dollar. I do love MAC's G5 case design - its truly elegant.

Mike, above I asked a question that no one answered. I figgered it was just a boring question. But from what you are saying the answer to my question is that there IS no way to set up a person who is not willing to do high maintance on their computer (PC) to keep it virus free. My friend who I want to give a pc to knows basically nothing about computers. After all this time, I would have thought that the pc makers would have been able to have a virus checker in the background that would not allow virus' to infect a pc system. Truely amazing that folks are defending pc s over macs. If i'm wrong correct me and tell me HOW to set the system up. For instance, what is the best (if any) virus protection application that is low or no maintaince.
Will

BobHaverford said:

My objection to MAC's: Limited software, more expensive, less
flexible, and from what I can tell slower dollar for dollar. I do
love MAC's G5 case design - its truly elegant.

Click to expand...

Limited Software: Yes, games and certain special-purpose applications, but for typical usage OS X programs are abundant...and usually very well executed...including tons of freeware/shareware. And how about the outstanding suite of software that comes bundled with a Mac?

More Expensive: Only at the low-ball end where you can indeed buy cheap garbage PCs, or build your own. From mid-price on up the cost of Macs & PCs are roughly the same, feature-matched. At the top end Macs might even be less expensive. Then there is the maintenance issue, total-operating-cost, where Mac wins easily.

Less Flexibe: How so? What peripheral can you add to a PC that you can't add to a Mac? If you want expansion slots buy a Mac tower, not an iMac or a Mini. Most owners of cheap PC towers never even add a memory stick.

Slower: Depends on the use, but probably true in a trivial stopwatch sense. That's like saying one brand of car is better than another because it will go 112-mph instead of 109-mph.

Elegant Design: Indeed...the tower, the iMac, the Mini, the monitors, the iPod, the software, the OS. And not just "elegant" but also highly functional. This is something you can't buy at any price in a PC.