What a GX10 should look like and will Panasonic do it?

[april fox]

As for the second part of the question: Will Panasonic do it?
Like many others, I was flabbergasted/astonished when Panasonic continued to use its old field-sequential 16:9 EVF in the LX100 II and the GX9.
This shows that Panasonic needs to improve in the area of listening to its current users and potential buyers.

Half the so called "potential" buyers of the GX series have long gone to smartphones.

Adding up all your requests I hope you and others be would be willing to pay for the price hike. It's not as if Panasonic or any other cameras are screaming of the shelves.

Be realistic the market as shrunk and will never get bigger for this type of camera

 

[Harold66]

So there is a balance to be had and the GX85 seems to strike the right ones that helped make it a sales success.

Hello

how do you know it was a success ?

 

[Harold66]

Unfortunately the GM1 was and will always be a point and shoot that takes M4/3 lenses.

It is all a matter of opinion. But frankly is one was to categorise the Gm1 as a point and shoot , it is hard to imagine they would put the Gm5 in a different category ;-)

I think a future GM could have a swivel 3 way like on the TX3 and an optional external EVF so that for those who want the EVF they don t have to use a ridiculously designed one

I made mine more sophisticated by designing and making an add-on device I called the “VEfinder” by which I could use the lcd as a form of evf. Worked tolerably well and because it had a magnetic mount it could be mounted and dismounted quite quickly and was not an encumbrance to the GM1 when not actually needed.

Adding a tilt lcd still leaves it as a point and shoot style.

maybe you can tell us which criteria makes the camera a point and shoot

For use of larger lenses and as a result the GM5 rises to become a full systems camera because of its useable evf.

you are missing the word "barely" in your sentence

I have no issues using a GM5 camera body with even the Panasonic 200/2.8 lens, teleconverter included as necessary.

yes sure you have told us that a thousand times . this does not change the fact that most people would :-O
Both GM were designed to use with small lenses anyway. and if a new GM was to appear , you can be sure that 99% of those users were not looking for a body for the biggest m4/3 lenses

Harold

 

[jeffharris]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

 

[jeffharris]

Buttons either need to be bigger or provide more tactile feel. I eventually sold my GX9 because it was just too fiddly. A bigger viewfinder would be a solid improvement too.

That would, AGAIN, be a GX8.

As soon as ANYTHING is enlarged on the GX9… buttons, dials, grip, EVF… you’ve got a GX8.

 

[jeffharris]

This is the SX1/SRX1 for the L-Mount - you will be in heaven.

Yep, I sure would!

Meanwhile an attractively priced GX9 will rule the sales roost. Price talks.

Not necessarily.

If I don’t like the way something handles, I won’t buy it. Even if I did buy it, if I didn’t like the way it felt in the hand, I definitely wouldn’t use it. I don’t care how cheap it is. For me, it would be a total waste!

I’d rather buy another lens.

I bought a new GX1 + LVF2, when there were closeout sales. The camera alone was about $300 or so. I used it a few times, but didn’t like it. It went into a drawer. My then girlfriend used it a bit for a couple of trips, but when I got my GX8, she got the GX7 and the GX1 went back in the drawer. When she got an iPhone SX Max, the GX7 moved into the drawer next to the GX1.

Buying the GX1 was a total waste.

 

[Gnine]

jeffharris wrote:

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

I have it on good authority, that if you look up “enormous” in the dictionary, there’s a photo of a GX8 there. Apparently.

 

[Adam-T]

j

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

Sometimes it terrifies me how collossally large the GX8 really is, As you say , it`s YUUUUUGE, can`t believe how Panasonic could possibly have conceived a camera which was so ungainly large that you need a Coat - yes, I`ll repeat, a COAT (not a trouser) pocket to put it in with the 12-60 on .. and whatsmore it`s almost as heavy as a Battery for a Canon 1DS Mk2 !!! wow the weight in that coat pocket makes the lining all saggy its that ludicrously obscenely heavy .

 

[SteveY80]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

No, more like this. I just edited a GX7 grip on the GX7 MkIII (GX9).

I'd be curious how many people would actually object to having a decent GX7 grip like that built in rather than a screw-on accessory?

The grip on the GX7 barely stuck out any further than a body cap. Even small pancake lenses like the 20mm f/1.7 made the camera significantly thicker than the grip alone. I really don't see the advantage to having a thin slippery grip over a comfortable one that's maybe 2-3mm thicker at its thickest.

 

[jeffharris]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

No, more like this. I just edited a GX7 grip on the GX7 MkIII (GX9).

I'd be curious how many people would actually object to having a decent GX7 grip like that built in rather than a screw-on accessory?

The GX7’s grip is fantastic. The sculpted shape makes for very good handling, but without the bulk of a stick-out grip. The rubber Panasonic engineers used is very comfortable and allows for good grip and a minimalist footprint. Why it was omitted from later GX-series cameras is a mystery only Panasonic’s bean-counters can resolve.

The grip on the GX7 barely stuck out any further than a body cap. Even small pancake lenses like the 20mm f/1.7 made the camera significantly thicker than the grip alone. I really don't see the advantage to having a thin slippery grip over a comfortable one that's maybe 2-3mm thicker at its thickest.

That the GX8 didn’t have a similar grip was a disappointment. The grips on the GX85 and GX9 are terrible. Maybe Panasonic was taking a page from Olympus’ approach to ergonomics… want good handling? Buy an add-on grip.

 

[mmartel]

No built in EVF, no deal, for me. I want the ability to use EVF and external flash simultaneously. Also, isn't the point of a rangefinder design to have the EVF over on the side? I love that my nose doesn't hit the LCD screen when using the EVF on my GX85. It's also easy to move the AF point around with my thumb while using the side mounted EVF.

 

[JakeJY]

So there is a balance to be had and the GX85 seems to strike the right ones that helped make it a sales success.

Hello

how do you know it was a success ?

It hits top seller lists on B&H and Amazon a couple times I checked. Also they are still continuing to sell it, refreshing it with new SKUs. They also built the successor model based on this body style (GX9) and in Japan the naming is kept through 3 generations (GX7, GX7 II, GX7 III) which suggests that this body style was popular enough to warranty keeping the name.

In contrast, the GX8 never hit top seller lists, and up to now there is still no "true" successor. You see similar in the GM line. I was interested in one before I got the GX85, but I saw that retailers had a hard time selling their last units, even at GF7 prices.

 

[JakeJY]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

Right, but for those that want a bigger grip presumably they are ok with that option. However the point is that leaves the rest of the people who don't need a bigger grip being able to have a smaller camera and manufacturer doesn't have to create a completely different model just to address grip preferences.

 

[jeffharris]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

Right, but for those that want a bigger grip presumably they are ok with that option. However the point is that leaves the rest of the people who don't need a bigger grip being able to have a smaller camera and manufacturer doesn't have to create a completely different model just to address grip preferences.

A bigger add-on grip does NOT solve the problem of few, cramped controls.

There's no auxiliary solution for that.

 

[Raist3d]

So there is a balance to be had and the GX85 seems to strike the right ones that helped make it a sales success.

Hello

how do you know it was a success ?

It hits top seller lists on B&H and Amazon a couple times I checked. Also they are still continuing to sell it, refreshing it with new SKUs. They also built the successor model based on this body style (GX9) and in Japan the naming is kept through 3 generations (GX7, GX7 II, GX7 III) which suggests that this body style was popular enough to warranty keeping the name.

In contrast, the GX8 never hit top seller lists, and up to now there is still no "true" successor. You see similar in the GM line. I was interested in one before I got the GX85, but I saw that retailers had a hard time selling their last units, even at GF7 prices.

I think this is a pretty reasonable answer. I have to agree that if the GX8 was a success, we would be seeing by now a successor.

What I would love to know is as phones have eaten more of the Camera companies bottom line, how receptive are people to smaller vs bigger cameras- how this has changed in the last 5 years? or has its remained the same?

I would love to see data on this.

 

[Max5150]

Buttons either need to be bigger or provide more tactile feel. I eventually sold my GX9 because it was just too fiddly. A bigger viewfinder would be a solid improvement too.

That would, AGAIN, be a GX8.

As soon as ANYTHING is enlarged on the GX9… buttons, dials, grip, EVF… you’ve got a GX8.

You are exactly right. That's why I dumped my GX9 for a EM5.3 and I'm so much happier.

Check it out for yourself GX8 vs EM5.3:

https://j.mp/3e26o4x

https://j.mp/2NaPWDz

And here's with the GX9:

Compact Camera Meter

Compare unlimited number of cameras with lenses, see how compact or bulky a camera is and sort by height, width, depth and weight.

j.mp

 

[MrALLCAPS]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

Right, but for those that want a bigger grip presumably they are ok with that option. However the point is that leaves the rest of the people who don't need a bigger grip being able to have a smaller camera and manufacturer doesn't have to create a completely different model just to address grip preferences.

Agreed.

The GX8 was just TOO big for a M43 camera, especially that it was similar in size to a XPro2 and larger than the Sony APS-C bodies.

The GX7 series going into it's 4th camera (hopefully soon) is a great sign of strength for a camera.

 

[Raist3d]

Buttons either need to be bigger or provide more tactile feel. I eventually sold my GX9 because it was just too fiddly. A bigger viewfinder would be a solid improvement too.

That would, AGAIN, be a GX8.

As soon as ANYTHING is enlarged on the GX9… buttons, dials, grip, EVF… you’ve got a GX8.

You are exactly right. That's why I dumped my GX9 for a EM5.3 and I'm so much happier.

Check it out for yourself GX8 vs EM5.3:

https://j.mp/3e26o4x

https://j.mp/2NaPWDz

And here's with the GX9:

https://j.mp/37BhUS7

I have to admit though the EM5.3 is pretty capable, I am finding myself preferring the EPL9/GX9 for street work. And it's all mainly due to the TILT LCD vs FAS.

I can only hope Olympus makes an EPL11 or PEN-6 with the TILT LCD and modern. Or Panasonic really put some effort in a GX10 or successor to GM5.

 

[Raist3d]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Keep the LCD hinge the same or it comes off my buy list as well.

But how many camera bodies of this type do I need? My GX7 still has my love and works well, then there is my GX85, then there is the GX9 .... I can need and use multiple GM5 camera bodies as they can be easily carried as “separate cameras” but the idea does not work so swimmingly with a bunch of “GX7-type” camera bodies.

Just because you don't need to buy one and are satisfied with cameras form before doesn't preclude coming out with new models to remain competitive. And Panasonic really needs to fix that real dial of the GX9/GX850 and to some extent GM5 to be more resistant to wearing out. IN the case of the first two - so quickly (where quickly means 3-6 months).

 

[Harold66]

My GX7 is heaven in design - just perfect to hold and use. Fiddling with the top plate design did not work for either the GX85 or GX9.

Just imagine a GX7 MkIV, with a screw on grip, that makes it look like a GX7 MkI.

Do you mean something like this (which they seemed to have created to address those that complained about the GX85 grip)?

https://shop.panasonic.com/cameras-...ories/camera-accessories-other/DMW-HGR1K.html

Unfortunately the Panasonic one neglected to leave a battery access door, but this JJC one does:

http://www.jjc.cc/index.php/Product/product_info/id/2425

The irony with add-on grips is that as soon as you install it, the camera becomes as big or bigger than the dreaded YUUUUGE GX8.

Right, but for those that want a bigger grip presumably they are ok with that option. However the point is that leaves the rest of the people who don't need a bigger grip being able to have a smaller camera and manufacturer doesn't have to create a completely different model just to address grip preferences.

Agreed.

The GX8 was just TOO big for a M43 camera, especially that it was similar in size to a XPro2 and larger than the Sony APS-C bodies.

better make that for YOU , or for SOME . Once again , there is no doubt that there is an absolute need for BOTH small and medium size bodies depending on the users hands , the lens sizes, the lens focal lengths. Having a choice is ALWAYS better

Harold