717 a disaster

[Shay Stephens]

mac, I don't know what your problem is, but you are flying off the handle here. There is no need for this.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[Arvin Chang]

Hey... I'll trade you my fully functional 707 for your 717, so long as the EVF/LCD actually works. (I'll "deal" with the hassles of returning it if it is a dude)

--arvin

Here we go with another psychologically based camera fault. I've
no idea why people think the 717 is any different to the 707. I
had three different 717's and they all operated correctly, as I
expected and the same as a 707 (which I also had for comparison)

Phil,

Are you forgetting that you completly missed the DLS problem with
the 707 in your review on this camera?

I for one purchased the 707 in the strength of that review and
ended up having to send the camera back to have the necessary fixes
applied.

Regards
Richard_

 

[Shay Stephens]

You don't know what your talking about here Hal, take a few deep breaths, spend some time figuring out what has gotten under your skin and then fix it. But don't go around bashing people like this.

I know your publication is not meant to
really pinpoint problems (hard to get advertisement dollars if you
bash their equipment). Also, got any spare 1Ds laying around

Hal

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[Akkers]

So why dont you guys accept that the 717 CAN and does have problems that people are talking about on this forum instead of labeling their problems as 'pyshological'.

This forum should force people to declare in the footer of posts whether they are members of the Sony Fan Club or if they work for Sony.

I don't understand, look, DLS crept up as a problem well after
the camera was introduced. It couldn't possibly have been included
in the review, because at the time it was not a problem.

Try using the analytical skills we all have been trained to use and
not just jump to conclusions that cannot be backed up by facts.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[mac west]

there is no need for what reporting problems with a camera then being attacked By the sony flag wavers.

mac, I don't know what your problem is, but you are flying off the
handle here. There is no need for this.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[Kimberly85208]

I was always taught that if you go over someone's house for dinner, you don't complain about the food.
--
--Kimberly--
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs...

 

[Richard91758]

I don't understand, look, DLS crept up as a problem well after
the camera was introduced. It couldn't possibly have been included
in the review, because at the time it was not a problem.

Try using the analytical skills we all have been trained to use and
not just jump to conclusions that cannot be backed up by facts.

Shay,

As much as I respect you as a photographer and a mainstay in this forum, why are you and other members finding it so hard coming to terms with the fact that there may be problems with some units.

You posted a workaround for the problem yesterday which I'm sure a lot of people will appreciate but, again let me say that I for one, wouldn't want to go through a sequence of button pushing to get a camera to do what it should do automiticaly straight from the box.

Let's do a survey on serial numbers to see if there's any pattern emerging.

If in doing this and there is a definite problem showing, Sony then need to be made aware that there Quality Control is slipping.

Regards
Richard_

 

[Zero_FX]

What is your point? Sometimes I get lost by analogies.

I was always taught that if you go over someone's house for dinner,
you don't complain about the food.
--
--Kimberly--
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs...

--
Chris

 

[Shay Stephens]

That is not my point, I want there to be discussion of problems because it helps us all out in finding ways around them. The point I am making is that there is some kind of mob mentality going on based on a few people with possibly bad cameras. Because one person has a bad camera does not mean all users have a bad camera. I have not been able to duplicate the problems some are having.

When a scientists makes a discovery, they usually have their findings tested by others to validate the claims. If those claims cannot be duplicated, then there is something wrong with the claim, either it is a case of something that is not wide spread, or it is operator error. As we delve into the problem it is becoming clear it is not a wide spread problem, but an isolated problem and possibly operator error as well.

Lets get to the bottom of it without attacking people trying to help shall we, or has this become the Sony rant and vent forum instead?

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[Eric Lamont]

I have had my 717 for two weeks or so and every picture has turned out just great. Some are not useable but its due to errors on my side.

Quickly losing my enthusiasm with all these negative comments...and
my camera is not even here yet. I sure hope a bunch of people post
some good-old 707 style saturated pictures!!!!!! Neon colors or
not!
Isabel

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Digipets/?yguid=11497599

--
Eric
DSC-F717
http://www.pbase.com/elamont
http://www.thedigitalgalleries.com/ (a work in progress)

 

[Yves P.]

That has to be one of the most pathetic answer I have ever read in STF to date ...

Hal

well guess what after two 717s that had focusing problems the third
one focuses much better still not like 707 the @#$% lcd screen and
evf have gone out tried the reset nothing you hear the song and see
nothing this one about 5 hours old. yeah great product of the year
thank god for B&h and sears return policy will not try again.
MAC west NYC
ps waiting for everyone to tell me nothing wrong with camera its me.

--
Phil Askey
Editor / Owner, dpreview.com

--
If you don't snap it, nobody will snap it for you ...
Kafrifelle (Yves P.)
Nikon D-100 with assorted lenses

http://www.pbase.com/kafrifelle

 

[mac west]

You dont have to be a scientist to know if a camera focuses correctly. Or the evf and lcd dont work.

That is not my point, I want there to be discussion of problems
because it helps us all out in finding ways around them. The point
I am making is that there is some kind of mob mentality going on
based on a few people with possibly bad cameras. Because one
person has a bad camera does not mean all users have a bad camera.
I have not been able to duplicate the problems some are having.

When a scientists makes a discovery, they usually have their
findings tested by others to validate the claims. If those claims
cannot be duplicated, then there is something wrong with the claim,
either it is a case of something that is not wide spread, or it is
operator error. As we delve into the problem it is becoming clear
it is not a wide spread problem, but an isolated problem and
possibly operator error as well.

Lets get to the bottom of it without attacking people trying to
help shall we, or has this become the Sony rant and vent forum
instead?

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[David Barker91965]

I was always taught that if you go over someone's house for dinner,
you don't complain about the food.
--
--Kimberly--
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs...

Was it one of the wild corn dogs that taught you that, Kimberly?

Seriously (ish) I assume you were talking about people here criticising Phil Askey on his own forum? I think Phil can take it - in fact, I think he knew exactly what he was doing when he implied that mac west had a psychologically-based camera problem. After all, it certainly got us all typing quicker!

Cheers Kimberly.

--
David Barker

 

[Shay Stephens]

I don't understand, look, DLS crept up as a problem well after
the camera was introduced. It couldn't possibly have been included
in the review, because at the time it was not a problem.

Try using the analytical skills we all have been trained to use and
not just jump to conclusions that cannot be backed up by facts.

Shay,

As much as I respect you as a photographer and a mainstay in this
forum, why are you and other members finding it so hard coming to
terms with the fact that there may be problems with some units.

For one, I have not said there is no problem, I am allowing for the fact that there are some bad units out there. However, I have not been able to duplicate the consistent bad results. My focus problems have been operator error, when used correctly, my camera has not given bad focus. So there is something going on here that is not a cut and dried case of widespread camera focus problems.

You posted a workaround for the problem yesterday which I'm sure a
lot of people will appreciate but, again let me say that I for one,
wouldn't want to go through a sequence of button pushing to get a
camera to do what it should do automiticaly straight from the box.

I posted a work around for the behavior of the camera not to display the focus brackets showing a focus lock when the laser comes on.

No camera is going to take perfect pictures in all situations. Especially a camera in auto. So users have a choice of taking matters into their own hands to guarantee a larger percentage of good pictures, or they can leave it up to the camera and be satisfied with a smaller percentage of good photos.

Let's do a survey on serial numbers to see if there's any pattern
emerging.

Anyone is free to do so, it is a hard job requiring dedication, so if that person is you, then my hat goes off to you

If in doing this and there is a definite problem showing, Sony then
need to be made aware that there Quality Control is slipping.

Regards
Richard_

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[Shay Stephens]

I know, what I meant to say was that when a claim that something doesn't work is made, it needs to be duplicated, if the problem is not duplicated, then the problem is an isolated problem and not indicative of a widespread problem, or possibly operator error.

There is a tendency to project ones problem to everyone. That does not serve anyone in the end, it only confuses people and wastes time.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp

 

[mac west]

They will always shoot the messenger. when it is clear sonys quality control is lacking but time will tell . Mac west NYC

I was always taught that if you go over someone's house for dinner,
you don't complain about the food.
--
--Kimberly--
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs...

Was it one of the wild corn dogs that taught you that, Kimberly?

Seriously (ish) I assume you were talking about people here
criticising Phil Askey on his own forum? I think Phil can take it -
in fact, I think he knew exactly what he was doing when he implied
that mac west had a psychologically-based camera problem. After
all, it certainly got us all typing quicker!

Cheers Kimberly.

--
David Barker

 

[John Burns]

I don't want to hear about it in thread after thread from someone who is to immature to take suggestions for improving their results and is more interested in whining like a spoiled eight year old. You informed the first time. From then on it is bitching. Perhaps the 717 has a auto jerk setting that is causing your problems. The only thing worse than your pictures is your attitude.

One last thought. I would rather have my head in the sand than where yours seems to be.

because I have a problem with it you dont want to hear about it so
start a forum where only people can post good things . stick your
head in the sand and dont read my posts if they make you unhappy
.I didnt know this was about making people happy or informing
people about problems with the product. Mac west NYC

--
John

 

[David Barker91965]

You dont have to be a scientist to know if a camera focuses
correctly. Or the evf and lcd dont work.

Fair points, but I suspect it was the way you stormed in at the start of the thread with a sweeping declaration about the 717, followed by a rejection of the possibility of even trying another camera. With the greatest respect, you have either had very very bad luck or done something slightly wrong with one or both of the first two cameras. The third clearly had a problem. I'm not Sony's chief apologist, but I feel certain that most of their 717s are fine. Why don't you let them fix you up with one of these and you'll go on to enjoy using it for a long time to come?

--
David Barker

 

[Akkers]

I have to say the Sony quality control has been lacking some time now.

What with the lousy flash and shutter-lag on 505v to DLS etc on 707 and now focusing problems on 717.

Sony digital camera dept people need shooting (with their own cameras) - thats if they can be focused upon correctly.

I was always taught that if you go over someone's house for dinner,
you don't complain about the food.
--
--Kimberly--
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs...

Was it one of the wild corn dogs that taught you that, Kimberly?

Seriously (ish) I assume you were talking about people here
criticising Phil Askey on his own forum? I think Phil can take it -
in fact, I think he knew exactly what he was doing when he implied
that mac west had a psychologically-based camera problem. After
all, it certainly got us all typing quicker!

Cheers Kimberly.

--
David Barker

 

[Shay Stephens]

mac, STF does not shoot the messenger. I posted a problem about the metering, but I also offered a solution of sorts. Posts that just bash are not received well because they offer nothing of value to the reader. The messenger is not being attack so much as the message. Lighten up a bit. Your message would be much more pleasurable to read and deal with if you were not being so nasty about it all.

All is not lost, just change your tune a little and let's get to the bottom of this.

--
Shay

My Sony F707 Gallery: http://www.shaystephens.com/portfolio.asp
My F717 Observations: http://www.shaystephens.com/f717.asp