WRONG WAY - GO BACK !!!

[Sergey Borachev]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

The high-$ strategy is clearly not working. The E-M1 II had its moments, but it had to compete with the cheaper D500 and the G9, and then with X-H1, and now the super-spec'ed A7 III. Unlike Panasonic, it cannot rely on superior video to justify its high price. So, it tries to do that with superior lenses like the f/1.2 lenses, but there is a basic problem. These super fine lenses are great for collectors, those who want to own rare, expensive products that make one feel good and proud, but do they actually produce better images compared to other products costing and weighing as much, with a M43 sensor? The X-H1 and the A7 III clearly shows how silly the high-price strategy is, for a smaller format system. This is starting to smell like the same problem contributing to 43's failure, bigger and bigger lenses and cameras at higher and higher costs, in pursuit of the very best optical and mechanical quality (but using a small sensor that put a restricting upper bound on its IQ). It's like a boxer only 5 feet tall aiming to fight for the heavyweight title by perfecting every imaginable martial skills, bulking up, wearing gimmicky shorts, hair style...

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

 

[Jan Chelminski]

Ha! Hilarious! Thanks for the much needed humor, at a time like this!

Jan

 

[Sergey Borachev]

Ha! Hilarious! Thanks for the much needed humor, at a time like this!

Jan

--
"In my opinion to search means nothing in painting. To find is the thing."
-Picasso
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On Equivalence[sic], and why m4/3 is THE NATURAL CHOICE, for those who value very high quality AND excellent portability:
https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/60478849

Yeah, I want to laugh too, but see those big trucks in all 3 lanes coming straight at you, The Sony truck, Fuji and further back the big Canon.

Would it have been better if Olympus had nurtured the E-M5 line better and stay in a patch where it can survive and compete better? Unfortunately, it never bothered to properly grow the E-M5, the camera that was to be a game changer and that sold so well it saved Olympus.

 

[Jan Chelminski]

Ha! Hilarious! Thanks for the much needed humor, at a time like this!

Jan

 

[JakeJY]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

The high-$ strategy is clearly not working. The E-M1 II had its moments, but it had to compete with the cheaper D500 and the G9, and then with X-H1, and now the super-spec'ed A7 III. Unlike Panasonic, it cannot rely on superior video to justify its high price. So, it tries to do that with superior lenses like the f/1.2 lenses, but there is a basic problem. These super fine lenses are great for collectors, those who want to own rare, expensive products that make one feel good and proud, but do they actually produce better images compared to other products costing and weighing as much, with a M43 sensor? The X-H1 and the A7 III clearly shows how silly the high-price strategy is, for a smaller format system. This is starting to smell like the same problem contributing to 43's failure, bigger and bigger lenses and cameras at higher and higher costs, in pursuit of the very best optical and mechanical quality (but using a small sensor that put a restricting upper bound on its IQ). It's like a boxer only 5 feet tall aiming to fight for the heavyweight title by perfecting every imaginable martial skills, bulking up, wearing gimmicky shorts, hair style...

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

The EM1 II was the camera (and the expensive lenses that launched with it) that brought Olympus back to profitability. I'm not buying the claim the high price strategy is not working. And as more competitors come out, it's trivial for them to price drop (as they are doing). However, by launching at a higher price, they take advantage of the profits they can generate while the competitors are not there yet.

And most of your post seems to be assuming people will always opt for a larger sensor when prices of the camera body is similar, but that ignores that fact that there is a lot more to a camera than just the sensor size. Weather sealing and stabilization for example being strong points for Olympus. Sony's weather sealing is a joke by comparison (Fuji is better, but still not up to Olympus standards), and Sony stabilization is not up to Panasonic standards yet (while Fuji is just getting started with stabilization).

 

[n3eg]

I'll repeat it again: The E-M1 II is what made me buy the E-M5 II. Size and price were the deciding factors.

 

[greg 123]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

The high-$ strategy is clearly not working. The E-M1 II had its moments, but it had to compete with the cheaper D500 and the G9, and then with X-H1, and now the super-spec'ed A7 III. Unlike Panasonic, it cannot rely on superior video to justify its high price. So, it tries to do that with superior lenses like the f/1.2 lenses, but there is a basic problem. These super fine lenses are great for collectors, those who want to own rare, expensive products that make one feel good and proud, but do they actually produce better images compared to other products costing and weighing as much, with a M43 sensor? The X-H1 and the A7 III clearly shows how silly the high-price strategy is, for a smaller format system. This is starting to smell like the same problem contributing to 43's failure, bigger and bigger lenses and cameras at higher and higher costs, in pursuit of the very best optical and mechanical quality (but using a small sensor that put a restricting upper bound on its IQ). It's like a boxer only 5 feet tall aiming to fight for the heavyweight title by perfecting every imaginable martial skills, bulking up, wearing gimmicky shorts, hair style...

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

You will have to wait and see where they go with the mark iii. So far Olympus has done well with the EM1ii. Not everyone feels the same way as you.

 

[cerich]

I think you will be proven tight. Only cameras on the mft playing field with features that make a upgrade appeal to me are too big and at a price that I may as well invest in a FF or APSC system in same size, weight and price zone. The lens may be slightly bigger or same as the new only 1.2 but will have a bigger sensor to make up for a slower aperture and a lower price point to boot.

 

[Vetteran]

Agree. $2k is ridiculous for an MFT including the EM1ii. Adding more expensive and faster glass, ie 1.2 lenses will still only produce a limited IQ relative to the big boy sensors.

That’s why I’ve only bought mid-level lenses and cheaper MFT bodies. IQ is sufficient and the bodies are fun to use. In the final analysis, still a small sensor camera.

PS: buying the A7iii

 

[daleeight]

Ya know, there is a Buy/Sell board here where you can give away your Olympus and Panasonic gear. Would help your time management too because you won't have to post endlessly about how Olympus is dead because Sony released yet another new camera that uses bits and parts of the one they released 3 releases ago, or the 2 and 3 year old ones.

 

[SpinOne]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

Yes, it's always bad when a camera company actually turns a profit.

The high-$ strategy is clearly not working.

Unless... it sorta is.

Loading…

www.43rumors.com

The E-M1 II had its moments, but it had to compete with the cheaper D500 and the G9, and then with X-H1, and now the super-spec'ed A7 III.

Every camera in existence has competitors.

The quality of the competition is pretty much the same today as it has been for years now.

Olympus also makes more than one camera. Crazy, huh?

So, not really sure what you're on about.

These super fine lenses are great for collectors, those who want to own rare, expensive products that make one feel good and proud, but do they actually produce better images compared to other products costing and weighing as much, with a M43 sensor?

That depends entirely on what you're looking for, what you like in your gear, and how you like to work.

More to the point, though, is that there is really nothing new here. Olympus has competed against Fuji and Sony mirrorless cameras for years. The comparative advantages have not, in fact, changed. If anything, Olympus and Panasonic offer a far more comprehensive portfolio of lenses than in the recent past.
Further, Olympus making some "halo goods" like high-quality f/1.2 portrait lenses doesn't mean they have stopped making the small high-quality primes that leverage the portability advantage of the platform. If you want to carry two tiny bodies, and 3 tiny, primes, in a tiny bag, you still really can't do that very effectively with a Sony Alpha -- or, depending on the lenses, even Fuji -- platform.

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

Yeah, news flash! Digital cameras are mature. There isn't much room for improvement across any sensor size.

E.g. for all the fuss this week, the A7 iii is really just a handful of nice tweaks to the A7 ii. The fundamental IQ won't be much different, it'll just have a few nicer video options and better AF.

We've heard people scream bloody murder about "zomg M43 is getting HUGE!!!" for years -- years -- and yet, things seem to keep getting better. Maybe you should worry less about Olympus' sales strategy, and focus more on what gear works for you.

 

[Alexis D]

You will have to wait and see where they go with the mark iii. So far Olympus has done well with the EM1ii. Not everyone feels the same way as you.

It is not reliable to judge the success of a business strategy based on one year's results, for a business selling products that take years to design and having to sell it for years to recover costs. Olympus is trying to go upmarket with the E-M1 II and the f/1.2 lenses, etc but the newest competitor products like the X-H1 and the A7 III (and even the G9) are showing what it is bumping up against. Unless it can push upwards with more reasonable prices, sizes, I'm afraid it is not looking good because for these competitors have products that are superior in DR, high ISO, perhaps also in AF, DOF control, .... and that are the roughly the same in size, weight and price. The only exception is in size of zoom lenses and M43 is clearly better, or has more compact zooms. The E-M1 II did well until recently due to some advantages that are vanishing fast, like 5-axis IBIS, PDAF, HiRes, ... Its price dropped quickly (for a flagship) to match the G9, which is not such a tough competitor when compared to the A7 III. Looking forward and recognising changes are more reliable approaches to compete and to profit in business.

 

[Sergey Borachev]

Ya know, there is a Buy/Sell board here where you can give away your Olympus and Panasonic gear. Would help your time management too because you won't have to post endlessly about how Olympus is dead because Sony released yet another new camera that uses bits and parts of the one they released 3 releases ago, or the 2 and 3 year old ones.

--
Dale

Does it matter whether the new Sony camera is made from 3 releases or 3 year old parts, if it can give you 15 stops of DR, much better DOF control, higher ISO performance, superior PDAF+CDAF, video features ... .... ... for about the same size, weight and price as your E-M1 II?

 

[justmeMN]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

Yes, it's always bad when a camera company actually turns a profit.

In Q3 (Oct-Dec 2017) Olympus' Imaging division had an operating loss of 0.1 billion yen.

 

[Sumer]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

The high-$ strategy is clearly not working. The E-M1 II had its moments, but it had to compete with the cheaper D500 and the G9, and then with X-H1, and now the super-spec'ed A7 III. Unlike Panasonic, it cannot rely on superior video to justify its high price. So, it tries to do that with superior lenses like the f/1.2 lenses, but there is a basic problem. These super fine lenses are great for collectors, those who want to own rare, expensive products that make one feel good and proud, but do they actually produce better images compared to other products costing and weighing as much, with a M43 sensor? The X-H1 and the A7 III clearly shows how silly the high-price strategy is, for a smaller format system. This is starting to smell like the same problem contributing to 43's failure, bigger and bigger lenses and cameras at higher and higher costs, in pursuit of the very best optical and mechanical quality (but using a small sensor that put a restricting upper bound on its IQ). It's like a boxer only 5 feet tall aiming to fight for the heavyweight title by perfecting every imaginable martial skills, bulking up, wearing gimmicky shorts, hair style...

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

 

[Sumer]

Hm,

LOL

Intersting and i supose you have been hugly succesfull in your own businiss ventures and having a loy of valuable knowledge to share. I certainly don't know where some of you people are coming from.

 

[gary0319]

Ya know, there is a Buy/Sell board here where you can give away your Olympus and Panasonic gear. Would help your time management too because you won't have to post endlessly about how Olympus is dead because Sony released yet another new camera that uses bits and parts of the one they released 3 releases ago, or the 2 and 3 year old ones.

 

[NowHearThis]

Unfortunately, especially for Olympus, it's going the wrong way.

Only if they don’t release a PEN-F2

How much can the next $2000 E-M1 III improve, and will it be able to compete with the A7 IV?

At least it won’t have those green lines runnin through the picture ruining your image.

 

[NowHearThis]

Ya know, there is a Buy/Sell board here where you can give away your Olympus and Panasonic gear. Would help your time management too because you won't have to post endlessly about how Olympus is dead because Sony released yet another new camera that uses bits and parts of the one they released 3 releases ago, or the 2 and 3 year old ones.

 

[tgutgu]

Ya know, there is a Buy/Sell board here where you can give away your Olympus and Panasonic gear. Would help your time management too because you won't have to post endlessly about how Olympus is dead because Sony released yet another new camera that uses bits and parts of the one they released 3 releases ago, or the 2 and 3 year old ones.