WL and AB Accuracy/Color bashing revelations

[Debbee]

Paul's postings got him banned from dpreview amidst a chorus of "we're glad you're here" from the majority of posters, and the thread in question got deleted. I guess his intense dedication to truth gave way to someone he ticked off.
Thanks for your support.
Deb Buff

Thanks for posting the test results and exposing some of the
foolishness that's been posted here in the past.

 

[HP Photography]

Sorry to hear Paul got bumped, I was ecstatic that we were getting direct feedback from him! Dpreview had gotten pretty boring until I saw his posts.
--
Harry

 

[Debbee]

Paul suggest you press the complaint button and tell the moderator how you feel if you want him back.
Regards,
Deb Buff

Sorry to hear Paul got bumped, I was ecstatic that we were getting
direct feedback from him! Dpreview had gotten pretty boring until I
saw his posts.
--
Harry

 

[CWilt]

Why? According to some the capacitors and tubes are all the same and shooting RAW fixes everything.

--
Light illuminates while shadow defines.

http://stakeman.smugmug.com

 

[Schweikert]

I submitted my complaint to have Paul reinstated to the forum. Simply put, whether I agree with all the designs Paul makes, I use his products for my business and with success.

Having the head of any major photo equipment manufacturer speak honestly and openly on a forum or any open public venue is important, vital, a privilege to us and virtually unseen in our modern world. The moderator has hurt the goodwill of Paul's participation. Paul doesn't have to be here to sell his product, he his here to speak and listen in a fair and appropriate manner. Paul and Chuck Westfall are the only two photo executives that have ever bothered to talk directly to photographers in open forums that don't have direct affiliation with the foruma themselves

A true shame. Just when we have a chance to move forward, there are always those that force us backward. Please let Paul know his time spent here was not in vain.

--
John

http://www.schweikertphoto.com

 

[RDKirk]

My question would be: If you had the data for AlienBees/White Lightning, you could compare them with sunlight and declare them "unsatisfactory," but you'd have no way of knowing if any other units were any better unless you had their data as well.

Which is similar to the circumstances regarding color temperature consistency--when compared with other units, AlienBees/White Lightning are just as consistent as others (except those pricey new systems designed specifically for color consistency).

--
RDKirk
'TANSTAAFL: The only unbreakable rule in photography.'

 

[Snook]

Your comparing alien bees to Profoto and Such.
That is a good one..
Snook
And were not even in april yet...:+}

--
1DsMII,5D,PB17',G5 D2.0---> Shooting RAW (Ofcourse)
http://homepage.mac.com/ekphotography/2006/

 

[benoit]

If you tell us that you have a tatoo saying I love my bees it would not come much as a surprise.

I posted on an other thread and mentioned my brand and the next thing I know is Paul has to make comments on how his lights work. Many here say it does not matter how much equipment you have to be in this business and to me, exactly the same way, I don't care what's inside the box, it's all about what the box does and how practical it is. I want ease of use, extreme flexibility, reliability and a fine selection of accessories. And yes, 1/10 of a stop, I do see the difference on table top. So I made a choice because to me it's an investment. Price is always an issue, but I'm expecting it to last at least 20 years and being a business my lighting is costing me less over 20 years that transportation alone. I've used the same brand at so many places over 15+ years and only once did a capacitor blew. I can't say I would have more or less problem with an other brand, I just don't know. What I know however is that Paul says he's been in business for ever and he seem to say that he was the first to introduce new ideas in the 80's. What has happened since then? How come other brands keep bringing new accessories and cycle their refresh on those. How come a ring flash only now in 2006? Again, I have nothing against his product and you can search for any bashing coming from me, but when you say you compete with bigger brands you can't only talk about what's inside the box and defend the use of sliders over and over. I may be totally off here, but it seem from all the threads I read over the years that his business has been exploding since the introduction of cheaper digital cameras.

As for the time spend writing here, I typically catch threads late because of work but I do like to write when I get a brake (if that's OK with you). Also, you are pretty much saying that Paul and Debbie don't work hard unless they fall in any imaginary exeption rule of yours.

Be fair

Hey Paul dont take it personally look at the source of people
writing the bashing? Most are forum trolling wanna be's that most
likely dont even know what Kelvin's are or have there monitors
calibrated. They only make those kind of statements so they can
feel or think they are hip or cool and know what they are talking
about. Also to brag that they spent money on Elichrome or Pro Fotos
to feel like they are cool because they own the expensive stuff or
to impress there forum buddies. But cant even figuire out how to
sync their camera's to the studio flash systems. I own one of your
old WhiteLighting 10,000 heads "Someone gave it to me" I have beat
that thing to death it still works after 10yrs of almost daily use
and is consistant as any of the PRO Foto power pack and heads that
i also use. The people that make those kind of comments really dont
know what they are talking about and just make those statements to
feel like they are important. Its obvious you dont need to prove
these forum types that your products are just as good as the big
expensive lights when it comes to consistancy and color balance.
You know its good most real pros that have used them and understand
light know they are consistant and color balanced. But there will
always be some "Forum Head" that wants to feel like a big fish in a
little pond by bashing your lighting system. Also that same guy
that says that stuff is most likely a weekend warrior that runs
around with a 80 to 200 zoom lens at indoor events because he
"Thinks" it looks cool. LoL. Most of the people on these forums are
here because they are not out working or making a daily living at
this. Because if they where they wouldnt have the time to be
posting on forums hourly like they do. LoL.

 

[CWilt]

First off, I am not the one trying to set the record straight. Nothing against Paul, or his lights.

If one wants to change public opinion or rumor, one must provide information. Quoting someone elses CT measurements and saying that RAW cures all is not the best way to do that in my opinion. Color temperature is an abstract number and to really see what is happening one needs the spectral data.

My question would be: If you had the data for AlienBees/White
Lightning, you could compare them with sunlight and declare them
"unsatisfactory," but you'd have no way of knowing if any other
units were any better unless you had their data as well.

Which is similar to the circumstances regarding color temperature
consistency--when compared with other units, AlienBees/White
Lightning are just as consistent as others (except those pricey new
systems designed specifically for color consistency).

--
RDKirk
'TANSTAAFL: The only unbreakable rule in photography.'

--
Light illuminates while shadow defines.

http://stakeman.smugmug.com

 

[Joe Marques]

Please explain. Your work is brilliant - tell us how the lights you use contribute to the outcome and how AB's or WL's would not produce the same result. This is an honest question since you can add something to this thread that goes well beyond color consistency.

Joe

Your comparing alien bees to Profoto and Such.
That is a good one..
Snook
And were not even in april yet...:+}

--
1DsMII,5D,PB17',G5 D2.0---> Shooting RAW (Ofcourse)
http://homepage.mac.com/ekphotography/2006/

 

[Paul.R.Lindqvist]

He started a thread stating the competiton was liars. (wich now is deleted) Not very professional to go on a public forum and pointing fingers at he competition and calling them liars.

--
Regards
Paul L.

 

[dwn]

--
dwn

 

[RDKirk]

First off, I am not the one trying to set the record straight.
Nothing against Paul, or his lights.

If one wants to change public opinion or rumor, one must provide
information. Quoting someone elses CT measurements and saying that
RAW cures all is not the best way to do that in my opinion. Color
temperature is an abstract number and to really see what is
happening one needs the spectral data.

He did provide information--he provided the results of one person's color temperature comparison WHICH IS MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE HAS PROVIDED. Nobody else, while criticizing AlienBees/White Lightning, has provided anything other than the skimpiest anecdotes.

YOU asked for spectral data, which has not only not been provided by anyone else, but has not even been mentioned by anyone else, and we only have your mention to suggest that it's relevant at all. Certainly, without the spectral data from other units, it's certainly NOT relevant as a method of comparison.

--
RDKirk
'TANSTAAFL: The only unbreakable rule in photography.'

 

[CWilt]

He did provide information--he provided the results of one person's
color temperature comparison WHICH IS MORE THAN ANYONE ELSE HAS
PROVIDED. Nobody else, while criticizing AlienBees/White
Lightning, has provided anything other than the skimpiest anecdotes.

I don't believe I criticized him or his equipment.

YOU asked for spectral data, which has not only not been provided
by anyone else, but has not even been mentioned by anyone else, and
we only have your mention to suggest that it's relevant at all.
Certainly, without the spectral data from other units, it's
certainly NOT relevant as a method of comparison.

Relevant? What do you think CT is?

Never mind. I'm not going to argue about this. Have a good day.

--
Light illuminates while shadow defines.

http://stakeman.smugmug.com

 

[swp]

I missed the deleted thread, was he accurate and the truth hurts? Either way he could have been more delicate and than of course so could have the moderators a friendly warning probably would have sufficed.

Scot

 

[swp]

in the end light is light. I see no joke in comparing WL to Profoto especially if it's the Acutes the poor mans Profoto. And if your comparing WL to Profoto monos the Profoto is the joke. Profoto offers some nice modifiers at a very inflated price MAC needs there cut. But I'll let you in on something that really isn't a secret WL/AB take Balcar reflectors/accessories.

Scot

 

[Paul.R.Lindqvist]

I missed the deleted thread, was he accurate and the truth hurts?
Either way he could have been more delicate and than of course so
could have the moderators a friendly warning probably would have
sufficed.

Scot

About as accurate as calling his b400 strobe 400ws effective or not....

--
Regards
Paul L.

 

[Warren Sarle]

....

 

[Ted Wilson]

About as accurate as calling his b400 strobe 400ws effective or
not....

Regards
Paul L.

If you actually read the specs it clearly says they are a true 160ws. They also qualify what an effective watt-second is. Not their fault people see a model number and jump to conclusions.
--
--
Whatever you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has
genius, power and magic in it. - Goethe

http://www.tedwilsonphoto.com/

 

[Paul.R.Lindqvist]

About as accurate as calling his b400 strobe 400ws effective or
not....

Regards
Paul L.

If you actually read the specs it clearly says they are a true
160ws. They also qualify what an effective watt-second is. Not
their fault people see a model number and jump to conclusions.
--
--
Whatever you can do, or dream you can, begin it. Boldness has
genius, power and magic in it. - Goethe

http://www.tedwilsonphoto.com/

My point was that MR buff has his own marketing "stunts".

I didnt jump to any conclusion, obviously you did.

And next thing you gonna say is that the B400 model number has nothing to do with the 400 "effective WS"....

--
Regards
Paul L.