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What is a Pro?
- Thread starter Greg7579
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tdwesbo
Senior Member
I haven't used the word in about a decade. It is meaningless in the context of photography...
BassFisher
Forum Enthusiast
Getting back to ‘Pro’ gear.
As I said previously a Professional Photographer, and that is all we are talking about here on a photography forum, derives his/her living from photography, e.g. photojournalist. As such, like any tradesperson they rely on their tools to produce that living, and accordingly it has to stand up to use, and abuse, that it receives in the day to day operation of earning their living. No camera, no photos. They will know their tools inside out and how to get the best out of them.
Now not all ‘Pros’ use top of the line cameras neither are they all college trained in their chosen profession. They just have to be to make a living at it. They have to be good at what they do, and have to be able produce the goods, conduct themselves in a professional manner, and if self-employed be able to successfully run a business.
Good tools in ANY profession are not cheap, and yes I believe in the old saying ‘you get what you pay for’. That is why over time the major camera makers have endeavoured to make their top camera like a tank e.g. Canon 1DXMkII and Nikon D5 also their ‘Pro’ line of lenses, that can take being in war zones, wind, rain, dust, ice & snow. You get the idea. Of course this comes at a cost and not everyone can afford this.
As these cameras/lenses are the peak of perfection, and non ‘pros’ can afford them, including me, and we appreciate good things why not have them. However that does NOT mean that all other gear is not up to the task. That is plain wrong if you look after all your tools they will often last a lifetime.
I have recently purchased a X-T2 for my wife, she reckons it’s for me:-D, with 16-50 f2.8 and a 90 f2 and I did take it out on a photo shoot in Sydney and enjoyed the experience. The camera and lenses are well made and feel well I’m sure that she will enjoy the experience as well.
As I said previously a Professional Photographer, and that is all we are talking about here on a photography forum, derives his/her living from photography, e.g. photojournalist. As such, like any tradesperson they rely on their tools to produce that living, and accordingly it has to stand up to use, and abuse, that it receives in the day to day operation of earning their living. No camera, no photos. They will know their tools inside out and how to get the best out of them.
Now not all ‘Pros’ use top of the line cameras neither are they all college trained in their chosen profession. They just have to be to make a living at it. They have to be good at what they do, and have to be able produce the goods, conduct themselves in a professional manner, and if self-employed be able to successfully run a business.
Good tools in ANY profession are not cheap, and yes I believe in the old saying ‘you get what you pay for’. That is why over time the major camera makers have endeavoured to make their top camera like a tank e.g. Canon 1DXMkII and Nikon D5 also their ‘Pro’ line of lenses, that can take being in war zones, wind, rain, dust, ice & snow. You get the idea. Of course this comes at a cost and not everyone can afford this.
As these cameras/lenses are the peak of perfection, and non ‘pros’ can afford them, including me, and we appreciate good things why not have them. However that does NOT mean that all other gear is not up to the task. That is plain wrong if you look after all your tools they will often last a lifetime.
I have recently purchased a X-T2 for my wife, she reckons it’s for me:-D, with 16-50 f2.8 and a 90 f2 and I did take it out on a photo shoot in Sydney and enjoyed the experience. The camera and lenses are well made and feel well I’m sure that she will enjoy the experience as well.
dmaclau
Senior Member
A pro photographer is someone who answers the "Are you a Pro?" question as "Yes!"
ta Daa
ta Daa
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tdwesbo
Senior Member
I don't disagree, but the local wedding/engagement/newborn/family photography scene here in Charlotte, NC is filled with working "Pro" photographers who have no idea how their gear works and never will. As long as the jpegs keep coming out, the dial stays on "P" and the ISO adjusts itself, there's no reason to learn your gear if the clients are satisfied and things just keep working.
Wes
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57even
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I just spoke to an old family friend, who ran a commercial studio in SW England till he retired in 2005. I told him about this thread.from Wikipedia : "A professional is a member of a profession or any person who earns their living from a specified professional activity. The term also describes the standards of education and training that prepare members of the profession with the particular knowledge and skills necessary to perform their specific role within that profession."
and
"In some cultures, the term is used as shorthand to describe a particular social stratum of well-educated workers who enjoy considerable work autonomy and who are commonly engaged in creative and intellectually challenging work"
so who, is Pro in the forum
--
Good judgment comes from experience
Experience comes from bad judgment
He just said, "tell them that a real pro is someone who doesn't take a camera on holiday, because then it's not a holiday."
Made me laugh. But I spoke to him many years ago about turning pro, and he just told me not to bother. As he said, if you turn pro, you shoot what other people want. If you shoot for yourself, you shoot what you want. I know that he treated photography as a job, and didn't do it for fun since he was much younger, and wasn't spending 60 hours a week at it.
--
Reporter: "Mr Gandhi, what do you think of Western Civilisation?"
Mahatma Gandhi: "I think it would be a very good idea!"
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MindInRewind
Senior Member
MindInRewind
Senior Member
from Wikipedia : "A professional is a member of a profession or any person who earns their living from a specified professional activity. The term also describes the standards of education and training that prepare members of the profession with the particular knowledge and skills necessary to perform their specific role within that profession."
and
"In some cultures, the term is used as shorthand to describe a particular social stratum of well-educated workers who enjoy considerable work autonomy and who are commonly engaged in creative and intellectually challenging work"
so who, is Pro in the forum
My advisor in art school got started as a photographer for the US Navy in reporting the Korean conflict. He met W. Eugene Smith who pushed him to go study under Minor White after he got out. He did and he and Smith became good friends which was good since Smith would often drop in on his classes. One night closing a pub in Baltimore the class talking with Smith someone asked why do you use a Leica. His answer it is the best available and it never breaks nor seldom needs recalibrating. It is built like a tank, I could take it into the field and make sure to get the shots. He said it was a camera built for a professional to take the abuse that often comes from a professional photographer.
But Smith never once referred to himself as a professional photographer nor did my advisor Richard - although photography was all they ever did. Smith only took one shot of his kids but it was a special shot - which had a lot more to do with him than his kids. When Smith shot it was for him to express his passion and emotion. He spent time with his kids - not taking pictures of them.
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Nikon and Canon make cameras that they call their professional cameras to take the beating of going to a war zone, going on long journeys to take images in far away places for National Geographic, to go on assignment to report tragedy. They cameras have to be designed like a tank and have to hold up. If someone wants to spend the money for such a camera - that more power to them. I am sure Canon nor Nikon will complain. However, most people know what a professional is and know one when they see it.
Unless there are laws against passing oneself off as a professional in a field - then people can call themselves whatever they want.
MindInRewind
Senior Member
Of course, no one calls them a professional anything! "im a professional doctor", "im a professional electrician" or "im a professional IT consultant". And you hit the nail on the head with, "... most people know what a professional is and know one when they see it." It has nothing to do with making a living, getting paid, working full time or part time - in any profession. If you didn't know a photographer was paid or not, judging by his or her work and demeanor, you would know if he or she is or is not a professional.
~MIR
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Keith Williamson
Leading Member
Well Greg, you certainly set the cat amongst the pigeons with this thread. Heated argument, insults, quotations from dictionaries - we've had the lot. This has even surpassed your "how many lenses do I take to Italy?" thread.
I am wondering, what you are going to post next to stir the pot up.
I am wondering, what you are going to post next to stir the pot up.
Greg7579
Forum Pro
Well Keith, I posted that what lenses to take to Italy question and expected to get only a couple of answers, but instead 47,000 people answered and it almost started a civil war.
The responses did make me want to buy the Brick though. But I can't. If I did, I would suffer immense ridicule from at least ten guys I know on this Board. But the responses did not help me decide which FX lenses to take....
So, I'm still trying to decide what lenses to take..... I lined them all up on the dinner table today and my wife asked me what I was doing.... She said, are you selling some of those damn lenses I hope? I said, no honey, I'm deciding what lenses to take with us to Italy. She said, you should have asked me sooner. If you must have more than two, take only three. I said no way Baby.... I'm taking at least seven and I need you to carry two of them onto the plane in your purse.
So anyway, I stared at those beautiful lenses and suddenly realized how badly the lens hoods all sucked, so I wrote a post about that today. I thought it would upset some people, but the funny thing is everyone agrees with me on that point.
I'm not sure what my next post will be. Something educational and uncontroversial, like the death of the DSLR, the disadvantages of full frame sensors or maybe something about how fast autofocus and great Fuji glass doesn't matter because it is all about the purity of the art.....
Greg7579
Forum Pro
Very nicely said. And congratulations...... You, Sir, are the only person on this thread that admitted he was a pro! One of the other pro's said he never even uses the word pro and hasn't in ten years.
That there are so many replies to your question proves, there is no one answer, what or who is professional in photography. Easy way is say, he who learn his/her living with photos.
When I look at a picture, I can judge on what level picture is technically, is it sharp, are colors bright and natural and tone scale in harmony. Is motive in picture clear and has it interesting composition. If all those points exists, I can judge picture as professional quality. Amateur photograph can make professional quality pictures. To describe where the border is between amateur and professional picture depends on person who is judging. This was my 2 cents, jouni
When I look at a picture, I can judge on what level picture is technically, is it sharp, are colors bright and natural and tone scale in harmony. Is motive in picture clear and has it interesting composition. If all those points exists, I can judge picture as professional quality. Amateur photograph can make professional quality pictures. To describe where the border is between amateur and professional picture depends on person who is judging. This was my 2 cents, jouni
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