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Trivial Discussion Time: Upload or Download?
- Thread starter severoon
- Start date
Voyager13b
Senior Member
That's a regional difference..... 
.
Voyager
.--"NT" means no text.
Joe Kurkjian, Pbase Supporter
SEARCHING FOR A BETTER SELF PORTRAIT
Voyager
Doug Kerr
Forum Pro
n/t
LenZen
Well-known member
...I had been thinking that I really enjoyed my Christmas dinner (or supper, depending on your locale, I suppose), but after reading all this, I got indigestion from worrying about whether I had just uploaded or downloaded my meal. I guess I'll just call it a "transfer", or was it copying, since I did have seconds?
All this of course was topped with a slice of pecan pie (I call it P-can, but my wife, who is of the South calls it p'cahn, and what does that say about our marriage?)
I hope a wonderful day was had by all
--
Ri2ch
'The only Zen you find at tops of mountains is the Zen you bring there' ~ R. Pirsig
All this of course was topped with a slice of pecan pie (I call it P-can, but my wife, who is of the South calls it p'cahn, and what does that say about our marriage?)
I hope a wonderful day was had by all
--
Ri2ch
'The only Zen you find at tops of mountains is the Zen you bring there' ~ R. Pirsig
Don't worry, your marriage has an excellent chance of success. I've been married to a southern belle for 26 years now and LOVE everything about her, especially that melodic accent. The secret to our success is to ignore name calling. For example, whenever she refers to me as a d@mn Yankee I just shrug it off (because I've been called worse by others).
Regards,
Joe Kurkjian, Pbase Supporter
SEARCHING FOR A BETTER SELF PORTRAIT
LenZen
Well-known member
...funny, my wife calls me the same...but I'm from CO (and I see you're from the same neck of the woods), so wouldn't that make us westerners? All teasing aside (since she's watching me type this...LOL), she is a wonderful woman who always forgives my transgressions at the local camera shop.For example, whenever she refers to me as a d@mn Yankee I just shrug it off (because I've been called worse by others).
--
'The only Zen you find at tops of mountains is the Zen you bring there' ~ R. Pirsig
Born and raised in Michigan (Go Blue!).
She sounds like a keeper to me, you ARE a lucky man.
Regards,
Joe Kurkjian, Pbase Supporter
SEARCHING FOR A BETTER SELF PORTRAIT
thecameraguy
Senior Member
--
~ Being over-exposed can get you arrested ~
~ Being over-exposed can get you arrested ~
thecameraguy
Senior Member
.....So the computer is not the centre of my universe, well it would be if it was filled with porn, but i digress...
By all means go and client/server yourself to death, but the camera is the source of your material, and the computer your recipient..therefore in your analogy the camera is the server, being the data source, and the puter the recipient (or client).. so its download.
Now, if you wish to be pedantic (which you are) you will say the camera is dumb storage.. ha!.. A server is nothing more than dumb storage, with a piece of software...and the camera hs plenty of software..it controls the data rate, the files, and which files are sent..
but regardless, up or down, them pics just aint wot they used to be..
--
~ Being over-exposed can get you arrested ~
By all means go and client/server yourself to death, but the camera is the source of your material, and the computer your recipient..therefore in your analogy the camera is the server, being the data source, and the puter the recipient (or client).. so its download.
Now, if you wish to be pedantic (which you are) you will say the camera is dumb storage.. ha!.. A server is nothing more than dumb storage, with a piece of software...and the camera hs plenty of software..it controls the data rate, the files, and which files are sent..
but regardless, up or down, them pics just aint wot they used to be..
--
~ Being over-exposed can get you arrested ~
Bobo Hodls
Forum Pro
I just xfer.
--
...Bob, NYC
Galleries: http://www.pbase.com/btullis
' Now, if you are asking instead why camera enthusiasts are more
emphatic than other enthusiasts, I have no answer. I've not seen
that movie yet. : ) ' - Joe Mama
--
...Bob, NYC
Galleries: http://www.pbase.com/btullis
' Now, if you are asking instead why camera enthusiasts are more
emphatic than other enthusiasts, I have no answer. I've not seen
that movie yet. : ) ' - Joe Mama
bogongbreeze
Leading Member
Me too. When I'm copying the files I'm using a copy command to transfer the files from the CF card (which appears as a drive) to another drive (normally another external drive) on the computer.
When I'm using software (eg lightroom or bridge) to copy the files from the cf card to another drive, I'm downloading the files from a temporary drive to the more permanent (albeit external) drive. If I were to use the software to do the reverse, I'd say I was uploading the files from my computer to the cf card. In the same way when I'm copying files from a drive located at the same physical location as I am onto a drive in Chicago (my website), I'm uploading them.
My desktop as the central piece in this equation so the 'upload' and 'download' is in reference to my desktop as the primary storage and from which I am in control - upload if it's from my desktop to another storage, download if it's from another storage to my desktop. I view the camera or the cf card as the secondary storage and the desktop as the primary storage.
Now, if I attached the camera by cable to the computer and used the camera to issue the command to upload to the computer (eg using the print button), then I would be uploading the files to my computer from my camera.
Anyway, whether this is right or wrong, I'll continue to use my desktop to download from the camera or cf card to my desktop, but sometimes I'll just copy the files. lol.
When I'm using software (eg lightroom or bridge) to copy the files from the cf card to another drive, I'm downloading the files from a temporary drive to the more permanent (albeit external) drive. If I were to use the software to do the reverse, I'd say I was uploading the files from my computer to the cf card. In the same way when I'm copying files from a drive located at the same physical location as I am onto a drive in Chicago (my website), I'm uploading them.
My desktop as the central piece in this equation so the 'upload' and 'download' is in reference to my desktop as the primary storage and from which I am in control - upload if it's from my desktop to another storage, download if it's from another storage to my desktop. I view the camera or the cf card as the secondary storage and the desktop as the primary storage.
Now, if I attached the camera by cable to the computer and used the camera to issue the command to upload to the computer (eg using the print button), then I would be uploading the files to my computer from my camera.
Anyway, whether this is right or wrong, I'll continue to use my desktop to download from the camera or cf card to my desktop, but sometimes I'll just copy the files. lol.
... as we are "reading" from the card and "writing" to the card. I agree with you guys, as it is my understanding that the terms upload/download only apply to remote transferring of the files over a data network. of course we might argue what is/is not a network but for this purpose I believe the USB connection (whether to a card reader or the camera) is not a network connection.
--
Duri
http://www.flickr.com/photos/durih
--
Duri
http://www.flickr.com/photos/durih
Julio
Senior Member
Since my computer sits on the floor and my cardreader is on the desk I guess I'm uploading down to the computer... and when I edit a picture style and send it to the camera (also on the desk) I'll upload it up to te camera... is that about right?
A very easy way to remember it is that whichever device is doing the receiving and saving is downloading--the sender is the uploader. Servers can also download.
Have a merry Christmas.
--
http://www.pbase.com/j_trujillo
A very easy way to remember it is that whichever device is doing the receiving and saving is downloading--the sender is the uploader. Servers can also download.
Have a merry Christmas.
--
http://www.pbase.com/j_trujillo
C.G. Ouimet
Well-known member
I agree that Uploading and Downloading are so often misused. So much so, I don't even know what is correct.
Personally, I use my PC as the point of refence - anything moving towards it is downloading, anything moving away from it is uploading.
Another solution is to just sya "transfer from Camera to PC" or "transfer from PC to Server".
Personally, I use my PC as the point of refence - anything moving towards it is downloading, anything moving away from it is uploading.
Another solution is to just sya "transfer from Camera to PC" or "transfer from PC to Server".
severoon
Senior Member
I've gotta be honest with you guys--I thought this problem was limited to my non-technical friends, and being a group of fairly technical-minded photographers I was expecting a lot better from this forum. After reading so many bizarre self-obsessed interpretations of the terms "upload" and "download" I started to doubt myself.
It's ok, though, after looking at half a dozen networking and operating system texts from my university days as a CS student, I've confirmed my understanding. Here's the definitive and authoritative word on it.
The terms "upload" and "download" have nothing to do with perspective of the people involved, and are often used from a third person perspective in which the speaker has no personal attachment or relationship to the machines involved. In common technical parlance, "download" and "upload" are terms used analogously to "upstream" and "downstream". No one would ever say they are going "downstream" against the river current--"'down' because it's the direction I'm going." Similarly, whether you're sitting at the server or the client is immaterial to the way the data--like the river kayak--is moving. Data going toward a server is being uploaded, and data going toward a client is being downloaded.
There is an interesting note on a networking forum I found (grr...I seem to have misplaced the link...figures) that says before P2P most programs served one primary purpose. If you run a linux box at home, you'll know this as well--you can run a "daemon" process, which denotes a server-type program--or a "client" process--which obviously denotes a client. Telnet is a client program, telnetd is the server or "daemon" process that the telnet client connects to. So many people incorrectly associate "server-ness" and "client-ness" with programs. In fact, a program can be written to do anything, and P2P programs like napster play both roles of server and client, even simultaneously, as data moves back and forth. But for the scope of a single session, the concept of "client" and "server" is very firmly fixed.
The terms "copy" and "transfer" are fine terms, definitely not incorrect, but often too general for developers like me that need to specify the roles of the endpoints of a session and wish to do so succinctly. This is the origin of "upload" and "download". Using those terms correctly, I can communicate to my technologically literate audience that, for the transfer session under discussion, the data is flowing in this direction, A is the server, and B is the client.
Using proper language communicates a volume of contextual information that I have grown accustomed to. So, it always annoys me when others use them incorrectly in the same way others are annoyed when they hear "aks" instead of "ask" or "very / really / the most unique" instead of the "unique".
I'm far happier with people that implicitly admit ignorance by using the less specific--and correct--"copy" or "transfer" than those who would unwittingly devalue "upload" and "download" with incorrect usage.
It's ok, though, after looking at half a dozen networking and operating system texts from my university days as a CS student, I've confirmed my understanding. Here's the definitive and authoritative word on it.
The terms "upload" and "download" have nothing to do with perspective of the people involved, and are often used from a third person perspective in which the speaker has no personal attachment or relationship to the machines involved. In common technical parlance, "download" and "upload" are terms used analogously to "upstream" and "downstream". No one would ever say they are going "downstream" against the river current--"'down' because it's the direction I'm going." Similarly, whether you're sitting at the server or the client is immaterial to the way the data--like the river kayak--is moving. Data going toward a server is being uploaded, and data going toward a client is being downloaded.
There is an interesting note on a networking forum I found (grr...I seem to have misplaced the link...figures) that says before P2P most programs served one primary purpose. If you run a linux box at home, you'll know this as well--you can run a "daemon" process, which denotes a server-type program--or a "client" process--which obviously denotes a client. Telnet is a client program, telnetd is the server or "daemon" process that the telnet client connects to. So many people incorrectly associate "server-ness" and "client-ness" with programs. In fact, a program can be written to do anything, and P2P programs like napster play both roles of server and client, even simultaneously, as data moves back and forth. But for the scope of a single session, the concept of "client" and "server" is very firmly fixed.
The terms "copy" and "transfer" are fine terms, definitely not incorrect, but often too general for developers like me that need to specify the roles of the endpoints of a session and wish to do so succinctly. This is the origin of "upload" and "download". Using those terms correctly, I can communicate to my technologically literate audience that, for the transfer session under discussion, the data is flowing in this direction, A is the server, and B is the client.
Using proper language communicates a volume of contextual information that I have grown accustomed to. So, it always annoys me when others use them incorrectly in the same way others are annoyed when they hear "aks" instead of "ask" or "very / really / the most unique" instead of the "unique".
I'm far happier with people that implicitly admit ignorance by using the less specific--and correct--"copy" or "transfer" than those who would unwittingly devalue "upload" and "download" with incorrect usage.
AltaChinook
Senior Member
zakk9
Senior Member
With film cameras, I just load and unload.
--
Jorgen, my name is Jorgen
--
Jorgen, my name is Jorgen
Glen Sansoucie
Leading Member
Since I have 10 mins to kill while my next batch of negatives get's processed...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upload
If you are on your computer and you are receiving files from your card reader (would an IT Scientist really use a USB cable to the camera? you would be downloading files to your computer. . .
If you were on your camera (connected via USB cable), somehow controlling the flow of data, you would be uploading the files to your computer. (If you could hack that Direct Print button to begin the transfer, you'd be uploading)
Now, granted I only have about 25 years of experience (and a degree or two) in the "Computer" field so I may not be qualified to state my opinion ;-)
OK, batch is down, gotta go.
--
-=Glen=-
http://www.pbase.com/gsansoucie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upload
If you are on your computer and you are receiving files from your card reader (would an IT Scientist really use a USB cable to the camera?
you would be downloading files to your computer. . .If you were on your camera (connected via USB cable), somehow controlling the flow of data, you would be uploading the files to your computer. (If you could hack that Direct Print button to begin the transfer, you'd be uploading)
Now, granted I only have about 25 years of experience (and a degree or two) in the "Computer" field so I may not be qualified to state my opinion ;-)
OK, batch is down, gotta go.
--
-=Glen=-
http://www.pbase.com/gsansoucie
severoon
Senior Member
I've gotta say, this makes me glum. It pays to recall that wikipedia is the collected wisdom of the masses. The day may fast be approaching when even us purists are forced to admit that the definitions have changed for the worse and the words have simply be redefined to be not nearly as useful as their original designers' intent.
But I stand by my sources. Wikipedia does not trump guys like Aho, Seti, Ullman, Tanenbaum, Berners-Lee, the Gang of Four, etc. (Even the wiktionary talk pages on the terms upload and download indicate the level of certainty attached to those definitions, with one even mentioning directly the absurdity inherent in "download to" and "upload from".)
I point to the analogy with "upstream" and "downstream" as a reference. In this analogy the server is the source of the river and the client is its foot. If I'm in a boat (the boat is the data in this scenario) traveling from the river's source to its foot, with the current, I'm going downstream. If I'm traveling against the current like a salmon, I'm going upstream.
If I were to misuse these terms as others misuse "upload" and "download", then it doesn't matter if the boat is going against the current or with the current...either term could apply. If I happen to be at the source of the river and the boat's going against the current, towards me, then it would be going "downstream". Similarly, if I'm at the river's source and the boat is traveling with the current, from my perspective that boat is going "upstream".
Yech. I don't like that at all. Particularly if I'm in a plane looking down on the boat. Then, using these bizarre and incorrect definitions, I wouldn't know what to say.
But I stand by my sources. Wikipedia does not trump guys like Aho, Seti, Ullman, Tanenbaum, Berners-Lee, the Gang of Four, etc. (Even the wiktionary talk pages on the terms upload and download indicate the level of certainty attached to those definitions, with one even mentioning directly the absurdity inherent in "download to" and "upload from".)
I point to the analogy with "upstream" and "downstream" as a reference. In this analogy the server is the source of the river and the client is its foot. If I'm in a boat (the boat is the data in this scenario) traveling from the river's source to its foot, with the current, I'm going downstream. If I'm traveling against the current like a salmon, I'm going upstream.
If I were to misuse these terms as others misuse "upload" and "download", then it doesn't matter if the boat is going against the current or with the current...either term could apply. If I happen to be at the source of the river and the boat's going against the current, towards me, then it would be going "downstream". Similarly, if I'm at the river's source and the boat is traveling with the current, from my perspective that boat is going "upstream".
Yech. I don't like that at all. Particularly if I'm in a plane looking down on the boat. Then, using these bizarre and incorrect definitions, I wouldn't know what to say.
BadtzMaru
Senior Member
Actually, where you are wrong is with the client server model for a transfer of data from a local storage device. You are moving data between 2 local file systems, it is neither a network 'upload' or 'download'. How its used colloquially... shrug people continue to use lense so I'm sure its considered common use by now even if it isn't proper.
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