To what extent does AI servo depend on the lens ?

[Paul Young]

I use a D30 and 70-200 f2.8 IS combo and certainly don't find AI Servo mode fool proof. I miss at least 50% of fairly straight forward moving sports shots (eg: time trial cycling).

My own humble opinion is that the AF is the weakness rather than the AI Servo mode. Whatever anyone say, unless you've got decent contrast for the AF to grab hold of then you'll struggle in any mode.

Shoot on a bright day, use centre AF focus spot, keep your shutter speed up and you'll be okay ........ but don't expect huge returns no matter what lens you use with a D30/60 !

 

[Inka]

I do not have idea where I can place my photos, but I am working with it..

Glad you're getting on ok with the athletics shooting, do you have
any on the web to share?

David

Hi all,

I'm going to buy a 70-200 lens (2nd hand Canon 70-200 f2.8L, new
Canon 70-200 f4L or new Sigma 70-200 f2.8 HSM, still undecided) in
order to shoot mainly mountain biking. I read contradictory
comments on photographyreview.com concerning the difference between
Canon USM and Sigma HSM autofocusing, some were saying that AI
servo performance using the aforementioned Sigma lens was
noticeably inferior compared to what we get using one of those
Canon lenses ; others said that AF is virtually as fast on USM and
HSM lenses.

Since this point is very important in my decision process, could
those that have tested both lenses (Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM and Canon
70-200 f2.8 or f4 L) share their impressions ?

Thanks in advance,
Shabok

 

[Shabok]

Try http://www.pbase.com

I do not have idea where I can place my photos, but I am working
with it..

 

[Shabok]

I decided to take no chances, so I just bought the 70-200 f/2.8L

Thanks again,
Shabok

 

[Soolim]

I will be shooting the Molson Indy this weekend with D60 and 200 2.8 + 1.4x. Will give you the feedback later.

Hi all,

I'm going to buy a 70-200 lens (2nd hand Canon 70-200 f2.8L, new
Canon 70-200 f4L or new Sigma 70-200 f2.8 HSM, still undecided) in
order to shoot mainly mountain biking. I read contradictory
comments on photographyreview.com concerning the difference between
Canon USM and Sigma HSM autofocusing, some were saying that AI
servo performance using the aforementioned Sigma lens was
noticeably inferior compared to what we get using one of those
Canon lenses ; others said that AF is virtually as fast on USM and
HSM lenses.

Since this point is very important in my decision process, could
those that have tested both lenses (Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM and Canon
70-200 f2.8 or f4 L) share their impressions ?

Thanks in advance,
Shabok

--
Regards,
Soolim
http://www.pbase.com/soolim

 

[AKamateur]

AI servo on my D60 is basicly useless for what I have tried with it. I have canon USM and non-USM lenses, it is equally horrible. Prefocusing is what I use for motocross. AI servo works fine on my EOS-3 with most all my lenses. If you really need a fast focusing DSLR Canon thinks you need a 1D.
Matt

Hi all,

I'm going to buy a 70-200 lens (2nd hand Canon 70-200 f2.8L, new
Canon 70-200 f4L or new Sigma 70-200 f2.8 HSM, still undecided) in
order to shoot mainly mountain biking. I read contradictory
comments on photographyreview.com concerning the difference between
Canon USM and Sigma HSM autofocusing, some were saying that AI
servo performance using the aforementioned Sigma lens was
noticeably inferior compared to what we get using one of those
Canon lenses ; others said that AF is virtually as fast on USM and
HSM lenses.

Since this point is very important in my decision process, could
those that have tested both lenses (Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM and Canon
70-200 f2.8 or f4 L) share their impressions ?

Thanks in advance,
Shabok

 

[jonlg]

These photos http://www.pbase.com/jonlg/thumper_nats_mxcc were
shot with AI servo and 125 to 250 sec.

Actually the shots you have posted look fairly sharp and I would
say they are sharper than my results, but I guess it rather depends
on how much processing you've done to them.

They have been lineared TIFF'd via BB and then Fred Mirandas LP Batch Pro'd with Low Contast/Normal Sharpening, then croped where needed and then resized.

The thing is the original file looks unsharp on my monitor then when I print it out the photo looks great/awesome and sharp ?

Thanks for your thoughts on the watermark.

I figure that I did not want it to intrude on the viewing of the photo and if someone wants to edit them out well they deserve the substandard image they will get.

Incidentally I thnk your watermarking is a little too subtle - it
could be edited out quite easily.

Chris.
--
http://www.hockeyphotos.com/

--
~

 

[Darren Moore]

Yes this would stop the blur from the object motion, but wouldn't solve the focusing problem

Darren

Incidentally, I was using the center focus point (someone else
asked about this).

I will try this again as soon as the sun comes out, and then we'll
know for sure how good the D60's AI Servo is. It looks like rain
for now so I'm stuck indoors.

On a bright sunny day at 1/60th of a sec, she will still be blurry.

In this sort of situation, using Shutter Priority mode (Tv) and a
higher shutter speed will freeze the motion and let you evaluate
better whether your lens is focusing properly or not. You may not
need to go as high as 1/500th, but 1/60th is pretty slow.

 

[Darren Moore]

No Mark shutter speed isn't relevant at all.

Your right that at that speed there could be blurring of the subject and a faster shutter speed would solve this.

However as we are discussing focus problems the shutter speed is independant it will not solve the not enought light to focus fast situation.

However the shutter speed maybe taken as an indication (assuming wide open lense) that there is or isn't enough light.

But motion blur is one thing to consider in the photo as a small amount of motion blur may be indistinguishable from being out of focus.

Darren

I can't see shutter speed having any direct effect on this.

Of course it has a direct effect. If the object is moving enough
so that within the time the shutter is open (in this case 1/60th of
a sec) there is any significant change in the object's position,
the moving object will be blurred.

It won't matter whether the camera is focusing accurately or not.

[SNIP!]

So if you really want to see what it'll do, try the running
daughter thing again outside on a bright sunny day.

On a bright sunny day at 1/60th of a sec, she will still be blurry.

In this sort of situation, using Shutter Priority mode (Tv) and a
higher shutter speed will freeze the motion and let you evaluate
better whether your lens is focusing properly or not. You may not
need to go as high as 1/500th, but 1/60th is pretty slow.

Darren

Your speed value was not fast enough, I think It should be about
500-or more if you wana get sharp pictures in that situation.

[SNIP!]

Regards,

Mark J.

--
EOS 1D ~ 28-70mm f/2.8 L ~ 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS ~ 20-35mm
f/3.5-4.5 ~ 550EX

 

[David Knight]

Darren

Shutter speed IS relevant to the thread and that's why I posted about ISO - we were discussing someone's experience with their child running towards him. He was using 1/60 at f5.6 with his zoom at 110mm and wondered why the shot was out of focus (and/or blurred). There is a distinct possibility that the shot was motion blurred not out of focus (and also a chance of handshake at that speed and focal length), however you are, of course, entirely correct with your later statements.

David

But motion blur is one thing to consider in the photo as a small
amount of motion blur may be indistinguishable from being out of
focus.

Darren

I can't see shutter speed having any direct effect on this.

Of course it has a direct effect. If the object is moving enough
so that within the time the shutter is open (in this case 1/60th of
a sec) there is any significant change in the object's position,
the moving object will be blurred.

It won't matter whether the camera is focusing accurately or not.

[SNIP!]

So if you really want to see what it'll do, try the running
daughter thing again outside on a bright sunny day.

On a bright sunny day at 1/60th of a sec, she will still be blurry.

In this sort of situation, using Shutter Priority mode (Tv) and a
higher shutter speed will freeze the motion and let you evaluate
better whether your lens is focusing properly or not. You may not
need to go as high as 1/500th, but 1/60th is pretty slow.

Darren

Your speed value was not fast enough, I think It should be about
500-or more if you wana get sharp pictures in that situation.

[SNIP!]

Regards,

Mark J.

--
EOS 1D ~ 28-70mm f/2.8 L ~ 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS ~ 20-35mm
f/3.5-4.5 ~ 550EX

 

[hyslopc]

I deleted the blurry ones instantly without really examining them closely. It's very possible that it was motion blur and not out of focus. I will do the test again in bright sunshine as soon as the !"# sun comes out again.

Shutter speed IS relevant to the thread and that's why I posted
about ISO - we were discussing someone's experience with their
child running towards him. He was using 1/60 at f5.6 with his zoom
at 110mm and wondered why the shot was out of focus (and/or
blurred). There is a distinct possibility that the shot was motion
blurred not out of focus (and also a chance of handshake at that
speed and focal length), however you are, of course, entirely
correct with your later statements.

David

But motion blur is one thing to consider in the photo as a small
amount of motion blur may be indistinguishable from being out of
focus.

Darren

I can't see shutter speed having any direct effect on this.

Of course it has a direct effect. If the object is moving enough
so that within the time the shutter is open (in this case 1/60th of
a sec) there is any significant change in the object's position,
the moving object will be blurred.

It won't matter whether the camera is focusing accurately or not.

[SNIP!]

So if you really want to see what it'll do, try the running
daughter thing again outside on a bright sunny day.

On a bright sunny day at 1/60th of a sec, she will still be blurry.

In this sort of situation, using Shutter Priority mode (Tv) and a
higher shutter speed will freeze the motion and let you evaluate
better whether your lens is focusing properly or not. You may not
need to go as high as 1/500th, but 1/60th is pretty slow.

Darren

Your speed value was not fast enough, I think It should be about
500-or more if you wana get sharp pictures in that situation.

[SNIP!]

Regards,

Mark J.

--
EOS 1D ~ 28-70mm f/2.8 L ~ 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS ~ 20-35mm
f/3.5-4.5 ~ 550EX

--
D60, 28-135 IS, 550EX

 

[Darren Moore]

Sorry David I didn't make myself very clear, your right it certainly is relevant as to why the photo is blurry, I meant it's not relevant as to whether the AI focus works properly or fast. Sorry for any confusion

Darren

Shutter speed IS relevant to the thread and that's why I posted
about ISO - we were discussing someone's experience with their
child running towards him. He was using 1/60 at f5.6 with his zoom
at 110mm and wondered why the shot was out of focus (and/or
blurred). There is a distinct possibility that the shot was motion
blurred not out of focus (and also a chance of handshake at that
speed and focal length), however you are, of course, entirely
correct with your later statements.

David

But motion blur is one thing to consider in the photo as a small
amount of motion blur may be indistinguishable from being out of
focus.

Darren

I can't see shutter speed having any direct effect on this.

Of course it has a direct effect. If the object is moving enough
so that within the time the shutter is open (in this case 1/60th of
a sec) there is any significant change in the object's position,
the moving object will be blurred.

It won't matter whether the camera is focusing accurately or not.

[SNIP!]

So if you really want to see what it'll do, try the running
daughter thing again outside on a bright sunny day.

On a bright sunny day at 1/60th of a sec, she will still be blurry.

In this sort of situation, using Shutter Priority mode (Tv) and a
higher shutter speed will freeze the motion and let you evaluate
better whether your lens is focusing properly or not. You may not
need to go as high as 1/500th, but 1/60th is pretty slow.

Darren

Your speed value was not fast enough, I think It should be about
500-or more if you wana get sharp pictures in that situation.

[SNIP!]

Regards,

Mark J.

--
EOS 1D ~ 28-70mm f/2.8 L ~ 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 L IS ~ 20-35mm
f/3.5-4.5 ~ 550EX

 

[Gary T]

Well, to a certain extent, shutter speed will affect the sharpness in a situation like this when dealing with movement other than direct movement to or from the camera. Especially when the subject is that of a human running because of movement up/down, left/right, etc. So for his daughter, along with the bright light suggestion you have made, he could consider a faster shutter speed than 1/60 to arrest the other movement the AI cannot compensate for. Even though his daughter runs slower than he walks, a little kid will have a lot more bouncing movement in their steps that will affect sharpness especially when they are "running" in their excitement.

Gary T

I can't see shutter speed having any direct effect on this.
Look at time taken to focus and whether the camera hunts at all
while focusing. Best results for focusing are always bright light
and high contrast. Seeing as the camera has to track a moving
object it must also refocus very quickly. So bright light is an
ideal situation.
Hence indirectly shutter speed is another consequence of good
light. Thus if you have a high shutter speed you either have
plenty of light and AI should work fine, a high ISO or very fast
lense in which case you takes your chances.

So if you really want to see what it'll do, try the running
daughter thing again outside on a bright sunny day.

Darren

 

[Tom O'Neil]

AI servo on my D60 is basicly useless for what I have tried with
it. I have canon USM and non-USM lenses, it is equally horrible.
Prefocusing is what I use for motocross. AI servo works fine on my
EOS-3 with most all my lenses. If you really need a fast focusing
DSLR Canon thinks you need a 1D.
Matt

That's what I need to know. Canon needs to get an "EOS-3D" into the market. I'm willing to pay some premium over the price of a D60 to get the 1D/1v/3 45-point focusing system with responsive AI Servo, but not a 1D-sized premium.

 

[Soolim]

My experience only.

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1019&message=3099052

Hi all,

I'm going to buy a 70-200 lens (2nd hand Canon 70-200 f2.8L, new
Canon 70-200 f4L or new Sigma 70-200 f2.8 HSM, still undecided) in
order to shoot mainly mountain biking. I read contradictory
comments on photographyreview.com concerning the difference between
Canon USM and Sigma HSM autofocusing, some were saying that AI
servo performance using the aforementioned Sigma lens was
noticeably inferior compared to what we get using one of those
Canon lenses ; others said that AF is virtually as fast on USM and
HSM lenses.

Since this point is very important in my decision process, could
those that have tested both lenses (Sigma 70-200 2.8 HSM and Canon
70-200 f2.8 or f4 L) share their impressions ?

Thanks in advance,
Shabok

--
Regards,
Soolim
http://www.pbase.com/soolim

--
Regards,
Soolim
http://www.pbase.com/soolim