Time to whinge about USB type C, PD and devices

[Chris Noble]

And for my two cameras, I like to have a spare battery with me, so I use the wall charger to top them up when I get home. Very simple.

I’m not going anywhere without a spare either but thats rather beside the point!

You did not read the OP? He was complaining about the difficulty of charging the battery in the camera because of camera charging-plug issues.

As the OP, I think I know what the original post was about.

It was about the chain of dependency between Type C chargers, usb cables cables and the end device (camera) to get the best performance between those components and their power and data capabilities are not clear.

That's what I called "camera charging plug" issues.

I thought it was rather obvious that we can use out of camera charging and image transfer; we have had these for years. In other words, it was about how the ‘new’ (nearly 10 years old) connections were not being implemented in an optimum way that helps the user. (A spare battery will remain useful, not least because it allows you to get camera power in seconds when you run out.)

My apologies if the original post wasn’t clear enough on the subtleties here.

I was just suggesting "the obvious" as you call it: a better solution than in-camera charging, which has many disadvantages, including the ones you mention and others.

 

[GeoffRG]

Some really good points here so a few thoughts:

The issues with cables should improve over time. For example, the USB 4 standard raises the bar on the data and power capabilities. This will go along with what has probably simplified USB-C for me

Yes, USB C (and other capabilities) are definitely better but the additional features raise the bar but also the complexity of the individual elements in the chain and especially those interconnect cables. As they get ‘smarter’, knowing how they are performing gets harder. For example, I have a couple of devices now that have a USB type C socket but will not charge with a PD cable. They need their own dumb (fortunately supplied) cable!

which is: No cheap cables. Get the good stuff, even though it costs more.

Yeup, very much my approach (except the examples above).

After assembling a core set of good performing USB-C cables, I use them interchangeably for everything, both external SSDs and charging devices. I have seen USB-C become more of the default even on cheap devices, which has really simplified my travel kit. New Sony? USB-C. New GoPro? USB-C. New gimbal, external SSD, tablet? USB-C.

That’s what I aim for too but I think the end devices (cameras) could do (a lot) more to tell the user what’s going on. E.g a message (“you are trying to charge the battery but the cable is not capable of fast charging. It will charge but slowly.”

It is becoming common for me to not even take OEM chargers of the box. If a product charges with USB-C, I use the chargers and cables I already have instead of having to find one more free wall-wart-width outlet on the power strip, and pack one more damn charger.

Instead, I have been standardizing on USB-C multi-outlet wall chargers (no less than four ports, please) and power banks. These have ben a godsend for travel, fewer items in less space. Now I only pack one 4-port wall charger and one battery power bank, and everything USB-C gets powered from those, including cameras and laptop. (If it is a critical job/trip, I pack a second 4-port charger as a backup in case the primary fails.)

Generally agree but (bit OT) I also count weight as an issue so I choose to travel with two single port chargers with interchangeable (I live in the UK) mains plugs for photography needs.

Reliability, spec compliance? I have been doing this for over a year, including international trips, and haven’t blown up any gear or worn out any ports yet.

Same here but been doing it for about 3 to 4 years with same successful experiences.

As a result I am increasingly annoyed at my remaining pieces of gear that are USB A/micro B or Lightning, or with any charger that only has one port on it. Can’t wait until I can go all USB-C, only having to pack one kind of cable and charger that works with everything.

Similar, I actively buy (despite my frustrations in the original post) look for USB C compatibility. My photography kit IS now completely USB C. It could just be super easy to use. At the moment I find myself testing anytime I change anything to be sure everything is playing nicely together.

As I said in response to your original post, the standardisation we have isn’t quite what the EU appears to have intended. We have chargers that could be universal but we also have a plethora of less capable chargers, sometimes only distinguishable by the data printed on the device. We have identical looking cables that are anything but and ports on devices that may, or may not, be charging, high speed data, USB or Thunderbolt ports but all look the same.

Even worse, many new devices, except computers, come with USB A, B or other non-C connectors. After 20 years of the C connector this really shouldn’t be the case.

The other thing wrong with requiring a standard connector is that it deters anyone from coming up with something better and getting it to market. Now if you want to sell a product with a superior connector you need to either make two versions, one for the EU and another for the rest of the world, or add it alongside USB C.

 

[Chris Noble]

on my laptop, some ports support charging, others don't. Some support thunderbolt, others don't. Some support DP/HDMI alternate modes, others don't. Some provide power while sleeping, others don't. And there is no label on them to signify any of that.

Wow, that's quite a collection for one laptop. What's the brand and model?

 

[bastibe]

on my laptop, some ports support charging, others don't. Some support thunderbolt, others don't. Some support DP/HDMI alternate modes, others don't. Some provide power while sleeping, others don't. And there is no label on them to signify any of that.

Wow, that's quite a collection for one laptop. What's the brand and model?

Is it? I don't think so. My previous laptop had three ports. There's one port that supports charging and thunderbolt und DP/HDMI alternate modes, there's two that supports DP/HDMI and thunderbolt, but not charging. And any ports on the docking station support partial thunderbolt, but no charging, nor DP/HDMI alternate modes. Except for the charging port on the docking station, which supports no data traffic whatsoever, but does do charging. Some of the ports on the laptop can be switched (in bios) to provide power while the laptop is sleeping, others can not. Except that functionality didn't ever work for me, so it just doesn't provide power while sleeping, even though it says it should. Except after a OS update, where this worked for a while. And except for the right port sometimes flaking out, and not providing DP/HDMI alternate modes any longer, but still do charging and USB. Restarts don't fix this, but running down the battery to zero does. And except for the ethernet port on the docking station, which works after a reboot, but doesn't after waking up from sleep. That's your regular Dell XPS setup these days. You might surmise that I'm not a fan.

Now I have a Lenovo, which has a fully functioning docking station, but no USB-C charging. Oh well.

At least pure USB functionality, and the DP/HDMI alternate modes actually do seem to work reliably all the time. So that's good I guess. But thunderbolt (e.g. gigabit ethernet, HDMI pass-through (not alternate mode!), external PCI-E) is still woefully unreliable.

 

[Chris Noble]

on my laptop, some ports support charging, others don't. Some support thunderbolt, others don't. Some support DP/HDMI alternate modes, others don't. Some provide power while sleeping, others don't. And there is no label on them to signify any of that.

Wow, that's quite a collection for one laptop. What's the brand and model?

Is it? I don't think so. My previous laptop had three ports. There's one port that supports charging and thunderbolt und DP/HDMI alternate modes, there's two that supports DP/HDMI and thunderbolt, but not charging. And any ports on the docking station support partial thunderbolt, but no charging, nor DP/HDMI alternate modes. Except for the charging port on the docking station, which supports no data traffic whatsoever, but does do charging. Some of the ports on the laptop can be switched (in bios) to provide power while the laptop is sleeping, others can not. Except that functionality didn't ever work for me, so it just doesn't provide power while sleeping, even though it says it should. Except after a OS update, where this worked for a while. And except for the right port sometimes flaking out, and not providing DP/HDMI alternate modes any longer, but still do charging and USB. Restarts don't fix this, but running down the battery to zero does. And except for the ethernet port on the docking station, which works after a reboot, but doesn't after waking up from sleep. That's your regular Dell XPS setup these days. You might surmise that I'm not a fan.

Really? I just ordered a new XPS, my third in 15 years. Two Thunderbolt 4/USB--C/DisplayPort/Power-Delivery ports. Nothing else. Bliss.

Now I have a Lenovo, which has a fully functioning docking station, but no USB-C charging. Oh well.

 

[bastibe]

Good for you, truly.

Perhaps mine was flaky, who knows. Or perhaps my periphery was specifically problematic. My experience was definitely one of frustrations. Had it been my own instead of the work laptop, I'd have gotten rid of it.

Good luck with yours! It's honestly heartening to see that it might have just been mine, and not a general Dell/USB-C issue.

 

[Mackiesback]

Standardization can be good. Our fuel cars have standardized fuel fillers, EVs are now all adopting the Tesla connectors, =motorcycles all have controls in the same place so riders new to the brand don't injure themselves etc. But with standardization you limit manufacturers from building a batter mousetrap. That's the downside.

If I am spending $1400 for a 2023 model of camera, I expect a cable, regardless of standards. Even Apple gives a cable, and they are the stingiest of electronics manufacturers. This is a poor optic for Sony.

Meh, my Sony cables for each camera sat in the box. I use Anker's braided nylon cables, they're far superior. I personally don't need a low quality short add-in cable that I'll never use anyhow.

I do agree that cable ends should have some info printed on them, like USB data standard, max charging volts & amps, etc. The charging bricks tend to have this info. I have a Klein USB-C tester to verify I'm getting charge speeds I want

That's fine, I don't always us it either. Sometimes its nice because these cable eventually wear out.

For me its a bit about the principle of it. Selling a new camera with no way to charge it is like selling a new car with no gas in it.