CMCM
Veteran Member
Well, I would expect the G1Xiii to have lower noise due to its APS-C sensor. And yes...where is that 1" sensor camera with lower noise????
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The G1X III's lens is SHARP! ...A comparison with DPRs own tool
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nolten
Leading Member
I think they are talking sensor size vs lens speed equivalencies. All of the reviews seem to make much of this, Camera Labs, DPR, etc. So you take a 1" sensor and put an f1.8 lens on it you get equivalent DOF, shutter speeds or ISO settings compared to the G1X3 - with both lenses wide open. The APS-C sensor will have better noise characteristics at equivalent ISOs but you can offset that to some extent by using a wider aperture on the smaller sensor camera.
However these analyses ignore that often in photography the situation does not require pushing the ISO/aperture to the maximum. In landscape photography for example you want to expose to the right but not so much as to blow the sky, even the bright clouds. You want deep DOF so you stop the camera down. Yet you still want to pull the shadows in post because they've gone very dark relative to the way the human eye sees. In this case the larger sensor is much better suited to the task. The G1X3 uses Canon's excellent 24 MP DPAF APS-C sensor with very good low ISO dynamic range and good higher ISO noise characteristics. The same sensor used in the 80D and recent M series cameras. You'll not find a 1" sensor to match.
I actually find the Camera Labs review quite positive and it helped my decision to get the G1X3. In the shallow DOF and low light tests the faster lens on the small sensor camera could equal but not really beat the G1X3. In other respects the G1X3 was the better camera. I especially liked his comparison to other Canon APS-C lenses like the EF-S and EF-M 18-55 or 15-45 where the G lens was faster wide open and could focus closer. He even got splashed by a wave which killed his small sensor camera but the G took unharmed. He never says the G has poor image quality as one poster here erroneously claims. In the end he preferred the G as do I.
I've been using G series cameras since the G3. The original G1X convinced me I'd never go small sensor again. I've been using the G1X mk3 for over a year now and it is the perfect compact camera with an excellent lens, excellent performance and handling, and a really convenient size and weight. In real world use its images compare well with images from my 80D and 5D4 and L zooms. Worth every penny IMHO.
However these analyses ignore that often in photography the situation does not require pushing the ISO/aperture to the maximum. In landscape photography for example you want to expose to the right but not so much as to blow the sky, even the bright clouds. You want deep DOF so you stop the camera down. Yet you still want to pull the shadows in post because they've gone very dark relative to the way the human eye sees. In this case the larger sensor is much better suited to the task. The G1X3 uses Canon's excellent 24 MP DPAF APS-C sensor with very good low ISO dynamic range and good higher ISO noise characteristics. The same sensor used in the 80D and recent M series cameras. You'll not find a 1" sensor to match.
I actually find the Camera Labs review quite positive and it helped my decision to get the G1X3. In the shallow DOF and low light tests the faster lens on the small sensor camera could equal but not really beat the G1X3. In other respects the G1X3 was the better camera. I especially liked his comparison to other Canon APS-C lenses like the EF-S and EF-M 18-55 or 15-45 where the G lens was faster wide open and could focus closer. He even got splashed by a wave which killed his small sensor camera but the G took unharmed. He never says the G has poor image quality as one poster here erroneously claims. In the end he preferred the G as do I.
I've been using G series cameras since the G3. The original G1X convinced me I'd never go small sensor again. I've been using the G1X mk3 for over a year now and it is the perfect compact camera with an excellent lens, excellent performance and handling, and a really convenient size and weight. In real world use its images compare well with images from my 80D and 5D4 and L zooms. Worth every penny IMHO.
telefunk
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Just look at what the posts refer to: the Cameralabs review
telefunk
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Would certainly choose the G1XM3 above the G7XM2. Specially for daytime & high quality shooting. But some 1" are as good if not better...I think they are talking sensor size vs lens speed equivalencies. All of the reviews seem to make much of this, Camera Labs, DPR, etc. So you take a 1" sensor and put an f1.8 lens on it you get equivalent DOF, shutter speeds or ISO settings compared to the G1X3 - with both lenses wide open. The APS-C sensor will have better noise characteristics at equivalent ISOs but you can offset that to some extent by using a wider aperture on the smaller sensor camera.
However these analyses ignore that often in photography the situation does not require pushing the ISO/aperture to the maximum. In landscape photography for example you want to expose to the right but not so much as to blow the sky, even the bright clouds. You want deep DOF so you stop the camera down. Yet you still want to pull the shadows in post because they've gone very dark relative to the way the human eye sees. In this case the larger sensor is much better suited to the task. The G1X3 uses Canon's excellent 24 MP DPAF APS-C sensor with very good low ISO dynamic range and good higher ISO noise characteristics. The same sensor used in the 80D and recent M series cameras. You'll not find a 1" sensor to match.
I actually find the Camera Labs review quite positive and it helped my decision to get the G1X3. In the shallow DOF and low light tests the faster lens on the small sensor camera could equal but not really beat the G1X3. In other respects the G1X3 was the better camera. I especially liked his comparison to other Canon APS-C lenses like the EF-S and EF-M 18-55 or 15-45 where the G lens was faster wide open and could focus closer. He even got splashed by a wave which killed his small sensor camera but the G took unharmed. He never says the G has poor image quality as one poster here erroneously claims. In the end he preferred the G as do I.
I've been using G series cameras since the G3. The original G1X convinced me I'd never go small sensor again. I've been using the G1X mk3 for over a year now and it is the perfect compact camera with an excellent lens, excellent performance and handling, and a really convenient size and weight. In real world use its images compare well with images from my 80D and 5D4 and L zooms. Worth every penny IMHO.
nolten
Leading Member
Agree, it really depends on what you are needing the camera for. All these cameras are so good now that in many ways you can't go wrong.
In my view the G1X3 is overkill or inappropriate if:
Its your only camera and need a longer zoom range, I often pair mine with a 77D + 55-250 while hiking, or my larger DSLRs for major trips, etc.
You only ever shoot in-camera jpegs or are posting on the internet or social media. The major benefit of modern sensors comes from shooting raw and post processing. 14 bits per color offers so much more than 8 bits per color. In-camera processors are pretty good, but ...
You really are aiming at low light or shallow DOF or I'll add telephoto or macro or very wide angle. Then you need appropriate lenses and those are generally out of the compact camera's job description. Still 24-70 is a good general purpose range. I personally prefer the 24 mm wide end vs the 28 of previous compacts I've had although I'm sacrificing the 70 to 100 or 140 end.
Your video needs go beyond its feature set or capability.
You really want to emphasize small size in the camera, but then you probably have your cell phone.
The G1X3 is just outside what you are willing to spend, All of these and more are considerations and everyone's taste and style and preference is personal and valid.
In my view the G1X3 is overkill or inappropriate if:
Its your only camera and need a longer zoom range, I often pair mine with a 77D + 55-250 while hiking, or my larger DSLRs for major trips, etc.
You only ever shoot in-camera jpegs or are posting on the internet or social media. The major benefit of modern sensors comes from shooting raw and post processing. 14 bits per color offers so much more than 8 bits per color. In-camera processors are pretty good, but ...
You really are aiming at low light or shallow DOF or I'll add telephoto or macro or very wide angle. Then you need appropriate lenses and those are generally out of the compact camera's job description. Still 24-70 is a good general purpose range. I personally prefer the 24 mm wide end vs the 28 of previous compacts I've had although I'm sacrificing the 70 to 100 or 140 end.
Your video needs go beyond its feature set or capability.
You really want to emphasize small size in the camera, but then you probably have your cell phone.
The G1X3 is just outside what you are willing to spend, All of these and more are considerations and everyone's taste and style and preference is personal and valid.
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T
TedR1
Guest
Thank you
I am thinking of the G1X3 to be my only camera (non professional) replacing a G16. I am used to small sensor IQ and would very much like to escape from those limitations and the APS-C mk3 seems to be one of the best options. I can sacrifice some zoom range, 100mm would be nice (like the G7Xmk2) but going down to 72mm seems too much. Please let me have your advice, how would I get more zoom range from the 3, digital zoom? It seems this forces the use of JPG only, am I right? Another possibility seems to be to crop the image post, 2x would give 144mm I think. What do think of this option?
CMCM
Veteran Member
I had a hard time deciding between the G1Xiii and the G7Xii. I used the G1X for a couple of weeks and really liked it a lot. But it wasn't going to be my only camera, I really wanted more zoom than 72, and I wanted a faster lens for shooting in museums and the like. These factors plus the high price for a camera that lacked several things I wanted made me opt for the G7Xii, which I do like a lot.
When I had the G1Xiii I tested out the digital zoom, and while using DZ isn't really a good thing as it will never look as good as optical zoom, the G1X actually surprised me and I found the digital zoom images I took to be fairly good. I didn't expect that.
Cropping: It has its limits on the G7Xii's 1" sensor. Things I shot and cropped more than a little bit didn't look satisfactory to me. I imagine the G1Xiii would be better due to its larger APS-C sensor, although I don't think I tested it in this way so I can't comment on it.
nolten
Leading Member
You ask a difficult question. When I first got the G1X3 I did some experimenting with the digital zoom. I was hoping that the camera was internally using the dual pixel capability of the sensor to enhance the digital zooming over just cropping. My experiments showed that the "zoomed" images were no better than cropped images. So your best bet would be to shoot raw and crop in post.
The question is will this be good enough? I can't answer that for you. You could find some sample RAW or full resolution jpeg images from review sites and process and crop them yourself to see if the quality meets your expectation.
However, I don't think that would satisfy me. If this was to be my only camera then I would probably look at a Canon M camera with a couple of lenses to cover my needs. For example, here is a two lens kit that is actually cheaper than the G1X3 but has the same sensor size and the reach you might want. The M50 body is not much larger than the G1X3.
As I said in my post above, I often use my G with a Canon Rebel with 55-250 lens or with my larger DSLRs. The G acts as backup, or normal zoom when I have a long zoom on the larger camera, or just a compact when I don't need more.
Hope this helps.
The question is will this be good enough? I can't answer that for you. You could find some sample RAW or full resolution jpeg images from review sites and process and crop them yourself to see if the quality meets your expectation.
However, I don't think that would satisfy me. If this was to be my only camera then I would probably look at a Canon M camera with a couple of lenses to cover my needs. For example, here is a two lens kit that is actually cheaper than the G1X3 but has the same sensor size and the reach you might want. The M50 body is not much larger than the G1X3.
Loading…
www.bhphotovideo.com
As I said in my post above, I often use my G with a Canon Rebel with 55-250 lens or with my larger DSLRs. The G acts as backup, or normal zoom when I have a long zoom on the larger camera, or just a compact when I don't need more.
Hope this helps.
I've used the digital zoom quite a bit. Although useful, your image quality rapidly degrades.
The G1X III is simply going to give you best of the best in image quality from a Powershot, but, to your point, with loss on the long end in particular.
The G5X and G7X are better in this regard, however, big but, going from 72mm to 100mm in my book, meh. It isn't till you get to say 120mm like the G1X II did that it starts to count.
Btw, the G1X III stomps on the image quality of the G1X II. I don't recommend the G1X II to anyone unless it's for budget reasons. You should think G7X (or G7X II) first.
I love referring folks to the wonderful M system btw. It's like an APS-C Powershot that you can swap lenses on, that really kicks butt. M50 is highly recommended. Just came from that forum a second ago I might add.
Where the G1X III edges out those M's is in sheer portability. It's got a lot packed into something so small, for what it is. But for the price? You could've done an M50, 15-45, 55-200 dual kit, and another lens, say the 11-22 or EF-M 22mm f/2 STM. That 32mm f/1.4 STM although $499 is wicked I might add. You get what you pay for, scratch that, you get more than you pay for with that lens (it's practically an L lens in my book).
telefunk
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OMG you touch upon a subject I nearly do not dare to approach: people using FF cameras just to get hi quality for their social media...Agree, it really depends on what you are needing the camera for. All these cameras are so good now that in many ways you can't go wrong.
In my view the G1X3 is overkill or inappropriate if:
Its your only camera and need a longer zoom range, I often pair mine with a 77D + 55-250 while hiking, or my larger DSLRs for major trips, etc.
You only ever shoot in-camera jpegs or are posting on the internet or social media. The major benefit of modern sensors comes from shooting raw and post processing. 14 bits per color offers so much more than 8 bits per color. In-camera processors are pretty good, but ...
You really are aiming at low light or shallow DOF or I'll add telephoto or macro or very wide angle. Then you need appropriate lenses and those are generally out of the compact camera's job description. Still 24-70 is a good general purpose range. I personally prefer the 24 mm wide end vs the 28 of previous compacts I've had although I'm sacrificing the 70 to 100 or 140 end.
Your video needs go beyond its feature set or capability.
You really want to emphasize small size in the camera, but then you probably have your cell phone.
The G1X3 is just outside what you are willing to spend, All of these and more are considerations and everyone's taste and style and preference is personal and valid.
Twitchly
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My name is Twitchly, and I am a crop-aholic.
That’s one of the main reasons I went with the G1X III and it’s 24-pixel resolution and ASP-C sensor. I do a lot of re-composing through cropping after shooting. If you’re curious, download a RAW file from a G1X III and try cropping it down to see what you think.
I’d love to have more zoom. It really is the greatest limitation for me with this camera. It’s one of the reasons I keep my Nikon DSLR. If they ever come up with a G1X IV with a 200 zoom, I’ll be all over it.
In the meantime, I’m about to trade in my DSLR for a full-frame, 45-pixel-resolution camera so I can do some serious cropping! (Among other things.) But this sweet little Canon will continue to be my go-everywhere camera. In the past 18 months, it has accompanied me to Europe, across the US, and pretty much everywhere I go. It’s a true joy to use.
That’s one of the main reasons I went with the G1X III and it’s 24-pixel resolution and ASP-C sensor. I do a lot of re-composing through cropping after shooting. If you’re curious, download a RAW file from a G1X III and try cropping it down to see what you think.
I’d love to have more zoom. It really is the greatest limitation for me with this camera. It’s one of the reasons I keep my Nikon DSLR. If they ever come up with a G1X IV with a 200 zoom, I’ll be all over it.
In the meantime, I’m about to trade in my DSLR for a full-frame, 45-pixel-resolution camera so I can do some serious cropping! (Among other things.) But this sweet little Canon will continue to be my go-everywhere camera. In the past 18 months, it has accompanied me to Europe, across the US, and pretty much everywhere I go. It’s a true joy to use.
CMCM
Veteran Member
Ah, yes....I too am a cropaholic, I confess it. And FF with 45 pixels....cropping heaven, I would imagine.
Nice to see you are still liking your G1Xiii after a year of use....I've been kind of following your comments/photos since you got it. I tested it for a couple of weeks and liked it very much, but the limited zoom stopped me (along with the price, which seemed too much because I was dissatisfied with the limited zoom). But I'm still watching for future developments, and I also wish Canon would magically gift us with a 28-120 lens on pretty much the same camera. Probably not going to happen, though, the physics of the larger sensor size and camera size may prevent that from happening.
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nolten
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Twitchly
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But my cappuccino looks so much better in full-frame!
telefunk
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Very valid!But my cappuccino looks so much better in full-frame!
T
TedR1
Guest
As you may know focus too sharp for some subjects has a long tradition in camera development going back into the nineteenth century and wet-plate cameras. Ways to soften lenses for some portraits, and/or retouch the negative, came very early to the photographic arts and have never gone away. The filter thread on the G1Xmk3 is ready and able to take something that might please the missus
T
TedR1
Guest
to nolten, CMCM, RLight and Twitchly, thank you for the thoughts and suggestions to my earlier questions.
The 7mk2 I have on loan is DIGIC 7 with picture styles, in-camera RAW editing, in-camera cropping which covers almost everything. I tried it out I produced some crops about 2500 px wide that would translate on the 1Xmk3 to approximately 150mm digital zoom range. Of course the smaller image loses some quality however for some of my purposes the result would be fine. Now if I just can find a way to raise the $000 :-D
The 7mk2 I have on loan is DIGIC 7 with picture styles, in-camera RAW editing, in-camera cropping which covers almost everything. I tried it out I produced some crops about 2500 px wide that would translate on the 1Xmk3 to approximately 150mm digital zoom range. Of course the smaller image loses some quality however for some of my purposes the result would be fine. Now if I just can find a way to raise the $000 :-D
nolten
Leading Member
I recently traded in my 5D3 on a 6D2 and 24-70 4f L lens to use as backup to my 5D4 & 24-105 L. Using the 6D2, I did a comparison between the 24-70 and 24-105. This morning I repeated the sequence using my G1X3 using the step zoom function to match the 24, 35, 50, 70mm equivalent FOVs and the widest aperture the lenses would support, f4 for 24 and 35, f5.6 for 50 and 70.
I did the original L zoom comparison because I had read that the 24-70 zoom was sharper in the corners at 24 and 70 but softer at 35 and 50 compared to the 24-105. I could see very little difference between the two lenses. For example, at 24 mm the left edge of the 24-70 was a tad sharper while the right edge was a tad sharper on the 24-105, at f5.6, the differences were gone.
To my astonishment the G1X3 was just as sharp across the range as the two L zooms. Well within the shot to shot variation. Also the colors and tone shading were equivalent. All images used ISO 100 and both cameras generally chose the same shutter speed. Also, at 24mm, f2.8 and f4 on the G1X3 looked identically sharp. I'm sure laboratory testing can detect differences I can't see but for my purposes they are identical. And to answer my wife's immediate question, no, this does not mean I'm getting rid of my FF cameras.
All images were shot in raw on a tripod and worked up equivalently in Lightroom Classic CC with lens corrections and basic sharpening and highlight/shadows applied. I compared images side by side at 1:1 on my 5K 27" retina iMac. The pixel dimensions of the 6D2 is 6240x4160 while that of the G1X3 is 6000x400, so fairly close for comparing images at 1:1. The deck on my house in San Diego faces south overlooking Rose Canyon with a view of several house encrusted ridge lines. Lots of detail to compare. All at near infinity focus. I let the cameras do the focusing.
I've been comparing cameras and lenses this way for years. When I first got my G1X3 I compared it to the EF-S 15-85 and EF 16-35 f4 L on my 80D. The G1X was a bit better than the 15-85 but a tad softer in the corners than the 16-35. Some time ago I had compared my original G1X to the 15-85 on 7D and the 24-105 on an original 5D. All fairly similar pixel resolutions. The wide edges on the 15-85 were a bit sharper than the G1X and the 24-105 was the sharpest of all by a small margin. So consistent with my current findings. So I agree with RLight's original post, the G1X3's lens is SHARP!
I did the original L zoom comparison because I had read that the 24-70 zoom was sharper in the corners at 24 and 70 but softer at 35 and 50 compared to the 24-105. I could see very little difference between the two lenses. For example, at 24 mm the left edge of the 24-70 was a tad sharper while the right edge was a tad sharper on the 24-105, at f5.6, the differences were gone.
To my astonishment the G1X3 was just as sharp across the range as the two L zooms. Well within the shot to shot variation. Also the colors and tone shading were equivalent. All images used ISO 100 and both cameras generally chose the same shutter speed. Also, at 24mm, f2.8 and f4 on the G1X3 looked identically sharp. I'm sure laboratory testing can detect differences I can't see but for my purposes they are identical. And to answer my wife's immediate question, no, this does not mean I'm getting rid of my FF cameras.
All images were shot in raw on a tripod and worked up equivalently in Lightroom Classic CC with lens corrections and basic sharpening and highlight/shadows applied. I compared images side by side at 1:1 on my 5K 27" retina iMac. The pixel dimensions of the 6D2 is 6240x4160 while that of the G1X3 is 6000x400, so fairly close for comparing images at 1:1. The deck on my house in San Diego faces south overlooking Rose Canyon with a view of several house encrusted ridge lines. Lots of detail to compare. All at near infinity focus. I let the cameras do the focusing.
I've been comparing cameras and lenses this way for years. When I first got my G1X3 I compared it to the EF-S 15-85 and EF 16-35 f4 L on my 80D. The G1X was a bit better than the 15-85 but a tad softer in the corners than the 16-35. Some time ago I had compared my original G1X to the 15-85 on 7D and the 24-105 on an original 5D. All fairly similar pixel resolutions. The wide edges on the 15-85 were a bit sharper than the G1X and the 24-105 was the sharpest of all by a small margin. So consistent with my current findings. So I agree with RLight's original post, the G1X3's lens is SHARP!
M. Anthony
Forum Enthusiast
I would never base a camera purchase based on DP Review only.
Too many good reviews of this camera and its lens ability to take seriously the review that this website conducted.
There are many photography websites that have accurate
camera reviews on the web.
M. Anthony
Too many good reviews of this camera and its lens ability to take seriously the review that this website conducted.
There are many photography websites that have accurate
camera reviews on the web.
M. Anthony
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