Switch from D500 to Z8. Help!

[LTheWafflePWN]

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

I definitely don't shoot birds, let alone wildlife (unless you count the occasional feral toddler) but I have a D500 and I have a Z8. All I can say is, the Z8 is absolutely the better camera over the D500 in everything I've shot with it. The Z8 just works. No AF Fine tuning lenses. I use Wide Area S with subject detection, nails people, cats, and dogs every time. Wide Area L, Custom Areas, Auto Area, single, dynamic, all works without a hiccup. For rouge toddlers or just running people, I have FN1 set to 3D tracking and it works without a hitch, every time I use it anyway.

Mirrorless and DSLR's are different, so no matter if you pick a Nikon, Sony, or even Canon there will be some amount of adjustment - but once you get used to mirrorless I think you'll prefer it. The other thing is for the Z8, if you like the size and weight of the D500 you'll be happy to know that the size and weight between the two is nearly identical.

The one thing I think people don't talk about enough is the blackout free shooting of the Z8/Z9 due to the lack of mechanical shutter and additional, dedicated feed to the EVF from the sensor. If you've ever had to follow something that's moving erratically, you know that it's difficult with blackout. The Z8 doesn't have blackout, so following something in frame is significantly easier than with a DSLR with a mirror flapping about - in my opinion. The A1 should also be blackout free as well - provided you aren't using it's mechanical shutter that is.

I know I'm not a wildlife guy, but I hope this helps!

**Edit** I saw you made a post about you being on a budget - I'll also mention you should look into the Tamron 150-500mm lens if you're on a really, really tight budget for a mount-native lens. Not as long as something ending in 600mm, but it's significantly cheaper at $1200 than Nikon/Sony's first party 180-600mm/200-600mm that are $1900/$2000 respectively (not sure of European price, but I'm sure it'll scale).

 

[Pietro13]

I have a Z8, had a Z7 (sold to buy Z8), D850, D5, and D500. To this day the D500 is still my favorite camera. That being said, there is a misrepresentation going on with advice on the switch to mirrorless regarding autofocus. The term "hit rate" is misleading as there is no difference between DSLRs and mirrorless. If you keep your AF point on your subject you will get similar results. In fact DSLRs might be a little better as they react more consistently than mirrorless. In group AF, on a Nikon DSLR, I know the AF system will focus on the closest part of the subject as Nikon mirrorless in wide AF area mode will choose the most contrast, which can be anywhere inside the box. Where mirrorless excels is it will move the AF point around the frame for you in Auto AF. This system works great most of the time but also has its faults. The D500 in group AF is still the best set up for birds flying directly at me. Birds in flight while panning is a different story. The Z8 would be the best choice. There really is few situations where either system would not get the shot, AF wise. Frame rate is where there is a bigger difference. If you double your chances, you will get more pictures to choose from, but this comes at a cost. Don't underestimate the time it will take to go cull all those extra pictures. I am in the small minority, but I still enjoy using both systems. If you can keep the D500 and still purchase the Z8 I would highly recommend it.

 

[chambeshi]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

I shared the following summary of how I find FX Z9 class Mirrorless features.... on a parallel thread (link below) yesterday.... The advanced 3rd generation Nikon MILCs with the Z9 AF system and EXPEED7 have powerful features for wildlife photography. These include :

• silent-shutter;
• high frame rates;
• PreCapture, image quality (including cropping flexibilitynif 45 mp FX);
• full frame AF coverage;
• Custom Area AF modes (inherited from the D6 in Z9 fw2.0, April 2022) although their unique advantages don't appear to be widely appreciated as they deserve;
• Subject Detection, especially the eye-detection;
• Autofocus works at fStops higher than f5.6, even f9, f11;
• No more AFFT, which confers new life on F-mount lenses, especially with a teleconverter pairing;

Last but not least, we have game changing options in the Z Nikkors for wildlife photography. These are the choices in lighter options for long focal lengths (400 f4.5S, 600 PF, 800 PF especially) as well as the improved lighter Ultrawide zooms.

The advice to Marry the Glass, Date the Bodies rules truer today than ever. I rely on a mixed Z and F optics system on the D6 and Z9... So final 0.02c to the OP, add a Z8 with FTZ to your F system but keep the D500.

Add the Z glass when you and wallet is ready

The Z8 uses shooting banks like the D500

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www.dpreview.com

 

[monte12345]

Note, the Gen 2 AF are all of the Z cameras with the Expeed 7 CPU and the Gen 1 is based on the Expeed 6 CPU which has about 1/20 the speed of the Expeed 7. That huge difference in processing speed yields a huge difference in the capabilities of the AF system.

My comparison is based on the Zf versus the Sony RX100VII which features the AF system from the latest A7R4, so it's probably a match for the top of the line AF in the A1 II. The Zf is nearly as good as the Sony so it's no slouch and more than good enough. Basically the Sony has a fail rate of about 4% and the Zf has a fail rate of 6-7%. Basically the Sony system is a bit better in selecting a subject to focus on if there are multiple subject in motion. So if you have a flock of birds in the frame the Sony will grab the closest bird near instantly, the Zf will be a touch hesitant and may not grab the closest bird every time. IMO these differences will be addressed in the future by firmware updates and the basic AF system is probably a match for Sony.

I will also point out that Nikon users have access to any lens that features a Sony mirrorless mount via an electronic adapter. As a result Nikon users have access to a much larger selection of lenses than Sony users.

 

[Ricardo00]

You can adapt that 300f2.8 to any Z with the Megadap ETZ21 pro.

Looks intriguing though some of the reviews say it is tight and hard to get off and on with the Z8? Have you had any such problems?

One of the best features of the z-mount is how many lenses you can adapt to it. You want it too be tight to avoid any alignment issues. Megadap recommends (see care instructions/tips on threads here,) not keeping it on the lens or attaching it while attached to a lens, which is slightly annoying. I have the luxury of two bodies, avoid extra lens changes, and changing in the field. If you change lenses more often than most adapting may not be for you.

I still adapt a few lenses that aren't available in Z-mount. Mostly the 20-40f2.8 Tamron. I've also adapted the Sigma 100-400, 70-180f2.8 before it was available, and various primes. I had no trouble with newer G or GM primes. There are a few quirks, and you have to shoot RAW to manually profile the lens in Lightroom Classic.

I've used a few ETZ21 copies, one works but no longer updates, and I have two Neewer adapters. I've also used the Fotodiox adapter, but it doesn't fit the DX bodies due to a slightly thicker plastic cover. The Neewer (a slightly nicer design,) doesn't work with my Samyang 45f1.8.

The overall benefit of the lens selection and TINY form factor are worth it. I also protect myself from expensive mishaps with a third party warranty on the body and more expensive gear.

Thanks for the details on how you avoid problems. Some of those things (ie. not leaving the adapter mounted to the lens and attaching the adapter to the camera body before the lens) sound a bit more than slightly annoying.

 

[Ricardo00]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

Last but not least, we have game changing options in the Z Nikkors for wildlife photography. These are the choices in lighter options for long focal lengths (400 f4.5S, 600 PF, 800 PF especially) as well as the improved lighter Ultrawide zooms.

The advice to Marry the Glass, Date the Bodies rules truer today than ever. I rely on a mixed Z and F optics system on the D6 and Z9... So final 0.02c to the OP, add a Z8 with FTZ to your F system but keep the D500.

Having the 400mm, 600mm and 800mm are nice, but the 500mm PF on the D500 is a great combo! Your list of advantages of the mirrorless system add to the argument to switch, but if funds are limited, the 500mm PF and D500 can be used quite effectively.

 

[skyrunr]

Thanks for the details on how you avoid problems. Some of those things (ie. not leaving the adapter mounted to the lens and attaching the adapter to the camera body before the lens) sound a bit more than slightly annoying.

Honestly, with the warranty in my pocket, I don't always follow the recommendations. I'll use the gear as I need to. I turn off traction control and break the speed limit now and then too.

Adapting was more necessary when the z lens lineup was as filled out. If you have a favorite lens you can use it on a Z. You can't use a Z lens on any other camera, and you can't put a Z lens on a D500. The 24-70F4S and 24-120F4S is almost worth getting a Z body alone. Most of the Z lenses have much closer focusing than their f-mount counterparts.

 

[Ltgk20]

I'm not a Nikon shooter, but a Sony shooter, so I'll weigh in on my experience with the A1 and 200-600 and add some input on what I've read between the Z8 and Z9. The A1 and 200-600 is a great combo cable of capturing most anything you'd want a camera to capture (minus pre-capture, of course). The A1 is small, relatively light and fast. The 200-600 is sharp, and though not lightning fast to focus, quick enough to follow most things in motion (only at the extremes was it too slow). It was also somewhat revolutionary being as long, as inexpensive, and with internal zooming as it was.

Based on what I've read, the Z8/Z9 combo have basically achieved parity on AF performance, though the A1 seems to be a little easier to get all of the AF performance out of it, whereas the Nikon combo requires a bit more familiarity and technique. From a lens standpoint, Nikon's 180-600 seems pretty much equivalent to the 200-600.

As much as I like my Sony and lenses, it'd be a hard sell to convince a Nikon shooter with a Z8 or Z9 to switch at this point. The A1 has a small advantage with flash (1/400s mechanical shutter), and has many more lens options in the ultra-wide to short telephoto range, but then Nikon has all those beautiful super-telephotos.

 

[Ken Seals]

What I mean is that by having body stabilization, you can shoot al lower speeds without having moved images, instead of forcing even more the ISO, what eventually will produce noisy images.

Not necessarily. A lot of wildlife situations include moving subjects and an appropriate shutter speed is necessary. Even grizzly bears move, but slowly most of the time. In the case of static subject, one should be ready for movement with the appropriate shutter speed already set.

 

[greenmanphoto]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

Last but not least, we have game changing options in the Z Nikkors for wildlife photography. These are the choices in lighter options for long focal lengths (400 f4.5S, 600 PF, 800 PF especially) as well as the improved lighter Ultrawide zooms.

The advice to Marry the Glass, Date the Bodies rules truer today than ever. I rely on a mixed Z and F optics system on the D6 and Z9... So final 0.02c to the OP, add a Z8 with FTZ to your F system but keep the D500.

Having the 400mm, 600mm and 800mm are nice, but the 500mm PF on the D500 is a great combo! Your list of advantages of the mirrorless system add to the argument to switch, but if funds are limited, the 500mm PF and D500 can be used quite effectively.

Ricardo00,

And the 500mm PF also works GREAT on the Z9 with the FTZ! I'd imagine it would work equally well on the Z8, since they're quite similar.

Sam

 

[KnightPhoto2]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

One mistake I see fellow D500 to Z8 wildlife shooters make is not increasing their lens focal length accordingly. You often shoot below 500mm, so on the Z8 that means you often shoot below 750mm!

since you often shoot from a hide this is less of an issue, but step out of that hide into what I call Field Birding and this is a big giant issue. That’s why you see many of us using the 800PF.

The Z8 is a marvel, silent, 46 megapixels of goodness, better ISO, fps, unlimited buffer, blackout free, eye-autofocus and associated much higher keeper rate, etc. But if you don’t do anything about lens focal length it really devalues the benefits. At minimum this would require the 180-600mm plus TC14 when you need it.

If budget won’t support, consider the Z50 II as an interim step.

--
Best Regards,
SteveK
'A camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera.' -- Dorothea Lange

 

[Ricardo00]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

Last but not least, we have game changing options in the Z Nikkors for wildlife photography. These are the choices in lighter options for long focal lengths (400 f4.5S, 600 PF, 800 PF especially) as well as the improved lighter Ultrawide zooms.

The advice to Marry the Glass, Date the Bodies rules truer today than ever. I rely on a mixed Z and F optics system on the D6 and Z9... So final 0.02c to the OP, add a Z8 with FTZ to your F system but keep the D500.

Having the 400mm, 600mm and 800mm are nice, but the 500mm PF on the D500 is a great combo! Your list of advantages of the mirrorless system add to the argument to switch, but if funds are limited, the 500mm PF and D500 can be used quite effectively.

Ricardo00,

And the 500mm PF also works GREAT on the Z9 with the FTZ! I'd imagine it would work equally well on the Z8, since they're quite similar.

Sam

Yep used it on my Z9 for a while before I bought my first Z lens (the 400mm). Now my wife has adopted the 500mm PF, my all time favorite lens.

When I first got the Z9, compared the 100-400mm plus 1.4TC with the 500mm PF and the 500mm was sharper then my copy of the 100-400mm plus TC so returned it. When the 400mm f/4.5 was announced, bought that and tried it with the 1.4 TC and it was about the same as the 500mm PF. So kept it and switched but could easily have stuck with the 500mm PF.

 

[toomanycanons]

Hope he gets back to us when he has

 

[AwesomeIan]

My $0.02

The AF and ISO on the Z8 are a big step up from the D500. Also you can shoot twice as fast in RAW (20fps). Also, you already have glass for the D500 which can be adapted to the Z8. I used a 500mm PF on my D500 and now use it on the Z6 III. It works great on the Z mount.

 

[Krish6102]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.

I am a bird photographer. The D500 was my primary camera from 2018 to 2023. In June 2023 I moved from the D500 to the Z8 - bought one of the first cameras that were available. About one and half years of usage now.
In June 2023 there were no equivalent Z mount APS-C bodies available. Today the Z-50 II will fulfil the needs of those wanting to stay in the APS-C space. You should check that out too.

I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

When you say "I have seen that it improved a lot" did you actually try it out or are you quoting online talk?

My Experience : before Firmware 2.0 the focus performance was less effective than desired. After that FW update the camera is fantastic. New cameras have that update already loaded.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

One of the first things I had to "unlearn" and re-learn after making the switch from the D500 to the Z8 was that most of the ISO parameters I considered important while shooting with the D500 were simply not applicable to shooting on a full frame Z body. Lot of that has to do with the construction of the body

In the DSLR era Nikon had the most deeply recessed (inside the body) sensor situated in an aperture opening that was the smallest diameter of the big three - Sony Canon & Nikon. In the Z construction they flipped this - Nikon now has a sensor right in front of the largest aperture opening compared to the other two manufacturers.
Consequently, the amount of light reaching the Z sensor has increased hugely. That also changed what ISO levels mean in the Z environment.

Practically that means : where I was reluctant to go beyond (say) ISO 3200 for a particular picture I can now, on my Z8, routinely do ISO 10,000 or more for the same picture.
That is not to say there is no noise. Noise levels now tolerate much higher ISO figures before they become unmanageable. Add to that mix the recent development of excellent NR software like LR's own NR and DXO Pro - wildlife / birders are better off now than ever before.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

Finally, I realize what I said above is not the most scientific way to put it, but hopefully it makes sense to those who are looking for specific answers in real world usage.

 

[John Jennings]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

I never had the D500. I had the D7100 and realize it was not in the same league. Now I have the Z7, Z8, Z50, and Z50ii.

The Z8 and Z50ii have equivalent AF performance for the work you describe even though the Z50ii does not have IBIS. The Z50ii is a huge leap forward from every other Nikon APS-C camera I have heard of, simply because it uses the same Expeed7 chip as the Z9 and Z8.

This is from last weekend, shooting handheld from a ferry (it was in the dock so wasn’t rolling with waves).



Another:



With the Z8, a few weeks ago:


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14 at 840mm.


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14 at 840mm.


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14.

Great images!

 

[john isaacs]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

Sony now has pre-capture raw in the latest A9 and A1. Nikon has pre-capture jpg only in the Z9, Z8, Z6iii and Zf.

That said, the Z8 is much better than the D500. Even in cropped mode.

 

[Bill Ferris]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you.

The ability to be quiet has been the #1 benefit to me of migrating from a D500 to a Z9. Wildlife aren't aware of my presence and birds are more tolerant of me now that they can't hear me.

Notable improvement in both autofocus performance and burst rate has been the next biggest upgrade. That's followed by the enhanced customization potential of the Z camera, the benefits of an EVF experience, and access to Z-mount lenses.

The 180-600mm zoom is a great lens to pair with a Z8 for birds. Down the road, you'll have the option of adding a 600mm or 800mm PF, lenses neither Sony nor Canon can match.

 

[phgordon]

For fun I reviewed my D500 images. First, ISO is not even close. Yes, topaz helps the D500. With the Z9 for wildlife shutter speed is a much more important factor than ISO in terms of optimal setting. The D500 tracked nicely, but no comparison to the Z9 with up to date firmware. Pre capture is another Z feature that is very useful to convert bird on stick to BIF. You will kick yourself for not making the transition sooner.

 

[PLShutterbug]

Another:

With the Z8, a few weeks ago:

Great images!

Thanks!