Switch from D500 to Z8. Help!

[argupovv]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

 

[ghostfox_1]

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

The AF is fine. Anyone complaining usually would rather fight it and whine than learn about it.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

It's going to be the same, give or take. IBIS doesn't change anything about shooting at higher shutter speeds.

 

[SteveCooper]

I had a D500 - loved the AF on it and it was a stellar performer for BIF and wildlife. I traded it in to get a Z8.

As far as AF on my Z8, I find myself having to switch AF modes depending on the situation. That's something I RARELY had to do on my D500.

Having said that, the Z8 is an incredible camera and given study and practice, I am sure you will grow to love it. If you don't put in the time, you will be frustrated- don't expect the Z8 to work like the D500- they are two different beasts.

Regarding "noise", do you use Topaz? I've gone back into my archives and resurrected photos from my very noisy old Sony DSC-F828 Cybershot camera with excellent results. I seriously don't worry about noise anymore. I shoot at higher ISOs than I would have never attempted prior to using Topaz.

 

[argupovv]

What I mean is that by having body stabilization, you can shoot al lower speeds without having moved images, instead of forcing even more the ISO, what eventually will produce noisy images.

 

[skyrunr]

The Z8 (and lenses) is in a whole different league than the D500. Without knowing more about your history, examples/results, if you sell, print, or just present your work online, we could not offer the best advice. Only you will know if the investment is going to be worthwhile or not. If you have any major hesitation it is probably more of a financial one than anything else. Or as in my case you really like what you already have. I'd compare the decision with replacing a reliable 7 year old car.

As a former Sony shooter (A7R's, A7C, A7CII, A7IV, A9-II,) there is A LOT more to consider than specs on paper. I'm not going to write or hash all that out here as I know better, but I'll just say that I'm quite happily back with Nikon.

• There's a learning curve going mirrorless, so hold onto both as you transition.
  
  
• The Z8 is a huge investment compared to what you already own, and I would generally prefer a Z9 with telephoto lenses, and would just for the battery life.
  
  
• The Z50II and Z6III are great cameras that will more often than not capture better photos than the D500. There will always be a few conditions where the D500 will have an advantage, but that decreases with every firmware update. NOTE: I picked up a Z50 just to see if I liked shooting mirrorless before getting a Z7II.
  
  
• Most of us THINK we're just going to happily just keep using our f-mount lenses, but then after acquiring a few lenses, move towards the z-mount glass. Adapting f-mount lenses isn't for everyone.

Good luck!

 

[ghostfox_1]

What I mean is that by having body stabilization, you can shoot al lower speeds without having moved images, instead of forcing even more the ISO, what eventually will produce noisy images.

Ibis is also much less impactful at long focal lengths. If you're at 600+, I'd guess it basically does nothing for you.

 

[twomonts1]

I got the D500 the 1st day it was released and shot with it exclusively for years, loved that camera, at the time it was the best camera I ever owned. I now have had the Z8 for over a year and a half. In my opinion there is nothing the D500 could do that the Z8 does just as good or in most cases better, some things much better. I gave my D500 to a nephew who I got into photography and have absolutely no regrets just shooting with the Z8. I had some real good f-mount glass, sold it all, I buy nothing but Z-mount glass now. I use mostly full frame on the Z8, but am satisfied when I do use Dx mode on the Z8 with the photos I get. I have never looked back, the Z8 is the best camera I have ever owned.

 

[TheSoaringSprite]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

The Z8 autofocus compared to the D500 is most definitely noticeably better. If I had one way to describe the Z8, it's that it just gets out of your way and makes your life easier. The keeper rate is phenomenal. At this point I don't sort through photos based on sharpness, but rather based on composition. Why? Because about 90-95% of them end up being spot-on.

Is it perfect every single time? No,... but you have full control over that. Subject detect for birds and humans is very good, but some subject's eyes are harder to follow than others. Animals with dark fur and covered eyes are likely going to be a bit of an issue, for example.

If you don't find the subject detect feature reliable for a particular subject, you can always turn it off and use the camera the way you would a D500, except that you can now move your focus points anywhere in the frame. You're not stuck in the middle for composition. The 3D tracking is also very good, much better than on the D500. It's what I use most of the time.

Long story short, the Z8 is a few steps up from the D500 IMO. The keeper rate will be higher if you learn to adjust your settings properly.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

The image quality in DX mode is going to be about the same. However,... you do have 45 megapixels to fill, vs. 20 megapixels with the D500.

I never shoot in DX mode. Some people shoot JPEG, they don't want to bother post-processing RAW files, and they may prefer to use DX mode for time and hassle-saving reasons. Personally I don't mind putting the time into PP. I have cropped into some of my shots to equivalent D500 size, but most of the time I try to fill the frame as best as possible. The 180-600mm is going to help you do that.

Depending on your budget, the Nikkor Z 800mm f/6.3 VR S is also an excellent piece of glass that's about the same size and weight as the 180-600mm! You will definitely find yourself filling the frame with that lens, if you ever decide to go for it. I find myself having to back away to fit the subject in the frame.

Long story short, the Z8 is a big step up from the D500 in almost every single way except battery life. You'll be able to create images with the Z8 that wouldn't be possible with a D500. When I moved to the Z8, that's what I came to realize. Some of the things I can do with this camera, I wouldn't be able to do with my DSLRs.

It's not just about the higher ISO performance or crop mode. You'll get shots with the Z8 that you wouldn't have been able to get with the D500. Even if the IQ was slightly lesser in DX crop mode, you'd make up for it in many other areas.

If you want to see some (or too many) samples, you can check out my Z8 + 180-600mm gallery at this link.

Also, here's my Z 800mm + Z8 gallery, if you're curious about results and possibilities.

A few quick samples shot with the 180-600mm:















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Dream Source Studio | Photography by J.P.

Welcome to Dream Source Studio, home to sports, wildlife, event, travel & landscape photography. Need help improving your own skills as an aspiring photographer? Check out the new photography tips section or feel free to e-mail me with your questions!

www.dreamsourcestudio.com

 

[PLShutterbug]

What I mean is that by having body stabilization, you can shoot al lower speeds without having moved images, instead of forcing even more the ISO, what eventually will produce noisy images.

If you shoot birds that are stationary then yes - IBIS helps a bit more than just lens stabilization alone. But eventually subject movement, particularly the abrupt movement from small birds, takes away from clarity in a way that no stabilization can help. VR helps with camera shake, not subject movement.

 

[PLShutterbug]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

I never had the D500. I had the D7100 and realize it was not in the same league. Now I have the Z7, Z8, Z50, and Z50ii.

The Z8 and Z50ii have equivalent AF performance for the work you describe even though the Z50ii does not have IBIS. The Z50ii is a huge leap forward from every other Nikon APS-C camera I have heard of, simply because it uses the same Expeed7 chip as the Z9 and Z8.

This is from last weekend, shooting handheld from a ferry (it was in the dock so wasn’t rolling with waves).



Another:



With the Z8, a few weeks ago:


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14 at 840mm.


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14 at 840mm.


Z8, Z 180-600 + TC14.

 

[LastLapPass]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

You will need to learn either system & it will result in the same pictures Sony or Nikon. The AF is equivalent too, they both do some things a tiny bit better.

It’s Not the Camera That’s the Problem | Thom Hogan

Does the term "hit rate" have any meaning?

www.zsystemuser.com

The more important thing are ergonomics. If you have been using a D500 the Z bodies will have a far smaller learning curve.

I rented a Sony and it was like I did not know how to take a picture. They just do things different & I did not want to learn new after shooing Nikon since my N8008 (1990).

JJ

 

[Ricardo00]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

Sorry haven't read all the replies. I made the switch from D500 (which I loved and used since it was introduced), first to the Z9 and then the Z8 (my first full frame cameras). Several advantages for me were the higher fps, the pre-capture and the ability to do video by using the view finder. You mention zoom lenses which are pretty much equal, but there are some distinct differences in primes. For me, the Nikon 800mm PF lens is great for some of my wildlife photos. That said, I am envious of the really light Sony 300mm f/2.8. But then again, you can use your older Nikon lenses on the Z8. So both choices would be an improvement over the D500 but not as much as getting better subjects in front of your camera (ie. a wildlife trip to a place with great animals).

 

[skyrunr]

You can adapt that 300f2.8 to any Z with the Megadap ETZ21 pro.

 

[argupovv]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

 

[skyrunr]

I want to add that 45mp Nikon JPG's are really nice for near SOOC shooting. You can also shoot HLG/HEIF and split the difference between JPG and RAW/NEF. Unfortunately, Adobe isn't letting us use all of the enhance/denoise features on HEIF's yet. You'll have to keep using a plug-in.

 

[Ricardo00]

You can adapt that 300f2.8 to any Z with the Megadap ETZ21 pro.

Looks intriguing though some of the reviews say it is tight and hard to get off and on with the Z8? Have you had any such problems?

 

[Ricardo00]

I have a hate-love relationship with the D500. I've had it for almost 8 years, and it's a really nice camera, BUT it has issues that have been producing me headaches. I didn't mention this, because all the cameras I'm talking about (sony or nikon) are mirrorless, but I do a lot of hide photography. The shutter sound of the D500 is terrible, it usually flushes away any bird that you could have near of you. This is the main reason of wanting to get a new camera, but being that said, I'm searching the best model possible around my budget of 2800-3000€. A prime lens isn't in my plans, because very often I take pictures below 500mm, so I need a more versatile lens, and it's out of my budget. I've been using the sigma 150-600 C, and I'm pretty happy with the pictures I've got (I've uploaded some of them in my gallery).

Thanks!

I know that one of the "selling" points of mirrorless is the lack of noise when shooting but haven't really found that it makes that much difference. Just the act of picking up my camera (even if I try to do it slowly) seems to spook some birds and animals (nothing to do with the noise of the shutter/mirror). And sometimes the shutter slap causes animals to look your way. Again I am happy to have switched to mirrorless but it isn't "earth shattering", if there is an interesting scene in front of one, then one can get shots with both.

 

[skyrunr]

You can adapt that 300f2.8 to any Z with the Megadap ETZ21 pro.

Looks intriguing though some of the reviews say it is tight and hard to get off and on with the Z8? Have you had any such problems?

One of the best features of the z-mount is how many lenses you can adapt to it. You want it too be tight to avoid any alignment issues. Megadap recommends (see care instructions/tips on threads here,) not keeping it on the lens or attaching it while attached to a lens, which is slightly annoying. I have the luxury of two bodies, avoid extra lens changes, and changing in the field. If you change lenses more often than most adapting may not be for you.

I still adapt a few lenses that aren't available in Z-mount. Mostly the 20-40f2.8 Tamron. I've also adapted the Sigma 100-400, 70-180f2.8 before it was available, and various primes. I had no trouble with newer G or GM primes. There are a few quirks, and you have to shoot RAW to manually profile the lens in Lightroom Classic.

I've used a few ETZ21 copies, one works but no longer updates, and I have two Neewer adapters. I've also used the Fotodiox adapter, but it doesn't fit the DX bodies due to a slightly thicker plastic cover. The Neewer (a slightly nicer design,) doesn't work with my Samyang 45f1.8.

The overall benefit of the lens selection and TINY form factor are worth it. I also protect myself from expensive mishaps with a third party warranty on the body and more expensive gear.

 

[skyrunr]

Again I am happy to have switched to mirrorless but it isn't "earth shattering", if there is an interesting scene in front of one, then one can get shots with both.

Don't underestimate not having to focus tune with mirrorless. I never realized how many image were back or front focused on my D500 until I went mirrorless.

Since getting the Z6III and Z50II my hit rate is WAY UP. I still have misses, but bursting with the Z7II wasn't nearly as successful as bursting with the Z6III. I will get the shot! I don't totally miss images due to leaving exposure compensation way up/down thanks to the EVF WYSIWYG. Image review is worse on mirrorless if left on as it has to re-read the JPG preview, but leaving it off is a much nicer shooting experience. Using 3D and the full image area to shoot macros (flowers) handheld is a game changer. I was often frustrated with the Z's inconsistency before Expeed7.

There are times when you have to disable mirrorless features such as IBIS, Silent Shutter, image preview, and no infrared flash, but overall most will manage just fine.

 

[Paddler213]

Hi.

I'm a wildlife photgrapher. I wanted to move on and change my Nikon D500 for a while. Since there's no APS-C equivalent camera from Nikon, I've been looking at the Z line, as well as other brands.
I have two options: stay with Nikon, getting the Z8 + 180-600 mm lens, or move to Sony (in that case, I would get a second hand a1 + 200-600 mm lens). The fact is: Nikon is a little bit cheaper, I like its ergonomics more than sony, it has a little bit better low light ISO permformance, it has precapture, and the 180-600 performs a little bit better in terms of stabilization.
The sony is more expensive and old, but has a few mpx more, and it has a better autofocus, although the stabilization issues with the 200-600. Having said that, I'm not sure what to do. My concerns about the Nikon, are two:

First, about the autofocus. We all know that Nikon has struggled quite a lot with AF performance, and not to mention in DSLR cameras. But i have seen that it improved a lot, and I would really appreciate if somebody could tell me about how does it performs.

Second (and this is the mainly one), about the ISO performance. The Nikon D500 is an APS-C camera, which helps a lot in many situations with wildlife because of it's 1.5x crop factor. I've been comparing in DP Review ISO comparision the two cameras, and obiously, the Z8 performs better. My concern if how does the Z8 performs (compared to the D500) in DX cropped mode. At least, it has the advantage to be a camera with 5 stops stabilization, and that helps in dark situations with lower obturation.

So, is there anybody who switched from the D500 to the Z8, and could tell me its feelings and impressions about it?

Thanks!

I went from the D500 to the Z9. For a while the AF settings on the latter were in quite a bit of flux, especially given the multiple firmware updates. It was and can still be confusing, where the D500 was Group AF and fire away.

I don't really think my hit rate has improved with the Z9, as Group AF on the D500 is excellent. I ordered the the Z9 after a long day of BIF out in the marsh. For some reason the blackout really bothered me that day. The other advantages of the Z8/Z9 is the higher frame rate and the FF makes it easier to keep birds in the frame. IBIS and VR aren't really helpul because my type of wildlife shooting typically require high SS anyway.

In summary, I don't think my image quality or AF performance with the Z9 have improved that much over the D500.