jalywol
Forum Pro
I know this is the wrong forum for this, but people over the past few years have been occasionally asking here about what computers will work with the AI based de-noise and sharpen programs that a lot of M43 users find very useful.
Macs have had some "neural engine" technology for a number of years now, making them very speedy and the gold standard, as it were, for zippy processing of AI based image adjustments. But, a lot of people do still use PCs, and those really required a rather ample GPU and memory to slog through AI functionality without bogging down hopelessly.
The thing is, GPUs for PCs , with the appropriate oomph, are not small, are relatively expensive, and they require substantial cooling, which means they are not usually found in anything but either desktops or large laptops. If you really wanted high level Image processing in a small laptop computer, Macs were still the best choice.
Now, a couple of years ago, Snapdragon came out with an ARM processor that was perfect for small computers and could do fast neural type image processing (Snapdragon Elite X). For a bunch of reasons, while it did exactly what it was advertised to, there are things about it that are not quite ready for prime time (compatibility with some x86 architecture software being one of them, as it has to run it in emulation vs native on those programs).
Both MS and Adobe have made significant software updates so that their (at least much of their) programs will run very well on the ARM architecture. But not everything is there yet. But the potential is very good...a 14" laptop without a separate GPU that can run Photoshop's AI features? And runs cool, with good battery life?
I figured this would be a rather large wake-up call for Intel, as their integrated graphics have really been anemic in past, which made finding a small laptop with an effective GPU for image processing had become an exercise in futility. And, here was a competitor (other than an Apple) that had managed what Intel had not....
(The next part is an early adopter saga, so you can skip over it if you want
)
Anyway, a year ago my 6+ year old, integrated graphics, Core i5 13" Samsung laptop pretty much waved the white flag at any image processing with any AI features, so I decided to take a chance on one of the Snapdragon machines. Got a 14" HP with the Snapdragon Elite X processor, and it was very nice. But things being what they are at the moment, I didn't use it a lot, so I didn't get a chance to really put it through a thorough comparison with the big Core i7 desktop with the beefy GPU.
Fast forward a bit, and a few weeks ago I decided I needed to really get my act in gear and set everything up and work with it. Turned on the machine, no problems; it needed a Windows update because I hadn't used it in a month or so; downloaded that; no problems. Poked around on it for a bit, then went to make dinner. Came back about an hour later, and it's off. Push the power button to wake it up, and....nothing. WTH? Finally got it to give me its error code blinks, and it was "SEND ME TO HP, I AM DEAD". Uh, ok. FORTUNATELY, it was still under warrantee. It will be back sometime this week, but I have no idea what failed. I suspect it was the motherboard, actually, from the beep code, but who knows. (I will call them and find out if the paperwork doesn't have the info, once it gets back).
Well, this does not inspire great confidence. So I did a bit of looking around when I was in Best Buy a few days after that, and thought the Samsung laptops (I am still quite fond of the old one I have, by the way) looked really good, so I got the specs and looked them up when I got home.
(Saga is done, conclusion follows: )
Turns out Intel actually must have gotten alarmed by the threat of ARM (LOL), as their most recent chips, with onboard graphics, are actually capable of doing AI computing in things like Photoshop, DXO, Topaz, without pain. So, even though the Samsung I was looking at did not have a dedicated, separate, GPU, the horsepower (brain power, maybe, actually?) is there with the on-chip GPU and it can, indeed, process AI image manipulation without making you need to go out for coffee while you wait for it to finish.
In any case, from my first tests with it today, Deep Prime is very fast, Adobe's AI processing is measured in seconds, not minutes, and Topaz is also quite fast. This is a huge improvement from any Intel integrated graphics hardware that I have used in the past. (When I get the HP back, I will do some comparisons also, just to see how the ARM and Intel stack up next to each other).
So, the long and short of it is, if you are looking for a laptop computer that is not a Mac, but you want to be able to do image processing that uses AI technology, and don't want to go hog-wild looking for a laptop with a mondo GPU, there are options out there now that will do the job.
More to follow, when I work with them more.
-J
Macs have had some "neural engine" technology for a number of years now, making them very speedy and the gold standard, as it were, for zippy processing of AI based image adjustments. But, a lot of people do still use PCs, and those really required a rather ample GPU and memory to slog through AI functionality without bogging down hopelessly.
The thing is, GPUs for PCs , with the appropriate oomph, are not small, are relatively expensive, and they require substantial cooling, which means they are not usually found in anything but either desktops or large laptops. If you really wanted high level Image processing in a small laptop computer, Macs were still the best choice.
Now, a couple of years ago, Snapdragon came out with an ARM processor that was perfect for small computers and could do fast neural type image processing (Snapdragon Elite X). For a bunch of reasons, while it did exactly what it was advertised to, there are things about it that are not quite ready for prime time (compatibility with some x86 architecture software being one of them, as it has to run it in emulation vs native on those programs).
Both MS and Adobe have made significant software updates so that their (at least much of their) programs will run very well on the ARM architecture. But not everything is there yet. But the potential is very good...a 14" laptop without a separate GPU that can run Photoshop's AI features? And runs cool, with good battery life?
I figured this would be a rather large wake-up call for Intel, as their integrated graphics have really been anemic in past, which made finding a small laptop with an effective GPU for image processing had become an exercise in futility. And, here was a competitor (other than an Apple) that had managed what Intel had not....
(The next part is an early adopter saga, so you can skip over it if you want
)Anyway, a year ago my 6+ year old, integrated graphics, Core i5 13" Samsung laptop pretty much waved the white flag at any image processing with any AI features, so I decided to take a chance on one of the Snapdragon machines. Got a 14" HP with the Snapdragon Elite X processor, and it was very nice. But things being what they are at the moment, I didn't use it a lot, so I didn't get a chance to really put it through a thorough comparison with the big Core i7 desktop with the beefy GPU.
Fast forward a bit, and a few weeks ago I decided I needed to really get my act in gear and set everything up and work with it. Turned on the machine, no problems; it needed a Windows update because I hadn't used it in a month or so; downloaded that; no problems. Poked around on it for a bit, then went to make dinner. Came back about an hour later, and it's off. Push the power button to wake it up, and....nothing. WTH? Finally got it to give me its error code blinks, and it was "SEND ME TO HP, I AM DEAD". Uh, ok. FORTUNATELY, it was still under warrantee. It will be back sometime this week, but I have no idea what failed. I suspect it was the motherboard, actually, from the beep code, but who knows. (I will call them and find out if the paperwork doesn't have the info, once it gets back).
Well, this does not inspire great confidence. So I did a bit of looking around when I was in Best Buy a few days after that, and thought the Samsung laptops (I am still quite fond of the old one I have, by the way) looked really good, so I got the specs and looked them up when I got home.
(Saga is done, conclusion follows: )
Turns out Intel actually must have gotten alarmed by the threat of ARM (LOL), as their most recent chips, with onboard graphics, are actually capable of doing AI computing in things like Photoshop, DXO, Topaz, without pain. So, even though the Samsung I was looking at did not have a dedicated, separate, GPU, the horsepower (brain power, maybe, actually?) is there with the on-chip GPU and it can, indeed, process AI image manipulation without making you need to go out for coffee while you wait for it to finish.
In any case, from my first tests with it today, Deep Prime is very fast, Adobe's AI processing is measured in seconds, not minutes, and Topaz is also quite fast. This is a huge improvement from any Intel integrated graphics hardware that I have used in the past. (When I get the HP back, I will do some comparisons also, just to see how the ARM and Intel stack up next to each other).
So, the long and short of it is, if you are looking for a laptop computer that is not a Mac, but you want to be able to do image processing that uses AI technology, and don't want to go hog-wild looking for a laptop with a mondo GPU, there are options out there now that will do the job.
More to follow, when I work with them more.
-J
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