'roof' option for diffuser

sanosai

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My macro rig: A7RIII + Sony 90mm + TT350S (single)

Having tried different approaches for the most challenging part (diffusion!), I m currently seeing some much better results with this type of diffuser:



77f9c786dbf94dfc8c34c58a711e09a5.jpg

Having practised for some time with this specific diffuser, I wonder if I can get even better results or at least more 'keepers'

The vendor of this diffuser also offers a roof option, which sits on top of the above diffuser (with some strap support) and promises even more uniform light distribution



ba71626909af4fa9b10a64e48ae77876.jpg

Now, just for reference (and for image copyright purposes..), this is the implementation for the Pope shield. But my question is vendor independent and goes to any advanced macro shooter who has experience shooting with/without a 'roof'

Does the roof really make a noticeable difference? Do you get consistently better lighting for your subjects? Vast majority of my shooting is in the 1:1 range, so really closeup, but yet again this is what those diffusers are made for - ideally you have to engulf the subject so that there's light everywhere, and very few shadows/dark areas

I m involved with macro for just over 3 years now, but still can't quite understand fully the ways of the light. If there is no roof, when the flash is firing, light that can 'hit' the diffuser is the usable one. But surely there is an amount of light (not sure if I can quantify it somehow..) which is just 'lost'. This is how I understand it. So logically at least, having a 'roof', which is basically an inner reflector should at least in theory create a 'light dome' within which light is abundant and uniform. That is why the diffuser/roof comes into different versions, to accommodate for the size of the lens and how tall the flash is. If the flash unit is too tall and cannot be tilted downwards, then there will be a lack of usable light hitting the diffuser. My TT350S tilts few degrees downwards, but still I feel that sometimes I could have more light towards the edges (diffuser part closer to the lens)

One downside of having a roof for sure - is the added bulk. Even with just the diffuser attached, sometimes I have to struggle to get close to the subject and have to manoeuvre around branches, twigs etc. Sometimes there is no room to do that - which means I either have to settle for a lesser shot - or lose a shot altogether. Adding a roof not only will make things worse in that respect but will also obstruct my view towards the subject

So for me having or not having a roof is not about the price as much as it is about practicality vs light improvement gain. So, what do you think? Does it worth it?
 
I have not used that particular setup but have tried many setups over many years. I would suggest the main difference would be getting more light on the subject. Some light will bounce off your diffuser (in the pic) and head of into outer space. A roof will bounce it back onto the diffuser and more light will end up on the subject. I don't think the quality of light will change much but you may be able to turn the flash power down a little and hence get a shorter flash duration. It may be that your setup with no roof creates a hot spot near the centre of the diffuser and a roof may give a more even light distribution but a hot spot may still remain, but less so. Taking an image of the setup in a mirror can show up hotspots. You may have turn the flash to a low setting. It may be that firing the flash into the roof would give a better spread of light over the diffuser. It may also be worth trying different amounts of zoom on the flash (assuming the flash has that feature). I have found over the years experimentation is the best way to observe the effects of changing the setup. Just for interest, I ended up with this setup that uses a bare bulb that fills the reflector with light which then focuses most of the light forwards. I am not suggesting this is for everyone but it shows my thinking on light.

So I think a roof may give a little more light on the subject and may give a a more even distribution of light over the diffuser. How much of a difference it would make I would not like to say.

2c2534789b2b42f8acf292fc24542e81.jpg

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https://paulstickley.com/insects-and-close-ups
 
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Is the roof worth it? Not for me. You gain one stop of light, at best 2. One particular area where this matters is focus stacking. For example the Godox V350, when set to 1/32 power, can fire hundred or more flashes without any delay (5 flashes a second on my Oly EM1.2).

Doing 5 flashes a second would probably be a lot easier with a roof on a popeshield. Or you can pick a higher ISO and do it without roof. I don't bother for the time being (but I also have the AK).

Bas
My macro rig: A7RIII + Sony 90mm + TT350S (single)

Having tried different approaches for the most challenging part (diffusion!), I m currently seeing some much better results with this type of diffuser:

77f9c786dbf94dfc8c34c58a711e09a5.jpg

Having practised for some time with this specific diffuser, I wonder if I can get even better results or at least more 'keepers'

The vendor of this diffuser also offers a roof option, which sits on top of the above diffuser (with some strap support) and promises even more uniform light distribution

ba71626909af4fa9b10a64e48ae77876.jpg

Now, just for reference (and for image copyright purposes..), this is the implementation for the Pope shield. But my question is vendor independent and goes to any advanced macro shooter who has experience shooting with/without a 'roof'

Does the roof really make a noticeable difference? Do you get consistently better lighting for your subjects? Vast majority of my shooting is in the 1:1 range, so really closeup, but yet again this is what those diffusers are made for - ideally you have to engulf the subject so that there's light everywhere, and very few shadows/dark areas

I m involved with macro for just over 3 years now, but still can't quite understand fully the ways of the light. If there is no roof, when the flash is firing, light that can 'hit' the diffuser is the usable one. But surely there is an amount of light (not sure if I can quantify it somehow..) which is just 'lost'. This is how I understand it. So logically at least, having a 'roof', which is basically an inner reflector should at least in theory create a 'light dome' within which light is abundant and uniform. That is why the diffuser/roof comes into different versions, to accommodate for the size of the lens and how tall the flash is. If the flash unit is too tall and cannot be tilted downwards, then there will be a lack of usable light hitting the diffuser. My TT350S tilts few degrees downwards, but still I feel that sometimes I could have more light towards the edges (diffuser part closer to the lens)

One downside of having a roof for sure - is the added bulk. Even with just the diffuser attached, sometimes I have to struggle to get close to the subject and have to manoeuvre around branches, twigs etc. Sometimes there is no room to do that - which means I either have to settle for a lesser shot - or lose a shot altogether. Adding a roof not only will make things worse in that respect but will also obstruct my view towards the subject

So for me having or not having a roof is not about the price as much as it is about practicality vs light improvement gain. So, what do you think? Does it worth it?


--
Bas
 
hi, for me a roof is a must if you want to do stacks or take quick repeated shots, otherwise probably not worth it.

You could build your own out of white/silvered card - white one side silver the underside, you can get it from hobby shops (or in my case i raid the wifes craft room)
 

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