Really need some help with my SB800..

[fuggy]

I have been shooting gymnastics for a year with my D50 where no flash is allowed. I realized the value of fill flash when I began to look at portrait shots of my daughter. So, I jumped in and bought the SB800 with a bit of excitement. However, I am having troubles.

Now, without flash I completely understand everything about my camera and how to dial in the settings for proper exposure. I am testing the unit with the 18-55 kit lens and I have tried to shoot in all modes and only get this type of result.



Here is the full exif. It is almost like the camera and the speedlight are not connected. The lcd seems to reflect accurate data and the flash does fire off. I have a feeling that this is operator error and I hope somebody can help me figure this out.

I took the speedlight off and tried to take the same picture with the on board flash and viola. So, there is definitely some user error somewhere. I just can't find where.

[Image]
Make = NIKON CORPORATION
Model = NIKON D50
Orientation = top/left
X Resolution = 72
Y Resolution = 72
Resolution Unit = inch
Software = Capture NX 1.3.0 W
Date Time = 2007-12-21 15:59:18
YCbCr Positioning = centered
Reference Black White = [0/1, 255/1, 0/1, 255/1, 0/1, 255/1]
Exif IFD Pointer = Offset: 278

[Camera]
Exposure Time = 1/60"
F Number = F5.6
Exposure Program = Aperture priority
Exif Version = Version 2.2
Date Time Original = 2007-12-21 16:51:46
Date Time Digitized = 2007-12-21 16:51:46
Components Configuration = YCbcr
Exposure Bias Value = ±0EV
Max Aperture Value = F5.28
Metering Mode = Pattern
Light Source = Flash
Flash = Flash fired, auto mode, return light detected
Focal Length = 45mm
Maker Note = 5911 Byte
User Comment =
Subsec Time = 0.70"
Subsec Time Original = 0.70"
Subsec Time Digitized = 0.70"
Flashpix Version = Version 1.0
Color Space = Uncalibrated
Exif Image Width = 800
Exif Image Height = 531
Sensing Method = One-chip color area sensor
File Source = DSC
Scene Type = A directly photographed image
CFA Pattern =
Custom Rendered = Normal process
Exposure Mode = Auto exposure
White Balance = Manual white balance
Digital Zoom Ratio = 1x
Focal Length In 35mm Film = 67mm
Scene Capture Type = Normal
Gain Control = None
Contrast = Normal
Saturation = Normal
Sharpness = Normal
Subject Distance Range = unknown

[Thumbnail Info]
Compression = JPEG Compressed (Thumbnail)
X Resolution = 72
Y Resolution = 72
Resolution Unit = inch
JPEG Interchange Format = Offset: 6977
JPEG Interchange Format Length = Length: 553

[Thumbnail]
Thumbnail = 160 x 106

[MakerNote (Nikon)]
Makernote Version = 0210
ISO Speed Used = 400
Quality = RAW
White Balance = FLASH
Sharpening = AUTO
Focus Mode = AF-S
Flash Setting = NORMAL
Auto Flash Mode = Optional,TTL (this looks suspicious to me)
White Balance Bias Value = 0

White Balance Red, Blue Coefficients = 23984375/10000000, 133984375/100000000, 1/1, 1/1
000D = 00, 01, 06, 00
Exposure Diff = C6, 01, 0C, 00
ThumbOffset = 5905
Flash Compensation = 00, 01, 06, 00
ISO Speed Requested = 400
0017 = 00, 01, 06, 00
AE Bracket Compensation Applied = 0EV
001D = D50
Tone Compensation (Contrast) = AUTO
Lens Type = Nikon D series Lens
Lens Min/Max Focal Length, Max Aperture = 18/1, 55/1, 35/10, 56/10
Flash Used = 7
Auto Focus Area = 00, 00, 00, 01
Bracketing & Shooting Mode = 1
Colour Mode = MODE3a
Lighting Type = SPEEDLIGHT (we know that it can see it)
Hue Adjustmen = 0
Noise Reduction = OFF
Total Number of Shutter Releases for Camera = 10935
Image optimisation = NORMAL
Saturation = NORMAL
Digital Vari-Program =
0E09 = Capture NX 1.3.0 W

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/

 

[morris]

That is a very good black. Don’t print it, you will use an entire ink cartridge!

Rather than debugging your problem, I’m going to suggest a few settings to get you going.

For flash as primary light:
Manual exposure mode
Shutter speed 1/125
Aperture as you desire for DOF.
Spot or matrix metering
Flash set to TTL

Note that the wider your aperture (smaller number) the greater your flash range will be and if your subject is close the less power will be needed. Note that if you want to avoid dark or black backgrounds that the exposure with out flash controls this.

For flash as secondary light (fill flash)
Manual exposure mode or aperture priority
Set exposure for ambient light
Set flash for TTL-BL

Watch out for your minimum shutter speed if shooting in aperture priority as in dark conditions if you need a slower shutter speed than the minimum shutter speed, you will get underexposure.

Morris

--



http://qcpages.qc.cuny.edu/~morris/POD

 

[fuggy]

Morris,

Those are some good technique suggestions but I think mine is a camera problem. As I said, I can take the speed light off and use the onboard with no problem. it is just the speedlight that is producing these ink jet killing images. I cannot figure it out. I have tried every setting on both the camera and flash and I have shot in every mode at every aperture. I fear that if I cannot get an answer here then I will have to bring it into the shop. Blast! Right before xmas, the reason I bought the speed light!

Thanks for the suggestions though. Really appreciate it.

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/

 

[David314]

Here is the full exif. It is almost like the camera and the
speedlight are not connected.

it looks like the camera thinks it fired

i wonder if it really did

i had a flash that went bad and it was frustrating because it slowly went bad and sometimes would fire and sometimes not and well, you would see those nice black scenes

i would say the flash is not really firing and it should

does it work on manual?

David

 

[fuggy]

Does not work in any mode. It is firing though. Looks like a trip to the camera store is on my agenda tomorrow morning.

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/

 

[pavi1]

Here is what your picture looks like with D lighting so we know your camera is taking a picture.
What is the mode on the back of the flash when you take a picture?
Options are TTL-BL, TTL, AA, M, RPT
Is that a mirror on the wall? Is this the only scene that you have tried?



--
Everything happens for a reason. #1 reason: poor planning

 

[fuggy]

I have gone all over the house shooting different things in different lighting. The camera and flash are in TTL mode. One thing that I notice is that the distance meter is now not showing up and the flash zoom is off, rather it has the M over zoom. I have gone through the sb settings and turned this off but it still shows up.

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/

 

[Will64]

Have you tried resetting the flash? I had the same problem with my SB-800 when I first got it a couple of years ago. I called Nikon Tech Support and they had me reset the flash and it fixed the problem. I never did figure out what caused the problem, nor have I been able to reproduce it. To reset it, hold down the Mode & On/Off buttons for about 2 seconds.

Outside of that, a frequent mistake I make with the pop-up flash that causes this problem is to have it in commander mode instead of TTL, but I don't think this would affect the SB-800 when it's mounted. But with the SB-800 make sure it's not in Master (rpt) or a wireless mode where you see Group and Channel settings on the display.

--Will
------

 

[pavi1]

I have gone all over the house shooting different things in different
lighting. The camera and flash are in TTL mode. One thing that I
notice is that the distance meter is now not showing up

The only mode in which I can make the distance go away is AA and that is with a 1.4 lens wide open.

and the flash
zoom is off, rather it has the M over zoom.

If you have the diffuser on the flash it will read M and 14mm. If the diffuser is off you can make the M go away by pressing the zoom button. You will need to try both directions as it matters from which point you start.

Are you 100% sure you have a full set of hot batteries. The flash has no battery indicator other than it takes longer for the ready light to come on. Your pictures will gradually get darker as the batteries get near dead. You will still see the flash fire even when it is too weak to light the picture.

 

[glhid]

If you have taken a lot of pictures looking for the problem, it probably isn't the batteries--but it's worth checking them anyway. I had this exact same behavior this afternoon due to dead batteries--the display was okay and the flash appeared to fire, but it wasn't producing enough output to light the scene. (It did beep at me, however.)

 

[Horacio Borromeo]

Morris, I stumbled on this thread and your tip caught my attention. It works great!! Thanks mucho. I will be experimenting to see the difference when using center-weighted versus spot metering. I seem to recall reading somewhere that matrix metering is not a good idea when using flash but (prior to reading your tip) I'd been using matrix metering and not seeing it to produce inferior results to center-weighted metering. I also noticed (while experimenting with your tip) that the flash leaves backlight mode when I switch to spot metering. Hmm. Wonder what Nikon's logic is.

I'm sure I've read similar advice as yours but yours is the most straightforward yet.

Many thanks and Merry Christmas to you and your loved ones. And may the new year bring you great photographs.

All the best,

Horacio

 

[gisle]

You say it is firing - but is the main flash firing, or just the pre-flash?

Things to try:

• Test it in manual (so there is no pre-flash).
• Fire straight into a mirror - justa faint glow indicates commander mode - a significant blown out-area around the flash indicates a working flash.)

--

• gisle [ http://folk.uio.no/gisle/album/ ]

 

[fdevyatkin]

I second the weak battery theory. I experienced the same thing, put fresh batteries in and solved the issue.
--
http://www.flickr.com/photos/fdevyatkin/

 

[been missing out]

When my batteries got weak it didn't beep or anything as I thought it should. I got the same results as you have here. I tried manually pumping up the power, adjusting the ev value, everything I could think of before I thought of the batteries. Perhaps if they were just charged they are too old?
Good luck with it keep us posted.
--
Happy hunting,

C J

 

[pavi1]

Horacio Borromeo wrote:
I also noticed (while experimenting with

your tip) that the flash leaves backlight mode when I switch to spot
metering. Hmm. Wonder what Nikon's logic is.

In spot metering TTL-BL is not available. BL is balanced fill-flash. The camera tries to balance exposure of the main subject and background. Spot on the subject leaves the camera with insufficient information to try to balance the background.

 

[lee lindquist]

This happend to me when too many successive, high-power flashes
burning out the speedlight.

Hopefully, your problem is something else.

 

[fuggy]

Went to the camera store and they tested the unit. Turns out it was bad. He put a new unit on a d200 at the store, fired off a flash and viola, great picture! Took the unit home and fired off a couple of test shots and, bummer, same results. So that tells me it is user error. I don't understand. TTL is selected on both speed light and in camera. Flash is set to rear curtain, M mode, 1/125 shutter, f 5.6.

Subject about 6 feet away.



I don't know where to turn now.

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/

 

[lee lindquist]

test shots and, bummer, same results. So that tells me it is user
error. I don't understand. TTL is selected on both speed light and
in camera. Flash is set to rear curtain, M mode, 1/125 shutter, f
5.6.

Turn on the SB800

Press the 'Mode' button a few times until "TTL" is displayed in the top
left corner of the display.

Then, try it that way.

 

[racer4ever]

You said that the new flash unit which the store gave you worked in the store on their D200, but not on your camera at home? That would make me suspect that there is some problem with the hot-shoe of your camera.

Maybe you could bring in YOUR camera to the store and have them take a look at it. Good luck, and I hope you get it figured out!
--

“Photography takes an instant out of time, altering life by holding it still.” -Dorothea Lange

 

[fuggy]

I brought my camera in but they were too busy to spend any time with me. In fact, the guy was kind of a jerk. I am thinking the same thing about the hot shoe cause i have never really protected it. I guess that I could take it in for service.

--
Gymnastics Dad with a Camera.

Nikon D50
Nikon 85mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 50mm f1.8 AF
Nikon 18-55mm AF-S DX
Nikon 70-300mm Zoom

And lest we forget my trusty Panny FZ50!

http://public.fotki.com/fugfuggy/