Panasonic's "WOW-EEE!!" GH6 Sensor and Processor

[Tom Caldwell]

The first hint of big things to come was the official "5.7K p60 10-bit video capability" - for frame size of 5472 x 3088 px, 16.8MP - twice 4K's. That's one huge data throughput @ p60, along with 10-bit 4K p120 HFR/VFR video. Two new video power landmarks for m4/3.

The leaked 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 px actually is wide enough to shoot 6K 16:9 , and it doesn't seem a big processor challenge to shoot that @ 30p, with frame size just a couple MP's over the 5.7K's 16.8. And that leak included a 100MP Hi-res figure.

Another leak: 1) "Rolling shutter eliminated" 2) "AF tracking 5X better than GH5's" Which may be called DFD-AI.

Promising to be an interesting month for a (according to some) dead system. Tomorrow the OM Systems camera and one week later the GH6. Very curious especially about the latter.

Where did you see those specs? If they are true, the OM System’s new camera may get a hard time..

why ? they will have the same sensor and processor like previous models.

Ds

According to the OP the Lumix has a 25mpx sensor. Which would be a surprise given previous sensor announcements from Sony, but nice if true. We know that the OM systems cam has a 22.9/20mp effective resolution sensor.

I think that the comment might have been a bit obscure - that if the OM-1 was much the same as the E-M1iii which was a pretty good camera (agreed) then the OM-1 would also be a great camera. All wow aside.

Re-trim and a makeover of the firmware and it can be a quite desirable camera.

Im going with the gh6 and om1 will use the same sensor same as the gh5 and em12.

Ds

Interesting for Panasonic “nuts” is if the GH6 uses the PDAF capabilities if the same sensor is used.

Dare Panasonic change direction with their CDAF? But of course PDAF with already great CDAF capability hitched on for the ride would be interesting.

Much like how Panasonic did their own thing with lens IS despite the Olympus IBIS juggernaut. Then surprised the industry with their own IBIS and hitched their existing lens IS to it to provide dual stabilisation. They still keep using lens IS with new lens launches.

This means that non-IBIS cameras such as the GM series bodies can have some stabilisation with Panasonic lenses where stabilisation is most needed.

Could it be that the GH6 is also incorporating the G9 update?

 

[Tom Caldwell]

The first hint of big things to come was the official "5.7K p60 10-bit video capability" - for frame size of 5472 x 3088 px, 16.8MP - twice 4K's. That's one huge data throughput @ p60, along with 10-bit 4K p120 HFR/VFR video. Two new video power landmarks for m4/3.

The leaked 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 px actually is wide enough to shoot 6K 16:9 , and it doesn't seem a big processor challenge to shoot that @ 30p, with frame size just a couple MP's over the 5.7K's 16.8. And that leak included a 100MP Hi-res figure.

Another leak: 1) "Rolling shutter eliminated" 2) "AF tracking 5X better than GH5's" Which may be called DFD-AI.

Promising to be an interesting month for a (according to some) dead system. Tomorrow the OM Systems camera and one week later the GH6. Very curious especially about the latter.

Where did you see those specs? If they are true, the OM System’s new camera may get a hard time..

why ? they will have the same sensor and processor like previous models.

Ds

According to the OP the Lumix has a 25mpx sensor. Which would be a surprise given previous sensor announcements from Sony, but nice if true. We know that the OM systems cam has a 22.9/20mp effective resolution sensor.

I think that the comment might have been a bit obscure - that if the OM-1 was much the same as the E-M1iii which was a pretty good camera (agreed) then the OM-1 would also be a great camera. All wow aside.

Re-trim and a makeover of the firmware and it can be a quite desirable camera.

Im going with the gh6 and om1 will use the same sensor same as the gh5 and em12.

Ds

Interesting for Panasonic “nuts” is if the GH6 uses the PDAF capabilities if the same sensor is used.

Dare Panasonic change direction with their CDAF? But of course PDAF with already great CDAF capability hitched on for the ride would be interesting.

Much like how Panasonic did their own thing with lens IS despite the Olympus IBIS juggernaut. Then surprised the industry with their own IBIS and hitched their existing lens IS to it to provide dual stabilisation. They still keep using lens IS with new lens launches.

This means that non-IBIS cameras such as the GM series bodies can have some stabilisation with Panasonic lenses where stabilisation is most needed.

Could it be that the GH6 is also incorporating the G9 update?

Talking 25mp for the GH6 sensor so perhaps it is a different one. Intel’s purchase of Tower Jazz at about the same time as the GH6 (delayed launch) might suggest a Tower-Jazz sensor inside and perhaps some seriously revolutionary new science in this sensor.

All speculation of course but the wait is not that long delayed.

 

[TomFid]

Im going with the gh6 and om1 will use the same sensor same as the gh5 and em12.

Ds

Well, that prediction didn't last long!

 

[Gnine]

Once you get to about 1/400 sec SS, I think it becomes unnoticeable. I think the Z9 E shutter is not even that fast, & there's no complaints about that.

Shouldn't 1/250 about equal the rolling shutter of a mechanical shutter? Or maybe the shutter curtains move faster than the flash sync to leave some margin?

You're probably correct. I'm just trying to remember something I read years ago, didn't understand it properly then, and forgotten the rest

 

[Dspider]

Im going with the gh6 and om1 will use the same sensor same as the gh5 and em12.

Ds

Well, that prediction didn't last long!

why ? the quad sensor can be programmed to shoot 8k and is a video centric sensor will be interesting the next few days. its actually an 80 meg sensor

Ds

 

[Richandhiscat]

Im going with the gh6 and om1 will use the same sensor same as the gh5 and em12.

Ds

Well, that prediction didn't last long!

why ? the quad sensor can be programmed to shoot 8k and is a video centric sensor will be interesting the next few days. its actually an 80 meg sensor

Ds

You've not seen the Lightroom screenshots that show a resolution from a 25mp sensor then?

 

[Gnine]

The first hint of big things to come was the official "5.7K p60 10-bit video capability" - for frame size of 5472 x 3088 px, 16.8MP - twice 4K's. That's one huge data throughput @ p60, along with 10-bit 4K p120 HFR/VFR video. Two new video power landmarks for m4/3.

The leaked 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 px actually is wide enough to shoot 6K 16:9 , and it doesn't seem a big processor challenge to shoot that @ 30p, with frame size just a couple MP's over the 5.7K's 16.8. And that leak included a 100MP Hi-res figure.

Another leak: 1) "Rolling shutter eliminated" 2) "AF tracking 5X better than GH5's" Which may be called DFD-AI.

Promising to be an interesting month for a (according to some) dead system. Tomorrow the OM Systems camera and one week later the GH6. Very curious especially about the latter.

Where did you see those specs? If they are true, the OM System’s new camera may get a hard time..

Chris, this was a compilation of things coming up in "4/3 Rumors". The hard spec that requires a larger sensor is the 5.7K p60 video as the old sensor is only 5.4K width.

I've had a long interest in numerical relationships, and deduced that Panasonic's 16:9 1K unit is not 1000, but 960 - half of a 2K (1920 px) frame width. 4K is exactly 4X this at 3840.

So our "old" sensor is 5184 px wide. Divide this by 960 px and you get precisely 5.4K - too small for the new 5.7K video promised : 5.7 X 960 = 5472px wide.

So IF the new 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 is right, a 16:9 6K video frame is 6 X 960 = 5760 px wide - and fits like a glove with 16 px to spare. For the frame height, simply multiply this by (9/16 = .5625) and you get 3240. So a 5760 x 3240 = 18.66MP 6K frame size.

Remember the GH5 and G9 "Photo 6K" ? In 4/3 ratio, it measures, from the manual, 4962 x 3744 = 18.58MP - essentially identical in total pixels to the 16/9 6K version above - and worthy of the name, shooting at 30 fps, with sound track.

Thanks, appreciate the explanation/logic!

My thoughts on that, while reading: If the 5.7K is the highest resolution requirement actually mentioned/promised, the sensor would have enough if it delivers 5472x4104 in 4:3, or slightly less if they round e.g. 5.67K to 5.7K.

And if it would be 25Mp, it could deliver 6K, so why not advertise that in that case?

In any case, I'm very curious what it will deliver in the end. A last year published product information sheet of a new Sony M43 sensor (IMX472-AAJK) indicated 5280x3956, which is not enough for 5.7K, and following your logic is just 5.5K, lets see what we'll get!
Also wondering if they can use a bit more than the 'effective' pixels of the sensor, as DXO already gives me more than the effective resolution of the 20Mp sensors, somewhat depending on the lens used.

It may not even be a Sony sensor. And hasn't there been official confirmation that it will shoot 5.7K? Pretty sure I've read that somewhere.

Yeah, I did https://www.panasonic.com/global/consumer/lumix/g/gh6.html

"It is absolutely the flagship of the LUMIX G Series and the latest model of the GH line, which is renowned for its stunning mobility and innovative video performance. Combining the high-speed sensor and Venus Engine image processor, the new GH6 realizes next-generation video expression. Providing 4:2:2 10-bit DCI 4K/60p recording capability*2, the LUMIX GH6 achieves unlimited video recording when the camera is used under the certified operating temperature*3. It is reliable enough to record continuous footage for a desired duration. It also provides a 10-bit 4K 120p High Frame Rate (HFR) and Variable Frame Rate (VFR) for high resolution slow/quick motion video. Moreover, the GH6 records 10-bit 5.7K 60p video by taking full advantage of the newly developed Micro Four Thirds sensor."

 

[ChrisFB]

The first hint of big things to come was the official "5.7K p60 10-bit video capability" - for frame size of 5472 x 3088 px, 16.8MP - twice 4K's. That's one huge data throughput @ p60, along with 10-bit 4K p120 HFR/VFR video. Two new video power landmarks for m4/3.

The leaked 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 px actually is wide enough to shoot 6K 16:9 , and it doesn't seem a big processor challenge to shoot that @ 30p, with frame size just a couple MP's over the 5.7K's 16.8. And that leak included a 100MP Hi-res figure.

Another leak: 1) "Rolling shutter eliminated" 2) "AF tracking 5X better than GH5's" Which may be called DFD-AI.

Promising to be an interesting month for a (according to some) dead system. Tomorrow the OM Systems camera and one week later the GH6. Very curious especially about the latter.

Where did you see those specs? If they are true, the OM System’s new camera may get a hard time..

Chris, this was a compilation of things coming up in "4/3 Rumors". The hard spec that requires a larger sensor is the 5.7K p60 video as the old sensor is only 5.4K width.

I've had a long interest in numerical relationships, and deduced that Panasonic's 16:9 1K unit is not 1000, but 960 - half of a 2K (1920 px) frame width. 4K is exactly 4X this at 3840.

So our "old" sensor is 5184 px wide. Divide this by 960 px and you get precisely 5.4K - too small for the new 5.7K video promised : 5.7 X 960 = 5472px wide.

So IF the new 25MP sensor size of 5776 x 4336 is right, a 16:9 6K video frame is 6 X 960 = 5760 px wide - and fits like a glove with 16 px to spare. For the frame height, simply multiply this by (9/16 = .5625) and you get 3240. So a 5760 x 3240 = 18.66MP 6K frame size.

Remember the GH5 and G9 "Photo 6K" ? In 4/3 ratio, it measures, from the manual, 4962 x 3744 = 18.58MP - essentially identical in total pixels to the 16/9 6K version above - and worthy of the name, shooting at 30 fps, with sound track.

Thanks, appreciate the explanation/logic!

My thoughts on that, while reading: If the 5.7K is the highest resolution requirement actually mentioned/promised, the sensor would have enough if it delivers 5472x4104 in 4:3, or slightly less if they round e.g. 5.67K to 5.7K.

And if it would be 25Mp, it could deliver 6K, so why not advertise that in that case?

In any case, I'm very curious what it will deliver in the end. A last year published product information sheet of a new Sony M43 sensor (IMX472-AAJK) indicated 5280x3956, which is not enough for 5.7K, and following your logic is just 5.5K, lets see what we'll get!
Also wondering if they can use a bit more than the 'effective' pixels of the sensor, as DXO already gives me more than the effective resolution of the 20Mp sensors, somewhat depending on the lens used.

It may not even be a Sony sensor. And hasn't there been official confirmation that it will shoot 5.7K? Pretty sure I've read that somewhere.

Yeah, I did https://www.panasonic.com/global/consumer/lumix/g/gh6.html

"It is absolutely the flagship of the LUMIX G Series and the latest model of the GH line, which is renowned for its stunning mobility and innovative video performance. Combining the high-speed sensor and Venus Engine image processor, the new GH6 realizes next-generation video expression. Providing 4:2:2 10-bit DCI 4K/60p recording capability*2, the LUMIX GH6 achieves unlimited video recording when the camera is used under the certified operating temperature*3. It is reliable enough to record continuous footage for a desired duration. It also provides a 10-bit 4K 120p High Frame Rate (HFR) and Variable Frame Rate (VFR) for high resolution slow/quick motion video. Moreover, the GH6 records 10-bit 5.7K 60p video by taking full advantage of the newly developed Micro Four Thirds sensor."

Yes, so that was my point: 5.7K is confirmed (although they may have rounded-up and it could be slightly less, I guess). So, I suspect the sensor is nog going to deliver 25Mp as that would allow a 6K video. Still, it requires more than the standard 20Mpx sensor, unsless they upscale of course, or trick it in another way (strange definitions of 5.7K for ex.)