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Nobody uses the Ax in MANUAL mode?

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Comming from a background of an XD11, the first camera with S mode ... i mostly shoot my A1 in S mode... but that is because i mostly shoot people, mostly in low light situations. i set it at about 1/20s, and let the A1 adjust aperture, and then ISO to always get that speed. i generally find that i can catch useable, non-subject blurred images using this S mode approach. Of course i shoot raw ... as i get a lot of high ISO shots like this. AFAIK the A1 does not have real analog multipliers, so there is really no point even bothering with the ISO controls, just set the slowest speed you can afford and maybe use the exposure compensation to force narrower apertures.

When i am out doors in good light - i switch to A mode, with aperture 5.6.

When i am shooting something where i have plenty of time to retry, eg the Moon, i use M mode.

i really, really, hope the A3 will finally be a replacement for my A1 in my low light venues. The Sony R1 makes me very hopeful. As of now, nothing touches the A1 when it comes to ergonomics + low light performance.
--
http://public.xdi.org/=greg.heil
 
I really agree with you, and as I already said, I'll try the other modes. When I wrote this last post, I was trying to sum up things in a rather radical way, only to confront my point of view with your opinions.

One more thing, please don't see me as someone who just wrote this topic to say that the M mode is better. I'm totally open minded about my A2 and the best ways to use it, and I could easily switch to A mode if I saw it was "better" to me.

Best regards
José Ramos
 
I also always start with the aperture value and then go for the shutter speed.

I find that, except in sunny outdoors, if I want to use ISO 64 to avoid noise, the limiting factor will always be the aperture value, and I'll have to increase it to the maximum that gives me an acceptable shutter speed that avoids camera blur.

If the A2 gave me ISO800 or ISO1600 without noise, than I'd probably use A mode metering every time, as I wouldn't have to worry with the shutter speed, because it would be always fast, and I'd not worry with camera shake.
 
Funny. Nobady notice that this image is far above dinamic range response of A1 camera. In fact I use 5 differend image to achieve this effect :-) For this one i need (believe or not) 8 :-):

 
Very interesting discussion, indeed! :-)
DigitalDick said:
Feri,
In A, S or P on both my A200 and my D7ug, as I change the f stop or
shutter speed settings the EVF doesn't change UNTIL I press the
shutter release down halfway to lock in the focus. Then if I change
the compensation setting, the EVF does get brighter or darker.
However, this doesn't happen until I get a focus/exposure lock. In
manual mode the EVF brightens or darkens before I press the shutter
release halfway down.
This allows me to see the image that the sensor will capture long
before I commit to taking a picture. I think this is an advantage
over and beyond what A, S and P do.
****
Click to expand...
So, ****, on the A2 I do not have to release the shutter halfway down in P, A and S modes, but still the EVF changes brightness as I pan with the camera. While, in M more nothing changes. I could explain this behavior of the camera by saying that in P, A and S modes the internal metering is enabled, thus resulting in the change of brightness as seen on the EVF brought about by the camera's ability to change the non-fixed parameter (Shutter speed in A mode, aperture in S mode and both shutter speed and aperture in P mode.)

And when I switch to M mode everything becomes completely manual, i.e. the internal metering mode will be disabled resulting in no change of brightness on the EVF till I touch either the shutter speed dial or the aperture dial.

But in your explanation the A200 and the D7ug both work the other way around.

Now I'm confused! :-) Especially in M mode when metering is disabled I don't get the clue what makes the A200 and the D7ug EVF change brightness?

Care to explain? ;-)

--
Cheers, Feri

'I can look at a fine photograph and sometimes I can hear music. Ansel Adams.'
 
larsbc said:
Probably because if the camera has focused on something, it can
then use the distance measurement to further figure out the
appropriate aperture/shutter speed to use. The camera can still
figure out a good shutter/aperture combo w/o knowing the distance,
but with that info, it can make a more informed guess.
Click to expand...
These digital cameras use the so called "passive AF" method where the camera looks for a contrasty part of the subject the crosshair is amined at. So, in this regard distance measurement in not involved at all, or in other words the camera does not know how far the object is, it only looks for the biggest contrast in adjacent pixels, then when it finds it, it will activate the AF motor to move the lens and locks it.

Passive AF systems therefore can never be used for measuring distance!

Moreover, I do not see how distance measurement would have effect on shutter/aperture settings. AFAIK, it's the amount of available light that is the input information the camera needs to know when setting shutter speed and aperture values, once again reardless of the distance factor.

Care to comment? ;-)

--
Cheers, Feri

'I can look at a fine photograph and sometimes I can hear music. Ansel Adams.'
 
Ferenc MOGOR said:
These digital cameras use the so called "passive AF" method where the camera looks for a contrasty part of the subject the crosshair is amined at. So, in this regard distance measurement in not involved at all, or in other words the camera does not know how far the object is, it only looks for the biggest contrast in adjacent pixels, then when it finds it, it will activate the AF motor to move the lens and locks it. Passive AF systems therefore can never be used for measuring distance!
Click to expand...
"Passive AF"? What's that? Contrast AF i understand. AFAIK contrast AF is perfectly useable for distance judgment: The camera after all moves the focus to achieve the focus lock ("focus by wire"), and knows exactly how far it moved it. The D lenses, use distance encoders to make this easy. Non D lenses, have to know where they start from, hence they usually home to either infinity or near focus on startup. In either case they can know it and indeed report it in the EXIF, according to Dalibor. KM may not be willing to pass the info on to its flash system ... but that may have more to do with marketing more expensive lenses than the uselessness of the information.

i presume the GT is a D lens? Dunno, but i sure wish they would report the FL and focal distance on screen!!
Ferenc MOGOR said:
Moreover, I do not see how distance measurement would have effect on shutter/aperture settings. AFAIK, it's the amount of available light that is the input information the camera needs to know when setting shutter speed and aperture values, once again regardless of the distance factor.
Click to expand...
Agreed ... except when flash is involved.
--
http://public.xdi.org/=greg.heil
 
gheil said:
"Passive AF"? What's that? Contrast AF i understand. AFAIK contrast
AF is perfectly useable for distance judgment: The camera after all
moves the focus to achieve the focus lock ("focus by wire"), and
knows exactly how far it moved it.
Click to expand...
gheil,

Please don't confuse AF (auto-focus) with manual focus! ;-)

Manual focus is the one that uses "focus-by-wire".

Here's how it works:

Even though the focus ring is rotated manually it is not actually connected to the focus mechanism. The ring just gives electrical impulses to the focus motor to move the lens. The wire in this case means an electrical wire.

And, yes, in Manual Focus mode the camera does give a reading of the distance on the EVF/ LCD. Although it's another question how accurate it is!! :-)

--
Cheers, Feri

'I can look at a fine photograph and sometimes I can hear music. Ansel Adams.'
 
Feri

Well of course they are BOTH "focus by wire" it is just that the wire comes from two different places. In the case of manual - from the manual ring. In the case of AF - from the focusing logic.

Very few systems use "active focus". An example would be laying down a laser grid and using that to focus. Finding contrast in a scene is one of the major mechanisms in Image Processing to obtain depth of field. So Both "passive" AF systems (contrast and the specialized sensors of dSLRs) can generate depth of field and hence distance. All that is needed is an absolute: usually obtained by "homing" the focuser - though in the case of D lenses there is an encoder and the homing step can be skipped. Ie all you need is an origin and how far you are from the origin, all available to any system that focuses by wire, as opposed to being directly mechanically controlled by the user.
--
http://public.xdi.org/=greg.heil
 
I don't know how the Minolta engineers managed to get the A200 and the D7 to change brightness in the EVF in Manual mode but I very grateful that they did. It would have been nice if they added that feature in A, S and P mode as well as they apparently have done in the A2.

Does the A1 work the same way as the A2 or is it like the A200? At least now I understand why the A2 users find A, S and P so attractive though I must admit I'm glad the A200 does it in M mode.
****
 
Ferenc MOGOR said:
Ferenc MOGOR said:
Probably because if the camera has focused on something, it can
then use the distance measurement to further figure out the
appropriate aperture/shutter speed to use. The camera can still
figure out a good shutter/aperture combo w/o knowing the distance,
but with that info, it can make a more informed guess.
Click to expand...
These digital cameras use the so called "passive AF" method where
the camera looks for a contrasty part of the subject the crosshair
is amined at. So, in this regard distance measurement in not
involved at all, or in other words the camera does not know how far
the object is, it only looks for the biggest contrast in adjacent
pixels, then when it finds it, it will activate the AF motor to
move the lens and locks it.
Click to expand...
The method of focusing doesn't really matter, as long as the lens has distance information encoded into it, and I wouldn't at all surprise me if the GT lens had this ability.
Ferenc MOGOR said:
Moreover, I do not see how distance measurement would have effect
on shutter/aperture settings. AFAIK, it's the amount of available
light that is the input information the camera needs to know when
setting shutter speed and aperture values, once again reardless of
the distance factor.
Click to expand...
True, but then consider the fact that you have different program modes (sport, portrait, scenic, etc). Why? Because the choice of shutter/aperture hinges are more than just the amount of available light. The question of which aperture setting to use can often include a consideration of the distance. You could assume, just from knowing the focal length and distance whether you'd want to use a wider aperture or a smaller aperture.

As I said, knowing the distance wasn't required, but it could make a more informed guess with that info.

larsbc
 
Ah! so that's why I keep using the shutter half press, the old SLR meter activation routine. That makes sense.

Hugh
 
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