m43 camera with Phase detect AF

[DomD]

I like the m43 format. It is large enough to produce good quality images, but at the same time, small enough to allow to use (much) smaller lenses. The 1" sensor goes a little too far in terms of size and you have to give up too much shallow DOF capabilities. Again, I am left with the m43.

But most of the m43 camera only use contract detect AF (except the EM1 which is too big is too expensive for me).

Has anyone heard about a camera that would have AF speed of either a Sony a6000 or a Nikon 1 V3. Something that can track fast but with an m43 sensor so I can have good images with small zoom lenses.

The Sony looks pretty good until you start putting on it a 18-200 mm zoom. Then the lense is so large that why bother to have a small camera at all.

The Nikon is nice but then it gets harder to produce images with shallow DOF.

An m43 camera can have lenses that are about 1/2 the size of a APC camera (14-140mm vs 18-200mm) while still producing fairly shallow DOF images.

Dominique

 

[alcelc]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

 

[Ontario Gone]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Chris Nickels from The Camera Store did a review comparing EM1/GH4/A6k/XT1. The Sony did well but it didn't beat the GH4 in any AF speed test, and if i remember the EM1 did better in the actual tracking test than the Sony. The A6k is good enough that many won't ever notice a difference between the two, but the lenses are where it is lacking. Still, if we are being fickle, MFT flagships have faster AF. No comparison yet against Nikon 1.

 

[sylon]

GH4 is even bigger than the EM1. OP wanted a small camera.

 

[Promit]

GH4 is even bigger than the EM1. OP wanted a small camera.

If he's lucky, the EM5 successor or the E-P6 whenever it's created. But that's little more than hope that Oly's high end tech will work its way down the line. Frankly, they may not be planning to. Same applies to Panasonic's other bodies.

For small bodies with high speed AF, it comes back to the A600, newly announced A5100, or Nikon 1.

 

[Ontario Gone]

GH4 is even bigger than the EM1. OP wanted a small camera.

If he's lucky, the EM5 successor or the E-P6 whenever it's created. But that's little more than hope that Oly's high end tech will work its way down the line. Frankly, they may not be planning to. Same applies to Panasonic's other bodies.

For small bodies with high speed AF, it comes back to the A600, newly announced A5100, or Nikon 1.

Can't speak for Olympus, Panny is said to be planning it in all bodies. They already put DFD into the FZ1000, which isn't even an ILC. Word is it's going into Panasonic's P&S, superzooms, and ILC. For now it is the 3 you mention above, but that may change soon when the next Panasonic non GH camera comes out. Be it a GX8 or Gm2, with DFD it will offer another lower cost body with blazing fast AF.

--
"Run to the light, Carol Anne. Run as fast as you can!"

 

[Fredrik Glckner]

I have tested the GH4 vs Nikon 1 V3 in terms of continuous AF during video recording, at 60 FPS:

http://m43photo.blogspot.fi/2014/07/af-comparison-lumix-gh4-vs-nikon-1-v3.html

I was surprised to see that the GH4 does almost as good as the V3. I was guessing that the V3 would win, as I have previously seen Nikon 1 cameras beating M4/3 in this respect previously.

But it appears that the DFD in GH4 actually does work.

 

[FujLiver]

I like the m43 format. It is large enough to produce good quality images, but at the same time, small enough to allow to use (much) smaller lenses. The 1" sensor goes a little too far in terms of size and you have to give up too much shallow DOF capabilities. Again, I am left with the m43.

But most of the m43 camera only use contract detect AF (except the EM1 which is too big is too expensive for me).

Has anyone heard about a camera that would have AF speed of either a Sony a6000 or a Nikon 1 V3. Something that can track fast but with an m43 sensor so I can have good images with small zoom lenses.

The Sony looks pretty good until you start putting on it a 18-200 mm zoom. Then the lense is so large that why bother to have a small camera at all.

The Nikon is nice but then it gets harder to produce images with shallow DOF.

An m43 camera can have lenses that are about 1/2 the size of a APC camera (14-140mm vs 18-200mm) while still producing fairly shallow DOF images.

Dominique

Contrast detect is more accurate then phase detect, I would choose it every time

The e-m1 is actually not so big but it is not cheap

Try the newest 4/3s like the e-m10 or gm1 and you will see the focus is very fast

 

[agachart]

I like the m43 format. It is large enough to produce good quality images, but at the same time, small enough to allow to use (much) smaller lenses. The 1" sensor goes a little too far in terms of size and you have to give up too much shallow DOF capabilities. Again, I am left with the m43.

But most of the m43 camera only use contract detect AF (except the EM1 which is too big is too expensive for me).

Has anyone heard about a camera that would have AF speed of either a Sony a6000 or a Nikon 1 V3. Something that can track fast but with an m43 sensor so I can have good images with small zoom lenses.

The Sony looks pretty good until you start putting on it a 18-200 mm zoom. Then the lense is so large that why bother to have a small camera at all.

The Nikon is nice but then it gets harder to produce images with shallow DOF.

An m43 camera can have lenses that are about 1/2 the size of a APC camera (14-140mm vs 18-200mm) while still producing fairly shallow DOF images.

Dominique

i guess new body from oly&panny will include

new predict AF software. em1 was only one hybrid AF.

 

[Peter 1745]

I like the m43 format. It is large enough to produce good quality images, but at the same time, small enough to allow to use (much) smaller lenses.

But most of the m43 camera only use contract detect AF (except the EM1 which is too big is too expensive for me).

Me to

Has anyone heard about a camera that would have AF speed of either a Sony a6000 or a Nikon 1 V3. Something that can track fast but with an m43 sensor so I can have good images with small zoom lenses.

Not yet available.

Mirrorless camera's with just CDAF have fast and accurate S-AF (single-autofocus). PDAF cameras have no advantage in speed and can be less accurate.

When it comes to C-AF (continuous-autofocus) most of the current mirrorless cameras are at a disadvantage and have slower and less predicable C-AF than DSLRs.

Olympus address the issue on the E-M1 by using on sensor PDAF.

Panasonic have gone another route using DFD (Depth from Defocus) technology. A good explanation can be found at Imaging Resource.

At the current time predictive and fast and accurate C-AF aren't available on the majority of mirrorless cameras. This will change. It only took a couple of years for the performance of mirrorless S-AF to go from barely adequate to lightening fast.

I predict that

1. Mirrorless cameras released in 2015 will have improved but not class leading C-AF
2. 2016's mirrorless cameras will have C-AF that is as good as, or better than, current PDAF

Be patient. You will get what you want but not yet.

--
Regards,
Peter
'Keep taking the photos'

 

[danieladougan]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

 

[alcelc]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

Although both Pany and Oly are the major supporters of M43 system, there are still unavoidably sort of competition between the players.

While DFD becoming more wide used, as per a recent thread on this tropic, it appears to me that it's merit is more obvious on video shooting (might reduce AF hunting on video more effectively than non DFD). Regarding some users' general opinion on DFD's improvement in AF tracking for still, I have not feel very obvious benefit like that in video yet (might be limited by my own poor skill in this respect :-( ).

 

[brianric]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

the 40-150/2.8 works fine with my GX-8.

 

[danieladougan]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

the 40-150/2.8 works fine with my GX-8.

But does it track moving subjects well?

 

[brianric]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

the 40-150/2.8 works fine with my GX-8.

But does it track moving subjects well?

You decide.

2015 MS Bike to Bay Day 2 Finish Line - brianric

Brian Richards Photo Shoots

www.brianric.com

2016 MS Bike to Bay Finish Line - brianric

Brian Richards Photo Shoots

www.brianric.com

 

[danieladougan]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Unfortunately DFD only works with Panasonic lenses, which can be limiting. My Olympus 40-150mm f2.8 PRO lens does not appreciate that.

the 40-150/2.8 works fine with my GX-8.

But does it track moving subjects well?

You decide.

http://www.brianric.com/Multiple-Sclerosis--Events/2015-MS-Events/2015-MS-Bike-to-Bay-Day-2/

http://www.brianric.com/Multiple-Sclerosis--Events/2016-MS-Events/2016-MS-Bike-to-Bay-Finish/

Great photos. But without DFD, it must have been more difficult to do subject tracking with the Olympus lens than a Panasonic lens, right?

I mean I CAN get some fast action shots on my E-PL5, but the hit rate is pretty low.

I haven't really shot bicycle events before, but it feels like it would be one of the easier sporting events to shoot because everyone is going along a fairly predictable path. How would that compare with, say, a soccer match or birds in flight? I've struggled with both of those on my E-PL5.

 

[Max Iso]

The DFD of GH4, despite unlike EM1 having on sensor PDAF detector, its pure CDAF actually could tracking a bit better than EM1.

PDAF is better for tracking but the gap is closing. In term of non tracking, Panny is more accurate, least at par if not faster than top DSLRs.

Are you sured A6K is faster than M43? From other good members here, I understand A6K's focusing speed has been greatly improved from its siblings, but still not as good as M43s. Nikon has claimed that AF of it's 1's series could match with its DSLRs, as there was not much discussion here so I 'd no idea.

Chris Nickels from The Camera Store did a review comparing EM1/GH4/A6k/XT1. The Sony did well but it didn't beat the GH4 in any AF speed test, and if i remember the EM1 did better in the actual tracking test than the Sony. The A6k is good enough that many won't ever notice a difference between the two, but the lenses are where it is lacking. Still, if we are being fickle, MFT flagships have faster AF. No comparison yet against Nikon 1.