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Let's Talk About Chimping....

  • Thread starter Thread starter Jim Radcliffe
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Dan, I think you may have misunderstood or misinterpreted what this thread was about.. and it was not about you or me or anyone in particular. It was about the subject in my original post, the act of chimping.

Some think it's a bad thing, some think it's good... it really doesn't matter as we all have our own way of working, learning and living.

I don't think anyone ripped you a new one and I certainly do not knock your work. On the contrary I quite appreciate it. I have appreciated the work of film photographers far longer than digital and your work is no exception. I think the Kodachrome Project is a great endeavor.

I made the choice to put down my camera, sell my darkroom equipment and walk away from photography for over 20 years. I did not get back into photography until Canon released the D30. I will probably never go back to film for a number of reasons but I certainly have nothing against those who still love and use it.

I am excited about digital as it has opened a new world for me. When I gave up photography I was tired of the darkroom, chemicals, print dryers, dust specks, safe lights and working in the dark. I no longer have to deal with anything but dust specks on my sensor.

Film seemed to have gotten about as good as it was going to get when I put my camera down. Digital, in just a very short period of time, compared to film, has made incredible advances and I believe it will continue. You can't fault me for my enthusiasm. Photography, whether it is film based or digital, is still about the captured image and in that we all have a commonality.

If you interpreted anything I wrote as bashing you and your choice of medium you certainly have my apology. That was never my intention. And really, more power to you if you can read the light as well as you have stated. You've reached a level that most aspire to but few achieve.

For many of us the chimping is just a way to learn, trial and error, if you will. Some will learn from it and some will simply use it as a crutch. In and of itself, it's not the bad thing that some seem to think it is.
--
Jim Radcliffe
http://www.boxedlight.com
http://www.oceona.com

The ability to 'see' the shot is more important than the gear.... and remember, a camera is a tool, not a religion.
 
... I never said anything about you or your work. In fact I wasn't even thinking about you when I wrote my last post. My last post was really about neither position is right or wrong. There is no right or wrong, there is only difference.

My own work runs the gamut from alternative processes to digital only work using HDR etc. I am fascinated with all forms of photography, and to me the photograph is what is important. I truly think that anything that helps people makes the images they want is a wonderful thing. Personally I only 'chimp' a couple of times when on a shoot, a look at the histogram to see everything is doing what I want and then I don't look at the work until its downloaded. Just the way I worked with Polaroid. If you don't want to chimp, hey I can dig that, and if Jim wants to chimp away to his heart's content I say great.

There are a lot of very talented photographers out there enjoying themselves producing great work, and that is what is important to me.
 
To see a thread on such a moronic topic run so long. But I'll bet a thread on a serious photographic issues about the relation of photography to the other visual arts, the interaction of painting and photography for the last 150 years, postmodern photography, or is Barthes right, would not get 3 responses.

--

'No matter how capable it may be, any camera you have to hold out in front of you like a tourist is not cool.'
Dean Forbes
 
Stovall said:
To see a thread on such a moronic topic run so long. But I'll bet a
thread on a serious photographic issues about the relation of
photography to the other visual arts, the interaction of painting and
photography for the last 150 years, postmodern photography, or is
Barthes right, would not get 3 responses.
Click to expand...
I'm amazed you continue to visit this forum....

So why don't you start such a thread and see if the intellect here is up to it? I doubt it.

The truth is, John, most here probably don't give a sh# t about that kind of cerebral photography discussion. You know this and yet you keep coming back.

I'll say it again, John. If you don't like the content here.. move on to another forum. No one forces you to read anything here. No one forces you to post anything here. Go find another home, John. One with intellect as great as your own and leave us Morons to our own amusement.

--
Jim Radcliffe
http://www.boxedlight.com
http://www.oceona.com

The ability to 'see' the shot is more important than the gear.... and remember, a camera is a tool, not a religion.
 
Ross said:
You seem to have jumped from my "just like film", over the process
into the usual image quality of film vrs. digital fiasco.
Click to expand...
Not at all. I just thought you can really only compare it to having the film automatically processed somewhere - exactly what you said in your last post.

I pushed even slides by up to 4 stops by turning up the scanner gain. The result was a lot like pushing digital raw images and nothing like trying with JPEGs.
 
mean-spiritedness on your part, has it?

I thought Stovall made a fair & valid comment. What about it makes you feel threatened? He didn't say you were moronic, he said the topic was. If he'd used the word silly would that have ameliiorated your reply?
This nasty righteousness seems so typical of the Leica forum. Depressing.
jp

--
I like making pictures.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/inframan
 
inframan said:
mean-spiritedness on your part, has it?
I thought Stovall made a fair & valid comment. What about it makes
you feel threatened? This seems so typical of the Leica forum.
Depressing.
jp
Click to expand...
Threatened? Please, get serious.. nothing in this forum is a threat to me or anyone else.

Actually my comment to John is not typical of the Leica forum. John enjoys Leica photography on a different level than most.. He has, in the past, made comments that have been counterproductive and even been banned for such.

John and I have a history of butting heads. I disagree with much of what John says. I don't like his attitude and I think John would be much happier elsewhere. I have no personal axe to grind with John but he often crosses a line here and if no one else will challenge him, I will. If that makes me mean-spirited.. I'll wear that title rather than let someone of presumed higher intellect dictate what is and is not written and talked about here.

--
Jim Radcliffe
http://www.boxedlight.com
http://www.oceona.com

The ability to 'see' the shot is more important than the gear.... and remember, a camera is a tool, not a religion.
 
Jim Radcliffe said:
inframan said:
mean-spiritedness on your part, has it?
I thought Stovall made a fair & valid comment. What about it makes
you feel threatened? This seems so typical of the Leica forum.
Depressing.
jp
Click to expand...
Threatened? Please, get serious.. nothing in this forum is a threat
to me or anyone else.

Actually my comment to John is not typical of the Leica forum. John
enjoys Leica photography on a different level than most.. He has, in
the past, made comments that have been counterproductive and even
been banned for such.

John and I have a history of butting heads. I disagree with much of
what John says. I don't like his attitude and I think John would be
much happier elsewhere. I have no personal axe to grind with John
but he often crosses a line here and if no one else will challenge
him, I will. If that makes me mean-spirited.. I'll wear that title
rather than let someone of presumed higher intellect dictate what is
and is not written and talked about here.

--
Jim Radcliffe
Click to expand...
Hi Jim,

I wouldn't apply any descriptives here, but you do need to lower your ISO when it comes to John. Remember it is not "a line" he crosses, but "your line".

IMO, John did make a valid observation and he does contribute to the forum with interesting information. Your resonses to John simpliy says that you are experiencing a steep highlight detail fall off......:-)
--
Bob
 
Ross said:
Hi Jim,
I wouldn't apply any descriptives here, but you do need to lower your
ISO when it comes to John. Remember it is not "a line" he crosses,
but "your line".
IMO, John did make a valid observation and he does contribute to the
forum with interesting information. Your resonses to John simpliy
says that you are experiencing a steep highlight detail fall
off......:-)
--
Bob
Click to expand...
Point taken, Bob. I will do my best.

However, if John doesn't like a thread he certainly doesn't have to participate and since I was the one who started the thread and John referred to it as Moronic.. I felt I had the right to respond, if not an obligation. The thread may be moronic to John but not everyone is of the same opinion.. and yes, I suppose he has the right to refer to it as moronic if he wishes.. but that shows a lack of judgment on John's behalf in my opinion.

John has indicated on a number of occasions that he desired a "higher level" of photography discussion here in the Leica forum, yet he rarely initiates such threads. He prefers to snipe and I find that objectionable.

John is a talented and very knowledgeable guy. I would never say otherwise but he constantly tries to swim upstream. He has, on a number of occasions, indicated his unhappiness with the level of discussion here. If it were me and I was unhappy with the forum (because it's not going to change) I think I would spend my time trying to find a forum more in tune with what it is I wish to discuss rather than making negative remarks here.

Once again, if you don't like a thread, no one will force you to read it. John certainly has the ability to begin his own thread regarding the impact of photography on other media, etc.. and if no one responds that should tell him one of two things... no one is interested or there is not enough intellect to respond to his post.

I think from this point on I will take my own advice and just ignore John's posts if I disagree with them. I'll let others deal with his sniping.

Thanks for the reprimand... and I mean that sincerely.

--
Jim Radcliffe
http://www.boxedlight.com
http://www.oceona.com

The ability to 'see' the shot is more important than the gear.... and remember, a camera is a tool, not a religion.
 
Jim, I've had harsher. I just ignored it. I'm not one of your sensitive new age guys.

Yes, I like swimming upstream. It's like a salmon. It makes you more creative.

--

'No matter how capable it may be, any camera you have to hold out in front of you like a tourist is not cool.'
Dean Forbes
 
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