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Interview with Greg (Fuji guy)

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The Fuji HS10 manual actually say's "optical stabilization (image sensor shift)"...Fuji double talk for optical in sensor perhaps??? However it does seem effective and certainly OIS would seem a unnecessary complication for a 2.33 sensor.
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Fred, KM A2, Canon S90.
'Your best Photo should be viewed with a biased eye'
http://coolsiggy.smugmug.com/
 
15 elements, 11 groups, 3 aspherical elements......and given this quite a lot of people expect really Great image quality.....hmm



well just my humble opinion on this, it sounds much more like an experiment to make a vario lens do huge zoom and wide, and include IS, and cure barrel distortion, and CA also, and,..and,..and... - pure compromise of the main component of IQ - the lens

Cheers!

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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
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First of all I think there is nothing to laugh about, at least not yet...

With no doubts, a 24-720 mil is an extremely large zoom range and is a very tough challenge for any camera manufacture.

It certainly needs compromises, but there are a couple of things that should help to cope with issues such as CA, geometric distorsion, vignetting etc.:
1. mirror-less design enables the lens to be mounted closer to the sensor

2. compared to larger sensor cameras, it's easier for a small sensor to get a big-zoom range and not sacrifice as much IQ, simply because a small sensor can't capture as much light (even a BSI CMOS)

3. the combination of 1. and 2. makes it possible to build an easier/cheaper zoom-lens which can more easily control lens problems and deliver high IQ!

What's also important in this case is to carefully match the lens and the sensor. This has certaily been done throgh the close cooperation between Fuji and their sister company Fujinon.

All in all I'm quite confident that the HS10 will positively surprise most of us!

Cheers!

Roberto, Italy
 
Hi Roberto,

Well you didn't get quite right what I was saying - I was saying that the lens WILL cope with barrel distortion and CA and it will be huge zoom, it is just that each of those things costs a part of the IQ, they do not contribute to IQ unlike many tend to think, they decrease IQ - this is the cost for solving the given issues, for example:

Multi coating - heals direct sunlight flare, decreases sharpness and contrast

CA and BD are solved by different lens structure - this reduces some lines of optical resolution and also it really decreases the marvelous half-tones and colors of simple lens structure (lets say as an example 6 glass planar, or 4 glass tessar developed back in 1896-1900, they cant be matched by any vario lens - simple physics/optics and their focal length to 35mm film/sensor diagonal ratio also is something that rises the IQ, of course they suffer distortions in earlier models)

I agree that on a tiny sensor it is easier and cheaper to make a huge zoom without any R&D costs and also without any significant impact on the image that will be taken with 36MP/cm2 sensor.

Well regarding vignetting - given the 1/2.33" I will be really interested to see any lens vignetting on such crop.

This will be a lens solving CA and BD I hope, and this will be a lens giving huge vario (excuse me zoom) also definitely it will be a lens perfectly matched to the sensor(besides the focal length to sensor diagonal ratio which is dead here) and I don't mean to discourage any future HS10 owners, it is just that I PERSONALLY think that all this will give us a nice compact, but nothing special in terms of IQ.

My regards to you and lovely Italy!

Cheers!
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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
Янко Китанов

 
Hi Yanko,
thanks for your highly professional and very helfull clarifications.

Nonetheless we should'nt forget, in my opinion, that we are talking about a bridge camera worthing $500 as launch price (likely cheaper later on).

That said it's clear it will have IQ limits, but even a DSLR with e.g. a 18-270 tele has it's limits also in terms of IQ (CA, BD and yes PF).
This is the price to pay for a huge focal range I think.

To me, as regards HS10, these limits are largely "softened" by all the features it boasts, last but not least the price...

I know that vignetting is increased with small sensors but a well designed lens with 15 elements or so and with uniform colour dispersion can decrease the difraction effects at the surface of the sensor and reduce the vignetting issue.

We will see Yanko, let's wait for the first reviews hoping that they will dispel our doubts.

Cheers!
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Totally agree with you here - given the price it should be a deal!
And, yes, such a lens will put it's limitations on a dslr too, no doubt.

I am far from being professional, it's just my reaction explanations regarding my laugh to some other posters here(not you definitely) claiming that this cam will have it's features, plus an astonishing good IQ, well it might be a good deal camera, but come on let's keep real about the IQ.

P.S. Actually lenses vignette easier on larger sensors - a lens vignetting on the 5D MkII, will not vignette on a 50D, physics.

Cheers!
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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
Янко Китанов

 
1. Multi coating quite often decreases IQ no matter how strange it sounds to You, and it decreases optical resolution lines too (measured as lines in the center and at the edges), any coating on any lens does more or less, some manufacturers actually issue two types of the same lens - with MC and without it.

2. This question is one I would like not to answer, it is a matter of some photographic education and common sense in physics. You can enjoy a CZ planar lens as an example here ( http://www.zeiss.com/C12571FF00438F7A/0/12CEC086F50E1989C12573D40055917C/ $file/slr_flyer_p_1_4_50_en.pdf select the whole link)

I will not dare to state in the current FTF that it is better than the HS10 lens poor me )))

I can't give you a support on my statement, sorry no one ever compared such things.

It is not reasonable to compare incomparable things pro level primes and zoom lenses, that was not my point, but just an example.

That will not be a reasonable comparison at all, it's like comparing a 911GT3 - designed more than half a century ago and a modern Japanese MPV, I hope you get my point here.

I am not saying zoom lenses are bad, they have their application, but comparing IQ it's just that primes are better and CZ planar is one of the best constructions ever.

Cheers
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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
Янко Китанов

 
Oh, now I get it, they are incomparable therefore it is not reasonable to try to compare them :-)

Poor me, I was actually expecting an answer to my questions in terms of simple physics/optics... Too bad the link does not work.
 
Let's avoid ill temper my friend! Ignorance is not a reason to laugh.

To put the long story short: There is no reason to compare incomparable things as I said - they have different purposes. But I will do this for the especially gifted.
It's like comparing a fish eye to a superzoom although.

Still you are stubborn and do not search the answers yourself. Small advise - Please do Google before asking simple questions.

1. Do some reading before doubting universally known facts. The prime lenses are better due to the optical construction optimized for better quality and not for zooming - and usually they are more expensive, despite the fact that you need several of them to cover the range of a single zoom lens.

The whole theory is too much for a post. Here you have several links to cure ignorance in prime/zoom optics, my advise - read more, knowledge makes you stronger:

http://www.the-digital-picture.com/Canon-Lenses/Zoom-Vs-Prime-Lens.aspx
http://digital-photography-school.com/prime-vs-zoom-lenses-which-are-best
http://blog.fotolia.com/us/issue/zoom-prime_lens.html
http://www.edbergphoto.com/pages/Tip-zooms.html

2. The link to the CZ pdf works, still on DPReview forums you have a maximal link length and this exceeds it - read more carefully as I wrote - Copy the Whole link, attention to detail.

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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
Янко Китанов

 
I think I figured out why uncoated lenses may still sell: their lower contrast softens the picture giving a retro portait look. 'Photoshopping' back in the day. Limit resolution depends on contrast, and isn't helped by this either.
Member said:
Let's avoid ill temper my friend! Ignorance is not a reason to laugh.
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But you don't practice what you preach, do you? ;-)
Member said:
The whole theory is too much for a post. Here you have several links to cure ignorance in prime/zoom optics, my advise - read more, knowledge makes you stronger
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Those weren't exactly my questions. Anyway, apart from not being proofs, it's funny the links you gave seem more to support quite the opposite. But let's keep it here, I don't want to start a 3rd party quote polemic, it could take forever.
Member said:
2. The link to the CZ pdf works, still on DPReview forums you have a maximal link length and this exceeds it - read more carefully as I wrote - Copy the Whole link, attention to detail.
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That's what I did

Cheers
 
neat_image said:
Check this interview out on the HS10 at PMA booth.

To me it's an interesting interview which, among other things, clarifies how the lens is built and how the IS is working...

Enjoy it!

Roberto, Italy
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Thanks for posting that link. I found it very interesting, BUT we must not think that its going to be a superior camera. It may be, let's hope it is. We must await pics OOC not PP, and a couple of reviews.

Arturo
 
Your question was to get a prove why is prime lens IQ better than a zoom lens IQ.

You received an answer, which was basically pointless, still silly me...answering to guys that can only post ill tempered in others' threads and do nothing else, not a single thread started, without a single shot posted and without any contribution showing that they can take photos, or have any idea of photography besides P&S.

Any further discussion will be just a time consuming nonsense - zooms have better IQ than primes for you and I am absolutely OK with this. :)

P.S.

Regarding multi-coating - I see that you did some basic reading on it - good job, still wrong conclusions, or a bad source on the Internet - long way for you to go - it increases the contrast (just in conditions when there is direct light that should be reflected), it decreases optical resolution(measured in lines-check same lenses data-sheets with and without the MC), it shifts colors as it decreases the tones and half-tones registered by decreasing the light reaching through the lens, which makes them look more contrasty (exactly what the multipurpose zoom lens and P&S users need), but resulting worse and poorer colors actually, it decreases lens speed, it increases marginally the needed ISO, etc, etc, etc - good that you started reading buddy, after more reading and a small analysis of what you read you will start getting the right.

Looking forward for some interesting posts and photos from you!

Cheers!
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1/25sec. and thats all...anything can fit in it

Yanko Kitanov
Янко Китанов

 
it works after all, the trick was to copy it from the auto quote mode, otherwise it's truncated...

there's an add to what resembles a double Gauss design. not what I expected, but nice anyway. it has indeed a relatively large f/1.4 aperture.

Often top sharpness requires smaller apertures though, even when downscaled for pinhead sensors image circles, and the diffraction starts to take over.
 
Hi Arturo,

In terms of IQ, I don't think that the HS10 will be a superior camera when compared to any DSLR cameras, but I do believe that it'll be the best among superzoom bridge cameras of the latest generation.
Too confident? Only time will tell...

Cheers!

Roberto, Italy
 
Member said:
Your question was to get a prove why is prime lens IQ better than a zoom lens IQ.
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Some particular old designs, but ok, let's extend the question.
Member said:
You received an answer, which was basically pointless, still silly me...
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Yes, it was more of a rephrasing of the initial statement.
Member said:
answering to guys that can only post ill tempered in others' threads and do nothing else, not a single thread started, without a single shot posted and without any contribution showing that they can take photos, or have any idea of photography besides P&S.
Click to expand...
Well I have a pic of some doves, but I need to get over the emotional impact of your 'Fuji ducks' thread! ;-)
Member said:
Any further discussion will be just a time consuming nonsense - zooms have better IQ than primes for you and I am absolutely OK with this. :)
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I merely asked for a proof based on simple optics, like you said!
Member said:
Regarding multi-coating it increases the contrast just in conditions when there is direct light that should be reflected
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Direct light? Is it so hard to realise that there's nothing special about direct sunlight? It is just light. Just like sun gives visible small ghosts, any light does, even if larger and less obvious. That increases random illumination, so decreases contrast.
Member said:
it decreases optical resolution (measured in lines-check same lenses data-sheets with and without the MC), it shifts colors as it decreases the tones and half-tones registered by decreasing the light reaching through the lens, which makes them look more contrasty (exactly what the multipurpose zoom lens and P&S users need), but resulting worse and poorer colors actually, it decreases lens speed, it increases marginally the needed ISO, etc, etc, etc
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hmm, they're more transparent, so that doesn't sound too logical...
Member said:
good that you started reading buddy, after more reading and a small analysis of what you read you will start getting the right.
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I'll never get it right, it's a never ending quest
Member said:
Looking forward for some interesting posts and photos from you!
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I'm more into the tech stuff, but I did try to get your interest here

PS You know what, on a nice day I may agree with you, there's something special about an old lens, even when cold numbers are against it. Cars and lenses may have a soul after all :-)
 
And no bridge camera was ever close to a dslr, will the HS10 be the best among superzoom bridge maybe and we'll soon find out;)
neat_image said:
Hi Arturo,

In terms of IQ, I don't think that the HS10 will be a superior camera when compared to any DSLR cameras, but I do believe that it'll be the best among superzoom bridge cameras of the latest generation.
Too confident? Only time will tell...

Cheers!

Roberto, Italy
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http://www.pbase.com/spartanwarrior
 
Since (four!) weeks they only can UNBOX the camera - is that all?
Are the members from promotion staff - nothing knowing about cameras?
Ask them about hotdogs or so ....

Did they get only license to unbox ? 0.000007 ?
 
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