I dunno why I cannot fix this (LR-PS colour problem)

[primeshooter]

Experienced shooter and PS user here, but I am totally lost here with this. Suddenly out of nowhere, the colour between LR (fine) and PS is off. I have LR in Prophoto and PS the same, but it's literally more green tinged. I checked that camera raw is updated, and both programs are up to date also but I would appreciate some advice. I tried just about every colour space in PS, including SRGB, but nothing matched what LR is showing in prophoto! Help me lol.

NB - astro images, and it's generally a green cast. Goes away if I go back into LR, even after doing some edits in PS so it is a colour space related issue I would think. Nvidia drivers?

Are you using the Edit in Photoshop path or saving a file from LR and then loading a file into PS.

Doesn't matter what I do. It does same. Edit in photoshop as smart object mostly. But same happens with edit in photoshop...

When you go to PS, do you go through Adobe Camera Raw first?

I import through LR, I don't want to change this as its simplier for me and this shouldnt be happening

First step is to narrow down exactly the path you are using to help debug what is going wrong.

Okay see above

Having the file or a link to the file giving your trouble would be helpful too.

I will try screenshoting tomorrow

I have had some troubles in the past as well, and there are several ways that you can end up with a mismatch.

1) Both LR and PS have separate ACRs. Both versions must match. You can check the version of Lightroom under the "About Lightroom Classic " command. You can find the version in Photoshop under Settings > Camera Raw

2) In association with having the same version, you want to make sure that in Lightroom Preferences/Settings, you "Reset All Warning Dialog" at the bottom of the Preferences/Settings > General page. The reason this is important is if there were a mismatch in ACR versions, it could process the Lightroom image in PS's ACR which has its own color space settings. You normally have a warning about this when doing an "Edit in PS" command, yet if the "Don't show this dialog again" then you don't see the warning . That is a sneak path for having the wrong color space attached to your image.

3) Make sure that the Preferences for External Editing are set as you said to ProPhoto RGB as in this image:



Then, on the Photoshop side, make sure the Edit > Color Settings are set as below. I circled in red the important ones. Using these settings this way should smoothly move from ProPhoto RGB in LR to ProPhoto RGB in PS, assuming the images are tagged right from LR. If they are not tagged right, these color settings will warn you that there is a mismatch and that would help in the debugging. Also, you want to make sure the "Desaturate Monitor Colors By" was not accidentally turned on.



If, after all of these steps, you still have a color mismatch, the issue may be above my pay grade.

Hope these suggestions are helpful.

John Wheeler

Here is what I had before I saw your suggestions


I changed to this (the difference in colour is just I haved stretched the file yet

Even on the new suggestion, I am still getting this weird problem. Now see below:


LR colour - good


PS Colour - weird (smart object, but same occurs with normal layered import)

If you look closely at the PS version, there are also coloured rings not present in the LR version as well as the strange green cast.

Hi

@Primeshooter. from what I see, the LR and PS are closer in being the same than with your prior settings yet the resolution of your images is quite low and I cannot pick out the details your are describing.

I did some more research and I have a couple things to add.

1) Only view the images both at 100% magnification in LR and PS. This will eliminate any potential screen rendering issues.

2) I was making an assumption yet the OS needs to be using the same monitor profile for both LR an PS. I use a Mac and that is pretty much guaranteed yet I am not sure about Windows based OS So that would be worth checking

3) There were a couple setting I saw where they made a different recommendation than I had shared with you before. That is included below with the red being the consistent settings from before and the green are the ones that are different.



I will go through those changes one by one.

1) Using 8-bit dither with 16-bit images and no change in color space between LR and PS, this setting should not make a difference. Yet if you were working with 8-bit images at some point, or changing color spaces, the dither option helps remove banding that might occur

2) Compensate for Source-referred profiles. That's a good one to leave off, but I didn't think such profiles were in play. It would be good to turn off just in case.

3) Turning off Blending RGB Colors Using Gamma. Since you were working with single Layers, this should not come into play yet, leaving it unchecked would be safer

4) Turn off Blend Text Colors Using Gamma. You didn't have text, so I thought it wouldn't be an issue, but it doesn't hurt to leave it off.

Might as well make those changes and see if it helps. Personally, viewing at 100% magnification may be all that is needed, yet using the updated settings would cover all bases.

I'm not sure that will solve your problem, but I am pretty sure this is the limit of my knowledge in debugging your issue.

Hope this helps.

John Wheeler

Hey John, once again thanks for all your help so far. So I did what you asked there, I think it looks right now. However most times I bring something from LR to PS it complains that the prophoto profile is embedded and that PS is on RBG2.1etc etc and do I want to convert it etc etc. Is this normal, i don't remember this.

Hi @primeshooter

Glad the colors are pretty much matched up.

The topic of the warnings coming up and what color space to use is two separate issues so will address them that way.

If you do not want the warnings to come up, then you just need to set the upper left setting in red (working space RGB) to the same color space as the incoming images. In your case, your incoming images are ProPhoto rgb so if you set the Working Space RGB setting to ProPhoto RGB then there is no mismatch and the warning will not come up per this image.

https://i.postimg.cc/jS7GXTZS/Color-Settings.jpg

Which color space to use has tradeoffs.

ProPhotoRGB has the widest color gamut yet best to use it with 16 bit images to avoid banding. Todays printers and displays cannot show all of the colors in ProPhoto RGB so it brings some challenge in post processing

sRGB is the industry common denominator standard (i.e.the most compatible with minimal issues) yet is also has the smallest color gamut

Adobe RGB and Display P3 are both intermediate gamuts between sRGB and ProPhoto RGB

Here is a link to articles about Color Management and a little ways down they have two topcis, one about Color Spaces, and the other about converting between color spaces. I suggest you read those for more detail.

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/color-management-printing.htm

I hope this is helpful

John Wheeler

Hi John, yes I am aware I can block those notifications from coming up, I should have explained better what I was getting at here. I am concerned about not editing in the biggest colour space. LR is fine (prophoto is good, and it's standard, so no problems there). However, in PS, using RGB 2.1 seems like I could encounter issues, especially during astro processing or complex lum masking that I contend with daily. So my question is, why are the colours off when I set PS to prophoto (the same space as LR)? I'm sure this is still happening, I can check tonight. Maybe i'll be wrong, but it was off before when I had them matching each other and everything was the same version camera raw, etc, both updated to latest versions. Thanks for the links, I have read both of these before actually.

NB I always edit in 16 bit in PS and LR.

Hi @primeshooter.

That would be great if you change the working space RGB to ProPhoto. You should not see a different color image. If you do, there are a couple other things to consider.

Note that I use a Mac system and you are on a Windows system so cannot give specific instructions

1) I am assuming that you are viewing on the same monitor. Ideally with the LR and PS apps are open and side by side for easy comparison and magnification at 100% for both

2) In LR, only view in the Develop Module. Other modules actually are set to Adobe RGB which has the potential to make a slight difference

3) I am not sure how you verify this yet you Windows OS needs to be using the exact same monitor profile for both LR and PS. I am under the impression that one can set the monitor profile on an app by app basis yet I would hope the default would be to used the same monitor profile. I cannot guide you there not owning a PC.

4) If you see a side by side difference between LR and PS then swap the location of those two windows and see if the difference follows the app or stays on the same side of the monitor. If it stays with the monitor that is a monitor problem. If the same issue follows the swap locations, then you still have a problem.

5) Make sure soft proofing is not turned on for either LR or PS (another posting had already mentioned this suggestion)

Hope this incremental information is helpful

John, thanks for sticking with me on this one, and to knickerhawk.

I thought it was fixed but no - see images below. All the settings are correct it seems. Prophoto on LR, Prophoto on PS. Still it changes much more green in PS as you can see. Same v camera raw, both LR and PS on latest version, all the settings you have said too. I can't understand it at all.


LR


PS

The weirdest part is, it only is happening on some images!

 

[JohnWheeler]

Experienced shooter and PS user here, but I am totally lost here with this. Suddenly out of nowhere, the colour between LR (fine) and PS is off. I have LR in Prophoto and PS the same, but it's literally more green tinged. I checked that camera raw is updated, and both programs are up to date also but I would appreciate some advice. I tried just about every colour space in PS, including SRGB, but nothing matched what LR is showing in prophoto! Help me lol.

NB - astro images, and it's generally a green cast. Goes away if I go back into LR, even after doing some edits in PS so it is a colour space related issue I would think. Nvidia drivers?

Are you using the Edit in Photoshop path or saving a file from LR and then loading a file into PS.

Doesn't matter what I do. It does same. Edit in photoshop as smart object mostly. But same happens with edit in photoshop...

When you go to PS, do you go through Adobe Camera Raw first?

I import through LR, I don't want to change this as its simplier for me and this shouldnt be happening

First step is to narrow down exactly the path you are using to help debug what is going wrong.

Okay see above

Having the file or a link to the file giving your trouble would be helpful too.

I will try screenshoting tomorrow

I have had some troubles in the past as well, and there are several ways that you can end up with a mismatch.

1) Both LR and PS have separate ACRs. Both versions must match. You can check the version of Lightroom under the "About Lightroom Classic " command. You can find the version in Photoshop under Settings > Camera Raw

2) In association with having the same version, you want to make sure that in Lightroom Preferences/Settings, you "Reset All Warning Dialog" at the bottom of the Preferences/Settings > General page. The reason this is important is if there were a mismatch in ACR versions, it could process the Lightroom image in PS's ACR which has its own color space settings. You normally have a warning about this when doing an "Edit in PS" command, yet if the "Don't show this dialog again" then you don't see the warning . That is a sneak path for having the wrong color space attached to your image.

3) Make sure that the Preferences for External Editing are set as you said to ProPhoto RGB as in this image:



Then, on the Photoshop side, make sure the Edit > Color Settings are set as below. I circled in red the important ones. Using these settings this way should smoothly move from ProPhoto RGB in LR to ProPhoto RGB in PS, assuming the images are tagged right from LR. If they are not tagged right, these color settings will warn you that there is a mismatch and that would help in the debugging. Also, you want to make sure the "Desaturate Monitor Colors By" was not accidentally turned on.



If, after all of these steps, you still have a color mismatch, the issue may be above my pay grade.

Hope these suggestions are helpful.

John Wheeler

Here is what I had before I saw your suggestions


I changed to this (the difference in colour is just I haved stretched the file yet

Even on the new suggestion, I am still getting this weird problem. Now see below:


LR colour - good


PS Colour - weird (smart object, but same occurs with normal layered import)

If you look closely at the PS version, there are also coloured rings not present in the LR version as well as the strange green cast.

Hi

@Primeshooter. from what I see, the LR and PS are closer in being the same than with your prior settings yet the resolution of your images is quite low and I cannot pick out the details your are describing.

I did some more research and I have a couple things to add.

1) Only view the images both at 100% magnification in LR and PS. This will eliminate any potential screen rendering issues.

2) I was making an assumption yet the OS needs to be using the same monitor profile for both LR an PS. I use a Mac and that is pretty much guaranteed yet I am not sure about Windows based OS So that would be worth checking

3) There were a couple setting I saw where they made a different recommendation than I had shared with you before. That is included below with the red being the consistent settings from before and the green are the ones that are different.



I will go through those changes one by one.

1) Using 8-bit dither with 16-bit images and no change in color space between LR and PS, this setting should not make a difference. Yet if you were working with 8-bit images at some point, or changing color spaces, the dither option helps remove banding that might occur

2) Compensate for Source-referred profiles. That's a good one to leave off, but I didn't think such profiles were in play. It would be good to turn off just in case.

3) Turning off Blending RGB Colors Using Gamma. Since you were working with single Layers, this should not come into play yet, leaving it unchecked would be safer

4) Turn off Blend Text Colors Using Gamma. You didn't have text, so I thought it wouldn't be an issue, but it doesn't hurt to leave it off.

Might as well make those changes and see if it helps. Personally, viewing at 100% magnification may be all that is needed, yet using the updated settings would cover all bases.

I'm not sure that will solve your problem, but I am pretty sure this is the limit of my knowledge in debugging your issue.

Hope this helps.

John Wheeler

Hey John, once again thanks for all your help so far. So I did what you asked there, I think it looks right now. However most times I bring something from LR to PS it complains that the prophoto profile is embedded and that PS is on RBG2.1etc etc and do I want to convert it etc etc. Is this normal, i don't remember this.

Hi @primeshooter

Glad the colors are pretty much matched up.

The topic of the warnings coming up and what color space to use is two separate issues so will address them that way.

If you do not want the warnings to come up, then you just need to set the upper left setting in red (working space RGB) to the same color space as the incoming images. In your case, your incoming images are ProPhoto rgb so if you set the Working Space RGB setting to ProPhoto RGB then there is no mismatch and the warning will not come up per this image.

https://i.postimg.cc/jS7GXTZS/Color-Settings.jpg

Which color space to use has tradeoffs.

ProPhotoRGB has the widest color gamut yet best to use it with 16 bit images to avoid banding. Todays printers and displays cannot show all of the colors in ProPhoto RGB so it brings some challenge in post processing

sRGB is the industry common denominator standard (i.e.the most compatible with minimal issues) yet is also has the smallest color gamut

Adobe RGB and Display P3 are both intermediate gamuts between sRGB and ProPhoto RGB

Here is a link to articles about Color Management and a little ways down they have two topcis, one about Color Spaces, and the other about converting between color spaces. I suggest you read those for more detail.

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/color-management-printing.htm

I hope this is helpful

John Wheeler

Hi John, yes I am aware I can block those notifications from coming up, I should have explained better what I was getting at here. I am concerned about not editing in the biggest colour space. LR is fine (prophoto is good, and it's standard, so no problems there). However, in PS, using RGB 2.1 seems like I could encounter issues, especially during astro processing or complex lum masking that I contend with daily. So my question is, why are the colours off when I set PS to prophoto (the same space as LR)? I'm sure this is still happening, I can check tonight. Maybe i'll be wrong, but it was off before when I had them matching each other and everything was the same version camera raw, etc, both updated to latest versions. Thanks for the links, I have read both of these before actually.

NB I always edit in 16 bit in PS and LR.

Hi @primeshooter.

That would be great if you change the working space RGB to ProPhoto. You should not see a different color image. If you do, there are a couple other things to consider.

Note that I use a Mac system and you are on a Windows system so cannot give specific instructions

1) I am assuming that you are viewing on the same monitor. Ideally with the LR and PS apps are open and side by side for easy comparison and magnification at 100% for both

2) In LR, only view in the Develop Module. Other modules actually are set to Adobe RGB which has the potential to make a slight difference

3) I am not sure how you verify this yet you Windows OS needs to be using the exact same monitor profile for both LR and PS. I am under the impression that one can set the monitor profile on an app by app basis yet I would hope the default would be to used the same monitor profile. I cannot guide you there not owning a PC.

4) If you see a side by side difference between LR and PS then swap the location of those two windows and see if the difference follows the app or stays on the same side of the monitor. If it stays with the monitor that is a monitor problem. If the same issue follows the swap locations, then you still have a problem.

5) Make sure soft proofing is not turned on for either LR or PS (another posting had already mentioned this suggestion)

Hope this incremental information is helpful

John, thanks for sticking with me on this one, and to knickerhawk.

I thought it was fixed but no - see images below. All the settings are correct it seems. Prophoto on LR, Prophoto on PS. Still it changes much more green in PS as you can see. Same v camera raw, both LR and PS on latest version, all the settings you have said too. I can't understand it at all.


LR


PS

The weirdest part is, it only is happening on some images!

Hi @primeshooter

No problem hanging in there.

It might help if you save a 16 bit TIFF file from LR in ProPHoto RGB and share a link to it. I could then bring it into my LR and PS to compare on my monitor.

The differences I see are very slight.

What I did, I took your two last images, trimmed to just the image and transformed so the stars were aligned as best as possible.

The first image below is when I took the difference between the two images. As you can see it is very black meaning they are very close.

The second image is applying a curve adjustment Layer at maximum magnification.

It does show some differences yet in an ususual circular pattern. Not sure what to make of that and do not want to speculate since these are screen shots not at the same magnification. So it may be differences in the two images or just some resizing artifacts. That was why I was asking for the original image to apply to LR and PS directly and then compare:











You can open the images and magnify them both to see the details.

John Wheeler

--
John Wheeler
Never give up. Never surrender. Galaxy Quest

 

[primeshooter]

Experienced shooter and PS user here, but I am totally lost here with this. Suddenly out of nowhere, the colour between LR (fine) and PS is off. I have LR in Prophoto and PS the same, but it's literally more green tinged. I checked that camera raw is updated, and both programs are up to date also but I would appreciate some advice. I tried just about every colour space in PS, including SRGB, but nothing matched what LR is showing in prophoto! Help me lol.

NB - astro images, and it's generally a green cast. Goes away if I go back into LR, even after doing some edits in PS so it is a colour space related issue I would think. Nvidia drivers?

Are you using the Edit in Photoshop path or saving a file from LR and then loading a file into PS.

Doesn't matter what I do. It does same. Edit in photoshop as smart object mostly. But same happens with edit in photoshop...

When you go to PS, do you go through Adobe Camera Raw first?

I import through LR, I don't want to change this as its simplier for me and this shouldnt be happening

First step is to narrow down exactly the path you are using to help debug what is going wrong.

Okay see above

Having the file or a link to the file giving your trouble would be helpful too.

I will try screenshoting tomorrow

I have had some troubles in the past as well, and there are several ways that you can end up with a mismatch.

1) Both LR and PS have separate ACRs. Both versions must match. You can check the version of Lightroom under the "About Lightroom Classic " command. You can find the version in Photoshop under Settings > Camera Raw

2) In association with having the same version, you want to make sure that in Lightroom Preferences/Settings, you "Reset All Warning Dialog" at the bottom of the Preferences/Settings > General page. The reason this is important is if there were a mismatch in ACR versions, it could process the Lightroom image in PS's ACR which has its own color space settings. You normally have a warning about this when doing an "Edit in PS" command, yet if the "Don't show this dialog again" then you don't see the warning . That is a sneak path for having the wrong color space attached to your image.

3) Make sure that the Preferences for External Editing are set as you said to ProPhoto RGB as in this image:



Then, on the Photoshop side, make sure the Edit > Color Settings are set as below. I circled in red the important ones. Using these settings this way should smoothly move from ProPhoto RGB in LR to ProPhoto RGB in PS, assuming the images are tagged right from LR. If they are not tagged right, these color settings will warn you that there is a mismatch and that would help in the debugging. Also, you want to make sure the "Desaturate Monitor Colors By" was not accidentally turned on.



If, after all of these steps, you still have a color mismatch, the issue may be above my pay grade.

Hope these suggestions are helpful.

John Wheeler

Here is what I had before I saw your suggestions


I changed to this (the difference in colour is just I haved stretched the file yet

Even on the new suggestion, I am still getting this weird problem. Now see below:


LR colour - good


PS Colour - weird (smart object, but same occurs with normal layered import)

If you look closely at the PS version, there are also coloured rings not present in the LR version as well as the strange green cast.

Hi

@Primeshooter. from what I see, the LR and PS are closer in being the same than with your prior settings yet the resolution of your images is quite low and I cannot pick out the details your are describing.

I did some more research and I have a couple things to add.

1) Only view the images both at 100% magnification in LR and PS. This will eliminate any potential screen rendering issues.

2) I was making an assumption yet the OS needs to be using the same monitor profile for both LR an PS. I use a Mac and that is pretty much guaranteed yet I am not sure about Windows based OS So that would be worth checking

3) There were a couple setting I saw where they made a different recommendation than I had shared with you before. That is included below with the red being the consistent settings from before and the green are the ones that are different.



I will go through those changes one by one.

1) Using 8-bit dither with 16-bit images and no change in color space between LR and PS, this setting should not make a difference. Yet if you were working with 8-bit images at some point, or changing color spaces, the dither option helps remove banding that might occur

2) Compensate for Source-referred profiles. That's a good one to leave off, but I didn't think such profiles were in play. It would be good to turn off just in case.

3) Turning off Blending RGB Colors Using Gamma. Since you were working with single Layers, this should not come into play yet, leaving it unchecked would be safer

4) Turn off Blend Text Colors Using Gamma. You didn't have text, so I thought it wouldn't be an issue, but it doesn't hurt to leave it off.

Might as well make those changes and see if it helps. Personally, viewing at 100% magnification may be all that is needed, yet using the updated settings would cover all bases.

I'm not sure that will solve your problem, but I am pretty sure this is the limit of my knowledge in debugging your issue.

Hope this helps.

John Wheeler

Hey John, once again thanks for all your help so far. So I did what you asked there, I think it looks right now. However most times I bring something from LR to PS it complains that the prophoto profile is embedded and that PS is on RBG2.1etc etc and do I want to convert it etc etc. Is this normal, i don't remember this.

Hi @primeshooter

Glad the colors are pretty much matched up.

The topic of the warnings coming up and what color space to use is two separate issues so will address them that way.

If you do not want the warnings to come up, then you just need to set the upper left setting in red (working space RGB) to the same color space as the incoming images. In your case, your incoming images are ProPhoto rgb so if you set the Working Space RGB setting to ProPhoto RGB then there is no mismatch and the warning will not come up per this image.

https://i.postimg.cc/jS7GXTZS/Color-Settings.jpg

Which color space to use has tradeoffs.

ProPhotoRGB has the widest color gamut yet best to use it with 16 bit images to avoid banding. Todays printers and displays cannot show all of the colors in ProPhoto RGB so it brings some challenge in post processing

sRGB is the industry common denominator standard (i.e.the most compatible with minimal issues) yet is also has the smallest color gamut

Adobe RGB and Display P3 are both intermediate gamuts between sRGB and ProPhoto RGB

Here is a link to articles about Color Management and a little ways down they have two topcis, one about Color Spaces, and the other about converting between color spaces. I suggest you read those for more detail.

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/color-management-printing.htm

I hope this is helpful

John Wheeler

Hi John, yes I am aware I can block those notifications from coming up, I should have explained better what I was getting at here. I am concerned about not editing in the biggest colour space. LR is fine (prophoto is good, and it's standard, so no problems there). However, in PS, using RGB 2.1 seems like I could encounter issues, especially during astro processing or complex lum masking that I contend with daily. So my question is, why are the colours off when I set PS to prophoto (the same space as LR)? I'm sure this is still happening, I can check tonight. Maybe i'll be wrong, but it was off before when I had them matching each other and everything was the same version camera raw, etc, both updated to latest versions. Thanks for the links, I have read both of these before actually.

NB I always edit in 16 bit in PS and LR.

Hi @primeshooter.

That would be great if you change the working space RGB to ProPhoto. You should not see a different color image. If you do, there are a couple other things to consider.

Note that I use a Mac system and you are on a Windows system so cannot give specific instructions

1) I am assuming that you are viewing on the same monitor. Ideally with the LR and PS apps are open and side by side for easy comparison and magnification at 100% for both

2) In LR, only view in the Develop Module. Other modules actually are set to Adobe RGB which has the potential to make a slight difference

3) I am not sure how you verify this yet you Windows OS needs to be using the exact same monitor profile for both LR and PS. I am under the impression that one can set the monitor profile on an app by app basis yet I would hope the default would be to used the same monitor profile. I cannot guide you there not owning a PC.

4) If you see a side by side difference between LR and PS then swap the location of those two windows and see if the difference follows the app or stays on the same side of the monitor. If it stays with the monitor that is a monitor problem. If the same issue follows the swap locations, then you still have a problem.

5) Make sure soft proofing is not turned on for either LR or PS (another posting had already mentioned this suggestion)

Hope this incremental information is helpful

John, thanks for sticking with me on this one, and to knickerhawk.

I thought it was fixed but no - see images below. All the settings are correct it seems. Prophoto on LR, Prophoto on PS. Still it changes much more green in PS as you can see. Same v camera raw, both LR and PS on latest version, all the settings you have said too. I can't understand it at all.


LR


PS

The weirdest part is, it only is happening on some images!

Hi @primeshooter

No problem hanging in there.

It might help if you save a 16 bit TIFF file from LR in ProPHoto RGB and share a link to it. I could then bring it into my LR and PS to compare on my monitor.

I will look into this.

The differences I see are very slight.

Yes they are.

What I did, I took your two last images, trimmed to just the image and transformed so the stars were aligned as best as possible.

The first image below is when I took the difference between the two images. As you can see it is very black meaning they are very close.

The second image is applying a curve adjustment Layer at maximum magnification.

It does show some differences yet in an ususual circular pattern. Not sure what to make of that and do not want to speculate since these are screen shots not at the same magnification. So it may be differences in the two images or just some resizing artifacts. That was why I was asking for the original image to apply to LR and PS directly and then compare:

I know you know this, but just confirming these are exactly the same RAW image, just imported from LR to PS. The circular ring thing is usually an artefact that occurs in PS with certain images when they aren't viewed at full size (as you previously alluded to, I kinda knew about this one - not sure how to fix that). However I can live with that problem, but not the colour issue as when we do curve adjustments they colour really changes fast between the imported and original file - so I can't edit correctly! Please be aware, these are just astro test shots on star fields to check aberrations. I still don't understand why I am experiencing a colour shift when using exactly the same colour space in both programs and importing one from the other (something I do regularly). Thanks for your help so far.

You can open the images and magnify them both to see the details.

John Wheeler

 

[JohnWheeler]

Experienced shooter and PS user here, but I am totally lost here with this. Suddenly out of nowhere, the colour between LR (fine) and PS is off. I have LR in Prophoto and PS the same, but it's literally more green tinged. I checked that camera raw is updated, and both programs are up to date also but I would appreciate some advice. I tried just about every colour space in PS, including SRGB, but nothing matched what LR is showing in prophoto! Help me lol.

NB - astro images, and it's generally a green cast. Goes away if I go back into LR, even after doing some edits in PS so it is a colour space related issue I would think. Nvidia drivers?

Are you using the Edit in Photoshop path or saving a file from LR and then loading a file into PS.

Doesn't matter what I do. It does same. Edit in photoshop as smart object mostly. But same happens with edit in photoshop...

When you go to PS, do you go through Adobe Camera Raw first?

I import through LR, I don't want to change this as its simplier for me and this shouldnt be happening

First step is to narrow down exactly the path you are using to help debug what is going wrong.

Okay see above

Having the file or a link to the file giving your trouble would be helpful too.

I will try screenshoting tomorrow

I have had some troubles in the past as well, and there are several ways that you can end up with a mismatch.

1) Both LR and PS have separate ACRs. Both versions must match. You can check the version of Lightroom under the "About Lightroom Classic " command. You can find the version in Photoshop under Settings > Camera Raw

2) In association with having the same version, you want to make sure that in Lightroom Preferences/Settings, you "Reset All Warning Dialog" at the bottom of the Preferences/Settings > General page. The reason this is important is if there were a mismatch in ACR versions, it could process the Lightroom image in PS's ACR which has its own color space settings. You normally have a warning about this when doing an "Edit in PS" command, yet if the "Don't show this dialog again" then you don't see the warning . That is a sneak path for having the wrong color space attached to your image.

3) Make sure that the Preferences for External Editing are set as you said to ProPhoto RGB as in this image:



Then, on the Photoshop side, make sure the Edit > Color Settings are set as below. I circled in red the important ones. Using these settings this way should smoothly move from ProPhoto RGB in LR to ProPhoto RGB in PS, assuming the images are tagged right from LR. If they are not tagged right, these color settings will warn you that there is a mismatch and that would help in the debugging. Also, you want to make sure the "Desaturate Monitor Colors By" was not accidentally turned on.



If, after all of these steps, you still have a color mismatch, the issue may be above my pay grade.

Hope these suggestions are helpful.

John Wheeler

Here is what I had before I saw your suggestions


I changed to this (the difference in colour is just I haved stretched the file yet

Even on the new suggestion, I am still getting this weird problem. Now see below:


LR colour - good


PS Colour - weird (smart object, but same occurs with normal layered import)

If you look closely at the PS version, there are also coloured rings not present in the LR version as well as the strange green cast.

Hi

@Primeshooter. from what I see, the LR and PS are closer in being the same than with your prior settings yet the resolution of your images is quite low and I cannot pick out the details your are describing.

I did some more research and I have a couple things to add.

1) Only view the images both at 100% magnification in LR and PS. This will eliminate any potential screen rendering issues.

2) I was making an assumption yet the OS needs to be using the same monitor profile for both LR an PS. I use a Mac and that is pretty much guaranteed yet I am not sure about Windows based OS So that would be worth checking

3) There were a couple setting I saw where they made a different recommendation than I had shared with you before. That is included below with the red being the consistent settings from before and the green are the ones that are different.



I will go through those changes one by one.

1) Using 8-bit dither with 16-bit images and no change in color space between LR and PS, this setting should not make a difference. Yet if you were working with 8-bit images at some point, or changing color spaces, the dither option helps remove banding that might occur

2) Compensate for Source-referred profiles. That's a good one to leave off, but I didn't think such profiles were in play. It would be good to turn off just in case.

3) Turning off Blending RGB Colors Using Gamma. Since you were working with single Layers, this should not come into play yet, leaving it unchecked would be safer

4) Turn off Blend Text Colors Using Gamma. You didn't have text, so I thought it wouldn't be an issue, but it doesn't hurt to leave it off.

Might as well make those changes and see if it helps. Personally, viewing at 100% magnification may be all that is needed, yet using the updated settings would cover all bases.

I'm not sure that will solve your problem, but I am pretty sure this is the limit of my knowledge in debugging your issue.

Hope this helps.

John Wheeler

Hey John, once again thanks for all your help so far. So I did what you asked there, I think it looks right now. However most times I bring something from LR to PS it complains that the prophoto profile is embedded and that PS is on RBG2.1etc etc and do I want to convert it etc etc. Is this normal, i don't remember this.

Hi @primeshooter

Glad the colors are pretty much matched up.

The topic of the warnings coming up and what color space to use is two separate issues so will address them that way.

If you do not want the warnings to come up, then you just need to set the upper left setting in red (working space RGB) to the same color space as the incoming images. In your case, your incoming images are ProPhoto rgb so if you set the Working Space RGB setting to ProPhoto RGB then there is no mismatch and the warning will not come up per this image.

https://i.postimg.cc/jS7GXTZS/Color-Settings.jpg

Which color space to use has tradeoffs.

ProPhotoRGB has the widest color gamut yet best to use it with 16 bit images to avoid banding. Todays printers and displays cannot show all of the colors in ProPhoto RGB so it brings some challenge in post processing

sRGB is the industry common denominator standard (i.e.the most compatible with minimal issues) yet is also has the smallest color gamut

Adobe RGB and Display P3 are both intermediate gamuts between sRGB and ProPhoto RGB

Here is a link to articles about Color Management and a little ways down they have two topcis, one about Color Spaces, and the other about converting between color spaces. I suggest you read those for more detail.

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/color-management-printing.htm

I hope this is helpful

John Wheeler

Hi John, yes I am aware I can block those notifications from coming up, I should have explained better what I was getting at here. I am concerned about not editing in the biggest colour space. LR is fine (prophoto is good, and it's standard, so no problems there). However, in PS, using RGB 2.1 seems like I could encounter issues, especially during astro processing or complex lum masking that I contend with daily. So my question is, why are the colours off when I set PS to prophoto (the same space as LR)? I'm sure this is still happening, I can check tonight. Maybe i'll be wrong, but it was off before when I had them matching each other and everything was the same version camera raw, etc, both updated to latest versions. Thanks for the links, I have read both of these before actually.

NB I always edit in 16 bit in PS and LR.

Hi @primeshooter.

That would be great if you change the working space RGB to ProPhoto. You should not see a different color image. If you do, there are a couple other things to consider.

Note that I use a Mac system and you are on a Windows system so cannot give specific instructions

1) I am assuming that you are viewing on the same monitor. Ideally with the LR and PS apps are open and side by side for easy comparison and magnification at 100% for both

2) In LR, only view in the Develop Module. Other modules actually are set to Adobe RGB which has the potential to make a slight difference

3) I am not sure how you verify this yet you Windows OS needs to be using the exact same monitor profile for both LR and PS. I am under the impression that one can set the monitor profile on an app by app basis yet I would hope the default would be to used the same monitor profile. I cannot guide you there not owning a PC.

4) If you see a side by side difference between LR and PS then swap the location of those two windows and see if the difference follows the app or stays on the same side of the monitor. If it stays with the monitor that is a monitor problem. If the same issue follows the swap locations, then you still have a problem.

5) Make sure soft proofing is not turned on for either LR or PS (another posting had already mentioned this suggestion)

Hope this incremental information is helpful

John, thanks for sticking with me on this one, and to knickerhawk.

I thought it was fixed but no - see images below. All the settings are correct it seems. Prophoto on LR, Prophoto on PS. Still it changes much more green in PS as you can see. Same v camera raw, both LR and PS on latest version, all the settings you have said too. I can't understand it at all.


LR


PS

The weirdest part is, it only is happening on some images!

Hi @primeshooter

No problem hanging in there.

It might help if you save a 16 bit TIFF file from LR in ProPHoto RGB and share a link to it. I could then bring it into my LR and PS to compare on my monitor.

I will look into this.

The differences I see are very slight.

Yes they are.

What I did, I took your two last images, trimmed to just the image and transformed so the stars were aligned as best as possible.

The first image below is when I took the difference between the two images. As you can see it is very black meaning they are very close.

The second image is applying a curve adjustment Layer at maximum magnification.

It does show some differences yet in an ususual circular pattern. Not sure what to make of that and do not want to speculate since these are screen shots not at the same magnification. So it may be differences in the two images or just some resizing artifacts. That was why I was asking for the original image to apply to LR and PS directly and then compare:

I know you know this, but just confirming these are exactly the same RAW image, just imported from LR to PS. The circular ring thing is usually an artefact that occurs in PS with certain images when they aren't viewed at full size (as you previously alluded to, I kinda knew about this one - not sure how to fix that). However I can live with that problem, but not the colour issue as when we do curve adjustments they colour really changes fast between the imported and original file - so I can't edit correctly! Please be aware, these are just astro test shots on star fields to check aberrations. I still don't understand why I am experiencing a colour shift when using exactly the same colour space in both programs and importing one from the other (something I do regularly). Thanks for your help so far.

You can open the images and magnify them both to see the details.

John Wheeler

Hi Primeshooter

Yes I understand they are the same image. Yet somewhere in the workflow a difference is being introduced. To get to root cause, I often use a divide and conquer approach to isolate where specifically in the work flow the problem arises. Between LR and your monitor and from LR to PS to Monitor there are a lot of things going on. One way to do that is try the same paths on a competely different system by sharing the raw file. I am offering to do that on my system to see what happens. I sent you a message on DPreview about this topic.

Another example would be to ouput your file in LR to a 16 bit TIFF file and read that into PS to see if that looks the same as the path using "Edit In". Each of those steps gives information that helps narrow down the issue.

As a reminder, one of the issues with matching images is viewing at 100% only to eliminate/bypass rendering an image to a difference pixel size on the monitor. So that is another divide and conquer step.

John Wheeler

--
John Wheeler
Never give up. Never surrender. Galaxy Quest

 

[knickerhawk]

I know I said I’d not butt in, but I’d suggest starting with a mutually available raw file like the DPR studio scene for primeshooter’s camera model. If the problem persists when using that raw then we know it’s not image-dependent. Plus the color checker and other elements in the scene are good for detecting color space issues. If the problem can’t be replicated with the DPR scene, then it’s imperative that the night sky shot is shared.