How to get good prints from labs using a Fuji Frontier...

[Guillaume in Paris]

hi all

Here's my story: i recently made test prints from a french online lab (photoways.com) to test their quality. They use a Fuji Frontier. I sent them some test pics from Phil's Canon D30 review. All the prints were 4x6", from fullsize D30 files (2160x1440 pix).

What came out was astonishing in terms of color fidelity, i made no adjustments before sending, i don't know if they did before printing.
But look at these comparisons, and you'll understand the problem (huge one!!).



(full size:







(full size:





As you may notice, there are jaggies everywhere and to my eye (maybe not everyone's, i'm very shortsighted and i can watch things from very close) they were awfully visible. Watch the full size images to really see what i'm talking about.

Every curve becomes a stairway, every straight line is aliased... numbers are distorted... close lines seam together...

It's clear that i gave their Frontier too much pixels to cope with (hopefully it wasn't a D60: 503 dpi for a 4x6 !!), and brutal aliasing has occured (like Nearest Neighbour resampling in Photoshop).

I mailed the lab, the answers are the following: the Fuji Frontier has a resolution of 300 dpi MAX. Of course lower resolution files will print perfectly because the Frontier can upsample well. But it's a dog at downsampling nicely: a D30 file of 2160x1440 fitting on a 4x6" print, means roughly a resolution of 361 dpi. Too much!

Gotta say that the 4x6 D60 test chart had less disturbing jaggies... but jaggies are jaggies and they suck.

So if you want to get GOOD results from all your 3+ megapixel digicams, better downsample YOURSELF the pics to the right sizes, to match the final size of the print you desire.

Photoways gave me these perfect image definitions for each print size (at 300dpi):
4x6" = 1205x1795 pix (10,2x15,2cm precisely)
6x8,5" = 1795x2551 pix (15,2x21,6cm)
8x12" = 2397x3602 pix (20,3x30,5cm)

and so on... for intermediate sizes.

you should always downsample using your favorite software before going to print: the photos from this french Frontier are perfect except the jaggies i got here. The Frontier can go up to 300 dpi, what a shame it would be not to take advantage of it!!
Using Photoshop to resize, it's simple: Menu Image > Size,

then type 300 for the resolution, type in the dimensions in cm (not inches, i think it's worse) and you'll get your perfect image ready to be Frontierized

Hope it will help you get the most of your camera...

 

[nicola]

Lambda is the way to go!
Find a lab equipped with one of those machines. The results are astonishing!

http://www.durst.it/uk/produkte.asp?pid=3&hid=1--Nicola (mr)(Amateur Photographer) http://www.pbase.com/nicola/galleries

 

[Guillaume in Paris]

Nice for LAAAARGE prints! but do the prints last as long as photographic paper? maybe not!

and most of us here don't need 50" prints!! for 4x6" or even 8x12" this might be overkill... impressive machine anyway

 

[nicola]

The Lambda does use chemical photographic paper with the longevity of any paper print from film processing.

And you can have 4x6 prints too!--Nicola (mr)(Amateur Photographer) http://www.pbase.com/nicola/galleries

 

[Daniel V. Lopes]

How do you know that they use the Fuji Frontier? I didn't find any info on their site about the printers they use.

But if they really use the Fuji Frontier that would be great, because I'm looking for a long time for a lab that uses them and that ships to Europe.

Daniel V. Lopes

hi all
Here's my story: i recently made test prints from a french online
lab (photoways.com) to test their quality. They use a Fuji
Frontier. I sent them some test pics from Phil's Canon D30 review.
All the prints were 4x6", from fullsize D30 files (2160x1440 pix).
What came out was astonishing in terms of color fidelity, i made no
adjustments before sending, i don't know if they did before
printing.
But look at these comparisons, and you'll understand the problem
(huge one!!).



(full size:







(full size:





As you may notice, there are jaggies everywhere and to my eye
(maybe not everyone's, i'm very shortsighted and i can watch things
from very close) they were awfully visible. Watch the full size
images to really see what i'm talking about.
Every curve becomes a stairway, every straight line is aliased...
numbers are distorted... close lines seam together...

It's clear that i gave their Frontier too much pixels to cope with
(hopefully it wasn't a D60: 503 dpi for a 4x6 !!), and brutal
aliasing has occured (like Nearest Neighbour resampling in
Photoshop).

I mailed the lab, the answers are the following: the Fuji Frontier
has a resolution of 300 dpi MAX. Of course lower resolution files
will print perfectly because the Frontier can upsample well. But
it's a dog at downsampling nicely: a D30 file of 2160x1440 fitting
on a 4x6" print, means roughly a resolution of 361 dpi. Too much!
Gotta say that the 4x6 D60 test chart had less disturbing
jaggies... but jaggies are jaggies and they suck.
So if you want to get GOOD results from all your 3+ megapixel
digicams, better downsample YOURSELF the pics to the right sizes,
to match the final size of the print you desire.

Photoways gave me these perfect image definitions for each print
size (at 300dpi):
4x6" = 1205x1795 pix (10,2x15,2cm precisely)
6x8,5" = 1795x2551 pix (15,2x21,6cm)
8x12" = 2397x3602 pix (20,3x30,5cm)

and so on... for intermediate sizes.

you should always downsample using your favorite software before
going to print: the photos from this french Frontier are perfect
except the jaggies i got here. The Frontier can go up to 300 dpi,
what a shame it would be not to take advantage of it!!
Using Photoshop to resize, it's simple: Menu Image > Size,
then type 300 for the resolution, type in the dimensions in cm (not
inches, i think it's worse) and you'll get your perfect image ready
to be Frontierized

Hope it will help you get the most of your camera...

 

[Guillaume in Paris]

How do you think i know they use a Frontier? i asked them what they were using!! LOL
They can send the photos worldwide as far as i've read on their FAQ.

 

[Bob Randall]

Can you use the cropping tool and insert the dpi rather than the image size menu and achieve the same result?

 

[Dr_Michael - Hellas Athens - 6900z]

So if you want to get GOOD results from all your 3+ megapixel
digicams, better downsample YOURSELF the pics to the right sizes,
to match the final size of the print you desire.

Photoways gave me these perfect image definitions for each print
size (at 300dpi):
4x6" = 1205x1795 pix (10,2x15,2cm precisely)
6x8,5" = 1795x2551 pix (15,2x21,6cm)
8x12" = 2397x3602 pix (20,3x30,5cm)

and so on... for intermediate sizes.

you should always downsample using your favorite software before
going to print: the photos from this french Frontier are perfect
except the jaggies i got here. The Frontier can go up to 300 dpi,
what a shame it would be not to take advantage of it!!
Using Photoshop to resize, it's simple: Menu Image > Size,
then type 300 for the resolution, type in the dimensions in cm (not
inches, i think it's worse) and you'll get your perfect image ready
to be Frontierized

Hope it will help you get the most of your camera...

Better use these instructions my friend:
http://www.zeusflash.com/articles/prepareforprint.pdf

--
Michalis Vlastos
Athens, Hellas
Founder of the Greek Digital Photography Virtual Community http://www.dpgr.gr

 

[LP Choi]

Here in HK there is plenty of opprtunity to use Frontier lab prints.

I have printed at different labs using Frontier. Results from borderless prints of 4x6in yielded cropped edges, similar to prints made from inkjet printers having borderless prints.

So assuming 4x6in in the calculation may similarly yield jaggies in the final prints.

However, when I specify to have white borders in the prints, the final images match my original file images much more with nearly all details up to the edges showing up.

So I measure the actual image area on a bordered 4x6in print. Using my best ruler at home, the result is 95mmx145mm in a 101.5mmx151.5mm print.

The outer size is not significant, so I am going to ignore it. Take the inner image area, 95x145mm, multiply it at 300ppi = 1122x1713 pixels.

Using the "Image Size" function in PS7 is less convenient as I need to type in various figures every time, check and uncheck the boxes, and most importantly still do not yield my wished resultant resolution if I choose "Constrain Proportions" from the "Image Size" menu. In fact I do not think any crop of current digital camera has the same proportions as the one specified by me (1122:1713), so this does not work well.

Naturally, the crop tool would be better. I just enter "1713 px" in the width box, then "1122 px" in the height box, and "300" "pixels/inch" in the resolution boxes, and perform the cropping I wanted. This also gives me the opportunity to fine tune my images after the exposure to correct any composition problem.

An advantage of such technique is that I do not have to re-enter the figures because PS7 remembers my settings for the next image unless I change them.

Althought this technique involves re-sampling, I think this is better done by my PS7 rather than the Frontier lab machine, especially considering that with either of the current 6+MP digital cameras, downsampling from such large files will usually yield good result rather than bad result from upsampling from an 1 MP image from a 1MP camera, or re-sampling a 2MP image from an 2MP DC (as 1,713x1,122 = 1,921,986 pixels).

LP

hi all
Here's my story: i recently made test prints from a french online
lab (photoways.com) to test their quality. They use a Fuji
Frontier. I sent them some test pics from Phil's Canon D30 review.
All the prints were 4x6", from fullsize D30 files (2160x1440 pix).
What came out was astonishing in terms of color fidelity, i made no
adjustments before sending, i don't know if they did before
printing.
But look at these comparisons, and you'll understand the problem
(huge one!!).



(full size:







(full size:





As you may notice, there are jaggies everywhere and to my eye
(maybe not everyone's, i'm very shortsighted and i can watch things
from very close) they were awfully visible. Watch the full size
images to really see what i'm talking about.
Every curve becomes a stairway, every straight line is aliased...
numbers are distorted... close lines seam together...

It's clear that i gave their Frontier too much pixels to cope with
(hopefully it wasn't a D60: 503 dpi for a 4x6 !!), and brutal
aliasing has occured (like Nearest Neighbour resampling in
Photoshop).

I mailed the lab, the answers are the following: the Fuji Frontier
has a resolution of 300 dpi MAX. Of course lower resolution files
will print perfectly because the Frontier can upsample well. But
it's a dog at downsampling nicely: a D30 file of 2160x1440 fitting
on a 4x6" print, means roughly a resolution of 361 dpi. Too much!
Gotta say that the 4x6 D60 test chart had less disturbing
jaggies... but jaggies are jaggies and they suck.
So if you want to get GOOD results from all your 3+ megapixel
digicams, better downsample YOURSELF the pics to the right sizes,
to match the final size of the print you desire.

Photoways gave me these perfect image definitions for each print
size (at 300dpi):
4x6" = 1205x1795 pix (10,2x15,2cm precisely)
6x8,5" = 1795x2551 pix (15,2x21,6cm)
8x12" = 2397x3602 pix (20,3x30,5cm)

and so on... for intermediate sizes.

you should always downsample using your favorite software before
going to print: the photos from this french Frontier are perfect
except the jaggies i got here. The Frontier can go up to 300 dpi,
what a shame it would be not to take advantage of it!!
Using Photoshop to resize, it's simple: Menu Image > Size,
then type 300 for the resolution, type in the dimensions in cm (not
inches, i think it's worse) and you'll get your perfect image ready
to be Frontierized

Hope it will help you get the most of your camera...