How to determine which shutter type was used for a photo

[Pierre Lagarde]

All Nikon Z6 and Z7 models (Z6, Z6II, Z6III, Z7 and Z7II) have a mechanical shutter.

With Custom Controls setting for Shutter Type (d5 or d6, depending on the model) you have several options to choose the shutter type to be used:

• Auto
• Mechanical shutter
• Electronic front-curtain shutter (EFCS)
• Electronic shutter (only on the Z6III)

The camera's default to "Auto" and that in turn determines which shutter type is used based on the shutter speed.

The manual also states that the option "Mechanical shutter" is "not available with some lenses".
I found a list of lenses with shutter type limitations:
https://www.nikonimgsupport.com/eu/BV_article?articleNo=000066929&configured=1&lang=en_GB

The closest you can get to using a mechanical shutter when using one of these lenses is setting the shutter type to "Electronic front-curtain shutter".
But I'm not sure if this eliminates the risk of banding in environments with LED lights, like the mechanical shutter would.

Why did Nikon impose such limitations to their camera's and glass?
Their DSLR's never had those limitations and worked fine for me. ...

The answer is in the article you mentioned:

When the following lenses are mounted on Z series cameras, the 'Mechanical Shutter' option will be unavailable in the 'Shutter Type' menu option.
This specification is designed to mitigate mechanical vibration effects that occur when shooting at slower shutter speeds.

Why impose these limitations on photographers who plan to shoot with faster shutter speeds to photograph sports or action?

My point is, that in the old DSLR days the vibration of the shutter was the least of your worries when photographing long(er) exposure. The movement of the mirror was more of an issue than the movement of the mechanical shutter (the only shutter available at the time).
And when photographing sports of fast action with (much) faster shutter speeds the 'shutter shock' is not an issue.

I think you should reread the thread. I and others explained that if you set the shutter mode to Auto, mechanical shutter is always chosen above 1/320s.

Trying to keep ISO's al low as possible when photographing concerts I start at 1/200. Based on the amount of action on stage I might shorten or lengthen the shutter speed. But 1/200 should be fast enough to prevent blurry images caused by 'shutter shock'.

I've photographed concerts with DSLR's without stabilised sensor and with lenses without VR and had no issue getting sharp photos.

Why patronise me by not allowing me to use the mechanical shutter and forcing me to use electronic front-curtain shutter.

It's not the case.

It feels like that. And feelings matter.

Why not let the photographer choose how he or she wants to use the camera?

Why impose these limitation on the newer S glass (like my Z 24-120mm f/4 S) and not on the older Z glass like the 24-70mm f/4 S of Z 14-30mm f/4 S?
It makes no sense

I'm sorry, but I'm not sure to get your issue. On one hand you say you want to use high speed shutter for action and on the other hand you say you don't.

With Auto mode, camera will choose between Mechanical shutter or EFCS. TBH, I don't see what can be the problem with this behaviour in the situations you're describing.

Maybe you should describe more precisely your sets and different situations (what lens for what purpose) in order to readers here to better understand your issue.

If there was enough light during concerts I would use faster shutter speeds. But since that's not the case, to keep ISO as low as possible, I photographed most of the shows with 1/200 or 1/250.

With those shutter speeds, when shutter type is set to Auto, the camera will use the electronic shutter and this increases the risk of banding when photographing artist lit by LED stage lighting.

Another unpredictability is the frames rate associated with the shutter type. The electronic shutter maxes out at 20 fps, the mechanical shutter at 14 fps. The 14 fps is is more than I need (10 fps is the sweet spot for me), but that too is out of my control with shutter type set to "Auto".

My point is: I want more control than just setting shutter type to "Auto".

You're confusing : Electronic Shutter (so ES) is not EFCS. Auto shutter mode is choosing between EFCS and mechanical, not between ES and mechanical.

EFCS have much less problems than ES on most cameras, but perhaps some differences in bokeh at faster shutter speeds which is not a problem as Auto shutter mode precisely switch to mechanical shutter for those faster shutter speeds. So you won't likely see any difference in results between EFCS and mechanical at lower shutter speeds, and so, you don't have to worry about it.

If you want to know more about the differences between ES, EFCS, mechanical shutter, I encourage you to read this article on Photography Life :

https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

If ever it can help too, my own experience is that, in concerts, I usually use F/2 or F/2.8 lenses and expose with Highlight-weighted metering because of spotlights, and also use(d) short teles to 300mm lenses, and more than 1/200s at distance to avoid motion blur and fix musicians movements. Modern cameras allows the usage of higher ISOs + Highlight-weighted metering allows to avoid over exposition of lights and lower ISOs, BTW.

I already was doing this with DSLRs and never had problems with results.

As well, there is no relation between shutter mode and release mode, unless too slow shutter can slow down your burst, of course : may it be ES, EFCS or mechanical shutter mode, chances are that you can perfectly set your release mode to any burst rate available on your camera, including 10Fps - if it's available.

Once again tell us more about your set and usage : what camera, what lens in what conditions ?

 

[jthomas39]

Wow, and I'm mad. But nothing I can do about it now, and apparently it's not a big deal as I was unaware it was happening. But old fashioned me had insisted my camera be set to mechanical shutter only, now I see that most of my photos have likely been taken with electronic shutter. It apparently incorporates an electronically produced shutter sound, as I hear the shutter or thought I did when I shoot. We live and we learn I suppose. Thanks for messing up my day. :-D

I don’t know if you are serious or mocking, Bob. But vjpeters is wrong.

Using EFCS, low-shutter speed images are not taken using an electronic shutter. They are taken by using only the rear mechanical shutter curtain. There is a big difference.

Using only electronic shutter, the camera has to continuously reset sections of the shutter at speeds faster than the shutter can read out - 1/9 to 1/50 second depending on the camera model. Think of measuring a gallon of water using only a one-cup measure. You have to dip the measure in the stream, pour a cup into the vessel, dip again, and repeat until you have your gallon. And electronic shutter must reset the first part, expose and read-out that, then repeat for the entire shutter height - because at 1/250 second, that is only one-fifth the time that fastest electronic shutter can read. Remember, the sensor reads as long as it is exposed to light, so if the last section of the shutter stayed active for the entire 1/50 second the entire shutter takes to read out, that bottom part would be severely over-exposed. So the top 1/5 resets, exposes, and reads; then the next fifth; the next; the next; and finally the last. In the meantime, the hummingbird’s wing has moved a LONG ways - or the LED has turned itself off and back on and you get banding.

With EFCS, the entire shutter resets, it starts exposing, and in the next 1/200 second the rear curtain has covered the entire sensor. Now the sensor can read out without any of it being exposed further, because the rear curtain is covering it.

EFCS is a benefit - not a liability as vjpeters keeps asserting. He doesn’t understand it.

Yes, EFCS is mechanical shutter. The sensor scan time is around 1/340 second for the Z cameras, the same as pure mechanical.

For the Z6, 14 bit raw electronic shutter is about 1/20, a long time. Z7 at 14 bit is 1/16 second, even slower.

The Z6 iii is 1/70 second. Very usable for action, so I rarely switch to mechanical Auto.

The Z8 is 1/270 second, close to the mechanical timing.

 

[PLShutterbug]

Wow, and I'm mad. But nothing I can do about it now, and apparently it's not a big deal as I was unaware it was happening. But old fashioned me had insisted my camera be set to mechanical shutter only, now I see that most of my photos have likely been taken with electronic shutter. It apparently incorporates an electronically produced shutter sound, as I hear the shutter or thought I did when I shoot. We live and we learn I suppose. Thanks for messing up my day. :-D

I don’t know if you are serious or mocking, Bob. But vjpeters is wrong.

Using EFCS, low-shutter speed images are not taken using an electronic shutter. They are taken by using only the rear mechanical shutter curtain. There is a big difference.

Using only electronic shutter, the camera has to continuously reset sections of the shutter at speeds faster than the shutter can read out - 1/9 to 1/50 second depending on the camera model. Think of measuring a gallon of water using only a one-cup measure. You have to dip the measure in the stream, pour a cup into the vessel, dip again, and repeat until you have your gallon. And electronic shutter must reset the first part, expose and read-out that, then repeat for the entire shutter height - because at 1/250 second, that is only one-fifth the time that fastest electronic shutter can read. Remember, the sensor reads as long as it is exposed to light, so if the last section of the shutter stayed active for the entire 1/50 second the entire shutter takes to read out, that bottom part would be severely over-exposed. So the top 1/5 resets, exposes, and reads; then the next fifth; the next; the next; and finally the last. In the meantime, the hummingbird’s wing has moved a LONG ways - or the LED has turned itself off and back on and you get banding.

With EFCS, the entire shutter resets, it starts exposing, and in the next 1/200 second the rear curtain has covered the entire sensor. Now the sensor can read out without any of it being exposed further, because the rear curtain is covering it.

EFCS is a benefit - not a liability as vjpeters keeps asserting. He doesn’t understand it.

Yes, EFCS is mechanical shutter.

Yes, I agree with you. Did you think I thought it was not?

The sensor scan time is around 1/340 second for the Z cameras, the same as pure mechanical.

Not sure what you mean here. WHAT takes 1/340 for all Z cameras?

For the Z6, 14 bit raw electronic shutter is about 1/20, a long time. Z7 at 14 bit is 1/16 second, even slower.

The Z6 iii is 1/70 second. Very usable for action, so I rarely switch to mechanical Auto.

The Z8 is 1/270 second, close to the mechanical timing.

 

[vtpeters]

Thank for clarifying.

However...

With DSLR cameras the movement of the mirror, when moving out of the way just before exposure, caused a lot of vibrations too. Which in turn impacts the sharpness of the photo.

But back in the day photographers knew how to deal with this and found ways to take sharp photos despite these sources of vibration in their cameras. One might wonder how those photographers were able to take sharp photos handheld at 1/125th with a 50mm non-stabilised lens mounted on a DSLR camera without sensor-stabilisation. But they did.

I don't dumbing things down.
But at least give me the option to set my camera up the way I want to.

 

[vtpeters]

<snip>

Actually, it doesn’t. In both EFCS and pure mechanical, the sensor is not read out until the rear curtain closes.

For the OP: EFCS is not a limitation. It is a benefit especially for lower shutter speeds. Just leave the camera on Auto and forget about it.

The reason for me wanting to use the mechanical shutter is to prevent banding on my photos when photographing subjects lit by flashing LED lights.

i never had this issue when photographing with a DSLR. But after I switched to a Z9 I started to run into issues with banding on some of my photos. Dialling in High Frequency Flicker Reduction, which became available after a firmware update, during the shoot was impossible due to the nature of stage lights (constantly and very rapidly switching on and off).

So I figured that a mirrorless camera with a mechanical shutter might be the solution to that problem. But while setting up the camera to always use the mechanical shutter it turned out that the option is not available with certain lenses. Bummer.

And I understand that the front curtain moving down short before exposure causes some vibration. But what about the mirror in a DSLR, that has to be moved out of the way shortly before exposure?|And photographers were able to deal with that on the past and made sharp photos with their DSLR's.