How important is using layers in PS?

[peterm1]

I have read one of the cardinal rules in PS editing is to make any adjustments on a layer rather than the original. However, I never do this and am wondering if it is such a big deal after all.

I take photos in RAW on my 1DmkI, adjust WB and exposure in C1, convert to 16bit TIFF, and then sharpen in PS CS using local contrast sharpening (i.e., 20/40/0 in unsharp mask) and then Focus Magic or Focal Blade. Sometimes I may do a few other things in PS CS such as convert to B&W, crop, apply a warming photo filter, etc.

Is one the of the reasons to use layers that you are not harming the original file? If so, I don't really care since I have the original RAW image I can always convert again.

Is it the ability to fine tune the effect of whatever filter, etc. you are applying? If so, I usually find I can do enough tweaking with the filter's sliders and settings to get the desired result.

I would rather not use layers since it just makes the file bigger anyway. I can understand that if you are creative and like to use a lot of effects layers are indispensible, but for someone who does the normal range of post-processing to get the best looking file as outlined above, is there something I am really missing by not using layers here?

Thanks,

Peter

 

[jezsik]

Well, you're not working off your orginals, so that's good. As far as layers go, they're useful for fine tuning your images and adding additional effects. They're also good for when you want to go back and do a bit of tweaking. Once you get using them, you'll find more and more things you can do with 'em.

For example, for my portait work I'll duplicate a layer, apply soft focus to that layer, then delete some of the muted details like individual hairs or pupils. The orginal (sharp) image beneath then comes through.

As far as missing something ... yeah, sort of, but don't lose any sleep over it.

 

[JohnW@VDS]

As far as I'm concerned, the power of Photoshop lies in the layers. Just my opinion.

Well, you're not working off your orginals, so that's good. As far
as layers go, they're useful for fine tuning your images and adding
additional effects. They're also good for when you want to go back
and do a bit of tweaking. Once you get using them, you'll find more
and more things you can do with 'em.

For example, for my portait work I'll duplicate a layer, apply soft
focus to that layer, then delete some of the muted details like
individual hairs or pupils. The orginal (sharp) image beneath then
comes through.

As far as missing something ... yeah, sort of, but don't lose any
sleep over it.

 

[Georgi]

Plus I think that there are certain things you cannot do to the first layer (background) but I could be wrong.

I'm not that big on Photoshop though.

George

 

[bryan davies]

Hi,

Layer are very important and when you use them more you will find you cant do without them.
Adjustment layers allows you to tweak the pic without destroying info.

Layer blending modes allow you to blend into each other, drop shadows, I could go on and on but read a book or use the help files.
Bryan

Plus I think that there are certain things you cannot do to the
first layer (background) but I could be wrong.

I'm not that big on Photoshop though.

George

 

[blindfish]

Well, you're not working off your orginals, so that's good. As far
as layers go, they're useful for fine tuning your images and adding
additional effects. They're also good for when you want to go back
and do a bit of tweaking. Once you get using them, you'll find more
and more things you can do with 'em.

Yep - if you decide later on that a particular change isn't what you want after all you can simply remove that layer - if you've 'baked' everything into one layer you may have to ditch changes you were happy with.

For example, for my portait work I'll duplicate a layer, apply soft
focus to that layer, then delete some of the muted details like
individual hairs or pupils. The orginal (sharp) image beneath then
comes through.

I think this is particularly useful - you can paint out adjustments/changes at varying levels of opacity to reveal the layers beneath, or alternatively fill the layer to make it transparent and then paint the effect back on where necessary - in many ways easier than using selections to apply adjustments to specific areas

 

[tpf1952]

Well, you're not working off your orginals, so that's good. As far
as layers go, they're useful for fine tuning your images and adding
additional effects. They're also good for when you want to go back
and do a bit of tweaking. Once you get using them, you'll find more
and more things you can do with 'em.

Yep - if you decide later on that a particular change isn't what
you want after all you can simply remove that layer - if you've
'baked' everything into one layer you may have to ditch changes you
were happy with.

For example, for my portait work I'll duplicate a layer, apply soft
focus to that layer, then delete some of the muted details like
individual hairs or pupils. The orginal (sharp) image beneath then
comes through.

I think this is particularly useful - you can paint out
adjustments/changes at varying levels of opacity to reveal the
layers beneath, or alternatively fill the layer to make it
transparent and then paint the effect back on where necessary - in
many ways easier than using selections to apply adjustments to
specific areas

Layering is by far the best feature of Photoshop. To overcome my trepidation about learning layers, I thumbed through several Photoshop books til I found one in which the author presented the power of layers in a way that I could understand. Don't give up on them.

--
Tom F.
Raleigh, NC

 

[Terrance Vacha]

Suppose you work on you photos by using levels to WB, curves for contrast, saturation, sharpening, etc. in that order. Perhaps after saturation, you decided that you want to readjust contrast or WB. With layers, just go back to that layer and tweak it a bit.

Making an action for your workflow can help put all of the layer adjustments in quickly. When the action is done, go back and tweak those that need a little more, a little less of that layer.

Also, from a previous post, changing layers from normal, overlay, screen, multiply, etc is of enormous help in many situations.

Terry

Well, you're not working off your orginals, so that's good. As far
as layers go, they're useful for fine tuning your images and adding
additional effects. They're also good for when you want to go back
and do a bit of tweaking. Once you get using them, you'll find more
and more things you can do with 'em.

Yep - if you decide later on that a particular change isn't what
you want after all you can simply remove that layer - if you've
'baked' everything into one layer you may have to ditch changes you
were happy with.

For example, for my portait work I'll duplicate a layer, apply soft
focus to that layer, then delete some of the muted details like
individual hairs or pupils. The orginal (sharp) image beneath then
comes through.

I think this is particularly useful - you can paint out
adjustments/changes at varying levels of opacity to reveal the
layers beneath, or alternatively fill the layer to make it
transparent and then paint the effect back on where necessary - in
many ways easier than using selections to apply adjustments to
specific areas

Layering is by far the best feature of Photoshop. To overcome my
trepidation about learning layers, I thumbed through several
Photoshop books til I found one in which the author presented the
power of layers in a way that I could understand. Don't give up on
them.

--
Tom F.
Raleigh, NC

--
gallerie http://www.pbase.com/tvacha

 

[VG]

Peter,

A lot of times when I work for professional clients, I need the ability to show multiple edits of an image and also the ability to come back later and either use only one of the edits or tweak one further. Without adjustment layers and layer sets, this would be a very difficult job. For the average hobbyist, this type of workflow is usually overkill.
Regards,
VG

I have read one of the cardinal rules in PS editing is to make any
adjustments on a layer rather than the original. However, I never
do this and am wondering if it is such a big deal after all.

I take photos in RAW on my 1DmkI, adjust WB and exposure in C1,
convert to 16bit TIFF, and then sharpen in PS CS using local
contrast sharpening (i.e., 20/40/0 in unsharp mask) and then Focus
Magic or Focal Blade. Sometimes I may do a few other things in PS
CS such as convert to B&W, crop, apply a warming photo filter, etc.

Is one the of the reasons to use layers that you are not harming
the original file? If so, I don't really care since I have the
original RAW image I can always convert again.

Is it the ability to fine tune the effect of whatever filter, etc.
you are applying? If so, I usually find I can do enough tweaking
with the filter's sliders and settings to get the desired result.

I would rather not use layers since it just makes the file bigger
anyway. I can understand that if you are creative and like to use
a lot of effects layers are indispensible, but for someone who does
the normal range of post-processing to get the best looking file as
outlined above, is there something I am really missing by not using
layers here?

Thanks,

Peter

 

[rjbc]

Photoshop IS layers. let me say this again:

if you're not using layers and masks, then I dont think you're really "using" photoshop, and don't realize its full capabilities at all.

yes, there are certain things (white balance etc) that you can "re-process" if you still have the RAW original, but if that's where you're post-processing "ends"(ie after RAW conversion), you're still missing out big time. that's where my real workflow just BEGINS.

1) just about EVERYTHING PS does is eventually destructive. check the histogram palette to see what those contrast enhancements do. Or even worse, what sharpening does, or noise reduction does. It CANT BE UNDONE if you dont copy the original layer.

2) To give you an idea of my workflow, my background layer is the RAW processed orginal. Then I process via Noise Ninja (the best noise reducer IMHO) and make that the next layer, sometimes slightly blended (or masked in spots) to keep a little extra detail if NN overdoes it a bit.

Then I sharpen via a masked High Pass Layer, which in my eyes, is ESSENTIAL. there is no correct "amount" to sharpen, bec. it is ENTIRELY dependent on final PRINT SIZE: ie, if I print out at say 8x10, I blend the sharpened layer to only 50%, if I was enlarging to 13x19 I would want 100% or more sharpening. The blending allows me customize the right amount of sharpening as needed at THAT time. only amateurs ruin the original background layer via Unsharp Mask. Pro's use layers.

And then come all the usual burning dodging, saturation, etc that some images need, all done via blended layers and masks. Just like Ansel would have done, just in the digital darkroom this time.

Yes, somtimes I do have a "perfect" RAW capture and it likely does not technically "need" all this attention, but I can promise you that all this extra "work" in the workflow pays off big time, simply put, my digital images look 10 times all the better for it. If I only saved the RAW original, I would miss out on these "little things" that take the work to the "next" level.

lets be honest: each part of an image "needs" TOTALLY different things:

certain details (like eyes or faces) need to be sharpened more, some not at all, backgrounds and horizons often need to be smoothed, certain spots needs brighter bits, others darker bits. If you're applying any of these things to the entire image without masks, and/or (shame on you!) not using layers, you are taking the quick and easy way out.

put some work in and learn how to really use PS. Layers and Masks are the HEART & SOUL of Photoshop.

 

[Virgílio #229992]

Primordial, essential, crême de la crême, the cherry on top, the dot on the i, my life, my love, layers are you best friend, your rest, your everything.

Get to know them, they will make you one of the happiest beings on the face of the planet, and don't forget theyr fellas, the masks, also they love to be blend in several ways, and sometimes the cousins "adjustments" or the "fill" layers, give very precious and vital fullfilment to your goals.

They're picky and tricky at the begining, but that because you don't know them, some time later you'll just be unable to live without them!
That IMHO, and my thanks for having layers to sort thing out.

 

[Michael Browers]

If you're not using layers and masks, chances are you don't need such a high priced software solution as PS CS. Once you learn what layers and masks can do, you'll probably wonder how you got by without them.
M

 

[Miguel Barrio]

How about having a layer with WB, one with Curves, one with dodging, one with Unsharp Mask, one with Lens blur in one section of the image?

How about being able to adjust each effect WITHOUT having to deal with the previous adjustment?

How about turning each one on and off instantly?

Layers are ABSOLUTELY indispensible for any serious work!

Miguel

 

[jralbert]

I have read one of the cardinal rules in PS editing is to make any
adjustments on a layer rather than the original. However, I never
do this and am wondering if it is such a big deal after all.

Peter: the beauty of layers is that you can apply a correction without having altered the entire image. If later you don't like the image correction you can re-do or kill just the layer without having to go back and re-do all your work.

In addition, there are the other artisitic adjustments mentIoned in the other posts. You should title the layer to indicate the correction being applied (eg: "red dress"). So, yes, it's worth reading up on layers and using them freely.
--
joel albert
[email protected]