F717 overexposure with onboard flash

[Zane Cole]

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.

My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

 

[Hal Fisher]

I thought the onboard flash gave a fairly good flash level. But, you can adjust for what you like if you use Manual mode. I would suggest setting the flash on Medium with Aperture of 4.0 and a shutter speed of 160 should work welll. For a portrait I would say an aperture of 2.0 would be best (blurs background).

Hal

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that
it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.


My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots
indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I
have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still
have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried
moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't
big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking
the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to
adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only
works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in
AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the
instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on
the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

 

[Zane Cole]

I thought the onboard flash gave a fairly good flash level. But,
you can adjust for what you like if you use Manual mode. I would
suggest setting the flash on Medium with Aperture of 4.0 and a
shutter speed of 160 should work welll. For a portrait I would say
an aperture of 2.0 would be best (blurs background).

Hal

Thanks, Hal

I have been experimenting with Manual mode and found that solved the problem. I'll try the Aperture of 4.0.

Zane

 

[netguru717]

The 707 flash metering were 20 or 30 levels better. From another planet !

I am sure it will be better after the fix.

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that
it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.


My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots
indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I
have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still
have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried
moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't
big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking
the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to
adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only
works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in
AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the
instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on
the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

 

[Yehuda Katz]

Zane

May I suggest that you refrain from using the onboard flash indoors, mainly because it is a sure recipe for getting red eyes!

Instead get yourself an external flash. (I have currently a Vivitar 2000, $17 at Wal-Mart, and am very happy with it. You can even bounce it. At ISO 100 I use it in manual mode with f:3.1, and can't remember missing a photo with it.

Regards, Yehuda

 

[HenCon]

I have found that after the update, my 717 works a lot better with the onboard flash, as well as the Sony F1000 external flash. Before the update the F1000 pictures taken with the F1000 was over-exposed to such an extent, that they were useless - completely washed out. After the update, with the flash level set to low for close distances, it (F1000) exposes pictures about the same as the onboard flash. In one word, it works very well with the F1000 now. Unfortunately, I have found that the 717 still has a problem with pictures taken at distances less than 2 m - although they are almost focused, one does not require an expert eye to see that they are still slightly out of focus. Sony South Africa has however been very helpful and has exchanged the camera with another unit, which is better, but it is still not focusing 100% at

 

[David Dredge]

I noticed in another thread that teh user had a similar problem.

All I can say is it works fine to my eyes. My flash exposures have been spot on.

Iincidently how does changing the flash output affect the result? If using TTL surely the camnera will give whatever it needs to product a good shot?

Dave

I have found that after the update, my 717 works a lot better with
the onboard flash, as well as the Sony F1000 external flash. Before
the update the F1000 pictures taken with the F1000 was over-exposed
to such an extent, that they were useless - completely washed out.
After the update, with the flash level set to low for close
distances, it (F1000) exposes pictures about the same as the
onboard flash. In one word, it works very well with the F1000 now.
Unfortunately, I have found that the 717 still has a problem with
pictures taken at distances less than 2 m - although they are
almost focused, one does not require an expert eye to see that they
are still slightly out of focus. Sony South Africa has however been
very helpful and has exchanged the camera with another unit, which
is better, but it is still not focusing 100% at
(wide angle). Sony SA have referred the problem to Sony Singapore
and I'm waiting for their response.

--
David D

 

[grimace]

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that
it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.


My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots
indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I
have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still
have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried
moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't
big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking
the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to
adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only
works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in
AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the
instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on
the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

Yep My 717 overexposes- I dont see how in 2002 a camera cant compute the correct flash to correctly expose pics in auto setting-its not good enough..grrrrrrrr......

 

[Jay Jervey]

Try using manual mode with F4 and shutter 1/125 or more. That should help with the slight focus issue (it's really a DOF issue when using wide apertures). Just something to try.

I have found that after the update, my 717 works a lot better with
the onboard flash, as well as the Sony F1000 external flash. Before
the update the F1000 pictures taken with the F1000 was over-exposed
to such an extent, that they were useless - completely washed out.
After the update, with the flash level set to low for close
distances, it (F1000) exposes pictures about the same as the
onboard flash. In one word, it works very well with the F1000 now.
Unfortunately, I have found that the 717 still has a problem with
pictures taken at distances less than 2 m - although they are
almost focused, one does not require an expert eye to see that they
are still slightly out of focus. Sony South Africa has however been
very helpful and has exchanged the camera with another unit, which
is better, but it is still not focusing 100% at
(wide angle). Sony SA have referred the problem to Sony Singapore
and I'm waiting for their response.

--
Jay Jervey
Former Sony DSC-S70, S85, F707
Canon S200 (ultra portable)
Sony DSC-F717

 

[Jeremy Birn61459]

The flash itself does an auto-exposure pre-flash thing on the F707, so that even in full "Manual" mode, shutting down to f8 and 1/1000th shutter speed at 100 ISO for example, doesn't really darken your image much if you are close to your subject, because the flash just makes itself brighter to make up for your other settings. (Being close to a subject with a black background is the worst situation.)

Does anybody else wish the flash had a M option instead of just + - so that we could adjust flash brightness with the thumbwheel just like other exposure parameters?

-jeremy

I am sure it will be better after the fix.

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that
it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.


My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots
indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I
have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still
have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried
moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't
big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking
the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to
adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only
works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in
AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the
instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on
the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

--
Jeremy Birn
http://www.3dRender.com/

 

[netguru717]

Yes, the cam has a TTL flash. I like it, of cause I have to think of backgroundcolor and such things. I often flash at F 2.0 for less red eyes.
M flash ? I dont miss but of cause we never can enough features. (-:

Does anybody else wish the flash had a M option instead of just + -
so that we could adjust flash brightness with the thumbwheel just
like other exposure parameters?

-jeremy

I am sure it will be better after the fix.

I have had my 717 for just 3-4 days and have quickly learned that
it is not capable of making a professional out of a rank amature.


My biggest problem seems to be overexposure when taking shots
indoors when the light conditions call for the onboard flash. I
have set the Flash Level to Low, which helps marginally, but still
have the problem of washed out colors on many shots; I have tried
moving further away from the subject, but the room most often isn't
big enough. The camera just seems so sensitive! (When checking
the ISO , it has been at 100) I even tried using the histogram to
adjust the exposure, but have come to the conclusion that only
works when not using the flash. Most of my shooting has been in
AutoP mode. I know the problem is me, not the camera; I wish the
instruction manual offered a little more detailed information on
the many impressive features of this camera.

Any suggestions?

Zane

--
Jeremy Birn
http://www.3dRender.com/

 

[Zane Cole]

Thanks to all for everyone's suggestions. Sorry to be away so long but business has prevented me from getting back until now. I am still wrestling with which work-around is easiest for me; still disappointed in my camera's inability to generate acceptable photos in automatic mode......especially with the onboard flash.

Yehuda, I did get a Vivitar 2000(at that price not much to lose) to give it a try thinking that perhaps the problem was the onboard flash. I haven't had much time to "play" with it yet, but so far it is worse than the onboard flash. By that I mean that since it appears to be more powerful than the onboard flash, the over-exposure is TOTAL. Nothing but white. If I go to manual mode and set f8.0, it will produce only slightly over exposed shots. Of course by bouncing the flash at about 45 degrees I can lower the f-stop to 4 or 5. I am beginning to suspect a problem with this particular camera as others here have not complained about over-exposure being such a significant problem.

I was counting on this camera to take pictures at my dad's(he's 78 years young) wedding this weekend, but we will probably be restricted to outdoor shots or indoor shots without a flash. BTW, the camera does very well, in all modes, when not using the flash. I love the detail and sharpness it produces along with the 2560x1920 images. The colors, imo, are also very good.

Zane

Zane

May I suggest that you refrain from using the onboard flash
indoors, mainly because it is a sure recipe for getting red eyes!

Instead get yourself an external flash. (I have currently a Vivitar
2000, $17 at Wal-Mart, and am very happy with it. You can even
bounce it. At ISO 100 I use it in manual mode with f:3.1, and can't
remember missing a photo with it.

Regards, Yehuda

 

[Zane Cole]

UPDATE ! ! ! !

Yehuda,

You might want to visit the following link which indicates that the Vivitar 2000 may be harmful to the F717 because of too high a trigger voltage.
http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html

John Rising posted this over at http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=3733601

I am returning the Vivitar 2000 I bought yesterday so as not to take any chances.

Thanks again,

Zane

Zane

May I suggest that you refrain from using the onboard flash
indoors, mainly because it is a sure recipe for getting red eyes!

Instead get yourself an external flash. (I have currently a Vivitar
2000, $17 at Wal-Mart, and am very happy with it. You can even
bounce it. At ISO 100 I use it in manual mode with f:3.1, and can't
remember missing a photo with it.

Regards, Yehuda

 

[arra]

Can You put examples of Yours overexposed flash pictures?

netguru717: I think my 717 is from another planet too.

If You have real problem Your camera need to be fixed - CALL SONY!

BTW. My camera isn't fixed yet.

--- Arra ---
Poland
Sony DSC-F717
(I am going to buy sharper 2 megapixel camera...)
http://www.pbase.com/717

 

[Russ Yost]

Perhaps you're setting the exposure metering at other than "spot".

Spot will control the flash to properly expose the subject, rather than the more distant backgroound. As to focusing problems under 2 meters, perhaps you should be useing the Macro mode. Another source pf error could be the HAF pattern falling partly on other than the subject. In Phil's review, he mentioned focusing on a person's torso, then holding the half press while reaiming at the subject's face, then making the exposure.

I don't have an F7x7 yet, so these remarks may have to be interpreted

Yehuda, I did get a Vivitar 2000(at that price not much to lose) to
give it a try thinking that perhaps the problem was the onboard
flash. I haven't had much time to "play" with it yet, but so far
it is worse than the onboard flash. By that I mean that since it
appears to be more powerful than the onboard flash, the
over-exposure is TOTAL. Nothing but white. If I go to manual mode
and set f8.0, it will produce only slightly over exposed shots. Of
course by bouncing the flash at about 45 degrees I can lower the
f-stop to 4 or 5. I am beginning to suspect a problem with this
particular camera as others here have not complained about
over-exposure being such a significant problem.

I was counting on this camera to take pictures at my dad's(he's 78
years young) wedding this weekend, but we will probably be
restricted to outdoor shots or indoor shots without a flash. BTW,
the camera does very well, in all modes, when not using the flash.
I love the detail and sharpness it produces along with the
2560x1920 images. The colors, imo, are also very good.

Zane

Zane

May I suggest that you refrain from using the onboard flash
indoors, mainly because it is a sure recipe for getting red eyes!

Instead get yourself an external flash. (I have currently a Vivitar
2000, $17 at Wal-Mart, and am very happy with it. You can even
bounce it. At ISO 100 I use it in manual mode with f:3.1, and can't
remember missing a photo with it.

Regards, Yehuda

--
Russell

 

[netguru717]

They change only 2 values in the software but I heard this would also have influence to flash in some situations.

I also had the laser on testing. Took some pictures and sent in on monday. Before I had a 707.

Can You put examples of Yours overexposed flash pictures?

netguru717: I think my 717 is from another planet too.

If You have real problem Your camera need to be fixed - CALL SONY!

BTW. My camera isn't fixed yet.

--- Arra ---
Poland
Sony DSC-F717
(I am going to buy sharper 2 megapixel camera...)
http://www.pbase.com/717

 

[grimace]

Yehuda,

You might want to visit the following link which indicates that the
Vivitar 2000 may be harmful to the F717 because of too high a
trigger voltage.
http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html

John Rising posted this over at
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1009&message=3733601

I am returning the Vivitar 2000 I bought yesterday so as not to
take any chances.

Thanks again,

Zane

Zane

May I suggest that you refrain from using the onboard flash
indoors, mainly because it is a sure recipe for getting red eyes!

Instead get yourself an external flash. (I have currently a Vivitar
2000, $17 at Wal-Mart, and am very happy with it. You can even
bounce it. At ISO 100 I use it in manual mode with f:3.1, and can't
remember missing a photo with it.

Regards, Yehuda

I still expect the inbuilt flash on the 717 to compute a correct exposure within its flash range - most film cameras I have do it easily

is there a problem with the pop up 717 flash software?????