Difference between snapshot and photo

scaron

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While checking out CCs POTD at Steve's Digicam (great shot!) I noticed in his posting instructions the phrase "There's a big difference between photographs and snapshots."

I'm sure I agree, but as a newbie I'm still at the "I can't define it but I know it when I see it" stage.

So, in your opinion, what are the elements that differentiate a snapshot from a photograph?

Sean
 
To me a snapshot is a picture that was taken with no thought in it at all.

Grab the camera point it and shoot it. The exposure may not be just right and the composition may not really be that good. This is not to say that if you think about what you are doing that you will not get a snapshot.

A non-snapshot is a picture that has had a lot of thought put into it. The person looked at all the angles, picked the best one, looked and thought about what they want in the DOF and how they wanted to compose it, got the exposure right on. Again you may think about a shot all day and still come up with a snapshot.

This is only my opinion.

This is a snapshot, I just took the picture with no real thought to anything but getting the whole tractor in the shot.
http://www.pbase.com/image/26839401

This is a photograph, I was trying to get the angle just right and the lighting the way I wanted, but also this is more then likely a snapshot to other people.
http://www.pbase.com/image/26839399

So it still boils down to the person behind the camera and what they think a snapshot is.

--
Bill Huber
 
To me a snapshot is a picture that was taken with no thought in it
at all.
Grab the camera point it and shoot it. The exposure may not be just
right and the composition may not really be that good. This is not
to say that if you think about what you are doing that you will not
get a snapshot.

A non-snapshot is a picture that has had a lot of thought put into
it. The person looked at all the angles, picked the best one,
looked and thought about what they want in the DOF and how they
wanted to compose it, got the exposure right on. Again you may
think about a shot all day and still come up with a snapshot.

This is only my opinion.
This is a snapshot, I just took the picture with no real thought to
anything but getting the whole tractor in the shot.
http://www.pbase.com/image/26839401

This is a photograph, I was trying to get the angle just right and
the lighting the way I wanted, but also this is more then likely a
snapshot to other people.
http://www.pbase.com/image/26839399

So it still boils down to the person behind the camera and what
they think a snapshot is.

--
Bill Huber
I would like to take Bill's definition a bit further:

To me, a snapshot is made to describe the subject, to show what it looks like.

The photographer is not trying to interpret the subject for others, to express an idea, a point of view or tell a story. Snapshots simply show us what the subject looks like, but say relatively little about it.

A photograph, on the other hand, does the very opposite. It is, as Bill points out, made with forethought, but it can also go on to express the photographer's thoughts about what he or she sees.

How do we make expressive photographs? I have put together a learning resource on this subject at http://www.pbase.com/pnd1 . I would be happy to answer any questions. (I happen to currently use Canon cameras, but everything I say in my pbase galleries applies just as much to those using Olympus products.

In any event, thanks for posting this thread. Cameras don't make photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form or the tool used to make it.

Phil Douglis
Director, The Douglis Visual Workshops
Phoenix, Arizona
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1
http://www.worldisround.com/home/pnd1/index.html
http://www.funkytraveller.com/Pages/travelogues/travelphotophild.htm
 
In any event, thanks for posting this thread. Cameras don't make
photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a
tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form
or the tool used to make it.
Thanks Phil for posting the link to your gallery. It is very insightful and helps newbies like me to "see" better.

Camilo_C
----------------
Trying to learn how to make nice pictures.
http://www.pbase.com/camilocano
 
But to be honest, I can just tell by looking at them. I can't really define the difference between an excellent photo and a good one. It has to do with composition, focus and exposure. And then there's often an indefinable quality to a really great photo. It makes you go WOW! or feel some emotion, be it sadness or joy.

Having said that, if we used that definition there are very few photos and lots of snapshots out there and I don't really agree with that whole premise. I think there are a lot of excellent "snapshots" that I would call photos.

Karen

--



'Let us cross over the river and rest under the shade of the trees.'

Last words of General Thomas 'Stonewall' Jackson, killed in error by his own troops at the battle of Chancellorsvillle during the US Civil War, 1863.
 
it has to be composition! The lighting and exposure are learned ~ composition is in the eye of the camera holder!! You can follow techniques, but in the end, you have to have an "eye" for outstanding photographs!!

I think of a snapshot as a picture of friends or family at an event ~ something you look at for remembrance of an event. A photogragh is something you look at and see or feel an emotion from!

The others here have said it much better then I could ~ I'm with Karen on one thing ~ I know one when I see one!!

Good thread ~ very tough to answer!!

DaveZ
UZI

http://www.pbase.com/davezz

 
"There's a big difference between photographs and snapshots."
A square is ALWAYS a rectangle, but a rectangle is NOT always a square.

A snapshot is by definition a photograph. But sometimes a photograph will rise above the mundane and becomes something much greater. A work of art, perhaps.

Occasionally this happens by sheer luck. Most of the time, however, it's by design.

The more we learn about and apply the secrets of the science / art of photography, the greater the odds become that we will -- if we're lucky -- one day produce a photograph that others will view and say "now THAT's a work of art!"

Even if it was just one of our snapshots.

--

 
In any event, thanks for posting this thread. Cameras don't make
photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a
tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form
or the tool used to make it.
Thanks Phil for posting the link to your gallery. It is very
insightful and helps newbies like me to "see" better.

Camilo_C
----------------
Trying to learn how to make nice pictures.
http://www.pbase.com/camilocano
--

Camilo,

Thanks -- glad to be of help. Feel free to ask any questions you might have and leave comments under my pictures. I will be adding new images and galleries as I travel.

By the way, you long exposure of Niagara Falls at night ( http://www.pbase.com/image/24093560 ) is a spectacular use of time to express an idea.

Phil Douglis
Director, The Douglis Visual Workshops
Phoenix, Arizona
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1
http://www.worldisround.com/home/pnd1/index.html
http://www.funkytraveller.com/Pages/travelogues/travelphotophild.htm
 
"There's a big difference between photographs and snapshots."
A square is ALWAYS a rectangle, but a rectangle is NOT always a
square.

A snapshot is by definition a photograph. But sometimes a
photograph will rise above the mundane and becomes something much
greater. A work of art, perhaps.

Occasionally this happens by sheer luck. Most of the time, however,
it's by design.

The more we learn about and apply the secrets of the science / art
of photography, the greater the odds become that we will -- if
we're lucky -- one day produce a photograph that others will view
and say "now THAT's a work of art!"

Even if it was just one of our snapshots.

--
Hi Scaron, Bill, Camilo, Dave, Karen, Lucy, and Beacon:

What some of you are saying in this thread is very true -- photography intended to function as expression is not just a matter of good luck, but rather, as you say, Beacon, it is the result of "design." How else can we consistently make images that stimulate the imaginations, emotions, and intellects of those who will view them?

Yet sometimes, as Karen believes, a casually made snapshot, created without any particular intention in mind, other than recording the scene or moment, may wind up working just as well as a carefully considered and well executed image, becoming something more than an accidental, mindless snapshot. Lucky? Perhaps. Yet more often than not, such "luck" usually turns out to be the residue of "design." Otherwise, why do so many people who have successfully devoted their lives to photography seem to have a corner on such "luck?"

After thirty-five years of teaching photographic communication, I can assure you that it comes down to a matter of applied knowledge. Some Photographer's (with that capital "P") may pre-visualize their images, first coming up with an idea for a picture and then working on it until it succeeds. Others may post-visualize their photographs, intuitively recognizing meaning in what they see, and then go on to simultaneously use their choices in light, time, and space to compose a picture that memorably expresses an idea or tells a story. Often its a combination of both pre and post-visualized thinking and seeing that produces an expressive image.

Excellent photographs rely heavily on three key principles I discuss in my first three pbase galleries: abstraction, incongruity, and human values. It is abstraction that prods the imagination, incongruity that turns the ordinary into the extraordinary, and resonant human values that bring meaning home to us as people. Only when these principles are working for us, can our choices in space, time, light, and composition take over, and help the photo do its job esthetically.

Lucy's quote offers still another thoughtful answer to Scaron's question -- Photography is indeed the art of seeing what others do not. A good picture is, more often not, based on a fresh idea.

This has been a thought provoking thread -- more important in its implications than long threads that fill these forums with interminable discussions of resolution, pixel counts, zoom ranges and which camera is "best." Our cameras, no matter how much we spend on them, are just tools, a means to an end. It is the photographer and his or her photographs that speak -- the camera itself has no mind.

Phil Douglis
Director, The Douglis Visual Workshops
Phoenix, Arizona
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1
http://www.worldisround.com/home/pnd1/index.html
http://www.funkytraveller.com/Pages/travelogues/travelphotophild.htm
 
A very, very good question... and many excellent answers too, but I don't think there's one simple answer. I have to agree with Karen; I also have about 3 gazillion snapshots in my drawer. The good ones were the one or two per film (still snapshots though!) which I'd be glad to pick out and think, well, at least these have made it worthwhile spending the money on the film and development. And then, once in a while, you may capture a particular emotion or moment in a photograph that makes it special for anyone who sees it. Snapshots are the ones with which you bore friends and family. Photographs are the ones which they ask to see again, long after you've taken them.

Bill Huber's two photographs are a very good indication of which is which, imo. The snapshot would be the best one to use if he'd wanted to sell that tractor and needed to convey all the information possible with one image, but the photograph would be the one to use if he'd wanted to convey a particular idea about John Deere products and what they stand for.

My mom has a simple P/S film camera, hopefully to be replaced by a digital soon, with a too short zoom lens, with which she takes the most amazingly crisp photographs of my niece and nephew. She still clings to the first advice I gave her when she started taking photographs: "Squeeze, don't press!" and that's all she concentrates on, but every now and then she comes up with something really great; a pair of huge blue eyes or a special smile... I don't know which should be called snapshots and which photographs; maybe there are things such as good snapshots and bad photographs? :}
"There's a big difference between photographs and snapshots."
A square is ALWAYS a rectangle, but a rectangle is NOT always a
square.

A snapshot is by definition a photograph. But sometimes a
photograph will rise above the mundane and becomes something much
greater. A work of art, perhaps.

Occasionally this happens by sheer luck. Most of the time, however,
it's by design.

The more we learn about and apply the secrets of the science / art
of photography, the greater the odds become that we will -- if
we're lucky -- one day produce a photograph that others will view
and say "now THAT's a work of art!"

Even if it was just one of our snapshots.

--
Hi Scaron, Bill, Camilo, Dave, Karen, Lucy, and Beacon:

What some of you are saying in this thread is very true --
photography intended to function as expression is not just a
matter of good luck, but rather, as you say, Beacon, it is the
result of "design." How else can we consistently make images that
stimulate the imaginations, emotions, and intellects of those who
will view them?

Yet sometimes, as Karen believes, a casually made snapshot, created
without any particular intention in mind, other than recording the
scene or moment, may wind up working just as well as a carefully
considered and well executed image, becoming something more than an
accidental, mindless snapshot. Lucky? Perhaps. Yet more often than
not, such "luck" usually turns out to be the residue of "design."
Otherwise, why do so many people who have successfully devoted
their lives to photography seem to have a corner on such "luck?"

After thirty-five years of teaching photographic communication, I
can assure you that it comes down to a matter of applied knowledge.
Some Photographer's (with that capital "P") may pre-visualize their
images, first coming up with an idea for a picture and then working
on it until it succeeds. Others may post-visualize their
photographs, intuitively recognizing meaning in what they see, and
then go on to simultaneously use their choices in light, time, and
space to compose a picture that memorably expresses an idea or
tells a story. Often its a combination of both pre and
post-visualized thinking and seeing that produces an expressive
image.

Excellent photographs rely heavily on three key principles I
discuss in my first three pbase galleries: abstraction,
incongruity, and human values. It is abstraction that prods the
imagination, incongruity that turns the ordinary into the
extraordinary, and resonant human values that bring meaning home to
us as people. Only when these principles are working for us, can
our choices in space, time, light, and composition take over, and
help the photo do its job esthetically.

Lucy's quote offers still another thoughtful answer to Scaron's
question -- Photography is indeed the art of seeing what others do
not. A good picture is, more often not, based on a fresh idea.

This has been a thought provoking thread -- more important in its
implications than long threads that fill these forums with
interminable discussions of resolution, pixel counts, zoom ranges
and which camera is "best." Our cameras, no matter how much we
spend on them, are just tools, a means to an end. It is the
photographer and his or her photographs that speak -- the camera
itself has no mind.

Phil Douglis
Director, The Douglis Visual Workshops
Phoenix, Arizona
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1
http://www.worldisround.com/home/pnd1/index.html
http://www.funkytraveller.com/Pages/travelogues/travelphotophild.htm
 
Some very thought-provoking comments have been made in this great thread, especially Phil's very incisive discussion.

To me, there is no clear line of distinction between a snapshot and a photograph. As Phil's discussion reveals, it is more a question of what makes a good photograph better, or even great. Any photo can be technically perfect, with fine exposure, focus, and shutter; following all the rules of composition, yet lack that intangible quality that makes it interesting or dynamic in the eyes of the viewer.

A good photograph can be planned, spontaneous, or combination of each as Phil mentioned in discussing pre and post-visualized thinking.

The photographer who has mastered the basic principles is much more likely to take a 'good' photograph when composition, camera settings, perspective, and awareness of the subject matter becomes more intuitive to the trained hand and eye. Some seem to have a gift of a "photographer's eye" which recognizes something unique or interesting and takes advantage of the opportunity. This can be planned or a 'shoot from the hip' situation but is not really a "snapshot", as when the mind processes the scene and takes action through manipulation of the camera to record what has been seen. So often, the opportunity lasts for a fleeting moment, as when the subject is moving or certain light conditions last for a brief time. This "recognition factor" is so important in separating a good photograph from the ordinary.

One of the most recognized great photos is that of raising the flag at Iwo Jima. Joe Rosenthal was not the only photographer there and he took other photos, but it's this one that captured the moment in sensational fashion. It was his "applied knowledge" that caused the shot to be taken, though even he didn't realize the full impact of what he had until the image was developed. First, he was there. Second, he had skill and training; Third, he had "the eye"; and Fourth, he took the shot.

I consider myself only a novice in technical knowledge and ability but, as Karen put it, I think I know the difference when I see it! :)

Digital photogaphy and developments in software gives the photographer a second chance at images that don't seem so good right out of the camera. Sometimes all it takes is a simple crop; others require more extensive post-processing.

This is one of my favorite photos. I was following my daughter and her new puppy around, and took it with my C-2100UZ. It is a crop of only about 25% of the original photo but is the portion that caught my eye when I reviewed it.



Sure, it lacks the detail of a full-frame image, especially with only a 2mp camera, but the part selected for cropping is the heart of the photo. The full image might be considered just a snapshot, but that special part, to me, is the photograph.

Taking lots of photographs certainly increases the chances of getting a really good one, but some skill and training makes the odds much higher in your favor. The only really bad photograph is the one not taken!

Great discussion! Thanks for raising the question, Sean.

****:)
While checking out CCs POTD at Steve's Digicam (great shot!) I
noticed in his posting instructions the phrase "There's a big
difference between photographs and snapshots."

I'm sure I agree, but as a newbie I'm still at the "I can't define
it but I know it when I see it" stage.

So, in your opinion, what are the elements that differentiate a
snapshot from a photograph?

Sean
--
http://www.pbase.com/richardr
E-10&C-2100UZ&C-3000Z&D-40&D-380&Fuji2600Z
PBase Supporter
 
Hi

Actually, I take lots of snapshots. Some have photographs embedded in them that I can extract by cropping and fiddling with color balance, brightness and contrast in a photoeditor.

I use a C-5050Z, and frame through the optical viewfinder (I've never been able to get comfortable with holding a camera at arm's length to use the LCD screen - too many years using conventional SLRs), so final composition is almost impossible at the time of shooting.
While checking out CCs POTD at Steve's Digicam (great shot!) I
noticed in his posting instructions the phrase "There's a big
difference between photographs and snapshots."

I'm sure I agree, but as a newbie I'm still at the "I can't define
it but I know it when I see it" stage.

So, in your opinion, what are the elements that differentiate a
snapshot from a photograph?

Sean
 
Camilo,

Wow! Phil is right on (thanks for posting the link, Phil). That Falls picture is DEFINITELY NOT a snapshot! Really well done. Must have been from the US side, no? :-) I also heartily concur with his quote (which I reiterate below) one which has governed my thoughts since R.I.T.

(To be used as a meditational mantra!)

Cameras don't make photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form or the tool used to make it.

TC.
Leigh
In any event, thanks for posting this thread. Cameras don't make
photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a
tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form
or the tool used to make it.
Thanks Phil for posting the link to your gallery. It is very
insightful and helps newbies like me to "see" better.

Camilo_C
----------------
Trying to learn how to make nice pictures.
http://www.pbase.com/camilocano
--

Camilo,

Thanks -- glad to be of help. Feel free to ask any questions you
might have and leave comments under my pictures. I will be adding
new images and galleries as I travel.

By the way, you long exposure of Niagara Falls at night
( http://www.pbase.com/image/24093560 ) is a spectacular use of time
to express an idea.

Phil Douglis
Director, The Douglis Visual Workshops
Phoenix, Arizona
[email protected]
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1
http://www.worldisround.com/home/pnd1/index.html
http://www.funkytraveller.com/Pages/travelogues/travelphotophild.htm
--
Please visit all my galleries at Webshots.com!
http://community.webshots.com/user/leightower
Nikon Coolpix990, Olympus C-5060
 
Indeed, thanx to Phil and Wonderfull gallery Camilo_C. I love shooting moving water over long exposures and always wondered why I didn't see more Niagra shots like that. More please when you get time. Even if you do use that OTHER camera! B^)

dwn
In any event, thanks for posting this thread. Cameras don't make
photographs. Photographers make photographs. A camera is only a
tool. Ultimately an image's content is more important than its form
or the tool used to make it.
Thanks Phil for posting the link to your gallery. It is very
insightful and helps newbies like me to "see" better.

Camilo_C
----------------
Trying to learn how to make nice pictures.
http://www.pbase.com/camilocano
--

Camilo,

Thanks -- glad to be of help. Feel free to ask any questions you
might have and leave comments under my pictures. I will be adding
new images and galleries as I travel.

By the way, you long exposure of Niagara Falls at night
( http://www.pbase.com/image/24093560 ) is a spectacular use of time
to express an idea.
 
Folks,

this has been great - I think each reply has some nugget of goodness to help a newbie make progress.

My take-aways go like this:
  • A "snapshot" is a record of a place in time
I think this is a snapshot http://www.pbase.com/image/26961619
Im only trying to convey the bleakness of upstate NY at winter's end, and
perhaps win an award for using every shade of brown in the camera's pallete
  • A "photograph" is an effort by a photographer to tell a story.
This is a photograph! http://www.pbase.com/image/25457843

(Thanks Phil) - I tried to describe this image to somebody today and couldn't do it. the photograph tells the story. How much of what we own and use everyday are in those boxes?

Sometimes snapshots become photographs - through serendipity (a fancy word for luck). See this http://www.pbase.com/image/26784653

The origin of my signature phrase "Even a blind squirrel gets a nut once in a while."

Also, sometimes snapshots become photographs thru judicious post-processing in a "digital darkroom" - extracting a message from the canvas of the raw image. Im not good enuf with PS yet to do this, but believe it could be done.

So how does this "navel gazing" on the nature of snapshots and photographs help me create images I'd be proud to frame and hang on my library wall, and tell folks when they come over "I took that!!!"

Lesson 1:

"Try to have a story in mind." Look at Phil's stuff, and explore the ways he describes for telling a story with an image. Keep those lessons in mind. Look at the world as a "potential storyteller".

Lesson 2:

"Quality photographs need Quantity photographs to happen in". Dont be afraid to shoot, to bracket and mess with exposures and angles and let that story appear. After all, we all flush pixels - its not like we are paying to develop this stuff ! ;-)

Well, professors, did I get it right?

Sincerely, thanks.
Sean
While checking out CCs POTD at Steve's Digicam (great shot!) I
noticed in his posting instructions the phrase "There's a big
difference between photographs and snapshots."

I'm sure I agree, but as a newbie I'm still at the "I can't define
it but I know it when I see it" stage.

So, in your opinion, what are the elements that differentiate a
snapshot from a photograph?

Sean
 
Sean and everyone who replied -

This was one of those "affirming" threads, that help me realize why I enjoy trying to take photographs, rather than just snapshots, even though snapshots have their place and value too.

I agree with Bill's point, that it's often the forethought (successful or unsuccessful) that helps tip the balance, but doesn't guarantee it.

I recall our long-time and very talented member 3D Tim's comment that while he's taken bunches of "snaps" (as he calls them) that have provided meaning and enjoyment for his family and friends, those weren't what he tended to post here for the Forum.

This topic, and the replies, and the links, and the examples resonated with me.

Not that all this good info will be able to do much about my skills, except to get me to practice, practice, practice - LOL!

Eric
--
pbase supporter
http://www.pbase.com/catalyst
 
An excellent thread, throughly enjoyable and educational....

For me snapshots are something I take to preserve memories at family gatherings etc, the subject is more important than the composition and are not intended for public viewing.

The quest to take a good photograph is one of my pleasures, I rarely succeed but it is fun trying, I have little success at planned shots, that is going to a specific location to take a specific shot. To compensate for this I'm trying to teach myself how to look, how to find subject matter in things and places you would generally walk past or ignore, I will stop at a random spot on a trail or a street and spend a few minutes just looking around picking out the details. Quite few people are surprised when they discover the shots they were looking at were taken less than two blocks from where they have lived for many year and were totally unaware that the subject of the shots existed...

John q

--
John Q....Olympus C-2100, Canon 300D
http://www.pbase.com/john_q

 

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