Curved sensors - good or a bad development ?

[Marco Cinnirella]

So I see some of the big names are lodging patents on new curved sensors and lenses to work with them. I'm pondering what this means for those of us with established and extensive lens collections - will these become obsolete and we have to buy a whole new set of lenses if the future = curved sensors ? I know lens development happens and in time replacement of lenses might need to happen but usually you envisage this happening gradually and selectively since some lenses can last us 30+ years of great service and results. It would be a bitter pill if we had to ditch all our existing lenses to use with shiny new bodies that featue curved sensors? Do you think such bodies would exist in parallel with bodies that used existing sensor tech?

I odn't mean this to be a doom and gloom post but I think it raises a valid point - is this a good time to stop buying expensive lenses if they might not work on new cameras featuring these new curved sensors ?

 

[loitokitok]

So I see some of the big names are lodging patents on new curved sensors and lenses to work with them. I'm pondering what this means for those of us with established and extensive lens collections - will these become obsolete and we have to buy a whole new set of lenses if the future = curved sensors ? I know lens development happens and in time replacement of lenses might need to happen but usually you envisage this happening gradually and selectively since some lenses can last us 30+ years of great service and results. It would be a bitter pill if we had to ditch all our existing lenses to use with shiny new bodies that featue curved sensors? Do you think such bodies would exist in parallel with bodies that used existing sensor tech?

I odn't mean this to be a doom and gloom post but I think it raises a valid point - is this a good time to stop buying expensive lenses if they might not work on new cameras featuring these new curved sensors ?

 

[Sonyshine]

"While the team from Sony showed off images from the curved sensors integrated with lenses, it did not provide comparisons with equivalent systems employing traditional, flat image sensors. One caveat we feel compelled to point out is that an image sensor with a given amount of curvature must be matched to a particular lens such that the curvature matches the inherent field curvature of that lens (which changes with focal length, aperture, etc.). This means that such curved sensors will probably only find their ways into fixed-lens cameras in the near future. That is, until a point in time when the curvature of the sensors can be adjusted on the fly (if ever)"

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www.dpreview.com

--

Stupidity is far more fascinating than intelligence. Intelligence has its limits...

 

[johnny_mnemonic]

If it ever come to fruition it's likely to be a scheme to make your current gear obsolete and fuel the urge to upgrade.

Highly corrected (ie expensive) lenses these days do great in the corners with flat sensors. And i think it's probably a given that curved sensors with matched lenses will also be expensive. At this point it's probably for specialty applications that don't apply to most people. However, it is hard to predict the future and maybe one day there will be benefits beyond better corners etc.

 

[loitokitok]

If it ever come to fruition it's likely to be a scheme to make your current gear obsolete and fuel the urge to upgrade.

Highly corrected (ie expensive) lenses these days do great in the corners with flat sensors. And i think it's probably a given that curved sensors with matched lenses will also be expensive. At this point it's probably for specialty applications that don't apply to most people. However, it is hard to predict the future and maybe one day there will be benefits beyond better corners etc.

Again, in theory, the design for lenses to be used with curved sensors could be less complex, resulting in lenses which are smaller, lighter and potentially less expensive.

However against that, for lenses designed to be used with ILCs, the specific curvature of the sensor used by the various camera body manufacturers would have to be the same for the manufacturers of 3rd party lenses (Sigma, Tamron, Zeiss, et.c, etc.) to benefit from it. Otherwise they would need to have different optical constructions depending on the camera body and not just a different mount. If that were the case 3rd party lenses could end up being more expensive.

 

[Mark S Abeln]

Again, in theory, the design for lenses to be used with curved sensors could be less complex, resulting in lenses which are smaller, lighter and potentially less expensive.

Unfortunately, the biggest factor in producing a low cost lens is economies of scale: lenses with production runs in the millions typically are the least expensive. Curved sensors on a smartphone with a fixed lens seems obvious.

But smaller, simpler lens designs at a high price might be desirable for some.

--
http://therefractedlight.blogspot.com

 

[Sonyshine]

Curved sensors will ( have) to be used with fixed lenses - which can be relatively simple lenses matched to the curvature of the sensor.

Not suitable for ILC cameras.

Most likely to be top end fixed lens and mobile phone usage therefore. Read this post again.

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www.dpreview.com

Stupidity is far more fascinating than intelligence. Intelligence has its limits...

 

[loitokitok]

Curved sensors will ( have) to be used with fixed lenses - which can be relatively simple lenses matched to the curvature of the sensor.

They are more likely to be used with fixed lenses as you say - but they do not have to be.

Not suitable for ILC cameras.

They could be and there could be some advantages but as discussed earlier in this thread it would have an impact on which lenses could be used successfully with which bodies.

I can see it being a possible way forward with, say a medium format system camera, which has relatively few lenses and for which 3rd party support in lenses is non existent anyway. Assuming of course the ability to manufacture curved sensors is not cost prohibitive.

Most likely to be top end fixed lens and mobile phone usage therefore. Read this post again.

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/6...ay-allow-for-simpler-lenses-and-better-images

Stupidity is far more fascinating than intelligence. Intelligence has its limits...

 

[Sonyshine]

I think zoom and ILC lenses highly unlikely.

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Stupidity is far more fascinating than intelligence. Intelligence has its limits...

 

[stevo23]

So I see some of the big names are lodging patents on new curved sensors and lenses to work with them. I'm pondering what this means for those of us with established and extensive lens collections - will these become obsolete and we have to buy a whole new set of lenses if the future = curved sensors ? I know lens development happens and in time replacement of lenses might need to happen but usually you envisage this happening gradually and selectively since some lenses can last us 30+ years of great service and results. It would be a bitter pill if we had to ditch all our existing lenses to use with shiny new bodies that featue curved sensors? Do you think such bodies would exist in parallel with bodies that used existing sensor tech?

I odn't mean this to be a doom and gloom post but I think it raises a valid point - is this a good time to stop buying expensive lenses if they might not work on new cameras featuring these new curved sensors ?

It should result in better images. But it's too far off to worry about just yet, but if it's coming, the camera companies are counting on you and I to pony up so they can stay in business.

And who knows if there won't be some way to adapt current lenses as a stop gap?

 

[TacticDesigns]

So I see some of the big names are lodging patents on new curved sensors and lenses to work with them. I'm pondering what this means for those of us with established and extensive lens collections - will these become obsolete and we have to buy a whole new set of lenses if the future = curved sensors ? I know lens development happens and in time replacement of lenses might need to happen but usually you envisage this happening gradually and selectively since some lenses can last us 30+ years of great service and results. It would be a bitter pill if we had to ditch all our existing lenses to use with shiny new bodies that featue curved sensors? Do you think such bodies would exist in parallel with bodies that used existing sensor tech?

I odn't mean this to be a doom and gloom post but I think it raises a valid point - is this a good time to stop buying expensive lenses if they might not work on new cameras featuring these new curved sensors ?

 

[Mark S Abeln]

I'd assume that in most cases, the image would be corrected to rectilinear.

 

[fishy wishy]

If a curved sensor is the answer, what is the question?

 

[Sonyshine]

Simple lens design without having to correct aberrations at the edges.

 

[rurikw]

Can't see any cause for gloom. Could imagine camera makers issuing new bodies with curved sensors + new better smaller wide angle lenses. We consumers tend to like supply and choice.

 

[stevo23]

So I see some of the big names are lodging patents on new curved sensors and lenses to work with them. I'm pondering what this means for those of us with established and extensive lens collections - will these become obsolete and we have to buy a whole new set of lenses if the future = curved sensors ? I know lens development happens and in time replacement of lenses might need to happen but usually you envisage this happening gradually and selectively since some lenses can last us 30+ years of great service and results. It would be a bitter pill if we had to ditch all our existing lenses to use with shiny new bodies that featue curved sensors? Do you think such bodies would exist in parallel with bodies that used existing sensor tech?

I odn't mean this to be a doom and gloom post but I think it raises a valid point - is this a good time to stop buying expensive lenses if they might not work on new cameras featuring these new curved sensors ?

--
"When words become unclear, I shall focus with photographs. When images become inadequate, I shall be content with silence." Ansel Adams.

I've just read what has been posted on this site about curved sensors.

Haven't really read too much.

But 2 questions.

1. Would curved sensors work well with trying to capture 180 or 360 degree pictures?

2. When you capture a curved image, I assume when shooting RAW, the image will be saved as captured. But when you capture as a JPG (or convert to a JPG), will the image seem distorted? Or will it be stretched out to a flat plane? So when you print it, it looks like the projections we are familiar with now?

None of the above This is about dealing with the curved and spherical nature of lens elements and reducing the required corrections. It's about getting truly flat field images.

 

[Jackson Bart]

As a film photorapher, should I be worried about this digital stuff?

Nah, too far off in the future.

--
My personal blog: https://jacksonbart.wordpress.com/

 

[Joe Pineapples II]

I've just read what has been posted on this site about curved sensors.

Haven't really read too much.

But 2 questions.

1. Would curved sensors work well with trying to capture 180 or 360 degree pictures?

[...]

You're thinking of those old panoramic cameras where the film was held on a semi-circular arc and the lens was rotated mechanically. These are very subtly curved sensors which compensate for the field curvature, rather than using optical elements in the lens to correct it. This Wikipedia page gives some examples:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petzval_field_curvature

J.

 

[stevo23]

As a film photorapher, should I be worried about this digital stuff?

Nah, too far off in the future.

Nah, you get to bypass the x-ray and go straight to your gate.

 

[Jackson Bart]

If a curved sensor is the answer, what is the question?

You mean the ultimate question?