And others! ;-)
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=17971444
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
-
Welcome to the new forums! Please read this first. For known issues we are working to resolve, click here.
Challenge of challenges: what do I get? ;)
- Thread starter onlooker
- Start date
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1032&message=17971444
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
mirrorrorrim
Well-known member
I personally think that creating a mood with a compelling image is more important than telling a story or technical achievement or pretty eye candy images.
But I voted on how I thought others would in this challenge – I gave the 1st place image 5 stars and the 3rd place image 4 stars, even though I liked #3 better (I would much rather have that one hanging on my wall). Maybe this was not the proper way to vote, but I was voting for the prize.
I like #17 better than the top finishers, also think #64 should have placed higher but was not surprised at the result.
But I voted on how I thought others would in this challenge – I gave the 1st place image 5 stars and the 3rd place image 4 stars, even though I liked #3 better (I would much rather have that one hanging on my wall). Maybe this was not the proper way to vote, but I was voting for the prize.
I like #17 better than the top finishers, also think #64 should have placed higher but was not surprised at the result.
chrisby
Forum Enthusiast
Several people discuss here how they vote. In the mean time the winner of the voting challenge was announced.
According my understanding in general if a winner is announced it should be good practice to show the result why the one is the winner.
Wouldn't it be a good idea if dpr (or the winner!) presents more details of his voting pattern?
Just a thought, what do you think?
According my understanding in general if a winner is announced it should be good practice to show the result why the one is the winner.
Wouldn't it be a good idea if dpr (or the winner!) presents more details of his voting pattern?
Just a thought, what do you think?
Ben_Egbert
Forum Pro
I think many replies were like mine, a statement that winning something was of no value, and that art is very subjective. Art contests may have no artistic meaning. So its probably a popularity contest with a side contest to see who could guess the most popular image.
--
When you can't focus, nothing else matters
Once you can, everything else does.
http://ben-egbert.smugmug.com/
Ben
Denjw
Veteran Member
I agree there are plenty of great bird photos shown on Dpr and there are better ones than this one. But a vote of 1.5 for the winner seems harsh and the reason a bit odd considering it captures an act of nature. By the way the winner attracted 109 votes of 5. But just goes to show how subjective voting/judging is.
--
http://dwehner.zenfolio.com/
--
http://dwehner.zenfolio.com/
chrisby
Forum Enthusiast
I agree that guessing the most popular images is not very demanding. But I am more interested in the extremes. I voted very high for some less popular images (e.g. 80th) and very low for some popular (e.g. 10th).
As you say voting is subjectiv, but that is exactly what I am looking for, how different an image is judged.
However, I would like also to see whether the winner just find the most popular ones or whether he hits the overall pattern. And also: what is a good voter according dpr?
As you say voting is subjectiv, but that is exactly what I am looking for, how different an image is judged.
However, I would like also to see whether the winner just find the most popular ones or whether he hits the overall pattern. And also: what is a good voter according dpr?
Deleted pending purge
Senior Member
- Messages
- 1,197
- Solutions
- 4
- Reaction score
- 505
I think it's pretty much the same as taking an interesting photo. Some scenes draw your attention, you cut a cadre out of what you see, and by doing so you comment upon the theme that has presented itself. The way you discern the important part worthy of your photo-comment-statement-highlight is dictated by your personal experience (not neccessarily photographic only), and the way you form the recorded visual depends upon your personality, photographic skill and the attitude toward the theme...
Ditto. If there are similarities in your experience with the work you observe, and/or if the way some theme has been presented triggers some harmonics within your personal knowlege (not neccessarily photographic only), you will relate to that work and "understand" it (i.e. respond to the intensity of emotional "hits" within you) and you may be compelled to rate such a work higher than some others...
Simplified, the "best" photo (imho) is a work that posesses high technical level of quality, reveals an easily acceptable presentation in as few elements as possible, and presents some universally known theme. This way, most viewers may respond to it in the most positive mode.
As to the "best voter"... to me, it is someone who is responsible enough to study the Challenge and its rules prior to casting their votes, and concentrates upon each work before deciding to comment its value in stars. But the voting is actually the same thing as taking a photo, or viewing someone else's work... therefore: as above.
--
Fil
A tornado destroying a city is also an act of nature. Regardless of the awesomeness of such a force of nature, no amount of beauty in such a photo could ever make it beautiful to me if I know (or especially if I can see) people (or animals) are suffering and dying in the image.
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
Deleted pending purge
Senior Member
- Messages
- 1,197
- Solutions
- 4
- Reaction score
- 505
There should be a strong differentiation between a good photo and a good photo theme!
The role of the photographic work is to convey as much data about some recorded scene as possible, and if such a work succeeds in the transference of emotion then it should be regarded (and valued!) as "good photography".
The actual theme of the scene can be attractive or repulsive, it depends upon too many and too complex factors. It is prevalently a personal thing, and has very little to do with the quality of the photograph. For instance, a photo containing nudity has one meaning to, say, a voyeur, and quite another for someone religious, but a real photographer could always say whether that photo is well made, or just a snapshot. Even more extremely, consider forensic photography: excellently made documents ("good photography"), but not very nice themes to watch ("ugly pictures").
A photo is the information-transferring piece between its author and its viewers, it is called a "medium", the "middle", and its transfering quality shouldn't be mixed with the transferred information content.
--
Fil
The role of the photographic work is to convey as much data about some recorded scene as possible, and if such a work succeeds in the transference of emotion then it should be regarded (and valued!) as "good photography".
The actual theme of the scene can be attractive or repulsive, it depends upon too many and too complex factors. It is prevalently a personal thing, and has very little to do with the quality of the photograph. For instance, a photo containing nudity has one meaning to, say, a voyeur, and quite another for someone religious, but a real photographer could always say whether that photo is well made, or just a snapshot. Even more extremely, consider forensic photography: excellently made documents ("good photography"), but not very nice themes to watch ("ugly pictures").
A photo is the information-transferring piece between its author and its viewers, it is called a "medium", the "middle", and its transfering quality shouldn't be mixed with the transferred information content.
--
Fil
Tony Tomlin
Leading Member
But DPreview is still a Marketing organization and there are what? 40 million iPads in the world, They cannot ignore such a base!
--
Tony
--
Tony
There are more than 1 billion PCs in current use. Probably closer to 1.5 billion.
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
bikinchris
Forum Pro
So you would rather the bird starve? Reminds me of the comments I got from an alliigator shot waiting under a rookery for baby birds to fall out. Someone commented that it was mean for them to do that. I also commented that the gator guards the rookery from small animals who would certainly eat ALL of the eggs and there would be no new birds.
In this case, there would be too many fish in the lake if the bird didn't reduce the population of the less wary fish for his meal.
Nature is both beautiful and ugly at the same time. It is all in YOUR viewpoint and dare I say attitude about nature.
Good cyclists are:
Visible, Predictable, Alert, Assertive and Courteous
They also use the five layers of protection available.
Layer 1: Control your bike (Don't fall or collide with others)
Layer 2: Follow the rules (Don't be the cause of traffic crashes)
Layer 3: Use Lane position (Discourage other drivers mistakes)
Layer 4: Hazard Avoidance (Avoid other drivers mistakes and road hazards)
Layer 5: Utilize passive protection (Use protection when all else fails)
Chris, Broussard, LA
In this case, there would be too many fish in the lake if the bird didn't reduce the population of the less wary fish for his meal.
Nature is both beautiful and ugly at the same time. It is all in YOUR viewpoint and dare I say attitude about nature.
--
Good cyclists are:
Visible, Predictable, Alert, Assertive and Courteous
They also use the five layers of protection available.
Layer 1: Control your bike (Don't fall or collide with others)
Layer 2: Follow the rules (Don't be the cause of traffic crashes)
Layer 3: Use Lane position (Discourage other drivers mistakes)
Layer 4: Hazard Avoidance (Avoid other drivers mistakes and road hazards)
Layer 5: Utilize passive protection (Use protection when all else fails)
Chris, Broussard, LA
Why do people have such trouble interpreting such simple statements?
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1044&message=40229347
It's perfectly natural, it's not wrong, I do now and have in the past participated in the activity of killing animals for food or eating animals, and I still don't find it beautiful to see animals being killed or made to suffer.
It's a nice image (not a great one - plenty of much better bird shots around) - that's why I gave it 1.5 instead of 0.5 which is what I would have given it based on subject matter alone.
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
Ed at Ridersite
Forum Pro
Check out the entries starting at the bottom right thumbnail (click on thumbnail) and moving up the list. There are lots of entries averaging less than one star:
http://www.dpreview.com/members/directory/bestchallenges?term=null&page=1548
Likewise, check out the entries starting at the top right and move down the list. There are many averaging more than four stars:
http://www.dpreview.com/members/directory/bestchallenges?term=null&page=1
--
AEH
http://aehass.zenfolio.com/
Question: What do you do all week?
Answer: Mon to Fri. Nothing, Sat & Sun I rest!
On that subject, do you remember Kevin Carter's famous photograph?
Never heard of him (or it), but I looked it up. I suspect few people have that image hanging on their wall. Winning a Pulitzer for journalism doesn't necessarily mean you've captured an attractive shot.
--
Lee Jay
(see profile for equipment)
Oh, I agree. I just wanted to offer an opinion of how your hypothetical (actually, it's not even hypothetical, read below) shot would have been received by the public and the media.
Not attractive photos, in fact, they are quite disturbing and disgusting, but pictures of death, human misery and suffering sell, they win awards and photographers make their careers on pictures like that. Hell, even the sports section of world press photo awards, just look at what they picked - 1st place is a picture of a football player getting kicked in the face. 2nd place, a bull ramming its horn into the matador's throat.
And finally, the exact scenario you suggested did happen, I know of two examples. A teenager was killed and eaten by bears few years ago. Picture of his body, what was left of it, was published on the front page of a daily newspaper next morning. Similar scenario happened in Alaska, two people killed, Werner Herzog made a movie about it.
Deleted pending purge
Senior Member
- Messages
- 1,197
- Solutions
- 4
- Reaction score
- 505
- A nice theme with a WOW factor in an excellent photo: high votes = photographically good judgment...
- A nice theme with a WOW factor in a mediocre photo: high votes = photographically wrong judgment...
- An ugly theme with a YUKK factor in a mediocre photo: low votes = photographically good judgment...
- An ugly theme with a YUKK factor in an excellent photo: low votes = photographically wrong judgment...
Theme contents within the photo do not change its quality (ability to transfer emotions).
This can be proven by the fact that low-quality photo effectively ruins the most attractive theme. And the emotionally highly charged Pulitzer-winning works, I presume, are distilled by the same principle. If some picture can make us LOL or at least smile, or if it makes us want to cry... or puke... or change our mind about human civilisation... that must be one good photographic work.
Keyboard shortcuts
- f
- Forum