Automatic focus stacking with Sony - It can be done (software inside)

[Entropy512]

Very impressive!

Will this software work with a Sony A77 II?

From the list of supported cameras given by Sony, only the 7r3 and 73 can be configured to MF in the remote software, this is necessary for the software patch to work?

Yes MF is required, but I don't see why the older A7s should not support it.

They don't support remote focus position control. That function was new on the R3.

 

[Paul Barnard]

Very impressive!

Will this software work with a Sony A77 II?

From the list of supported cameras given by Sony, only the 7r3 and 73 can be configured to MF in the remote software, this is necessary for the software patch to work?

Yes MF is required, but I don't see why the older A7s should not support it.

They don't support remote focus position control. That function was new on the R3.

 

[Entropy512]

Very impressive!

Will this software work with a Sony A77 II?

From the list of supported cameras given by Sony, only the 7r3 and 73 can be configured to MF in the remote software, this is necessary for the software patch to work?

Yes MF is required, but I don't see why the older A7s should not support it.

They don't support remote focus position control. That function was new on the R3.

Perhaps they introduced tha feature because of the loss of downloadable apps. Someone in Sony might have been thinking a little.

Would not surprise me if that was part of it, in general focus position control was the last thing missing from USB tethering.

Now the one thing they still need to do is document the protocol so third-party applications can integrate it. They have an SDK for the Wifi remote protocol but that protocol is severely limited. If third-party applications (such as qDSLRDashboard) were more robust/reliable, there wouldn't be a need for the in-camera apps (which were always barely-functional novelties, such as the timelapse app's 999 frame limit which turned it from a potentially great tool to a toy.)

 

[Snow Dog]

I'm a little confused what the application does. Does it automate the taking of the pictures in the stack or does it help merge the images? I have taken the images by focusing manually and using focus peaking on a monitor, but when I process the images through Photoshop I get a blurry mess. Does Edge assist in merging the images?
Thanks!
Snowdog

 

[Paul Barnard]

I'm a little confused what the application does. Does it automate the taking of the pictures in the stack or does it help merge the images? I have taken the images by focusing manually and using focus peaking on a monitor, but when I process the images through Photoshop I get a blurry mess. Does Edge assist in merging the images?
Thanks!
Snowdog

It automates taking the images. You still need to use a stacking SW to merge the images.

 

[Paul Barnard]

A couple of weeks ago I noticed that the Sony Imagine Edge software supports shifting the focus of my A7R3. Unfortunately the software itself does not provide sufficient means of automation to make focus stacking possible. I work as a software developer so I decided to build a small tool to fill the gap. The program simulates a user pressing the "shift focus"-button and "take picture"-button over and over again. In a way its a remote for a remote.

This is the first public version of my software. Please bear in mind that it was created in my leisure time in a couple of hours spread across weekends. So don't expect too much.
The software is open source, I don't make any profit with it nor do I intent to.
You can find some more infos and the download link at github: B8Stack at github

Here is a picture of an old brokoli that I found in my fridge stacked from 120 images:



And a little screenshot of the software:



Feedback is welcome.

The same approach works on the Mac. This is a very quick and dirty app to show the principle. Code is on GitHub if anyone wants it. I'll put a built app there as well

https://github.com/paulrbarnard/stacker

I just used the app today and discovered that Apple have locked down Mojave preventing the app from working. I've fixed it and the new version is at the same link. When you start the application it will prompt you to let it send keypresses to the system. You need to say Yes to that. It will then open system preferences and ask you to permit Stacker to use Accessibility options. These are the new hoops Apple has decided to add to keep the system safe. You only need to do it the once.

 

[lattesweden]

A couple of weeks ago I noticed that the Sony Imagine Edge software supports shifting the focus of my A7R3. Unfortunately the software itself does not provide sufficient means of automation to make focus stacking possible. I work as a software developer so I decided to build a small tool to fill the gap. The program simulates a user pressing the "shift focus"-button and "take picture"-button over and over again. In a way its a remote for a remote.

This is the first public version of my software. Please bear in mind that it was created in my leisure time in a couple of hours spread across weekends. So don't expect too much.
The software is open source, I don't make any profit with it nor do I intent to.
You can find some more infos and the download link at github: B8Stack at github

Here is a picture of an old brokoli that I found in my fridge stacked from 120 images:



And a little screenshot of the software:



Feedback is welcome.

The same approach works on the Mac. This is a very quick and dirty app to show the principle. Code is on GitHub if anyone wants it. I'll put a built app there as well

https://github.com/paulrbarnard/stacker

I just used the app today and discovered that Apple have locked down Mojave preventing the app from working. I've fixed it and the new version is at the same link. When you start the application it will prompt you to let it send keypresses to the system. You need to say Yes to that. It will then open system preferences and ask you to permit Stacker to use Accessibility options. These are the new hoops Apple has decided to add to keep the system safe. You only need to do it the once.

Thanks for the programming work you put in!

I wished there was a more mobile solution to focus bracket on Sony like it is on m4/3 cameras where one just sets the focus step rate, frames etc in camera since they have it built in.

It is of course possible to drag out a PC in the woods and run Imaging Edge with your add on, and I am happy that you have given us that option.

But if I could attach something else (mobile or small custom control box etc) that did the focus bracketing via the cable connection, that would make images like the below examples so much easier to make on my Sony cams:













--
Best regards
/Anders
----------------------------------------------------
42 Megapixels is the answer to life, the universe and everything.
You don't have to like my pictures, but it would help: http://www.lattermann.com/gallery

 

[kgivens]

Just finished reading this long thread. Would appreciate if someone can tell me if the following conclusions are correct.

1. This stacking program works only when tethered to a PC (or Mac).

2. No Android version.

3. Will not work on any of the Sony DSLRs (a77, a99)

4. Mirrorless: Works only on the a73 or a7r3

<start rant>

I do a great deal of manual focus stacking on Sony DSLRs and am endlessly frustrated that Sony, whether accidentally or deliberately, seems to have made app-driven focus stacking a complete impossibility on the a77 and a99 lines. (I also have an a6000 and a7ii; wish this app worked with those as well). I'm not a developer, but it seems to me that without some kind of total firmware overhaul it may be simply impossible to automate focus stacking on their DSLRs via a bolt-on device or app.

There are commercial (hardware) devices that "add" focus stacking to some digital cameras but I've yet to see one that works on any Sony body. I recently invested in a Kickstarter device called Arsenal that promised to provide focus stacking to Sony cameras via a small dongle.They released the product and it did not work from day one on Sony DSLRs. Now Arsenal is throwing in the towel and offering refunds to Sony owners like myself.

We can only hope that Sony's next flagship DSLR or mirrorless body steals a page from the Nikon D850 playbook and includes baked-in focus stacking. And if they could combine that with pixel shift, they would have a killer feature that no one else has. That would make a lot of macrophotographers very happy.

These apps are a promising step in the right direction. Most of my shooting is outdoors, where tethering is highly impractical. I patiently await Sony to produce a camera with built-in focus stacking.

<end rant>

 

[JSSadowsky]

I think I can only answer your first question - yes, it must be tethered.

I share your frustration. I'm an amateur developer for Mac applications, but could do iOS as well. I've looked into BT or WiFi connectivity. Sony used to publish some of their APIs (=Application Program Interface), but they are different for each camera and the stopped publishing for recent cameras. You're rant is correct - Sony software SUCKS! So, I add to that that not only does their provided software suck, but they don't publish the API needed for 3rd party developers to do it right. It is next to impossible to send a comment to Sony. Their developer web page says "post it on Stack Overflow" (SO is a programmer's problem/solution posting forum.) I've registered my complaints to phone support staff - you know where that goes.

I have a A7R III that does pixel shift. You have to merge the pixel shift raw files using Sony's software - and again it SUCKS. Given a 40 Mpix camera, the pixel shift merge should be 160 Mpix raw file. But you get a ~80 Mpix (I forgot the exact number) RGB TIFF file. That means they've applied interpolated that you have no control over. Of course, smooth, sharpen and resize as you desire in PhotoShop or whatever. You probably are not going to keep the original raw file. But NO! Sony knows how to do your workflow better than you do.

Arrrrgh!

 

[greg57]

Hi Paul, first of all thanks for your efforts. I've downloaded your app from the Dropbox link you provided earlier and I'm trying to make it work... unsuccessfully so far I have to say. The pictures are taken but the focus doesn't move inbetween the shots. I'm wondering if it could be because I'm using a third party lens - the samyang 35mm 2.8 - as I can't seem to change focus from Edge Remote indeed. Will try tonight with a Sony lens once I'm home. And I'll keep you posted of course.

This works very well (A7r3, sony imaging edge remote, various lenses) Step size normal is too small for some situations and big is too large. Is it possible to insert a numeric variable?

The step size is set by Sony and there only three choices. What would be possible is to issue multiple focus move commands between images. I’ll make that change on the Mac version.

The Mac version is updated to include setting a step 'size'. this causes the app to issue additional focus move commands between images.



The source is updated on GitHub

--
Gregory Dziedzic
gregorydziedzic.com

 

[A Clear View]

Hi Binary Camera & Paul.......Thank you so much for your work. This is exactly what I have been looking for since Helicon Remote doesn't support Sony. Bravo & looking forward to upgrades.

 

[binarycamera]

Paul made a similar program for mac:

https://github.com/paulrbarnard/stacker

I don't own a mac, so I can't really help with any mac related questions.

 

[zephyrprime]

What's Imagine Edge?

 

[Paul Barnard]

What's Imagine Edge?

It’s a more happening version of the John Lennon song

that should be Imaging Edge

 

[lattesweden]

What's Imagine Edge?

It’s a more happening version of the John Lennon song

that should be Imaging Edge

Imagine Edge no DSLRs
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky

 

[Chaplain Mark]

Your broccoli looks great! I just found one of my old socks behind the dryer, will it look good with stacking?

LOL.....

 

[CAADET]

I want to say thanks a bunch to binarycamera.

I too searched high and low and to find Camfi to be a "real" solution.

I watched their demo video and noticed that it is using the same 6 step for near and far focus, which makes me think they did a similar method to achieve their focus bracketing.

It is the only reason for me to be interested in their product but this small app does it.

Im almost thinking to get the D850 just for this because I do a lot of it and my macro lenses all auto focus on Nikon, not Sony.

 

[UtopiaArchitecture]

Hi, I am an extreme macro enthusiast, and really excited about your software. But i can not make it work. I only can make it start capturing image if only I turn the lens switch to MF. Is this right ? But then the focus did not move, just capturing the same images. If I turn the lens to AF, the camera did not work. I did the process with Objective lens mounted on my Sony a7iii + Sony FE70200 f4 with 10-15x magnification. Really hope your software can work like Olympus / Fuji so I dont need to buy automatic focusing rail . Let me know if I did it wrong. Thanks

 

[Paul Barnard]

Hi, I am an extreme macro enthusiast, and really excited about your software. But i can not make it work. I only can make it start capturing image if only I turn the lens switch to MF. Is this right ? But then the focus did not move, just capturing the same images. If I turn the lens to AF, the camera did not work. I did the process with Objective lens mounted on my Sony a7iii + Sony FE70200 f4 with 10-15x magnification. Really hope your software can work like Olympus / Fuji so I dont need to buy automatic focusing rail . Let me know if I did it wrong. Thanks

You need to be in MF. The SW adjusts the focus distance. If you have AF on it would refocus on the same point each time. Consequently the camera won’t accept focus step commands in AF mode.

 

[CAADET]

Just finished reading this long thread. Would appreciate if someone can tell me if the following conclusions are correct.

1. This stacking program works only when tethered to a PC (or Mac).

2. No Android version.

3. Will not work on any of the Sony DSLRs (a77, a99)

4. Mirrorless: Works only on the a73 or a7r3

<start rant>

I do a great deal of manual focus stacking on Sony DSLRs and am endlessly frustrated that Sony, whether accidentally or deliberately, seems to have made app-driven focus stacking a complete impossibility on the a77 and a99 lines. (I also have an a6000 and a7ii; wish this app worked with those as well). I'm not a developer, but it seems to me that without some kind of total firmware overhaul it may be simply impossible to automate focus stacking on their DSLRs via a bolt-on device or app.

There are commercial (hardware) devices that "add" focus stacking to some digital cameras but I've yet to see one that works on any Sony body. I recently invested in a Kickstarter device called Arsenal that promised to provide focus stacking to Sony cameras via a small dongle.They released the product and it did not work from day one on Sony DSLRs. Now Arsenal is throwing in the towel and offering refunds to Sony owners like myself.

We can only hope that Sony's next flagship DSLR or mirrorless body steals a page from the Nikon D850 playbook and includes baked-in focus stacking. And if they could combine that with pixel shift, they would have a killer feature that no one else has. That would make a lot of macrophotographers very happy.

These apps are a promising step in the right direction. Most of my shooting is outdoors, where tethering is highly impractical. I patiently await Sony to produce a camera with built-in focus stacking.

<end rant>

hear hear!

Damn I hear ya. Same gripe here. Focus stacking can create some amazing images.

There is an answer if you’re looking for future mirrorless cameras now, its called the Nikon Z7. There is a nice Techart converter for AF Sony lens as well as the FTZ converter for current Nikon DSLR lens.