30D vs 5D For a beginner

[Sean LA]

My experience was similar. I am an amateur and while upgrading from a P&S in the fall of 2005, I picked up a 20D+Kit lens, Canon then released the 5D, I was able to return my 20D and got a 5D in November 2005. Though I had to pay full price 3299, I have no regrets and have enjoyed my DSLR experience immensely. 16 months later the thrill has not worn off, this is one fine camera, and I am not even tempted to upgrade. Of course assembling a kit involved much more money than I had ever imagined spending on a "hobby" ! Lenses are very pricey but for starting out a basic set would be :
24-105 4L ,
70-200 (one of 4 flavors), I picked the 2.8 IS
& a fast prime 50 1.4 or 85 1.8.
This is enough IMHO for the first year. Add a flash if needed.
Good luck with your decision.

About a year or so ago I was ready to get out of point and shoot
photography and move on to the DSLR's. I wanted something as close
to 35mm SLR photography as I could get. The 5D was as much as would
dare spend but I still was not sure. I bought a 350D and
experienced everything my SONY 717F could not do (higher ISO's,
higher shutter speeds). Sold the 350D and bought the 30D for the
full range of ISO and shutter speed. Finally bit the bullet and
bought the 5D for 2500USD. If I would have known what I know today
I would have purchased the 5D a year or so ago.

--
Sean
http://picasaweb.google.com/rupiesq

The craftsman who wishes to do his work well must first sharpen his tools.... Confucius

 

[Dave Lewis]

Does a beginner really want to put over $3000 into a camera and lens that he is unsure he will need or use or understand. Buy a Rebel XT with the kit lens and enjoy a fine camera at an affordable price.
--
Dave Lewis

 

[Bear]

Ok, I don't own a 5D so don't shoot me here if I'm wrong. From everything I have read about the 5D and 1Ds cameras is that the FF sensor is very critical on the quality of the glass used ( i.e. you will need to exercise care on which lense you buy/use). For a long time I considered buying a FF sensor camera, now I'm not sure. The 30D is a fine camera (I have the 20D) and as others have said don't let the thought of only 8mp concern you. I was selling images (8x10) from a 4mp camera years ago. Unless you are going over 11x14 then 8mp will do just fine.

Bear

 

[blackhawk13]

Does a beginner really want to put over $3000 into a camera and
lens that he is unsure he will need or use or understand. Buy a
Rebel XT with the kit lens and enjoy a fine camera at an affordable
price.
--
Dave Lewis

--Why waste a grand that could go towards a nice body or lense? The 5D is such a sweet camera as long as you hung good glass on it. My 20D gets little use nowadays. The wider aspect of a FF is usually preferred over the crop magnification advantage. Plus the fact pixel for pixel the 5D really thumps the 30D, just as the 30D thumps the Rebel. I'm not fond of the 'S' lenses either; there unless on a FF.

The 30D is a good camera, but the Rebel has some features it doesn't. Still my next choice after a 5D would be the 30D; it has pro features that make it a better choice for a serious shooter.

-nothing beats a fast lense, except a fast girl-

 

[johnbandry]

If you're new to SLR photography, as well as digital, you'll need to gain experience in:

• composition of pictures
• use of different focal lengths
• use of aperture and exposure settings in various light conditions
• use of flash/fill flash
• processing and printing

The most important choice you have to make in terms of equipment at this stage is what lens you use. I suggest you will be better able to decide when you have a year's experience under your belt, so for now I would go for the less expensive (and lighter!) body: the 30D or 400D according to taste and budget. Don't buy the kit lens, get two decent lenses: for what you describe probably the EF-S 17-55m f2.8 IS and the EF 85mm f1.8. The latter will be a nice short tele on a crop sensor. The zoom will let you experiment with different focal lengths and will be great for capturing parties, kids, family as well as landscapes and around town.

By the time you outgrow that setup there will be new models on the market and you will have a good idea what you need.

Think a bit about how to preserve that photographic record of your growing family for your grandchildren. Digital formats and media become obsolete and inkjet prints fade.

Mostly, don't get obsessed with the equipment, enjoy the photos (and the kids).
--
John Bandry

 

[gdanmitchell]

Hard to imagine why a "beginner" would need to spend nearly $3000 on a body, plus a ton more on lenses good enough to take advantage of the 5D.

Don't take this as an insult - just advice about when to spend the real money. At this point you likely don't really know how your photographic interests will evolve - you probably have some particular interests right now, but as you start doing a lot more photography your interests will evolve and who knows whether the 5D will be the right body.

(If you were thinking that you should get the 5D so that you won't have to upgrade later, that is not likely to work out. You'll quite possibly - more than likely, actually - end up needing something different within a few years. Either you'll want an upgrade to the 5D series camera then, or it will turn out that your specific photographic interest is better served by something different.)

In most everything (skiing, music lessons, bike racing, you name it) it is generally not a good idea to start out with high end gear.

The 30D would be fine. I suspect that a 400D would be just as good for you at first.

Dan

--
---
G Dan Mitchell
SF Bay Area

 

[blackhawk13]

Hard to imagine why a "beginner" would need to spend nearly $3000
on a body, plus a ton more on lenses good enough to take advantage
of the 5D.

Don't take this as an insult - just advice about when to spend the
real money. At this point you likely don't really know how your
photographic interests will evolve - you probably have some
particular interests right now, but as you start doing a lot more
photography your interests will evolve and who knows whether the 5D
will be the right body.

(If you were thinking that you should get the 5D so that you won't
have to upgrade later, that is not likely to work out. You'll quite
possibly - more than likely, actually - end up needing something
different within a few years. Either you'll want an upgrade to the
5D series camera then, or it will turn out that your specific
photographic interest is better served by something different.)

In most everything (skiing, music lessons, bike racing, you name
it) it is generally not a good idea to start out with high end gear.

The 30D would be fine. I suspect that a 400D would be just as good
for you at first.

Dan

--
---
G Dan Mitchell
SF Bay Area

--Having gone from a Sony F828 to a 20D, and then a 5D in the coarse of two years, I disagree. I would get a 5D and a 24-70 L lense to start. Remember that you'll want a minimum of 4 Gbs of memory cards plus a 2nd battery, and a flash maybe as well. The new 580 is what I would wait for. A carry case in mandatory; a Kata sling,or a Lowepro top loader are good choices. A tripod is also needed for some types of shots. The cost is not just the camera and lense. After the 24-70 L, the next lense I would get is the 70-200 f/2.8 IS; it's worth every penny.

If you can afford it, and you enjoy it, why not do it? A cheaper camera doesn't make learning easier.

Life is short! Walk towards the fire; live in the flame.

-nothing beats a fast lense, except a fast girl-

 

[gdanmitchell]

-nothing beats a fast lense, except a fast girl-

Did you mean "fast girle?"

--
---
G Dan Mitchell
SF Bay Area

 

[noiseless]

If you enjoy shooting indoor photos, without flash, in natural light, whether your using a fast prime lens or an expensive 24-70L 2.8, and get better noiseless photos than the 30D or the 350D then go with the 5D. If you like to crop more photos just because you like to double clik to 100% and the crops jump out of screen and you say to yourself I have to have that trim then the 5D is the camera. If you like taking tack sharp camera in hand photos with shutter speeds down to 1/50 sec then the 5D is the camera.

 

[rrcphoto]

5D not really in my price range, but I may just be able to stretch
it and manage it wiht a minimal loan. My main question is:
Is the 5D just too much camera for a beginner. Would it better to
start with the 30D and buy a 5D later on?

your best bet is to buy a camera body that is in your price range, and augment it with good lenses through time.

Since you've said that the 5D is not in your price range, get the 30D.. it's a wonderful camera and 8MP can easily blow up to A4. I regularly use my 20D and blow up to 13x19 prints without any issues. I've done a 1/4 crop of an image and done 8x10's from that, so you'll have no issues with that at all.

but the glass or lenses that you use will affect your blow ups far more than the camera. so ge the cheaper body and invest into some good lenses.