Z8 timecode

[halfmanhalfbiscuit]

Is the Ultrasynch a better alternative to the Deity TC-1? I feel like implementing Timecode in camera without the ability to jam synch is almost pointless. I'm hoping you guys with more knowledge and experience will add more to this thread.

UltraSync blue/one are both supported by Nikon for the Z8 and Z9

AND I know they work - I have them and use them.

I have never heard of the product you mentioned.

But the UltraSync Blue is the only one talking to Z9/8, no? Or does the One also transmit over bluetooth?

I only use the Blue - Please look in the reference guide / ultrasync /atomos web site and you will see. There are various products in the Atomos range that work together and with the various types of Timecode sources and recorders. Many Cine cameras and field recorders need a wired Timecode connection. All my gear uses Bluetooth - hence why the BLUE is so useful.

Specifically answering Trazan’s question - no the UltraSync One does not support bluetooth. And the UltraSync Blue does not have any DIN connector, it can only output via Bluetooth to cameras and devices that have implemented their protocol.

See their comparison on their site - https://www.timecodesystems.com/ultrasync-blue-or-ultrasync-one/

 

[areallygrumpyoldsod]

Can the Z8 timecode jam? And is the timecode steady enough to run by itself for a day?

Being able to run the camera without attaching or setting up additional timecode units would be very welcome

As you are no doubt aware the purpose of saving timecodes with recordings is to enable recordings to be sync'd across multiple devices in post production. AND such timesync data has to be accurate and precisely the same in every recording device for this to be successful.

So yes you can instruct the Z8 and Z9 to utilise current time and you can use snapbridge to set the time AND when recording the timesync records time in 1/100th second intervals.

Without a live common timesync source (like an ultra sync one or blue - both of which are tiny) you may have to correct the recorded timesync values if there are any difference --- that is fine for one or two clips but not for hundreds or thousands.

And what about field recorders and other recording devices on your set?

Far FAr easy to just pick up an UltraSync Blue - pair all recorders to it and use it as the timecode source -- then you have no issues down the line.

What I'd really like to do is jam-sync my Sound Devices recorder to the camera, or vice versa. But it seems that this is not an option, as the Z8 does not have timecode output, or input. And the field recorder can not fetch time code via bluetooth...

You could add a Bluetooth dongle to your field recorder (sound devices make solutions). Or an UltraSync ONE and connect that to your field recorder AND have a Blue connected to the Z8/Z9 then decide which is master and which slave.

UltraSync - Atomos

support.timecodesystems.com

As noted there are other Atomos products that might be able to perform both Bluetooth TC and TC via cable.

I expect you could take a Z8/Z9 to a place with other TC solutions that have both Bluetooth and wired tc out to see if these can be paired with the camera.

 

[Mako2011]

You could add a Bluetooth dongle to your field recorder (sound devices make solutions). Or an UltraSync ONE and connect that to your field recorder AND have a Blue connected to the Z8/Z9 then decide which is master and which slave.

May still not work due t the Blue's propitiatory protocol? The Blue won't talk to the One ???

 

[areallygrumpyoldsod]

You could add a Bluetooth dongle to your field recorder (sound devices make solutions). Or an UltraSync ONE and connect that to your field recorder AND have a Blue connected to the Z8/Z9 then decide which is master and which slave.

May still not work due t the Blue's propitiatory protocol? The Blue won't talk to the One ???

Hi — well I was very pleased when NIKON added TC jamming to the Z9 after we pestered them to. Before that we had to sacrifice an audio channel. So I added a recorder that also sync’d via the Blue (with the right dongle).

I have not tried it — see - https://support.timecodesystems.com...UE-fit-in-with-the-Timecode-Systems-workflow-

Folk will have to speak to Atomos/UltraSync to see how to connect their gear to a common Timecode source that can also be used by the Z8/Z9 or fix this in post, which is not ideal.

My guess is this will take some exploration. I submitted a support ticket to confirm how UltraSync suggest this is done.

--
areallygrumpyoldsod
Nikon and Hasselblad shooter -- wildlife and and -- https://www.andymillerphoto.co.uk/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/ajm057/

 

[Mako2011]

You could add a Bluetooth dongle to your field recorder (sound devices make solutions). Or an UltraSync ONE and connect that to your field recorder AND have a Blue connected to the Z8/Z9 then decide which is master and which slave.

May still not work due t the Blue's propitiatory protocol? The Blue won't talk to the One ???

I have not tried it — see - https://support.timecodesystems.com...UE-fit-in-with-the-Timecode-Systems-workflow-

I may be reading it wrong but looks like it may not work in the OP's case. Thank's for the link !

 

[Jones Longshot]

Is the Ultrasynch a better alternative to the Deity TC-1? I feel like implementing Timecode in camera without the ability to jam synch is almost pointless. I'm hoping you guys with more knowledge and experience will add more to this thread.

UltraSync blue/one are both supported by Nikon for the Z8 and Z9

AND I know they work - I have them and use them.

I have never heard of the product you mentioned.

Thanks for the reply.

I have a Z6 ii and a couple of other cameras that do not support timecode. The TC-1 can output TC as an audio signal so the cameras would embed that into the audio track. The units have a built in omni mic so it records the mic to one channel and the TC to the other. I would also record the TC signal to one channel of my audio recorder.

A three unit set is about $600 complete and basically works with any camera that can jam synch or record timecode as audio.

https://deitymic.com/products/tc-1-timecode-box/

This is not a recommendation to anyone. I have never used them. I'm just comparing options right now and trying to determine the best place to spend my money.

Jones

--
https://www.joneshendershot.com
https://youtube.com/janeinspain

 

[areallygrumpyoldsod]

Is the Ultrasynch a better alternative to the Deity TC-1? I feel like implementing Timecode in camera without the ability to jam synch is almost pointless. I'm hoping you guys with more knowledge and experience will add more to this thread.

UltraSync blue/one are both supported by Nikon for the Z8 and Z9

AND I know they work - I have them and use them.

I have never heard of the product you mentioned.

Thanks for the reply.

I have a Z6 ii and a couple of other cameras that do not support timecode. The TC-1 can output TC as an audio signal so the cameras would embed that into the audio track. The units have a built in omni mic so it records the mic to one channel and the TC to the other. I would also record the TC signal to one channel of my audio recorder.

A three unit set is about $600 complete and basically works with any camera that can jam synch or record timecode as audio.

https://deitymic.com/products/tc-1-timecode-box/

This is not a recommendation to anyone. I have never used them. I'm just comparing options right now and trying to determine the best place to spend my money.

Jones

Thanks and this is the solution many have used for a long time — ears —

one option is to use SnapBridge to set current time in camera as accurately as possible and also do the same in others gear then sync off of this; but obviously most editing software is looking for a TC.
The other approach is to record enough audio in all gear to be able to use auto sync — again sub optimal.

Obviously as you indicate the TC-1 signal uses one channel, which is fine sine you are recording your primary audio on a recorder — but again if the recorder has no dedicated TC channel then you loose a channel. I hope your recorder has enough channels for your needs. I assume your TC-1 provides TC feed to all your devices as a result they have to be near to each other, which is fine but then when one uses multiple cameras and a number of mics and recorders then a more sophisticated approach is needed.

 

[areallygrumpyoldsod]

Lorena Bishop (Timecode Systems) Jun 20, 2023, 14:49 GMT+1

Hi Andrew,
The UltraSync ONE and UltraSync BLUE will connect over RF, the set up instructions can be found from page 20 on our user manual, for which I have attached the link below.

https://support.atomos.com/hc/en-us...2888291855/ultrasync-blue-user-guide_2019.pdf

This should give you the information that you need, but please don't hesitate to come back to us is you need any further information, or any advice on a set up.

Kind regards,
Lorena

 

[Rudis Electronics Lab]

Dear all,

Did anybody manage to get the Nikon Z8 camera to share a timecode with a Sound Devices MixPre 3 using HDMI, and without buying additional hardware? Because I may not be getting it, really. (And sorry for the lengthy post, but I wanted to be precise.)

From the specs and manuals, I understand that this MICPRE should be able to receive timecodes from Nikon cameras via HDMI. (Please note that I want to use HDMI, not talking ‘jam syncing’ using LTC timecode data in an audio signal.)

• The Z8 can output timecode via HDMI. And, when I connect an Atomos Ninja, I can see that the timecode is indeed being sent out via HDMI.
• The MixPre supports timecode input via its micro-HDMI connector labelled “HDMI TC Input”. The latest manual (“Guide 05/22”, FW8.00) says, “HDMI TC IN Many DSLR-style cameras output timecode via HDMI. If HDMI TC In is selected without an HDMI source connected, the MixPre will report missing sync. The MixPre has two HDMI timecode modes, HDMI flag for Sony, Panasonic, Nikon, Canon and Blackmagic cameras and HDMI FUJIFILM for FUJIFILM cameras.”
• Firmware 5.00 for the MICPRE added “Expanded list of cameras supported for HDMI timecode and triggers including cameras from Blackmagic, Canon, Nikon, and Fujifilm in addition to the already supported Sony and Panasonic cameras.” https://www.sounddevices.com/download/?prod=mixpre-3
  • Unfortunately, Sound Devices does not seem to specify which exact Nikon cameras are supported… Some YouTube videos show a page on the Sound Devices website with ‘supported cameras’ (like
    ), but this page seems to be no longer available 

Anyway, I do not manage to get this working. On the MixPre screen, I only see ‘--:--:--:--' for where the timecode should show.

On the Z8:

• I’m running the latest firmware (C2.01).
• I selected a video format that produces a MOV file (noting that Thom Hogan writes in his Z8 guide that “You must be recording to a .MOV type file on a Z8 for
• timecodes to be captured”. (Probably only relevant for the internal recording of timecode.)
• I tried several video codecs and resolutions, thinking the MixPre might not deal well with a, say, a 8k HDMI signal. In ‘SETUP MENU | HDMI | HDMI output resolution’, I tried “Auto” as well as to 720p, 1808i and 1080p.
• I set ‘SETUP | Output Shooting Info’ to Off.
• I tried playing with the different timecode settings on the Z8.
• In ‘SETUP MENU | HDMI | Output range’ I tried setting the output range to “Limited range”.
• In ‘SETUP MENU | HDMI | Output shooting info’ I tried turning this off. (Normally, I have this on to see a larger preview when I am in the frame myself.)

On the MixPre

• I’m running the latest firmware (version 9.02).
• I set the MixPre to “HDMI TC” input mode – the one supposed to support Nikon cameras.
• I also activated the Record | Rec trigger flag in the MixPre, following the video “How to use Timecode on the Sound Devices Mixpre-3 and Mixpre-6”
• I tried various other related settings in the MICPRE.

The above experiments are done by connecting the MICPRE simultaneously to the Z8. I tried different high-quality cables HDMI to micro-HDMI cables (note that these cables do work correctly with the Ninja showing timecode…)

I also connected the Z8 to their MixPre with the Ninja in between, where the Ninja indeed sees the proper timecode, and I tried trying various settings in the Ninja as well regarding its HDMI output. This is a setup similar to the following video (

), which uses a Nikon Z6II, where the timecode gets selected (but the user does have problem with multiple videos starting). But I do not get this setup to work with the Z8 either.

Strangely (but possibly unrelated), if I set the MICPRE on Timecode | TC mode “Time of Day”, it still starts from 0 all the time, not from the actual time of day - even if time and day is properly set on the device.

So, if anyone did get this to work, or has ideas how to get this working, please do let me know!

 

[TTY33]

I was trying to do the same ( Z8 --> [HDMI cable] --> MixPre 3 II ) this morning.

Did not work.

GH5 looks ok...

 

[Trazan]

Unfortunately I don't have a micro HDMI thingy, else I would have tried!

I wish Atomos would make an UltraSync Blue with audio output....

 

[Rudis Electronics Lab]

Thanks TTY33.

I indeed came across this video a couple of weeks ago when I was searching for experiences of people getting the PreMix to work with HDMI timecode in…

In the past, I had it all working on my Nikon Z7. When I have the opportunity, I will try whether that still works (I guess so, but seem to recall you need to keep the HDMI resolution low, like HD).

But I really would like within to work with the Z8. I just purchased the MixPre’s “+2” license for additional channels, with the plan to use it in the current setup, but if I do not get HDMI timecode to work with the Z8, this purchase was a waste and I will need to look out for other options.

Best, Rudi

 

[Rudis Electronics Lab]

Unfortunately I don't have a micro HDMI thingy, else I would have tried!

I wish Atomos would make an UltraSync Blue with audio output....

Thanks Tarzan.

The micro-HDMI plug is indeed a bit of a headache: you usually do not have them lying around, its hard to find good quality ones (and they may be terribly expensive), and it locks very poorly in place. I wished the MixPre wold have had full size HDMI in, or at least HDMI mini….

As for The UltraSync… Well, of there was a single device that would solve all my timecode challenges, I’d probably be willing to buy. But it seems that I would need a range of products to work with the gear I have, and it already takes more time than I would like to build up/down my set quickly, and if people assist me, additional equipment makes it all more complex and error-prone.

So, still hoping for the simple solution of connecting the MixPre directly to the Z8 (or, if need be, via de Ninja).

Best, Rudi

-
Nikon Z8, Z7, D500, D800E, FujiFilm X100, Sony RX100MK3, Mamiya 645PRO

 

[MasterOfGoingFaster]

Just an FYI. I use a Z8, Z9, UltraSync Blue, with Zoom F3 and F6 recorders. Works well enough for my needs. If I turn off the camera, I have to give it a few seconds for everything to sync up again. That's been the only "issue" I've had.

I know you've got a Sound Devices recorder, but it might be worth considering a Zoom F3 as it is pretty inexpensive.

 

[TTY33]

Thank you for the reply.

I do the wildlife recording using the following flow.

MKH 8070 --> [XLR]--> Mix Pre 3 II --> [3.5mm TRS] --> Z8 (H.265 @10bit) >>> Final Cut Pro >>> YouTube

This is a very simple work flow since the AV sync is not required.

I wanted to find out (simulate) the complexity and benefits of the best quality flow without buying Tentacle Sync E.

regards,

 

[Trazan]

Thank you for the reply.

I do the wildlife recording using the following flow.

MKH 8070 --> [XLR]--> Mix Pre 3 II --> [3.5mm TRS] --> Z8 (H.265 @10bit) >>> Final Cut Pro >>> YouTube

This is a very simple work flow since the AV sync is not required.

I wanted to find out (simulate) the complexity and benefits of the best quality flow without buying Tentacle Sync E.

regards,

You could send timecode from the MixPre to the Z8 in that setup, though.

 

[Rudis Electronics Lab]

You could send timecode from the MixPre to the Z8 in that setup, though.

Dear Trazan: Maybe I misunderstand you, but how do you do that?

Or do you mean that you can send LTC timecode data in an audio signal from MixPre to the microphone input of the Z8? That is a scenario I considered, but since Final Cut Pro does not seem to work with LTC timecode data in an audio signal, that is a route I'm trying not to go. I am hoping for proper timecode information in the video stream itself.

Thanks!

 

[Trazan]

You could send timecode from the MixPre to the Z8 in that setup, though.

Dear Trazan: Maybe I misunderstand you, but how do you do that?

Or do you mean that you can send LTC timecode data in an audio signal from MixPre to the microphone input of the Z8? That is a scenario I considered, but since Final Cut Pro does not seem to work with LTC timecode data in an audio signal, that is a route I'm trying not to go. I am hoping for proper timecode information in the video stream itself.

Thanks!

Oh, I just assumed FCP would handle LTC...I may very well be wrong in my assumption :-D

 

[TTY33]

Thank you for the suggestion!

I will try it and let you know (may take few days).

 

[TTY33]

Hi Trazan,

I setup the Mixpre 'stereo out' so that it can generate timecode and audio (split mode).

Z8 recoded this special signal into the video's audio track.

This way, I made 3 video (with audio/tc) files (.MOV) along with a Mixed Pre .WAV file.

Fed these files into Tentacle Sync Studio software (downloaded , 2 week free trial).

The files are nicely time synchronized. Then generated .XML file for Final Cut Pro.

Loaded this .XML file into FCP and filed are synced. It worked!!!

But there is a problem with the split file.

MixPre records the timecode signal into the R channel and the audio signal into the L channel. But the L channel is not clean. The timecode signal is leaking into the audio signal.