Pros and Cons Of Shutter Options (Mechanical Shutter, EFCS, Silent Shutter)

[Willy81]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

 

[dazzerfong]

If you want the full version, https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

If you want the lazy version:

• Silent shutter is electronic shutter
• EFCS is using the shutter only on end of exposure
• Mechanical shutter uses shutter on both beginning and end

As for advantages/disadvantages, here's a select few:

• Rolling shutter (the wavy effect you get when capturing fast moving objects): Mech shutter = EFCS > silent (unless you have stacked sensor)
• Bokeh: Mech = silent > EFCS (only for high shutter speeds)
• Noise: Silent >>>> EFCS > Mechanical
• Reliability: Silent > EFCS > Mechanical
• Flash: Mechanical > EFCS >>>>> Silent (unless you have stacked sensor)

In short, depends on what you're shooting and what kind of camera you have. If you have a stacked sensor camera or one with a very fast readout speed, can probably get away with silent 99% of the time.

 

[thunder storm]

If you want the full version, https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

Thanks for sharing, that's a great article.

 

[Willy81]

If you want the full version, https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

If you want the lazy version:

• Silent shutter is electronic shutter
• EFCS is using the shutter only on end of exposure
• Mechanical shutter uses shutter on both beginning and end

As for advantages/disadvantages, here's a select few:

• Rolling shutter (the wavy effect you get when capturing fast moving objects): Mech shutter = EFCS > silent (unless you have stacked sensor)
• Bokeh: Mech = silent > EFCS (only for high shutter speeds)
• Noise: Silent >>>> EFCS > Mechanical
• Reliability: Silent > EFCS > Mechanical
• Flash: Mechanical > EFCS >>>>> Silent (unless you have stacked sensor)

In short, depends on what you're shooting and what kind of camera you have. If you have a stacked sensor camera or one with a very fast readout speed, can probably get away with silent 99% of the time.

Thanks for your summary and link (very helpful and appreciated).

 

[Julesvernex2]

If you want the full version, https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

That's a great article, I have it bookmarked and often go back to double-check things.

One thing I believe it doesn't mention though, is the potential loss of dynamic range on cameras that record 12-bit Raw files when using the silent shutter. For Sony, it seems that only happens on older models: https://www.sony.com/electronics/support/articles/00229990

PS: would love if Sony implemented Fuji's auto shutter selection (EFCS if SS<1/2000s, mechanical between 1/2000 and 1/8000, and electronic above 1/8000s)

 

[Rag and Bone]

Thanks for that. Very clear.

 

[Mike VanV]

Simple...head over to YouTube, learn by watching..!

Lot's to learn there. Also the video recommended here is also very good info, and spelled out very simply.

https://photographylife.com/mechanical-electronic-shutter-efcs

Thanks dazzer.

Mike

 

[SQLGuy]

A couple of other things:

Your A7C doesn't have a first shutter curtain, so full mechanical is not an option with that camera.

EFCS has less release lag than mechanical.

HSS with EFCS results in fine horizontal lines in the photo with some flashes.

EFCS results in uneven exposure for short exposures (shorter than 1/1000th or so) because the EFCS does not accelerate like the mechanical second curtain.

 

[richj20]

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter

I use for flash because flash won't work with silent (aka electronic) shutter.

• Silent Shutter

My normal use, so as to save wear/tear on the mechanical shutter.

After seven years, my 2 A7Rii cameras have 6179 and 17,217 mechanical shutter clicks. They should last a long time.




With flash



--
Richard
http://www.rsjphoto.net/

 

[PWPhotography]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

Depend on what camera you use in my experience.

With stack-sensor as in A1, A9-series, I use e-shutter exclusively including in landscape. The penalty in DR is very minimum and not really can tell difference in real world. A1's e-shutter works flawless to me in all scenarios.

I learned lesson from my A7r IV. I used to use e-shutter lots in daylight that usually ran fine in single shot if don't move much. However I was frustrated in some blurry photos when I did hand-held pano as even shutter speed is around 1/100 that is not that low with 16-35 GM or CV 21. Turned out it's fault of rolling shutter when I rotating camera one shot after another shot that a few (even just one or two) in series are blurry that ruined entire series. I since changed to m-shutter exclusively and effectively addressed the issue. On tripod-mode that assigned to dial '1', it uses m-shutter, uncompressed RAW, IBIS off...

My A7 IV is between that has less rolling shutter but still having that issue if I moving camera a bit too fast after taking a shot before another shot.

When I use m-shutter sure with EFCS as used to with Canon DSLRs. I just cannot quite trust e-shutter on non-stacked sensors in A7/A7r series.

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/55485085@N04/albums

 

[ProDude]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

Depend on what camera you use in my experience.

With stack-sensor as in A1, A9-series, I use e-shutter exclusively including in landscape. The penalty in DR is very minimum and not really can tell difference in real world. A1's e-shutter works flawless to me in all scenarios.

I learned lesson from my A7r IV. I used to use e-shutter lots in daylight that usually ran fine in single shot if don't move much. However I was frustrated in some blurry photos when I did hand-held pano as even shutter speed is around 1/100 that is not that low with 16-35 GM or CV 21. Turned out it's fault of rolling shutter when I rotating camera one shot after another shot that a few (even just one or two) in series are blurry that ruined entire series. I since changed to m-shutter exclusively and effectively addressed the issue. On tripod-mode that assigned to dial '1', it uses m-shutter, uncompressed RAW, IBIS off...

My A7 IV is between that has less rolling shutter but still having that issue if I moving camera a bit too fast after taking a shot before another shot.

When I use m-shutter sure with EFCS as used to with Canon DSLRs. I just cannot quite trust e-shutter on non-stacked sensors in A7/A7r series.

I assume you were trying to do some kind of IN camera pano? If you're taking multiple images in a planned stitch pano you wouldn't get rolling shutter, the shots are taken one after the other but not with the movement aspects. Hmmm

 

[PWPhotography]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

Depend on what camera you use in my experience.

With stack-sensor as in A1, A9-series, I use e-shutter exclusively including in landscape. The penalty in DR is very minimum and not really can tell difference in real world. A1's e-shutter works flawless to me in all scenarios.

I learned lesson from my A7r IV. I used to use e-shutter lots in daylight that usually ran fine in single shot if don't move much. However I was frustrated in some blurry photos when I did hand-held pano as even shutter speed is around 1/100 that is not that low with 16-35 GM or CV 21. Turned out it's fault of rolling shutter when I rotating camera one shot after another shot that a few (even just one or two) in series are blurry that ruined entire series. I since changed to m-shutter exclusively and effectively addressed the issue. On tripod-mode that assigned to dial '1', it uses m-shutter, uncompressed RAW, IBIS off...

My A7 IV is between that has less rolling shutter but still having that issue if I moving camera a bit too fast after taking a shot before another shot.

When I use m-shutter sure with EFCS as used to with Canon DSLRs. I just cannot quite trust e-shutter on non-stacked sensors in A7/A7r series.

I assume you were trying to do some kind of IN camera pano? If you're taking multiple images in a planned stitch pano you wouldn't get rolling shutter, the shots are taken one after the other but not with the movement aspects. Hmmm

Yes but that is exactly what I experienced. In hand-held pano, I am moving from left to right (or reverse) usually 2 rows with 1/3 overlapping. Then I found under e-shutter a few (1~3) shots frequently are blurry in series (10~20 shots) even shutter around 1/100 from 16-35 GM @16mm or CV 21. I believe this is rolling shutter related when I am moving a bit fast between shots. It seems the entire process is not completed so a bit lag even after hitting shutter before taking next shot. Once I switched to m-shutter I am no longer having this issue around the same or slower shutter even at 1/60 sec. But anyway I don't trust e-shutter in A7r IV anymore and start shooting with m-shutter exclusively. That costs several thousand shutter counts in my recent Antarctica cruse trip

A7 IV e-shutter has less such issue but still experienced. Only A1 e-shutter has no issue that I shoot exclusively so my A1 supposed to have zero m-shutter count

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/55485085@N04/albums

 

[ProDude]

Yes but that is exactly what I experienced. In hand-held pano, I am moving from left to right (or reverse) usually 2 rows with 1/3 overlapping. Then I found under e-shutter a few (1~3) shots frequently are blurry in series (10~20 shots) even shutter around 1/100 from 16-35 GM @16mm or CV 21. I believe this is rolling shutter related when I am moving a bit fast between shots. It seems the entire process is not completed so a bit lag even after hitting shutter before taking next shot. Once I switched to m-shutter I am no longer having this issue around the same or slower shutter even at 1/60 sec. But anyway I don't trust e-shutter in A7r IV anymore and start shooting with m-shutter exclusively. That costs several thousand shutter counts in my recent Antarctica cruse trip

A7 IV e-shutter has less such issue but still experienced. Only A1 e-shutter has no issue that I shoot exclusively so my A1 supposed to have zero m-shutter count

Glad you found something that works for you. The only time I ever did pano's was on a competent tripod leveled correctly and moved gradually shot to shot in increments. No chance of error in that regard even with old cameras.

 

[dazzerfong]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

Depend on what camera you use in my experience.

With stack-sensor as in A1, A9-series, I use e-shutter exclusively including in landscape. The penalty in DR is very minimum and not really can tell difference in real world. A1's e-shutter works flawless to me in all scenarios.

I learned lesson from my A7r IV. I used to use e-shutter lots in daylight that usually ran fine in single shot if don't move much. However I was frustrated in some blurry photos when I did hand-held pano as even shutter speed is around 1/100 that is not that low with 16-35 GM or CV 21. Turned out it's fault of rolling shutter when I rotating camera one shot after another shot that a few (even just one or two) in series are blurry that ruined entire series. I since changed to m-shutter exclusively and effectively addressed the issue. On tripod-mode that assigned to dial '1', it uses m-shutter, uncompressed RAW, IBIS off...

My A7 IV is between that has less rolling shutter but still having that issue if I moving camera a bit too fast after taking a shot before another shot.

When I use m-shutter sure with EFCS as used to with Canon DSLRs. I just cannot quite trust e-shutter on non-stacked sensors in A7/A7r series.

I assume you were trying to do some kind of IN camera pano? If you're taking multiple images in a planned stitch pano you wouldn't get rolling shutter, the shots are taken one after the other but not with the movement aspects. Hmmm

Yes but that is exactly what I experienced. In hand-held pano, I am moving from left to right (or reverse) usually 2 rows with 1/3 overlapping. Then I found under e-shutter a few (1~3) shots frequently are blurry in series (10~20 shots) even shutter around 1/100 from 16-35 GM @16mm or CV 21. I believe this is rolling shutter related when I am moving a bit fast between shots. It seems the entire process is not completed so a bit lag even after hitting shutter before taking next shot. Once I switched to m-shutter I am no longer having this issue around the same or slower shutter even at 1/60 sec. But anyway I don't trust e-shutter in A7r IV anymore and start shooting with m-shutter exclusively. That costs several thousand shutter counts in my recent Antarctica cruse trip

A7 IV e-shutter has less such issue but still experienced. Only A1 e-shutter has no issue that I shoot exclusively so my A1 supposed to have zero m-shutter count

That makes sense - when you're pano'ing, even if the shutter speed is fast, there's still rolling speed from the e-shutter. If you pan when doing video, it's the same effect.

 

[Willy81]

Thanks to all for some great information and my learning.

For my A7C and A7RV I will mostly use "Silent Shutter" (saves wear on the Mechanical shutter and no noise). With action shots I will switch to the Mechanical Shutter to prevent rolling shutter. I have a button programmed on my cameras to toggle between Silent and Mechanical Shutter.

Again Thanks.

 

[panther fan]

As for advantages/disadvantages, here's a select few:

• Rolling shutter (the wavy effect you get when capturing fast moving objects): Mech shutter = EFCS > silent (unless you have stacked sensor)
• Bokeh: Mech = silent > EFCS (only for high shutter speeds)
• Noise: Silent >>>> EFCS > Mechanical
• Reliability: Silent > EFCS > Mechanical
• Flash: Mechanical > EFCS >>>>> Silent (unless you have stacked sensor)

• Shutter shock: silent >> EFCS >>> Mechanical (blurry images at slowish shutter speeds)
• Shutter lag: silent >= EFCS >>>> Mechanical
• Dynamic range: EFCS = Mechanical > silent (between almost = and >>>> depending on camera)

The perfect combination on non-stacked is, therefore:

EFCS for slowish shutter speeds to avoid the shock/ noise

Mechanical for high shutter speed to avoid the bokeh

That Sony has no auto switching like every other damn camera manufacturer is, therefore INSANE

 

[Julesvernex2]

As for advantages/disadvantages, here's a select few:

• Rolling shutter (the wavy effect you get when capturing fast moving objects): Mech shutter = EFCS > silent (unless you have stacked sensor)
• Bokeh: Mech = silent > EFCS (only for high shutter speeds)
• Noise: Silent >>>> EFCS > Mechanical
• Reliability: Silent > EFCS > Mechanical
• Flash: Mechanical > EFCS >>>>> Silent (unless you have stacked sensor)

• Shutter shock: silent >> EFCS >>> Mechanical (blurry images at slowish shutter speeds)
• Shutter lag: silent >= EFCS >>>> Mechanical
• Dynamic range: EFCS = Mechanical > silent (between almost = and >>>> depending on camera)

The perfect combination on non-stacked is, therefore:

EFCS for slowish shutter speeds to avoid the shock/ noise

Mechanical for high shutter speed to avoid the bokeh

That Sony has no auto switching like every other damn camera manufacturer is, therefore INSANE

I have so far assumed that only cameras that switched to a 12bit sensor readout had reduced dynamic range when using the electronic shutter, but your "almost =" above leaves me wondering : are there other factors that can reduce electronic shutter DR, even for cameras that keep a 14bit readout?

Bill Claff's mechanical vs. electronic DR measurements suggest that sensor readout bit depth is be the only factor, but there's not a lot of data to go by:

- Sony A7R3 (14bit ES readout, same DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Sony ILCE-7RM3,Sony ILCE-7RM3(ES)

- Nikon D850 (14bit ES readout, same DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Nikon D850,Nikon D850(14es)

- Canon R5 (12bit ES readout, big knock on DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Canon EOS R5,Canon EOS R5(ES)

PS: Hear! hear! on the lack of auto shutter selection on Sony cameras!

--
Jules Verne Times Two
https://www.julesvernex2.com

 

[PWPhotography]

What are the Pros and Cons of the various Shutter Options?

Can you tell me the benefits of each and why you would select a particular setting?

• Mechanical Shutter
• EFCS
• Silent Shutter
• Is there any other?

I am a very old dog but still trying to learn about the modern technology? Your comments will be greatly valued and appreciated.

Depend on what camera you use in my experience.

With stack-sensor as in A1, A9-series, I use e-shutter exclusively including in landscape. The penalty in DR is very minimum and not really can tell difference in real world. A1's e-shutter works flawless to me in all scenarios.

I learned lesson from my A7r IV. I used to use e-shutter lots in daylight that usually ran fine in single shot if don't move much. However I was frustrated in some blurry photos when I did hand-held pano as even shutter speed is around 1/100 that is not that low with 16-35 GM or CV 21. Turned out it's fault of rolling shutter when I rotating camera one shot after another shot that a few (even just one or two) in series are blurry that ruined entire series. I since changed to m-shutter exclusively and effectively addressed the issue. On tripod-mode that assigned to dial '1', it uses m-shutter, uncompressed RAW, IBIS off...

My A7 IV is between that has less rolling shutter but still having that issue if I moving camera a bit too fast after taking a shot before another shot.

When I use m-shutter sure with EFCS as used to with Canon DSLRs. I just cannot quite trust e-shutter on non-stacked sensors in A7/A7r series.

I assume you were trying to do some kind of IN camera pano? If you're taking multiple images in a planned stitch pano you wouldn't get rolling shutter, the shots are taken one after the other but not with the movement aspects. Hmmm

Yes but that is exactly what I experienced. In hand-held pano, I am moving from left to right (or reverse) usually 2 rows with 1/3 overlapping. Then I found under e-shutter a few (1~3) shots frequently are blurry in series (10~20 shots) even shutter around 1/100 from 16-35 GM @16mm or CV 21. I believe this is rolling shutter related when I am moving a bit fast between shots. It seems the entire process is not completed so a bit lag even after hitting shutter before taking next shot. Once I switched to m-shutter I am no longer having this issue around the same or slower shutter even at 1/60 sec. But anyway I don't trust e-shutter in A7r IV anymore and start shooting with m-shutter exclusively. That costs several thousand shutter counts in my recent Antarctica cruse trip

A7 IV e-shutter has less such issue but still experienced. Only A1 e-shutter has no issue that I shoot exclusively so my A1 supposed to have zero m-shutter count

That makes sense - when you're pano'ing, even if the shutter speed is fast, there's still rolling speed from the e-shutter. If you pan when doing video, it's the same effect.

Thanks for explanation. It's my puzzle in panning. In the past I used to shoot landscape photos in daytime with e-shutter on A7r IV as in perception this will minimize shutter shock, even better than EFCS and reduce shutter count. It didn't have problem virtually in single shot. But anyway I now use m-shutter exclusively. My A7r IV is old so don't care shutter count anymore

Probably A7r V has less such issue but as A7 IV still will subject to rolling shutter in some scenarios and still better to use m-shutter in hand-held panning which I did very often.

--
https://www.flickr.com/photos/55485085@N04/albums

 

[ProDude]

Thanks to all for some great information and my learning.

For my A7C and A7RV I will mostly use "Silent Shutter" (saves wear on the Mechanical shutter and no noise). With action shots I will switch to the Mechanical Shutter to prevent rolling shutter. I have a button programmed on my cameras to toggle between Silent and Mechanical Shutter.

Again Thanks.

A sensible move. I too use the ES for everything but fast moving subjects and it works gloriously in 14bit as well. The whole rolling shutter thing is blown way out of proportion. I mean if you shoot static subjects of course, which I DO.

 

[ProDude]

As for advantages/disadvantages, here's a select few:

• Rolling shutter (the wavy effect you get when capturing fast moving objects): Mech shutter = EFCS > silent (unless you have stacked sensor)
• Bokeh: Mech = silent > EFCS (only for high shutter speeds)
• Noise: Silent >>>> EFCS > Mechanical
• Reliability: Silent > EFCS > Mechanical
• Flash: Mechanical > EFCS >>>>> Silent (unless you have stacked sensor)

• Shutter shock: silent >> EFCS >>> Mechanical (blurry images at slowish shutter speeds)
• Shutter lag: silent >= EFCS >>>> Mechanical
• Dynamic range: EFCS = Mechanical > silent (between almost = and >>>> depending on camera)

The perfect combination on non-stacked is, therefore:

EFCS for slowish shutter speeds to avoid the shock/ noise

Mechanical for high shutter speed to avoid the bokeh

That Sony has no auto switching like every other damn camera manufacturer is, therefore INSANE

I have so far assumed that only cameras that switched to a 12bit sensor readout had reduced dynamic range when using the electronic shutter, but your "almost =" above leaves me wondering : are there other factors that can reduce electronic shutter DR, even for cameras that keep a 14bit readout?

Bill Claff's mechanical vs. electronic DR measurements suggest that sensor readout bit depth is be the only factor, but there's not a lot of data to go by:

- Sony A7R3 (14bit ES readout, same DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Sony ILCE-7RM3,Sony ILCE-7RM3(ES)

- Nikon D850 (14bit ES readout, same DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Nikon D850,Nikon D850(14es)

- Canon R5 (12bit ES readout, big knock on DR): https://www.photonstophotos.net/Charts/PDR.htm#Canon EOS R5,Canon EOS R5(ES)

PS: Hear! hear! on the lack of auto shutter selection on Sony cameras!

The A7RV shoots in 14bit with the Electronic Shutter. The R5 Canon I had prior dropped to 12bit in ES. Just the facts........